twominds
Bluelighter
Just wondering have any bluelighters out there used or would use an injecting room?
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AADD Moderators: andyturbo
Would/have you used an injecting room?
- Thread starter twominds
- Start date
Elicid
Bluelighter
if i did want to inject somthing it would be in my own home
BigTrancer
Bluelight Crew
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- Messages
- 7,342
Hmm... good question! If anyone wants to anonymously contribute a story to this thread, about their personal experiences using an injecting room, feel free to PM it to me and I will post it for you.
I can't say I've really thought about whether I'd use an injecting room or not. I would probably have a look if there was one nearby, just to see what kind of place they are, and put a mental picture with that option for future reference. If I was considering shooting a depressant, and I didn't know anyone that would sit for me or have a comfortable and hygenic place to prepare the shot, etc., then I think I'd definitely consider that option.
BigTrancer
I can't say I've really thought about whether I'd use an injecting room or not. I would probably have a look if there was one nearby, just to see what kind of place they are, and put a mental picture with that option for future reference. If I was considering shooting a depressant, and I didn't know anyone that would sit for me or have a comfortable and hygenic place to prepare the shot, etc., then I think I'd definitely consider that option.
BigTrancer
Last edited:
BigTrancer
Bluelight Crew
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Dunno? Nothing to do with me. I read the actual post, but perhaps the original poster retracted it.
BigTrancer
BigTrancer
twominds
Bluelighter
Why would you class this as a sensitive topic Apollo?apollo said:Damn, I missed it...
We understand this is a sensitive topic, so if you wish to post annonymously, PM the post to BT, myself or one of the other moderators and we can post it for you.
BigTrancer
Bluelight Crew
- Joined
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- 7,342
The reason I originally suggested this may be an option, is that I know some people who use IV drugs but prefer not to publicise that information on BL where their friends may be able to identify them from their nickname. Even among 'liberal' minded drug users, there often remains a prejudice against needles, and some people discriminate between 'good' drugs and 'bad' drugs.
But, since personal experiences of injecting rooms hasn't really been covered in any detail here, I wanted to encourage anyone in that frame of mind to still share their story, even if they don't want to be identified.
BigTrancer
But, since personal experiences of injecting rooms hasn't really been covered in any detail here, I wanted to encourage anyone in that frame of mind to still share their story, even if they don't want to be identified.
BigTrancer
twominds
Bluelighter
I totally agree Big Trancer. Thanks.BigTrancer said:The reason I originally suggested this may be an option, is that I know some people who use IV drugs but prefer not to publicise that information on BL where their friends may be able to identify them from their nickname. Even among 'liberal' minded drug users, there often remains a prejudice against needles, and some people discriminate between 'good' drugs and 'bad' drugs.
But, since personal experiences of injecting rooms hasn't really been covered in any detail here, I wanted to encourage anyone in that frame of mind to still share their story, even if they don't want to be identified.
BigTrancer
mibrane
Bluelighter
(Mibrane raises hand)
I've been quite enjoying Thursday Delight and Continuum at the last couple of months and, conveniently, MSIC is basically directly on the other side of the club hosting those events.
Oddly enough for about the same length of time I've also been enjoying meth. After wandering all the way down to Rushcutters Bay park a few times I decided to go through th initial hassle of registering (it wasn't too long actually, its just they close at 10:30 and I'm only just arriving before that so i didn't want to hassle the staff. SO, first time you visit you need to go through a rego with a worker - drug most often used at the moment, other drugs used, length of use, any vein damage issues, rules of the MSIC etc)
I'm obviously pretty ofay with the safe injection thing anyway, I've actually toured the place on a work basis, and one of my workmates also does shifts there, so I was pretty clued in on what to expect.
Its basically divided into 3 rooms - reception and a closed room for the initial registrations.
Then you move into the second room and its basically little tables, with a hospital-steel bowl with your equipment in it. And away you go...
Stage 3 is basically recovery - you can stay a couple of minutes or an hour if you need it. Workers will watch you if you're over the edge on whatever.
Benefits for me: (i) It happens to be located near somewhere I am going and want to use just before I get there. (ii) Its well lit. (iii) I'm often using on my own so I know if something does go wrong (and, for the record, I've lasted 10 years of injecting without overdosing) I will be attended to. (iv) I don't have to carry a dirty around with me all night or until I find a sharpsafe (i've also never dumped a fit)
Problems I have with it (and these are often reflected in research we,a nd MSIC itself, have done with more regular users): (i) You can't split deals - its one perso, one table. Now this is to avoid standover or sharing of any equipment. ANd it has benefits. But often users do need to go halves in a deal. You can't do that. (ii) I often mix up a few of mine early in the evening and take one out with me. You can't bring in made up fits and have them there. Its not a big deal, but if I'm without scales it can be difficult to get your divisions right.
I've only been the twice, but that's a bit of a tidbit. I've got to jump off now, but may expand a little later on.
I'd also be really interested in reading any other reports.
I've been quite enjoying Thursday Delight and Continuum at the last couple of months and, conveniently, MSIC is basically directly on the other side of the club hosting those events.
Oddly enough for about the same length of time I've also been enjoying meth. After wandering all the way down to Rushcutters Bay park a few times I decided to go through th initial hassle of registering (it wasn't too long actually, its just they close at 10:30 and I'm only just arriving before that so i didn't want to hassle the staff. SO, first time you visit you need to go through a rego with a worker - drug most often used at the moment, other drugs used, length of use, any vein damage issues, rules of the MSIC etc)
I'm obviously pretty ofay with the safe injection thing anyway, I've actually toured the place on a work basis, and one of my workmates also does shifts there, so I was pretty clued in on what to expect.
Its basically divided into 3 rooms - reception and a closed room for the initial registrations.
Then you move into the second room and its basically little tables, with a hospital-steel bowl with your equipment in it. And away you go...
Stage 3 is basically recovery - you can stay a couple of minutes or an hour if you need it. Workers will watch you if you're over the edge on whatever.
Benefits for me: (i) It happens to be located near somewhere I am going and want to use just before I get there. (ii) Its well lit. (iii) I'm often using on my own so I know if something does go wrong (and, for the record, I've lasted 10 years of injecting without overdosing) I will be attended to. (iv) I don't have to carry a dirty around with me all night or until I find a sharpsafe (i've also never dumped a fit)
Problems I have with it (and these are often reflected in research we,a nd MSIC itself, have done with more regular users): (i) You can't split deals - its one perso, one table. Now this is to avoid standover or sharing of any equipment. ANd it has benefits. But often users do need to go halves in a deal. You can't do that. (ii) I often mix up a few of mine early in the evening and take one out with me. You can't bring in made up fits and have them there. Its not a big deal, but if I'm without scales it can be difficult to get your divisions right.
I've only been the twice, but that's a bit of a tidbit. I've got to jump off now, but may expand a little later on.
I'd also be really interested in reading any other reports.
johnboy
Bluelight Crew
I'll be doing up a whole 'nother thread on this but I'll put it here for now.
Bent
Bluelighter
I'm curious...are there limitations to the drugs that you can use in the rooms?
As in is it just the standard injectable (heroin/meth) or could you if you wanted inject anything else? (Coke, pills, etc). Indeed can you rack up lines, or smoke under supervision. What sort of supervision is there whilst you're actually injecting?
Further, in terms of the actual action of injecting, is there any supervision/advise given as to how to safely inject? (First time users for example?).
As in is it just the standard injectable (heroin/meth) or could you if you wanted inject anything else? (Coke, pills, etc). Indeed can you rack up lines, or smoke under supervision. What sort of supervision is there whilst you're actually injecting?
Further, in terms of the actual action of injecting, is there any supervision/advise given as to how to safely inject? (First time users for example?).
I would like to say i find this thread most interesting, although i have no personal experience other than walking past the clinic, i do not have a problem with at all. however, i do agree with BT or/and APOLLO, i see the sensitivity, because i am one of those that does considering I.V. to be on that borderline of acceptable drugs.
thanks for you input Mibrane.
thanks for you input Mibrane.
twominds
Bluelighter
From what I hear the are no limits to what substances you IV. According to the Kings Cross injection room Heroin has approx. 85% of the users, while cocaine is second in line. I seriously doubt you can smoke or snort drugs, its not an open venue for all drug use. Its set up for the health of IV users and to get them off the street. Where they also have access to counselling or medical examinations.Bent said:
BongoBongo
Bluelighter
I had an injection at the Dentist's room the other day !!!!!
(Crude attempt to lighten the topic)8)
(Crude attempt to lighten the topic)8)
mibrane
Bluelighter
Ahh, Bent. Some interesting issues you raise.
Firstly, one of the big issues the users' movement has had with MSIC is the eclusion criteria (ie. who do they have to tell to piss off and shoot up in the back lane. All due respect to the staff, but this is essentially the situation they are placed in.)
One exclusion criteria is first time injectors - surely a group that could benefit from supervision. While staff can give general advice on safe injecting practices they cannot guide you through your whack. And its not just first time injectors who would benefit from this. Often users will have been injected by another, and then either fall out with that crowd, move to another place, or have their friend/ lover imprisoned, and then have to work out how to do it themselves. FTR, user group peer educators are frequently called upon to assist with this sort of step-by-step safe injecting assistance, and in almost all situations we are more than happy to provide it. The other point to m ake here is that its much easier to instil safe injecting practices in a new user than to change established practices that may be potentially harmful. I utilised safe injecting guides to help me get it right after finding myself in the sort of situation I talk about above (had been injected by a friend, moved back east from Perth, didn't have anything for a few months, but then when i wanted to use again I wanted to inject.) While I made a bit of a mess of myself at first, having access to SI info from the outset has meant I've never shared fits, still have great veins, etc. And I've passed on those concepts when I've used with others, and especially if I've initiated, and I've seen the way that others initiated into safe practices keep them.
Secondly, all illicit substances can be injected at MSIC. Interestingly, the main drug which some choose to inject which you can't whack at MSIC is the one the government dishes out - methadone.
the heroin first, cocaine second stats are probably getting a little dated now; if meth has not already paseed coke, it is certainly rapidly approaching being used more often
Smoking of any substance is not permitted - that's basically government public/ occupational health and safety issue. If disposal is done appropriately there is basically no health risk to staff from users injecting. But being in a room where cigarettes are being smoked all day - let alone meth being thrown into the mix - can obviously have a significant effect on the health of workers and other users.
Firstly, one of the big issues the users' movement has had with MSIC is the eclusion criteria (ie. who do they have to tell to piss off and shoot up in the back lane. All due respect to the staff, but this is essentially the situation they are placed in.)
One exclusion criteria is first time injectors - surely a group that could benefit from supervision. While staff can give general advice on safe injecting practices they cannot guide you through your whack. And its not just first time injectors who would benefit from this. Often users will have been injected by another, and then either fall out with that crowd, move to another place, or have their friend/ lover imprisoned, and then have to work out how to do it themselves. FTR, user group peer educators are frequently called upon to assist with this sort of step-by-step safe injecting assistance, and in almost all situations we are more than happy to provide it. The other point to m ake here is that its much easier to instil safe injecting practices in a new user than to change established practices that may be potentially harmful. I utilised safe injecting guides to help me get it right after finding myself in the sort of situation I talk about above (had been injected by a friend, moved back east from Perth, didn't have anything for a few months, but then when i wanted to use again I wanted to inject.) While I made a bit of a mess of myself at first, having access to SI info from the outset has meant I've never shared fits, still have great veins, etc. And I've passed on those concepts when I've used with others, and especially if I've initiated, and I've seen the way that others initiated into safe practices keep them.
Secondly, all illicit substances can be injected at MSIC. Interestingly, the main drug which some choose to inject which you can't whack at MSIC is the one the government dishes out - methadone.
the heroin first, cocaine second stats are probably getting a little dated now; if meth has not already paseed coke, it is certainly rapidly approaching being used more often
Smoking of any substance is not permitted - that's basically government public/ occupational health and safety issue. If disposal is done appropriately there is basically no health risk to staff from users injecting. But being in a room where cigarettes are being smoked all day - let alone meth being thrown into the mix - can obviously have a significant effect on the health of workers and other users.
Bent
Bluelighter
Thanks mibrane - I'm sort of surprised (but I suppose not really) that 1st time users don't get help, considering that in my mind anyway they'd be the #1 group that should get assistance - for a few reason including...
1. Counselling would be available before they've ever IV'd...IE do they really want to start IVing drugs, risked involved, proper techniques, blah, blah.
2. Having made the decision, and if the premence of the venue is to provide a safe and supervised area for IV users, surely 1st time users need the most supervision! If I'd ever plan to IV, I'd sure as hell like to know how to do it properly, and for some reason I don't think the local bulk billing medical clinc would show me!
Also, the stats (even if outdated) are interesting, I wouldn't have thought that coke would have been right up there, but would have expected both meth and heroin to be at the top.
1. Counselling would be available before they've ever IV'd...IE do they really want to start IVing drugs, risked involved, proper techniques, blah, blah.
2. Having made the decision, and if the premence of the venue is to provide a safe and supervised area for IV users, surely 1st time users need the most supervision! If I'd ever plan to IV, I'd sure as hell like to know how to do it properly, and for some reason I don't think the local bulk billing medical clinc would show me!
Also, the stats (even if outdated) are interesting, I wouldn't have thought that coke would have been right up there, but would have expected both meth and heroin to be at the top.
BigTrancer
Bluelight Crew
- Joined
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- Messages
- 7,342
^ I can follow your reasoning pretty well, and I feel that first-time users are quite often the ones who could use some knowledgeable, experienced help.
However, I would imagine that among the most-repeated community objections to injecting rooms would be something along the lines of "don't want our taxes paying for centres that teach people how to be junkies". I gather that a 'no first time users' policy would have its foundations in placating that concern, because that way the rooms are set up to help existing IV drug users, but not invite or instruct potential new IV users. I'm not sure exactly the reasoning, but there are a few reasons why this rule could be in existance.
It's really a minor technicality, I guess. If someone goes to an injecting room and has never shot up before, and tells the truth about it and gets declined registration, the staff in attendance would hopefully at least be able to give them information about where to get clean syringes from and/or places to find 'safe injecting' information or other syringe-related harm reduction? Then they could educate themselves before the fact, and if they decide to go through with IV use, they can have a stab
at it with clean equipment (and hopefully sensible doses of drugs). That way they can learn how to hit a vein easily without getting blood everywhere, learn their dose, and then make use of an injecting room before becoming so familiar with the process that safety matters are overlooked or forgotten.
BigTrancer
However, I would imagine that among the most-repeated community objections to injecting rooms would be something along the lines of "don't want our taxes paying for centres that teach people how to be junkies". I gather that a 'no first time users' policy would have its foundations in placating that concern, because that way the rooms are set up to help existing IV drug users, but not invite or instruct potential new IV users. I'm not sure exactly the reasoning, but there are a few reasons why this rule could be in existance.
It's really a minor technicality, I guess. If someone goes to an injecting room and has never shot up before, and tells the truth about it and gets declined registration, the staff in attendance would hopefully at least be able to give them information about where to get clean syringes from and/or places to find 'safe injecting' information or other syringe-related harm reduction? Then they could educate themselves before the fact, and if they decide to go through with IV use, they can have a stab
at it with clean equipment (and hopefully sensible doses of drugs). That way they can learn how to hit a vein easily without getting blood everywhere, learn their dose, and then make use of an injecting room before becoming so familiar with the process that safety matters are overlooked or forgotten.BigTrancer