Social Justice White/Straight/Cis/Male Privilege

[tubgirl.jpg]

@Atelier3

No, I think that's what @tubgirl.jpg is saying? If a white person isn't a racist homophobic woman beater, then that stereotype shouldn't bother them. I think that's what he said, anyway Maybe I misunderstood it. Just asking for clarification, because if you apply that logic to the black community clearly it is problematic... so why does it apply to white people?

I don't understand.

My logic might be flawed. But that's how I see it. I don't feel like a raping, homophobic wifebeater just bc I'm white.

 

[tubgirl.jpg]

There's one thing I really don't like about being a white cis male, and it's the expectations.
You're supposed to be strong and a sports freak, you're supposed to like football, and cars and all that nonsensical bullshit, You're supposed to be this confident, macho weirdo that talks to women like shit, but somehow gets laid even more for that. Everyone expects so much of you, it's really sickening. You can't be emotional. If you're emotional, people will make fun of you, telling you to put on your 'big boy pants'(read that in another thread, had to use it). You can't read, because reading is for girls. You have to always keep it together. You can't order specific cocktails because they are somehow "gay", you can't like certain music, or art, ...

It's a dog's world & It's really not all that easy, I think everyone has their own stereotypes of what they should and shouldn't be, being socially "persecuted" for not being the ideal, but people are super rough to white hetero males, because we are the "privileged" ones, like 213 years ago.

Shit. I hate sports, football is just a bunch of grown men chasing an oddly shaped ball, cars are stupid.
I'm emotional. My pants size is not big boy size. I read all the time. I fall apart every other hour. I love cocktails.

Fuck expectations.

 

[December Flower]

Shit. I hate sports, football is just a bunch of grown men chasing an oddly shaped ball, cars are stupid.
I'm emotional. My pants size is not big boy size. I read all the time. I fall apart every other hour. I love cocktails.

Fuck expectations.

Well I'm the same, I'm just saying I was made fun of by my schoolmates, and later even adults for my behaviour. And I'm Autistic, I have reason to behave like I do. It's not manly to watch birds and calculate their impetus up, so I was made fun of for doing things like that. People think Autists don't realize when you make fun of us - we might not understand why you make fun, but we understand that you do, and it feels bad.

Not sure how it is elsewhere, I mostly only know this secluded land, and we're very old in our ways.
There's something they expect a man to be, and if you're not exactly that, you're not a man in their eyes.
Being a man sucks ass, here. I'd rather be a woman having people kiss my ass over achievements that compare to "successfully clicked a mouse-button, wow that's so amazing how you did that" just because I'm hot. I'm Bavarian, of course I'd be hot.
As a man you can get together 50000 bucks, found your own company, and dad's like "Meh, let's see if it works"

 

[Xorkoth]

There's one thing I really don't like about being a white cis male, and it's the expectations.
You're supposed to be strong and a sports freak, you're supposed to like football, and cars and all that nonsensical bullshit, You're supposed to be this confident, macho weirdo that talks to women like shit, but somehow gets laid even more for that. Everyone expects so much of you, it's really sickening. You can't be emotional. If you're emotional, people will make fun of you, telling you to put on your 'big boy pants'(read that in another thread, had to use it). You can't read, because reading is for girls. You have to always keep it together. You can't order specific cocktails because they are somehow "gay", you can't like certain music, or art, ...

It's a dog's world & It's really not all that easy, I think everyone has their own stereotypes of what they should and shouldn't be, being socially "persecuted" for not being the ideal, but people are super rough to white hetero males, because we are the "privileged" ones, like 213 years ago.

Though I did grow up with some of this (the sports in particular), it seems to be getting much better, at least where I am. The idea of reading being for girls sounds extremely archaic to me, I never got a bit of that. I always associated most of the kind of stuff you've mentioned with being a male in general, not specifically a white male.

I've found that as an adult, all you need to do is project a quiet confidence in yourself and you can be whatever you want.

That said, I just realized I'm American and you're not, it's likely quite different depending on where you're from/where you live.

 

[tubgirl.jpg]

It's not manly to watch birds and calculate their impetus up, so I was made fun of for doing things like that.

I'd say manliness in the traditional sense is as useful as an extra asshole placed on your forehead. Birds are awesome.

I'm just saying I was made fun of by my schoolmates, and later even adults for my behaviour.

I stand corrected; people are the worst. Sorry to hear that man.

People think Autists don't realize when you make fun of us - we might not understand why you make fun, but we understand that you do, and it feels bad.

This infuriates me, people who act and treat autists like they're idiots. My best friends little brother is autistic, he's one of the brightest people I know.

There's something they expect a man to be, and if you're not exactly that, you're not a man in their eyes.

It's easy to say sitting comfortable in Scandinavia where it's almost the opposite, but a man is just a set of cliches.
Fuck'em dude. Try to ignore their ignorant asses.

Be you, not what they want you do be. Hit me up on PM if you ever wanna talk man.

 

[tubgirl.jpg]

I've found that as an adult, all you need to do is project a quiet confidence in yourself and you can be whatever you want.

I agree 100%.

 

[Jabberwocky]

I think there is quite a class thing in this sports/beer/cars/reading is for pussies thing.

The parents that send their boys to public (uk), prep? (US), or private (Auatralia) schools certainly expect their sons to be a lot more well rounded than that. And the participation rates in broader activities like debate/theatre/music etc etc are pretty high.

You need that stuff on your resume to get into Yale and a top tier investment bank or law firm when you graduate.

 

[December Flower]

Though I did grow up with some of this (the sports in particular), it seems to be getting much better, at least where I am. The idea of reading being for girls sounds extremely archaic to me, I never got a bit of that. I always associated most of the kind of stuff you've mentioned with being a male in general, not specifically a white male.

I've found that as an adult, all you need to do is project a quiet confidence in yourself and you can be whatever you want.

That said, I just realized I'm American and you're not, it's likely quite different depending on where you're from/where you live.

O yeah, I think it's for males in general, well straight males. As soon as you're gay, you can pretty much run around in a tutu and people will congratulate you for your bravery.

No my people are very very secluded, it's hard to describe in the modern world ^^
maybe I can find a picture that demonstrates this
hm, kinda found something

Spoiler

You can see how small this settlement is, and we're really kettled in by the mountains. There's no bus, no train, nothing..
Actually there is a bus, once a day, that brings you to a settlement that's slightly bigger. Also there is a road.

Our views of how the world should look, and how males and females should behave are still very strong. Many of our lives just get chosen by what society expects of us.

 

[Xorkoth]

Oh wow, that's so tiny! Beautiful though.

 

[December Flower]

This infuriates me, people who act and treat autists like they're idiots. My best friends little brother is autistic, he's one of the brightest people I know.

I'm one of the brightest people I know. OK, there's not much competition around here, but I'm quite learned, even for non-farmer in the middle of nowhere standards. But there's going to be many people who hear about my condition, and suddenly talk to me like I am a toddler, or try to use simpler words, or explain things like "I'm smiling because I'm happy". Yeah, thanks for the heads up, Sherlock, tell me when you caught Moriarty. It's sort of the same principle, they see something and expect something. Just like with being a male, or a female, or whatever: there's a certain stereotype and people deep down WANT you to behave like that

I really hate that. I'm OK with people, even if direct contact(for example shaking hands) is often a no-go. That makes me more oft than not rather not say I'm Autistic, but then I'm just a weird science nerd, that keeps tapping his fingers 2 counts per second. It's rly hard being a dude, sometimes.

 

[December Flower]

Oh wow, that's so tiny! Beautiful though.

We have a market where you can get fresh vegetables and stuff, every wednesday :D if you miss it you're fucked.
Cuz from the store you can't really get much ^^

 

[tubgirl.jpg]

I'm one of the brightest people I know. OK, there's not much competition around here, but I'm quite learned, even for non-farmer in the middle of nowhere standards. But there's going to be many people who hear about my condition, and suddenly talk to me like I am a toddler, or try to use simpler words, or explain things like "I'm smiling because I'm happy". Yeah, thanks for the heads up, Sherlock, tell me when you caught Moriarty. It's sort of the same principle, they see something and expect something. Just like with being a male, or a female, or whatever: there's a certain stereotype and people deep down WANT you to behave like that

I really hate that. I'm OK with people, even if direct contact(for example shaking hands) is often a no-go. That makes me more oft than not rather not say I'm Autistic, but then I'm just a weird science nerd, that keeps tapping his fingers 2 counts per second. It's rly hard being a dude, sometimes.

First of all; fuck yeah, that's the spirit. Second, that cracked me up, haha. Shit man. You should say that to someone if they say stupid shit like that to you.

I avoid touching people and I don't want people to touch me all to much either. Unless we're naked, then touch away.

I get this nervous tic and starts to drum with with fingers, always a d-beat.

So, you're not any weirder than any other person.

And that thing about stereotypes is so fucking true it's tragic.

 

[Xorkoth]

Weird people are the best people. it takes courage to be different and own it. All the best people are "weird". Any shmuck can be just like everybody else.

 

[birdup.snaildown]

But there's going to be many people who hear about my condition, and suddenly talk to me like I am a toddler, or try to use simpler words, or explain things like "I'm smiling because I'm happy". Yeah, thanks for the heads up, Sherlock, tell me when you caught Moriarty. It's sort of the same principle, they see something and expect something. Just like with being a male, or a female, or whatever: there's a certain stereotype and people deep down WANT you to behave like that

I totally feel you on this one. I'm a disability support worker. I do community access stuff with people with all sorts of different disabilities, including autistic clients. People in the community are definitely patronizing but I think it's because they don't understand. Most of the time, people want to do/say the right thing. They are just ignorant. I used to work with a guy with muscular dystrophy who was basically a genius. He worked in robotics. But, still, people see the wheelchair and assume he has the mentality of a child. It's super frustrating. There definitely needs to be more awareness re: ASD and many other conditions.

As for the white/cis/straight/male thing, I've literally been told by numerous people that old white men are the root of all the world's problems. My grandfather was a war hero. His father was a gambling drunken bastard that abandoned him and his three brothers. My great grandmother had to raise four boys by herself during the depression. He had a hard life. His skin colour didn't magically make everything easy for him. Then, he got early onset Alzheimer's. In my mind, he is a perfect example of why you shouldn't use the term "old white men" broadly to account for injustice.

 

[mal3volent]

As soon as you're gay, you can pretty much run around in a tutu

I'm quite learned

It shows.

 

[December Flower]

First of all; fuck yeah, that's the spirit. Second, that cracked me up, haha. Shit man. You should say that to someone if they say stupid shit like that to you.

I avoid touching people and I don't want people to touch me all to much either. Unless we're naked, then touch away.

I get this nervous tic and starts to drum with with fingers, always a d-beat.

So, you're not any weirder than any other person.

And that thing about stereotypes is so fucking true it's tragic.

I do. I say what I think, pretty much. I have no ability to not to. So I have often been an ass to people for trying to be nicer to me - not directly an ass, but for example I will point out that their behaviour changed upon the shocking revealing of "the weird dude is actually an autist", who would have thought? I dislike false friendliness. We all deserve to be made fun of, or none of us do, that's how easy it is.

I'm OK touching females. They're just so much more clean than males, especially their hands. But I'm glad someone understands me here. I said Hallelujah(well i didn't say that) when Corona came and I realized "The handshake is dead forever!"
Fucking moronic practice, have you seen what males touch with their right hand?!

O the tapping is my self-stimulatory behaviour. I thought it's too weird so I keep hiding that I'm doing this. I'll cross my arms because secretly i just need to tap my rhythm. It's always 120 bpm/2Hz, though, there's never a change in the frequency. Maybe I can relax more about this, but I have had a lot of anger in class from my teachers and classmates, because this doesn't stop. I would keep on tapping for hours. This was ofc all much worse in my childhood, since my use/abuse of MDMA my friends say I'm much less of a robot (they mean it teasingly)

I totally feel you on this one. I'm a disability support worker. I do community access stuff with people with all sorts of different disabilities, including autistic clients. People in the community are definitely patronizing but I think it's because they don't understand. Most of the time, people want to do/say the right thing. They are just ignorant. I used to work with a guy with muscular dystrophy who was basically a genius. He worked in robotics. But, still, people see the wheelchair and assume he has the mentality of a child. It's super frustrating. There definitely needs to be more awareness re: ASD and many other conditions.

As for the white/cis/straight/male thing, I've literally been told by numerous people that old white men are the root of all the world's problems. My grandfather was a war hero. His father was a gambling drunken bastard that abandoned him and his three brothers. My great grandmother had to raise four boys by herself during the depression. He had a hard life. His skin colour didn't magically make everything easy for him. Then, he got early onset Alzheimer's. In my mind, he is a perfect example of why you shouldn't use the term "old white men" broadly to account for injustice.

It's a really horrible phenomenon. When I used to manage my home for the mentally & physically impaired, I had one patient, he couldn't speak or really move, but if this guy wasn't the smartest guy I ever met I don't know. And he absolutely loved me, because I treated him like any other person. Make a little joke here and there "let's go for a walk", haha. He really loved me, because I was treating him like a human, not like a "special", if that makes any sense. All the nurses were talking to him like they would to a child, and this guy had an IQ of over 180, I'm pretty sure. He knew absolutely everything(O he talked with a little board-computer mounted on his wheelchair) - also he was faster than a calculator, not literally ofc, but when you told him an equation he'd tell you the value of x in a heartbeart. Pretty impressive guy. But when nurses talk to you like "Aw, did you mess your pants over night, Mister?", you're truly overcome with the urge to destroy her kneecaps and see how she likes being talked down to.

 

[December Flower]

It shows.

Why, when I use a metaphor, is there always someone like "THAT'S NOT TRUE IT'S NOT THE EXACT SITUATION"
I know I'm bad at metaphors, thanks for pointing it out, dear.
However, I would still prefer to use them, because they are fun

What I meant is that being gay, for certain behaviour you would be congratulated for your bravery to do so.
Being straight, for the same behaviour you will be condemned.
That's a part of social overcompensation.

edit: also I mean by the "social justice movement"/general social pressure/the internet.
If you were gay here people would be like "What do you mean you don't like women?" ..."So then how do you have sex?" ... "No that can't be right, what about boobs?" .... "I've never heard of that"

 

[tubgirl.jpg]

Weird people are the best people. it takes courage to be different and own it. All the best people are "weird". Any shmuck can be just like everybody else.

Laying down the law. This statement is something to live by. Quirks are perks.

 

[mal3volent]

Why, when I use a metaphor, is there always someone like "THAT'S NOT TRUE IT'S NOT THE EXACT SITUATION"
I know I'm bad at metaphors, thanks for pointing it out, dear tinkle fairy.
However, I would still prefer to use them, because they are fun

What I meant is that being gay, for certain behaviour you would be congratulated for your bravery to do so.
Being straight, for the same behaviour you will be condemned.
That's a part of social overcompensation.

This is why I'm having trouble. You claim to be learned but obviously have trouble with the definition of bravery. Can you see why that might apply to a member of a minority group as opposed to the majority? What is brave about living openly as a heterosexual in a society that is primarily heterosexual?

 

[tubgirl.jpg]

I dislike false friendliness. We all deserve to be made fun of, or none of us do, that's how easy it is.

Fuck yes. 100 %

I'm OK touching females. They're just so much more clean than males, especially their hands. But I'm glad someone understands me here. I said Hallelujah(well i didn't say that) when Corona came and I realized "The handshake is dead forever!"
Fucking moronic practice, have you seen what males touch with their right hand?!

Oh, yeah. I prefer hanging out with women aswell, might be because I grew up with only sisters, but I often feel more comfortable.
I definitely do. I'm not gonna shake a hand again. Fist bump or nothing.
Hahahah, I actually enjoyed COVID for several reasons. I can spend days by myself without having to explain myself.
No mandatory social events. No big "group-hangouts" (fucking shoot me already).

Yeah, I know what I do with my hand. Wouldn't touch that thing with a stick.

Maybe I can relax more about this,

Easy to say for me, but I think you should try. If my hands aren't drumming, I pretend I play machine-gun bassdrums a lá Bloodbath with my feet.
I seldom sit completely still. I've been told by friends it's "annoying" if we're at a pub or something. Okay. So? I don't complain about your clumsy and awkward attempts to pick-up the bartender, let me drum in peace.

It's always 120 bpm/2Hz, though, there's never a change in the frequency.

This. I actually find this really fucking impressive. Have you tried to employ this skill to playing drums for example?