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Opioids | Methadone HCL | tapering and good ethics

sl1p609

sl1p609

Bluelighter
Joined
May 18, 2008
Messages
156
Location
Costa Rica
well here is my story and I'll make as short as I can. I have been a opioid user for 7 - 8 years using daily. I started with Hydrocodone norcos from 15mgs/25mgs per day to OC, Fentynal and any other opioid I could get my hands on. After 2005 by 2007 I moved to Central America, Costa Rica where I found my self a connection which allowed me to get Hydrocodone Dirt cheap imported from Guatemala. There where 7.5/325's and Generic. I increased my dosages to from 25mgs to 6 or 8 tablets per dose. The hydrocodone Bitrtrate didn't last as long as other opioids. So i had to take doses of 45mgs to 60mgs every 4 - 6 hours 4x to 5x per 24 hours. I was really deep now and then i found myself in jail wd's big time. After a 10month rehab facility i was no longer using hydrocodone but then alternated to codeine phosphate 30/500mgs. I was using 15 - 25 tablets per day from 5 to 8 tablets. I was so tired of that so when i was walking around downtown central, I found a infested area of Colombians. H4 is rarely used by the locals here I was able to get my hands on some good skag after 4 years living in this country. Now after 1yr of snorting and smoking a gram per day obviously I turned to IV Intravenous use.

I went to the Hospital and asked them to put me on a MMT methadone program but they did not offer it. well they did but it cost 6,000 dollars. I was broke and with a really pissed of Wife, she
got me a doctor who could prescribe me the meds and was an addiction therapist m.d. I told him that night that i was withdrawing really hard and now using 2grms per day IV.

He got me to the clinic where they gave me 7 days of IM Methadone 30mgs. It really helped it was a life saver and after the week, I was in his office and he wanted me to start tapering
orally from 30mgs to 2.5mgs in 6 weeks. I told him that he was nuts and I would definitely be back using in less than 2 months. so we agreed to taper from 30mgs to 27.5mgs and lowering the dose 2.5gms
every 15days. I told him that if that is the best you can do it sounds better than the last option that i would not take.

Now I am on 25mgs and have been clean 45 days. He told me to do Intense Exercise for Endorphin production and keep going to NA/AA meetings every day.

I am committing to stay away from DiaMorphine but I think that with I would need more time to be on Methadone with a good dose every day. 30 to 40mgs per 24hrs

I am on 20mgs per day and feeling OK, I drink strong coffee and smoke Marlboro's Reds heavily now though. I think it just potentates the methadone.

Now with my history can anyone give me some advice :) would be greatly appreciated.

sl1p609

* sorry for the spacing an grammatical errors, can't you tell that I'm on opioids all ready from my rambling LOL, thank god for my humor in this matter.
 
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As someone who has been on methadone for 10 years and is in the process of tapering off right now (I've gradually gone from 100mg/day down to 8mg/day at this point) my strongest advice would be to get off the methadone as quickly as you possibly can. Of course don't do it if you are certain you will just end up using other drugs again, but bear in mind that with methadone the longer you take it the worse the withdrawals will be. The withdrawals for me when I drop just 2mg (after being on methadone for 10 yrs) are now as bad as the withdrawals were when I would stop cold turkey back when I'd been using methadone for only a few months.

The lower you get the harder it is to drop your dose and the shorter amount of time your dose will last you. If you find that it isn't lasting you 24hrs, I would definitely talk to your doctor and see if you can do "split dosing", taking your methadone twice a day instead of once a day. Initially when switching from once every 24hr dosing to once every 12hr dosing you may need an increase in your total dose per day, for example someone who is going from taking 20mg every 24hr may need to start at 15mgs every 12hrs.

Methadone is great for giving you some time to adjust to not using other drugs and working on making changes in your life, but it's absolute hell to get off when you've been taking it for any length of time. What are your plans, are you ok with being on methadone for the rest of your life? Or would you like to stop taking all drugs and not be chained to something anymore?

One thing I highly recommend for addictions is ayahuasca, done under the supervision of an experienced shaman, doctor or other experienced facilitator. For me I didn't find it to really help with the withdrawal symptoms from methadone (although people do report it helping with the WDs from shorter-acting opioids), but I found it to help immensely with the mental aspects of addiction and make it much easier to bear the pain of WDs without turning back to my drug of choice.
 
I have a question for then. I was supervised for a while by my wife as she would hold the meds but then she trusted me enough becuase I kept bugging her before work. So by choice now I am handling it. I kind fucked up too. one day when I was picking up the script and i decided to just for kicks take 50 or 55mgs. I found myself not getting the a stonger sensation of the dose. then feel a little aggitated that I did that. I mean if I wouldn't of tried then I wouldn't of know right.

I know someone on the network will say never mess with your dosing beause it will effect the overall program but idle hands are the devil etc etc etc.

So now I know like the Swim said it just makes the physical dose last longer and would take away symptoms only.... . I get that.

Look after all the abusing i have done, I have been good so I do think sometimes i need a day to fuck off. I really was on a sick ride for a long time.

And I understand that It would be harder to get off it, but mentally my head is saying fuck this and just use methadone to wd from Heroin when i can get more H. I don't want to return to that. So i believe yes i would need least a year
or 8 months of 20 - 30mgs. I have thought about splitting doses too. What I do want to do is research more on the pharmacology of Methadone which I think is not a derived from the poppy plant like others.

What is methadone really and is there any links other than Wikipedia?

I really do like this place and feel free to talk to anyone about this matter or others. its not just 7 - 8 years of opiates. Its been 15 - 16 years of substance abuse. I've done good to get off all them except this one.
which i preferred more than others now for a long time.

thoughts, info ;')
 
That is true, methadone is a synthetic opioid and unlike heroin or morphine, it just has an affinity for the same receptors. I don't know off-hand what the best resource for detailed info about methadone is, so I would just be doing the same thing as you and doing a Google search and going through the results to find the best/most reliable sites. Perhaps someone else on this forum knows of a good site about methadone.

I assume you are taking the racemic methadone hydrochloride, which is the only form of methadone available in the US. Are you taking it in liquid form?

Methadone effects different people differently, in that the duration of the effects lasts varying amounts of time from person to person. The same dose of methadone could last in one person for 5 hours and another for 40 hours. Some people are more sensitive to withdrawal symptoms than others, and some people are able to experience euphoria or analgesic effects while most are not. Generally the "high" or anti-depressant or pain-killing effects only occur when you first start taking methadone and over time your tolerance builds up rapidly and all it does is prevent withdrawal symptoms. People prescribed methadone for pain-management generally have to take methadone much more frequently and continuously raise the dose.

I would recommend against taking any other opioids while on methadone as they can raise your tolerance and make your methadone dose not enough anymore. You can easily get into a position where you are having to take your methadone AND your drug of choice. If you are subjected to random drug testing it is also not a good idea to use other drugs because you can lose your privileges like getting take-home doses, being able to go on trips, having control over your dosing, etc, and some doctors will even kick you off methadone if you have positive drug tests.

It is awesome that you have been able to resist using hydrocodone/codeine/other opioids with the help of methadone. I certainly don't want to downplay that accomplishment or encourage you to go off the methadone before you're ready. But it sure sucks to be chained to something for the rest of your life and I really wish someone had told me that the WDs would just get worse and worse and worse the longer I was on methadone, and that they are far worse and longer-lasting than any other opioid.
 
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NSFW:
mdone.jpg
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What I am working with Currently made in Hungary
 
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I am pretty certain that is the usual racemic methadone hydrochloride, since it says "metadona chlorhidrato" on the bottle. The reason I asked was because there are multiple forms of methadone with differing potencies. The racemic hydrochloride is the most widely available and is the only form currently available in the United States. The tartrate or levorotary salts are usually called levomethadone and are available in parts of Europe. D-methadone is an NMDA antagonist, so racemic hydrochloride contains both the NMDA antagonist and the opioid agonist, whereas the levorotary form is solely an opioid agonist (and therefore twice as strong). I wasn't sure what kind they had in Costa Rica as it seems like methadone treatment there is very different from the mainland US.

It's nice that you have the tablets, I find them more reliable than the liquid.
 
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well ou can allready strt on a plan on how no to relapse.. you will need a specialist, which will cost yu, but cost shouldn't be more important than your good health, think of new hobbies you could pick up, because long long after the physical withdrawls are the psychological withdrawl... do you work atm? un maybee, now would be a good time to nvest in that, the stats on relases are scary, so try to put every hance on your side by prepari g how you're going to be copping when you're clean
 
i just found out i have to wait till the 26th and the 17th ( 9 days ) with only 14 tablets left. .. . .. maybe ut my dose in half 12.5per dose really 12 mgs every 18 hrs

i have 140mgs left 14 pils... shit can i take alsmot 17.5mgs per dose daily
 
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sl1p609 said:
i just found out i have to wait till the 26th and the 17th ( 9 days ) with only 14 tablets left. .. . .. maybe ut my dose in half 12.5per dose really 12 mgs every 18 hrs
Click to expand...

That's awful! Did you take more than you were supposed to or something?
Are you saying you have 14 10mg pills to last 9 days?
If so, I would try taking a bit less each day for the first couple days and then stabilize. Assuming you will definitely be receiving more methadone in 9 days.
Do you usually take your methadone every 18 hrs or every 24 hrs? I would not recommend every 18 hrs, that is too hard to time and will have you taking it at a different time every day. I would do every 24 hrs or every 12 hrs.

If you have 140mg then you can take up to 15mg per day (and will have 5mg left over at the end).

But personally I think if your usual dose is 25mg/day, then I might start with lowering it to 20mg on the 1st day and then 17.5mg on the 2nd day, then 15mg on the 3rd day through 7th day, then 14mg on the 8th day and 13mg on the 9th day. Or something like that. Of course that is more complicated and it depends how easy it is for you to make the doses that precise, you don't want to end up over-estimating them and not having enough for the last day. (But personally I find the pills very easy to break or cut into pretty precise amounts).

Another option is to try to leave a bit of extra leftover just in case you have to wait another day or something before getting your next refill. So you could take 14mg/day so you'd at least have 14mg left over at the end of the 9 days. I always try to have some extra on hand because it's awful if you unexpectedly have to go without any.
 
Running out early is something that we all deal with at some point or another, yet is easily prevented by keeping an emergency supply. It takes some self control but is much easier with maintenance drugs like methadone or buprenorphine than with the usual suspects, the full agonists.

If you slowly add to your emergency stash, as you can, slowly putting doses in that you don't need, it would make these situations so much easier. I realize it's not possible to do this in your situation, but it's really basic and it doesn't take that much self control IMO because when I store methadone, I have no recreational use for it, but if I run out of my pain medication early or something, I will be very thankful that I didn't fuck around with something I don't even find that recreational.

edit: Like benzos, these are supposed to be tools, not toys.
 
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Just wanted everyone to know that I just got my script today and also IM injection of 20MGs of Methadone Ampule
 
ok, On the 12th of May I was Prescribed 75 tablets. It was supposed to be 25mgs for 15 days... meaning on the 26th of this Saturday was my refill.

I went over board a couple days taking 40 and 55 to 65mgs. It was a bad idea because I had to taper down from 25mgs - 20mgs - 17.5mgs - 12.5mgs - 10mgs each day ... by last Sunday I had 30mgs left
giving me 10mgs on Monday and 10mgs on Tuesday.,. My last dose on Tuesday was at 10am...

So when i saw him I felt not to manipulate and Lie and just tell him the truth that I fuked up and my wife was supposed to keep the meds on her....
I also said do not prescribe me 2weeks.. next time 8 days is enough.. because i can just robb my wife sorry to say and fuck it all up...

so i was withdrawing really bad today.. My DOC was in United States and came back yesterday. He was supposed to get to the Clinic at 1:00pm.
I took a taxi there at 8:00am and told them i'm not leaving until i see him. I was sweating and couldn't take it anymore..

When he wrote me the scrip this time he said it will be 20mgs .. not 22.5 which we supposed to do for the next 15days
so I didn't argue with him because, I guess i have to bite the bullet. .If he going to take me down from 25 to 20mgs then fine... I said
but i need methadone now... He was saying to me well i think i don;t have any until he open his office cabinet and had 5 ampules.

so i asked him could you at least give me 20 - to 30mgs so i can save the trip to the hospital to pick up the remaining..
he told me i was lucky and to see him in 8 days.. to keep excising build endorphins

I'm so happy but i still have a weird sensation. not a euphoric as much but at least to be glad to back to normal...

I'm really not ready to go down to 17.5 and 15mgs per 24hours.. but this is the only DOC i know... I'm thinking to search for others.. because the its is a low cost and i need to maintain.

The days i was on 10mgs i wanted to use Herion so bad and i was crying and fighting and yelling slamming doors .. leaving the house everyone scared of me but i needed to go some where to clear my head

my father said he was proud of me for not budging and using again that it was normal what i had and keep it going...

thank god H is hard to get here.. LOL

I am going to take a picture of the script for yall to see
 
I think it's a good idea that you asked to pick up your methadone more frequently. In the US and Canada people are started on having to pick up every day. Not that I think that's always fair and I do think people should be able to pick it up much less often when they have been on it for a while, but it can definitely help you at first because it makes you unable to take more than prescribed. I would highly suggest trying to save a little bit of methadone each week so you can build up a reserve in case something ever happens where you can't get your methadone on time or run out early.

That sucks that he is reducing your dose so rapidly. You could try reasoning with him and telling him that you are convinced you will use if the methadone is lowered too quickly, and you really don't want to and are trying so hard to stay clean.

Wouldn't picking up every 7 days be easier than every 8 days?


EDIT: By the way, when people on here say "DOC" in all caps like that they usually mean "Drug of Choice", not Doctor. Abbreviation for Doctor is normally Dr.
 
DOC is also Department of Corrections ::))

i got a script for 8 days , 4x tabs, 20mgs but today i took 3+ so it would 35mgs

i think that's perfect for me for 1 yr
 
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That's awesome that you're getting clean. I've been living in CR since 2004, and I've actually only been offered H once, and that was from a taxi outside of the delrey. I've never used it though, I prefer blow as my DOC. Good and bad thing about living in CR is the availibility and cost of drugs down here.
 
Maybe because it's an extract? lol. Just making an observation. Bing in NY hasen't stopped me getting pills from other countries before.
 
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