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  • LAVA Moderator: Shinji Ikari

Why are all HR Departments Almost Exclusively Staffed by Women?

No, that particular instance was concering a friend and her job. Not one of mine. Look...all depts. in corporate and academic institions are playing dirty. Very few of individuals are good or give a shit about other's suffering. What is this fantasy bi-coastal ski world that you live in alasdair?

My beef is mainly about what is going on the hiring process. I always knew better than to mess with HR if I had a problem. I threaten to kick people's asses and/or take them to court when I have a problem. It doesn't earn me raises, but it keeps backbiting monkeys of my fucking back!

It has less to do with HR being staffed almost exclusively by women than it does with it being staffed with American women are more like to buy into the structure of corporate submissiveness and phoniness.

But, ali, I think you embody this problem well with your constant posts saying, "if there is a problem...it must be you" as if everybody else is always doing the right thing and the world is perfect and completely just and fair.
 
you made a claim: "Most of them are extrememely poor decision makers and completely unfamiliar with any real policies." when what you meant (perhaps) to write was "Most HR people I've met are extrememely poor decision makers and completely unfamiliar with any real policies."

the former is a statement about millions of people with absolutely nothing to back it up. the latter is an unimpeachable personal opinion.

when somebody makes a claim they should be comfortable - even happy - to defend it and back it up with some substantiation. when people can't or won't do that (instead perhaps sending an insulting private message) that tells me everything i need to know about the veracity of their comments.

i don't think the world is perfect, nor completely just and fair. far from it. but then, you don't really know me at all, do you. you just think you do.

and "extrememely poor"? lolirony :)

regards

alasdair
 
MyFinalRest said:
My beef is mainly about what is going on the hiring process. I always knew better than to mess with HR if I had a problem. I threaten to kick people's asses and/or take them to court when I have a problem. It doesn't earn me raises, but it keeps backbiting monkeys of my fucking back!
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no wonder you support unemployment discrimination. i'd rather hire a monkey than sue happy tough guy.
 
ChickenScratch said:
no wonder you support unemployment discrimination. i'd rather hire a monkey than sue happy tough guy.
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No prospective employers know anything about me. I've never been fired. I stood up for myself in a couple of shitty minimum wage jobs that nobody knows would even exist. I wasn't a rich boy and daddy didn't provide great social connections for me, so I had it rough. Trust me, nobody gives me a bad review because I never was the bad guy in any situation.

The problem is that my individually tailored cover letters and resumes that were proofread and contained zero mistakes were likely never even read because some horny hiring manager wants to staff his office with vagina in hopes he can get some leverage on his wife by getting a blowjob in the office.

Do you and ali have anything constructive to say or do you want to have a shit talking battle?
 
MyFinalRest said:
No prospective employers know anything about me. I've never been fired. I stood up for myself in a couple of shitty minimum wage jobs that nobody knows would even exist. I wasn't a rich boy and daddy didn't provide great social connections for me, so I had it rough. Trust me, nobody gives me a bad review because I never was the bad guy in any situation.

The problem is that my individually tailored cover letters and resumes that were proofread and contained zero mistakes were likely never even read because some horny hiring manager wants to staff his office with vagina in hopes he can get some leverage on his wife by getting a blowjob in the office.

Do you and ali have anything constructive to say or do you want to have a shit talking battle?
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no, i agree with a lot of what you're saying about HR. but the bottom line is, people check references and do background checks. if it comes up that you sued one of your employers, or got fired for being a tough guy, you're not going to get the job. at least, you're not going to get a good job.
 
ChickenScratch said:
no, i agree with a lot of what you're saying about HR. but the bottom line is, people check references and do background checks. if it comes up that you sued one of your employers, or got fired for being a tough guy, you're not going to get the job. at least, you're not going to get a good job.
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I never sued anybody or beat anybody up. It wasn't my supervisor that caused problems. It was another employee and the HR woman had a "girl-crush" on her. My supervisor even later got fired from their insanity but he did sue and got his job back and nice sum of money too. The problem makers are history, but my supervisor has always had my back and would give me a great review...if anybody would actually call him!

I never was invlolved in anything that would come up on a background check (not even drugs) other than maybe some periods of low credit scores. But most people aren't even subjected to background checks because their shit is thrown out for stupid reasons.

You know sometimes you can't just help it and you gotta raise your voice and talk about getting a lawyer. That doesn't make me a tattoed motorcycle gang member.
 
MyFinalRest said:
Do you and ali have anything constructive to say or do you want to have a shit talking battle?
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if you're going to populate your responses with ridiculous generalisations, it's hardly shit-talking to both point that out and ask you to back up your claims with some substantiation.

if you can't or won't do that, it says everything i need to know about the veracity of your claims.

alasdair
 
Re: the OP....I once worked for a large national retail corporation and the HR dept head at my store was a straight male. That was 10 years ago and they have since changed their HR policy so the individual stores no longer have hiring power. Instead, a district HR manager roams around hiring people at different stores on an as-needed basis. I think this policy of streamlining HR is becoming more common in the corporate world. It works for management because having a hiring person who is disconnected from the local store cuts down on the favoritism that can exist when the HR person becomes buddies with people who stop by his or her office to chat. HOWEVER, I think it sucks for job seekers exactly because they don't have an office to go to where they can meet an HR person, shake their hand, and look them in the eye and sell themselves. And it sucks for employees who need an HR manager asap and the HR manager works at the district level and can only meet someone by appointment.

I read the article and completely agree with the two comments at the bottom of the article. As an anthropologist, if there's one thing I know it's people. And from my experiences in life, I have known women who were outspoken, loud, and aggressive and I have known men who were quiet, calm, yet reasonably assertive. My point is that BOTH men and women can be in HR positions and can be quite good at it. Besides, I don't trust the source of the article and the author outed herself as a woman who made her decision based on a couple of life experiences that were exceptions rather than the norm.

Re: the rest of the thread. It's not my job to choose sides in the dick-sizing that's going on but it needs to simmer down or I'll lock the thread.

If you have a problem with that.....call HR.
 
In the mid-atlantic and southern US, it seems to divide heavily along gender lines. Sometimes it's difficul to even find out who is in the HR dept, but when I do, it's still coming up as all female, and this is especially true in higher education.

I spoke to one of my old professors yesterday and I asked him if he was once on a hiring committee, and he was. He said that the HR dept. head (was a female too, but that's beside the point) did do the initial screening and that it was ridiculous. The committe had her go and dig out her rejected applicants and they chose a great person from this stack.

I think I would rather deal with some real people and real managers to get hired rather than an HR. HR's are like chicks on online dating sites it seems who are just reading the first line, going with some magic gut feeling and tossing. If she's religious, you can get approved to the next level by saying you love Christ in your opening sentence. Individual whims can get ridiculous and they aren't going deep at all for these initial screenings. HR doesn't have to depend on these people so why should they give a shit?
 
MyFinalRest said:
In the mid-atlantic and southern US, it seems to divide heavily along gender lines. Sometimes it's difficul to even find out who is in the HR dept, but when I do, it's still coming up as all female, and this is especially true in higher education.

I spoke to one of my old professors yesterday and I asked him if he was once on a hiring committee, and he was. He said that the HR dept. head (was a female too, but that's beside the point) did do the initial screening and that it was ridiculous. The committe had her go and dig out her rejected applicants and they chose a great person from this stack.

I think I would rather deal with some real people and real managers to get hired rather than an HR. HR's are like chicks on online dating sites it seems who are just reading the first line, going with some magic gut feeling and tossing. If she's religious, you can get approved to the next level by saying you love Christ in your opening sentence. Individual whims can get ridiculous and they aren't going deep at all for these initial screenings. HR doesn't have to depend on these people so why should they give a shit?
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I'm from Texas but the place where I had a male HR head was in the midwest. I don't know if the geographic location made a difference. I agree with the difficulty in finding out who is in the HR dept. I found this out as a job-seeker a few years ago. I would go somewhere armed with an application, resume, and cover letter.....ask for HR and they would look at me like I was a god damned UFO. I think that may depend on the industry and transparency of the organization. I just checked my university's website and out of 18 staff members in their HR dept, 3 of them are male. For all 18 their office, phone number, and email address are all published with their name and title. I guess my school is an exception to your experience, although 3/18 still makes them a little heavy on the estrogen. My school is in TX btw.

I know it is frustrating when all they go by is a resume and cover letter to filter through the applicants. Try to imagine how difficult it must be to be in HR and read (or skim) 300 applications for like 10 positions. It would take a long ass time to interview all 300 applicants. They have to screen applicants somehow just to have time to interview the "good" ones. I'm not defending them, I'm just stating how I believe it to work. The implications of all this is that you have to play the game and by their rules. You have to have solid references. You have to make a resume/cover letter that stands out from the rest. If your resume is too long....trim it down. If your resume is too concise....beef it up.

MFR I think you said you had a proofreader for your resumes. Has it always been just that one person? Have you run it by different people? I'm just trying to get a feel for what you're doing without making assumptions. Do you mind sharing what industry or industries you are trying to break into?
 
MyFinalRest said:
That's absurd and believe it or not, that is sexist. There are instances of bigger and stronger people being able to handle certain jobs better etc. but that doesn't always break on gender lines either. The largest part of the gender disparities is sexism and homosocial discrimination. There is no good reason why men are not being hired in staff and HR jobs. Must you believe in the myth of the confident, self-assured male who takes the lead and the female who submits and serves behind the scenes? You've made many posts in SLR that makes it clear that men who do not follow this stereotype have no sexual worth to you, and perhaps you can't imagine a man in a traditionally female held staff position either? How bout imagining a female bulldozer operator? Women can do that job just as well as any man.
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I am unsure how my post was sexist at all.
It is improbably to have every job to have exactly half females and half males. How is that being sexist? What if there is an odd number? Then there HAS TO be more of one gender than another.

Yes you are right that I am interested in dating a guy who is confident. That being said, I NEVER once said that females should submit and serve behind the scenes. I'm not sure WHERE you got the idea but it's far from true. Again - yes, I like confident guys. I'm not going to go through that again. That doesn't mean that unconfident guys are useless to me. As well, a confident guy can still hold a nurse job, or an HR job, or a secretarial job (all stereotypically female jobs). What does it matter a guy's self assurance? I also think girls should have confidence too ... like myself, for example.

I see nothing wrong with a female bulldozer operator either, as long as she's good at the job. Again - what did I ever say to make anyone think that I'd have something against that? I'm all for gender equality.
 
Jerry Atrick said:
I know it is frustrating when all they go by is a resume and cover letter to filter through the applicants. Try to imagine how difficult it must be to be in HR and read (or skim) 300 applications for like 10 positions. It would take a long ass time to interview all 300 applicants. They have to screen applicants somehow just to have time to interview the "good" ones. I'm not defending them, I'm just stating how I believe it to work. The implications of all this is that you have to play the game and by their rules. You have to have solid references. You have to make a resume/cover letter that stands out from the rest. If your resume is too long....trim it down. If your resume is too concise....beef it up.
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It's not like your cover letter is going to be the next blockbuster novel. Maybe writing about hedonistic sex a la Shades of Grey will get that resume "noticed."

If 300 applicants are applying for one position, there's a serious unemployment/under-employment/job-hopping crisis going on, and I would not mind if the government intervened here.

But really, you never know what's in the mind of an HR person and what they are choosing to throw out. The rules and regulations to a radio station give-away contest are laid out more clearly than any hiring policy - if there even is a "policy."
Most likely, the big criteria they are looking for is "previous experience" doing the same exact job. Experience is hardly everything, and may very well account for nothing. In this economy, young people aren't going to "break into" shit.

"Trying to make yourself stand out" is no solution to the hiring crisis. Besides, you don't know what you are getting in that honeymoon phase either. It's all corporate culture bullshit that places the blame on ultra high under and unemployment on the job seeker.

llama112 said:
Yes you are right that I am interested in dating a guy who is confident.
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How long does it take you to make such a serious judgement about a man's personality? Have you been right everytime?

It makes me wonder what these women in HR are up to? Are they treating it like some reality show dating game? Are they bringing their female dating "skills" into the picture?

No man or woman has telepathic ability that I know of. There has got to be a better process for evaluating people rather than the "gut-feelling" and snap judgement based on a shitty cover letter and resume. Cover letters and resumes just make me want to puke. It's disgusting American culture at its worst!
 
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Here's your daily dose of corporate confidence:

The Australian Human Resources Institute study found that 45.9% of HR managers either believed HR was not effective, or they were unsure about it. Nearly three-quarters of non-HR people had the same view.

Indeed, 80.4% of non-HR respondents had little understanding of what HR managers did to justify their existence.
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http://www.theage.com.au/news/busin...int-of-hr-again/2007/11/16/1195321760466.html

Welcome to a world where a phony image is held high above any actual substance. Not only does such an upside-down mentality exist - it has been departmentalized!
 
MyFinalRest said:
It's not like your cover letter is going to be the next blockbuster novel. Maybe writing about hedonistic sex a la Shades of Grey will get that resume "noticed."

If 300 applicants are applying for one position, there's a serious unemployment/under-employment/job-hopping crisis going on, and I would not mind if the government intervened here.

But really, you never know what's in the mind of an HR person and what they are choosing to throw out. The rules and regulations to a radio station give-away contest are laid out more clearly than any hiring policy - if there even is a "policy."
Most likely, the big criteria they are looking for is "previous experience" doing the same exact job. Experience is hardly everything, and may very well account for nothing. In this economy, young people aren't going to "break into" shit.

"Trying to make yourself stand out" is no solution to the hiring crisis. Besides, you don't know what you are getting in that honeymoon phase either. It's all corporate culture bullshit that places the blame on ultra high under and unemployment on the job seeker.



How long does it take you to make such a serious judgement about a man's personality? Have you been right everytime?

It makes me wonder what these women in HR are up to? Are they treating it like some reality show dating game? Are they bringing their female dating "skills" into the picture?

No man or woman has telepathic ability that I know of. There has got to be a better process for evaluating people rather than the "gut-feelling" and snap judgement based on a shitty cover letter and resume. Cover letters and resumes just make me want to puke. It's disgusting American culture at its worst!
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I agree wholeheartedly that resumes and cover letters are poor evaluation tools but HR can't interview everyone.

Clearly you do not wish to play the game by their rules so it's no wonder you're not getting hired. You came in here complaining and asking for advice and I gave you the best advice I could give and you responded with more complaining.

Do you really want help or are you just here to rant?
 
I wasn't asking for help or advice on how to try to slither into the corrupt structure of American corporate culture. I'm here to have a discussion, and a large part of that discussion includes complaining!

People need to quit trying to affably ride this bullshit dick statue and say hey...this sucks!
 
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Been reading this thread, silently agreeing with all the hate toward HR, upon thinking why however the only reason I can think is that they've been instrumental in every disciplinary and sacking I've ever had.
 
MyFinalRest said:
I wasn't asking for help or advice on how to try to slither into the corrupt structure of American corporate culture. I'm here to have a discussion, and a large part of that discussion includes complaining!

People need to quit trying to affably ride this bullshit dick statue and say hey...this sucks!
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Duly noted.

A couple of facts about me. I do not currently work in the corporate world although their is an HR dept at the non-profit agency where I work. I have worked for some large major retail chains in the past. On average I have more often than not had good luck with HR, especially when I was younger and without criminal record. Does that mean I'm better than you? No, I am not better than you. The only things to which I can attribute my good luck with HR is that I speak my mind, I'm a hard fuckin worker, and I don't kiss anyone's ass. That being said, every time I've been asked to be promoted to a supervisory position in retail I declined. In that sense you and I are not very different. You hate HR. I typically have problems with management...well certain managers.

So you can't get hired in the corporate world. I'm sorry about that. Suck it up and do something about it. Do something constructive like finding someone else to proofread your resume. You're not accomplishing anything by sitting here bitching about it....other than giving us free entertainment on the interwebz. It appears as if you are not even trying to get hired. Maybe I'm wrong. I hope I am.
 
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