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Random Which serial killers or true crimes intrigue you?

There is a lot of thinking that the Villisca, Iowa axe murder case was perhaps the first modern-style serial killer case, as there were families and people killed like that in other states like Colorado, a couple in Kansas, and I think one of the original main suspects killed his family just like that just near Chicago in 1917 I think it was. The cops said that the murder scene and apparent modus operandi strongly suggested a cocaine fiend was the murderer, but then again, at that time, the people who wanted to ban Bolivian Marching Powder also claimed that C-Jam made African American men impervious to .32 calibre bullets . . .

I don't know if they really believed it back then or were trying to flush out the murderer, but the stories about the murder in the Kansas City, Omaha and other newspapers claimed that the coroner had used the retina of one of the children to obtain a picture of the killer, as if the last thing a person sees before dying is imprinted on the retina like a photograph and somehow retrievable.
 
Nicomorphinist said:
There is a lot of thinking that the Villisca, Iowa axe murder case was perhaps the first modern-style serial killer case, as there were families and people killed like that in other states like Colorado, a couple in Kansas, and I think one of the original main suspects killed his family just like that just near Chicago in 1917 I think it was. The cops said that the murder scene and apparent modus operandi strongly suggested a cocaine fiend was the murderer, but then again, at that time, the people who wanted to ban Bolivian Marching Powder also claimed that C-Jam made African American men impervious to .32 calibre bullets . . .

I don't know if they really believed it back then or were trying to flush out the murderer, but the stories about the murder in the Kansas City, Omaha and other newspapers claimed that the coroner had used the retina of one of the children to obtain a picture of the killer, as if the last thing a person sees before dying is imprinted on the retina like a photograph and somehow retrievable.
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Whoa, I hadn't heard about the cases in Kansas, and Omaha, and what do you mean "used the retina of one of the children to obtain a picture of the killer"?

Could you send me some links about those murders?

I just ordered a book I found online last night called "The Man From the Train" which theorizes that the Hinterkaiffeck murders and another 9 axe murder-killings of families throughout the United States between 1898--1920-something (including the Axe Murders of New Orleans which was the other case I forgot about) were all killed by the same man named Paul Mueller. I am assuming the cases you are referring to are some of the ones this author also attributes to the killer.

His theory is that every house that the killer killed at was near a train station and that this guy was a transient riding the train around the U.S. killing people with an axe and that he was a German immigrant who returned to Hinterkaifeck to kill there.

Now...I don't know if you have read about the Hinterkaiffeck murders (if not you really should) but I've often thought there was much in common between that and the Villisca case, but honestly, I have to be very doubtful that the same person who committed the Villisca crime in Iowa was the same one who killed those people in Hinterkaifeck Germany 10 years later in 1922.

Of course it was still possible to take a plane back then to kill in another country, but I don't know, it's much easier for me to buy that someone killed multiple families in the U.S. than that that same person ALSO went to Germany to commit a crime, but not impossible. It kind of seems like something some true crime addict like me would WANT to believe out of it being an interesting idea rather than it likely being true. However, i think it is VERY likely that some of the other axe murders in the U.S. at the time were committed by the same person who did the Villisca killings, but whether or not they were this Paul Mueller guy I'm not sure of.

I read some excerpts, and there were so many similarities between these cases: entire families killed, usually with the BLUNT end of the axe, axe left at crime scene, likelihood of killer hiding out in the house, train stations near houses, mirrors covered up, bodies covered up, wick burned down on a lamp, etc....very interesting theory.

Still seems more likely to me that the one in Germany was someone else, but I don't know, it intrigues me that they could be the same person.

I look forward to reading it.
 
Mycophile said:
Whoa, I hadn't heard about the cases in Kansas, and Omaha, and what do you mean "used the retina of one of the children to obtain a picture of the killer"?

Could you send me some links about those murders?

I just ordered a book I found online last night called "The Man From the Train" which theorizes that the Hinterkaiffeck murders and another 9 axe murder-killings of families throughout the United States between 1898--1920-something (including the Axe Murders of New Orleans which was the other case I forgot about) were all killed by the same man named Paul Mueller. I am assuming the cases you are referring to are some of the ones this author also attributes to the killer.

His theory is that every house that the killer killed at was near a train station and that this guy was a transient riding the train around the U.S. killing people with an axe and that he was a German immigrant who returned to Hinterkaifeck to kill there.

Now...I don't know if you have read about the Hinterkaiffeck murders (if not you really should) but I've often thought there was much in common between that and the Villisca case, but honestly, I have to be very doubtful that the same person who committed the Villisca crime in Iowa was the same one who killed those people in Hinterkaifeck Germany 10 years later in 1922.

Of course it was still possible to take a plane back then to kill in another country, but I don't know, it's much easier for me to buy that someone killed multiple families in the U.S. than that that same person ALSO went to Germany to commit a crime, but not impossible. It kind of seems like something some true crime addict like me would WANT to believe out of it being an interesting idea rather than it likely being true. However, i think it is VERY likely that some of the other axe murders in the U.S. at the time were committed by the same person who did the Villisca killings, but whether or not they were this Paul Mueller guy I'm not sure of.

I read some excerpts, and there were so many similarities between these cases: entire families killed, usually with the BLUNT end of the axe, axe left at crime scene, likelihood of killer hiding out in the house, train stations near houses, mirrors covered up, bodies covered up, wick burned down on a lamp, etc....very interesting theory.

Still seems more likely to me that the one in Germany was someone else, but I don't know, it intrigues me that they could be the same person.

I look forward to reading it.
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This site has lots of information information about the 1912 case and speculations on possible connexions to others: http://villiscaiowa.com/
another: https://allthatsinteresting.com/villisca-axe-murders

The newspaper articles about the axe murder strongly implied that the doctors had somehow used the retina of the victim to obtain what was essentially a photograph or daguerreotype of the last thing the victim saw, which they said was the killer swinging the axe, and I think this kind of thing, whether it was real medical speculation at the time, or a way to trick the perpetrator into confessing, later found its way into several works of fiction too by folks like Agatha Christie and I think there was recently a use of this plot element in a television programme, possibly NCIS . . .
 
Caught a show yesterday on a extreme Russian jail called "Black Dolphin" where they house the worst people in Russia. The documentary crew were talking to some Russian guy who is classed as the worst in the jail, the guy was doing life & his crime was he killed a family & turned them into sausages, not only did he eat them he passed his "product" around the local town for several months too.

Now that guy really got my attention I can tell you, I'll see if I can Google him as that is quite a crime in my view.
 
I'm a huge fan of serial killers and true crime... my two votes go to

1. William Bonin
2. Randy Kraft

It's hard for normal people to understand how someone could do things like this to other people..it is grim and and yet facinating to watch hear the stories
 
“In Cold Blood” by Truman Capote is the all time best true crime novel. He invented the genre and the movie with damn now I’m forgetting dudes name is excellent.

To sum it up, a family living on a rural farm in Kansas is brutally held hostage and killed one by one by two ex cons who thought there was a safe in the house.

This all really happened and you will fly through the book if you pick it up.
 
MomaDance said:
“In Cold Blood” by Truman Capote is the all time best true crime novel. He invented the genre and the movie with damn now I’m forgetting dudes name is excellent.

To sum it up, a family living on a rural farm in Kansas is brutally held hostage and killed one by one by two ex cons who thought there was a safe in the house.

This all really happened and you will fly through the book if you pick it up.
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On a related note, did anyone see the Capote film starring our fellow drug addicted friend, the late, Phillip Seymour Hoffman? It dealt a lot with his relationship to the killer.

I recently watched the Bundy Tapes and the Zac Efron Bundy movie on Netflix.

I always found the Zodiac intriguing
because it coincided with a special time and place. I also found his letters and coding interesting.
 
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somnilicious said:
On a related note, did anyone see the Capote film starring our fellow drug addicted friend, the late, Phillip Seymour Hoffman? It dealt a lot with his relationship to the killer.

I recently watched the Bundy Tapes and the Zac Efron Bundy movie on Netflix.

I always found the Zodiac intriguing
because it coincided with a special time and place. I also found his letters and coding interesting.
Click to expand...

Obviously you didn’t read my post. That’s exactly what I’m talking about.
 
Richard kiklinski aka the ice man.
Shot people stabbed people poisoned people suffocated people chainsawed bodies and froze bodies. Got away with it for decades and got paid to do what he loved.
Claims 200 victims but not sure if that’s true.
Think the mafia had him killed in prison before he he gave evidence about contract killings he had done for them.
 
I am fascinated with serial killers and the motives that drives them commit such horrid crimes. The thing that blows my mind is the coldness that these guys have, they don't seem to feel anxiety and watching a Ted Bundy interview it is impossible to imagine that he can be so sadistic and evil.
 
Nicomorphinist said:
There is a lot of thinking that the Villisca, Iowa axe murder case was perhaps the first modern-style serial killer case, as there were families and people killed like that in other states like Colorado, a couple in Kansas, and I think one of the original main suspects killed his family just like that just near Chicago in 1917 I think it was. The cops said that the murder scene and apparent modus operandi strongly suggested a cocaine fiend was the murderer, but then again, at that time, the people who wanted to ban Bolivian Marching Powder also claimed that C-Jam made African American men impervious to .32 calibre bullets . . .

I don't know if they really believed it back then or were trying to flush out the murderer, but the stories about the murder in the Kansas City, Omaha and other newspapers claimed that the coroner had used the retina of one of the children to obtain a picture of the killer, as if the last thing a person sees before dying is imprinted on the retina like a photograph and somehow retrievable.
Click to expand...
I read a book about this theory called the man on the train but I did not believe the authors' theory that it was the same man responsible for all of these murders in different states and countries.
 
snagglepuss said:
I'm a huge fan of serial killers and true crime... my two votes go to

1. William Bonin
2. Randy Kraft

It's hard for normal people to understand how someone could do things like this to other people..it is grim and and yet facinating to watch hear the stories
Click to expand...
There is a great book about both of them called angel of darkness by Dennis McDougal.
 
PriestTheyCalledHim said:
I read a book about this theory called the man on the train but I did not believe the authors' theory that it was the same man responsible for all of these murders in different states and countries.
Click to expand...

This is the book I just ordered and plan on reading.

I tend to doubt it could all be the same person either, but I'm still going to read it.
 
As for the Kennedy assassination it was the secret service agent next to him that actually shot him accidentally while turning around to return fire at the sniper.a retired Australian detective named Colin something figured it out and made a TV show about it.he also wrote a book that shows the lengths he went to to capture ppl he was after.as a whole there not too cluey but every now and then one like this guy comes along and they're the type to watch out for.thank fuck they write books that tell you everything they did so you can avoid there methods being used on you.
 
Insofar was who was the first serial killer, in the modern sense -- I was talking to someone who theorises that Harry H Holmes, the killer who was active at the time of the 1893 World's Fair in Chicago was also Jack the Ripper . . . also that, yes, he killed people in a series but it was a sui generis case and the guy was totally unclassifiable . . .

There are those who connect the Axe Man of New Orleans to the Villisca case; the New Orleans case was 1918-1919 . . .

I suppose Holmes is not at all like the case of Charles Manson -- some opine he should maybe first and foremost, and amongst other things, Manson should be seen as a political terrorist and/or a Himmler wannabe, someone who wanted to catalyse a race war . . . also, of course, his organisation's modus operandi was mass murder, not serial killing; Most assuredly, Manson was a cult leader -- perhaps Jim Jones, David Koresh, and Marshall Applewhite et al are more in the same category . . .

The decoded cleartext of the 31. July 1969 Zodiac enciphered letter to the San Francisco Chronicle had the eighteen letters EBEORIETEMETHHPITI at the end, and I am not certain if anyone actually has decoded them yet, this is the one of which I was thinking . . .
 
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I've always had a deep fascination with the mob. Anything related to the 5 NY crime families captivates me, even though those guys were psychopathic killers.
 
Nicomorphinist said:
Insofar was who was the first serial killer, in the modern sense -- I was talking to someone who theorises that Harry H Holmes, the killer who was active at the time of the 1893 World's Fair in Chicago was also Jack the Ripper . . . also that, yes, he killed people in a series but it was a sui generis case and the guy was totally unclassifiable . . .

There are those who connect the Axe Man of New Orleans to the Villisca case; the New Orleans case was 1918-1919 . . .

I suppose Holmes is not unlike the case of Charles Manson -- some opine he should maybe first and foremost, and amongst other things, be seen as a political terrorist and/or a Himmler wannabe, someone who wanted to catalyse a race war . . . also, of course, his organisation's modus operandi was mass murder, not serial killing; Most assuredly, Manson was a cult leader -- perhaps Jim Jones, David Koresh, and Marshall Applewhite et al are more in the same category . . .

The decoded cleartext of the 31. July 1969 Zodiac enciphered letter to the San Francisco Chronicle had the eighteen letters EBEORIETEMETHHPITI at the end, and I am not certain if anyone actually has decoded them yet, this is the one of which I was thinking . . .
Click to expand...

There was a good show called "American Ripper" that was on for a while about a year ago where H.H. Holmes like great great grandson is going around doing research to try to prove that Holmes and The Ripper were the same person. I keep meaning to look up whether or not the show is coming back on the air, but I'm doubting it will because I don't see it as likely that they will be able to prove one way or another that they are or aren't the same person and then that basically seems like it would end the show in an anticlimactically.

There did seem to be some clues that they might be the same person, particularly the fact that records indicate that Holmes was in London giving lectures on how to dissect corpses as the same times as some of the ripper murders, and the fact that he was a doctor and that it has often been thought that the ripper might have been to have been able to dissect his victims so easily.

However, I don't see how Holmes is anything like Manson in terms of ideology. He didn't want a race war and didn't seem to have any political motivation for his crimes, so I'm not sure where you got that idea.

I have also heard about The Axe Man of New Orleans being linked to the Villisca case which is really interesting. I only recently heard of the Axe Man of New Orleans at all.

As mentioned above, I bought the book "The Man From the Train" which tries to tie those 2 cases together as well as a whole bunch of others like the Hinterkaiffeck murders in Germany around the same time, but it seems unlikely that all those crimes could have been done by the same person.

Another interesting serial killer or killers who committed unsolved murders was the person or persons called "The Servant Girl Annihilator" who killed a bunch of slave girls in Austin, Texas back in the 1880s.

I have a good book on it that I got about halfway through and keep meaning to eventually finish.

And yeah, the Zodiac is also fascinating.

I am really hoping that like the Original Night Stalker that maybe somehow the Zodiac might still be alive and that his cases could be solved by one of those family geneological tests linking him to a family member.

I am still waiting for the original Night Stalker's trial to end so we can find out more about him and there can be all these new true crime specials and books that explain things we didn't know before about him.

Like, I have literally read EVERYTHING there is to read about what we know so far about his crimes, but there's a lot we still don't know. Most of all I have not heard anything at all about his childhood or his parents and I'd like to know more about that and as much as possible about the motivation for his crimes.
 
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