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What is 'Natural'?

Since when did natural = symbiotic relationship? Are parasites (that kill their hosts) therefore unnatural? Virus'? Fungi? Bacteria?

Natural is what occurs in nature and nature is everything that exists.

Can't argue with definitions:

na·ture (nchr)
n.
1. The material world and its phenomena.
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Although granted.. there are others.. so basically everyone is right ;)

na·ture [ney-cher] Show IPA
noun
1.
the material world, especially as surrounding humankind and existing independently of human activities.
2.
the natural world as it exists without human beings or civilization.
3.
the elements of the natural world, as mountains, trees, animals, or rivers.
4.
natural scenery.
5.
the universe, with all its phenomena.
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Although i don't agree with separating humans from nature.. a birds nest is a construct of a bird, a beaver damn is the construct of a beaver, buildings, cars, guns, drugs, etc are constructs of human beings. Why should one animals products be natural while another's is not?
 
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Do cars exist naturally in nature? No. Is it human nature to advance tools and thought? Yes.
 
Shrooms00087 said:
Do cars exist naturally in nature? No. Is it human nature to advance tools and thought? Yes.
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Simplest and yet the best answer IMO. My definition of natural is anything that did not require enhancements from humans or man made such as soil, water, forests, animals. Cars, houses, cosmetics are made from natural resources but required human developments are not natural. Other examples I'd like to give would be plastic surgeries, breast augmentation and liposuction.
 
Foreigner said:
Saying that anything in the universe is natural is an extremely macrocosmic view. The question of what is natural speaks to human behavior vs. other behaviors within the biosphere.
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This.

'Natural' simply means 'predating humans', no more no less. This word can simply be a descriptor, and a valid one, without implying any value judgement. I don't think this term ought to be deprecated, because there are definitely situations where it is helpful to make a distinction between things and states of being that predate our arrival and influence on this planet, and things that postdate us and inexorably bear our influence.

I've found what most people are actually opposed to when they say "[un]natural is a meaningless / pointless term", is the conflation of 'natural' with 'good'. That is indeed a value judgement, an ideological statement, and a matter of taste. It's fine to hold the belief that some things should be preserved the way they were before humans encountered them. But it's not okay to presume or foist this belief upon somebody. Since we're a dynamic part of this world, keeping anything free from our influence is not easy, and the decision to attempt this needs to be made on a case-by-case basis.
 
Words have actual definitions, ya know ;)

It depends on the context in which you use the word..

Cars are natural.

Cars aren't natural.

Both sentences are true.
 
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rickolasnice said:
Words have actual definitions, ya know ;)

It depends on the context in which you use the word..

Cars are natural.

Cars aren't natural.

Both sentences are true.
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1. existing in or formed by nature (opposed to artificial ): a natural bridge.
2. based on the state of things in nature; constituted by nature: Growth is a natural process.
3. of or pertaining to nature or the universe: natural beauty.
4. of, pertaining to, or occupied with the study of natural science: conducting natural experiments.
5. in a state of nature; uncultivated, as land.

Actually the first sentence is not true.
Birdsnests in this same instance, again, is not natural. It is a constructed tool. A stick is natural, a stick used to get ants out of an anthole is just a tool.
 
1.
the material world, especially as surrounding humankind and existing independently of human activities.
2.
the natural world as it exists without human beings or civilization.
3.
the elements of the natural world, as mountains, trees, animals, or rivers.
4.
natural scenery.
5.
the universe, with all its phenomena.

NSFW:

1. The material world and its phenomena.
2. The forces and processes that produce and control all the phenomena of the material world: the laws of nature.
3. The world of living things and the outdoors: the beauties of nature.
4. A primitive state of existence, untouched and uninfluenced by civilization or artificiality: couldn't tolerate city life anymore and went back to nature.
5. Theology Humankind's natural state as distinguished from the state of grace.
6. A kind or sort: confidences of a personal nature.
7. The essential characteristics and qualities of a person or thing: "She was only strong and sweet and in her nature when she was really deep in trouble" (Gertrude Stein).
8. The fundamental character or disposition of a person; temperament: "Strange natures made a brotherhood of ill" (Percy Bysshe Shelley).
9. The natural or real aspect of a person, place, or thing. See Synonyms at disposition.
10. The processes and functions of the body.
 
rickolasnice said:
1.
the material world, especially as surrounding humankind and existing independently of human activities.
2.
the natural world as it exists without human beings or civilization.
3.
the elements of the natural world, as mountains, trees, animals, or rivers.
4.
natural scenery.
5.
the universe, with all its phenomena.

NSFW:

1. The material world and its phenomena.
2. The forces and processes that produce and control all the phenomena of the material world: the laws of nature.
3. The world of living things and the outdoors: the beauties of nature.
4. A primitive state of existence, untouched and uninfluenced by civilization or artificiality: couldn't tolerate city life anymore and went back to nature.
5. Theology Humankind's natural state as distinguished from the state of grace.
6. A kind or sort: confidences of a personal nature.
7. The essential characteristics and qualities of a person or thing: "She was only strong and sweet and in her nature when she was really deep in trouble" (Gertrude Stein).
8. The fundamental character or disposition of a person; temperament: "Strange natures made a brotherhood of ill" (Percy Bysshe Shelley).
9. The natural or real aspect of a person, place, or thing. See Synonyms at disposition.
10. The processes and functions of the body.
Click to expand...

I don't see where this is a rebuttle. The bold doesn't rebuke anything. When it is saying "phenomena" it is refering to 'natural phenomena'. What you're describing with this definition is similar to an all inclusive defenition which it is not.
 
Aye seems you're right.. Found a couple of these:

"1 [mass noun] the phenomena of the physical world collectively, including plants, animals, the landscape, and other features and products of the earth, as opposed to humans or human creations:"
 
In a theoretical sense, think that natural is a meaningless term. Following, so is artificial.

In a practical sense, natural is/are things which are found outdoors or are easily extracted from things found outdoors rather than things manufactured in labs. (So for the potheads in the audience, I would argue that wax is natural, spice is not.)
 
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