Benzos walking the benzo tightrope

[Aphex747]

well i just have a question, that other people may find useful. i see alot of people say that ALOT of "withdrawal" is in their head. or at least that the mild wd's are mental. like a craving, and feeling low confidence, hard to sleep, ect.. BUT what im wondering is this...

i abused benzos for a few good months, at least every other day 20mg of valium or 2mg klonopin and id do etizolam when they would wear off. (better than drinking beer with it) and after looking back, during these weeks i was going through 10-18mg of etizolam a week. like 5-6mg 3x a week on my "benzo days" but ive tapered down slowly over the past month or so. im down to 1mg klonopin/7.5mg diazepam every 4 days (3 days off in between) and the worst side effects im getting are the ones listed above.

now what im wondering...if i can go 3 days inbetween managing with cannabis and valerian root, do i even need to taper, or should i just stop drawing it out? id like to know bc i could start my 4 week break alot sooner, and could quit wasting pills. im getting very little relief on these days i take my taper dose. any recommendations for me from any experienced off and on benzo users? any info on this would be great, and im sure theres alot of other people who browse this forum in the same boat as me. got kind of recreational for a few months, now wants to take a month off. thanks -aphex

 

[5StarSquatHotel]

well i just have a question, that other people may find useful. i see alot of people say that ALOT of "withdrawal" is in their head. or at least that the mild wd's are mental. like a craving, and feeling low confidence, hard to sleep, ect.. BUT what im wondering is this...

i abused benzos for a few good months, at least every other day 20mg of valium or 2mg klonopin and id do etizolam when they would wear off. (better than drinking beer with it) and after looking back, during these weeks i was going through 10-18mg of etizolam a week. like 5-6mg 3x a week on my "benzo days" but ive tapered down slowly over the past month or so. im down to 1mg klonopin/7.5mg diazepam every 4 days (3 days off in between) and the worst side effects im getting are the ones listed above.

now what im wondering...if i can go 3 days inbetween managing with cannabis and valerian root, do i even need to taper, or should i just stop drawing it out? id like to know bc i could start my 4 week break alot sooner, and could quit wasting pills. im getting very little relief on these days i take my taper dose. any recommendations for me from any experienced off and on benzo users? any info on this would be great, and im sure theres alot of other people who browse this forum in the same boat as me. got kind of recreational for a few months, now wants to take a month off. thanks -aphex

i have used benzos for over a decade and can take breaks with no wd or problems others than insomnia so give it a go as you may not need to taper. remember that if you are to suffer wd it will not truly start till a couple of days after last dose.

 

[Aphex747]

^yea it could be mental, but after a few days without, i just feel blank. i just stare at the wall and i dont feel like doing anything. even listening to music or watching my favorite tv show. its like when i do benzos i am super productive. i feel like the clock is just whisking away instead of going nowhere. so it could be mental, or a mild WD. but if i take a vicodin, i feel content, that empty feeling is gone. so if a 5mg vicodin can take away my benzo blues, i figure it cant be that bad.

also, what kind of benzos were you on? the longer half lived ones like valium, can take weeks to feel WD bc of how much it accumulates taking it daily, or several times daily. i think my saving grace is im not a redoser. when a buzz fades i know i either have to take more than i did earlier to get the same effects, and this wastes $, pills, and build tolerance. and a wise person once told me tolerance, is the 1st step towards dependancy. i love valium but the half life sucks. i only feel it for 2-4 hours tops. plus i never did them everyday, but i did have a few weeks where i did them like 5 days out of 7. tapering has been real easy, which also may be a sign i dont need to. and it sucks waiting 4 days to take a smaller amount. its like looking forwards to a very short lived, mild relief. with no tolerance, when i got back into benzos (i took 4 years off solid) it took me 2mg klonopin to get a good, productive effect. and 10mg valium is a joke, i dont see how people even get anything from 2 or 5mg doses. anything less than 10 is not very noticable at all. ill just try going an extra day this time and see how i feel. if its nice out, that will help alot. this dreary winter weather hasnt been making my benzo tolerance easy. its gloomy and kinda stuck inside all day. yea my brother went through a bottle of 90 1mg xanax in like 3 weeks, popping them like candy and getting sloppy. but when they were gone, they were gone. he wasnt jonesing about getting more. he even had a refill but told his dr he doesnt like taking a pill that only lasts a few hours, and got switched to 10mg valium 2x a day. i just wish the peak plasma level lasted longer. i havent got to do a real dose and enjoy it in a month or more. Lol its like im torturing myself... thats enough to make me stop cold turkey. theres no point in taking less than 20mg of valium, or 2mg klonopin, or 3mg of etizolam.

what should i look for, if i go 4 days without, and 5 and just jump off where im at? are there minor symptoms besides insomnia and anxiety? i know about brain zaps. if i can make a full week, im just going to go the distance and finish out the other 3. i do have valerian root and cannabis to help the mental aspects. it just seems so dumb to me that this whole month i havent got to fully enjoy the right dose and id rather get this break on so i can get back to using them the way they work and no more than 1x a week if its got a longer halflife than 24 hours

 

[pasha]

well i just have a question, that other people may find useful. i see alot of people say that ALOT of "withdrawal" is in their head. or at least that the mild wd's are mental. like a craving, and feeling low confidence, hard to sleep, ect.. BUT what im wondering is this...

i abused benzos for a few good months, at least every other day 20mg of valium or 2mg klonopin and id do etizolam when they would wear off. (better than drinking beer with it) and after looking back, during these weeks i was going through 10-18mg of etizolam a week. like 5-6mg 3x a week on my "benzo days" but ive tapered down slowly over the past month or so. im down to 1mg klonopin/7.5mg diazepam every 4 days (3 days off in between) and the worst side effects im getting are the ones listed above.

now what im wondering...if i can go 3 days inbetween managing with cannabis and valerian root, do i even need to taper, or should i just stop drawing it out? id like to know bc i could start my 4 week break alot sooner, and could quit wasting pills. im getting very little relief on these days i take my taper dose. any recommendations for me from any experienced off and on benzo users? any info on this would be great, and im sure theres alot of other people who browse this forum in the same boat as me. got kind of recreational for a few months, now wants to take a month off. thanks -aphex

Well when people usually say in your head, it means your symptoms aren't real and that's certainly not the case. I think the issue of what your currently doing is that your over thinking things. I responded to your other valerian post and like I told your habit wasn't that extreme. If your feeling no withdrawal symptoms, that's fantastic.

You've mentioned you have anhedonia, which is a withdrawal symptom usually coupled with depression. if that's the only symptom your feeling, than that's good news, your probably in the clear. Anhedonia, or a boredom, or lack of interest in things reverses itself in a very short time. All it takes for you is to do the things that used to give you pleasure even though they currently don't, so you can re-wire your reward circuit again gradually.

Valerian does not to be tapered at all, I was merely trying to prove a point in your other thread to another user belittling someone's question about addiction to valerian. It rarely happens, and its nothing to worry about.

 

[Aphex747]

^good to know. i def overthink things waaaay to much and am a worrier. ive kind of always had that. and yea i know what your talking about. its like when i was a pothead and 17 and if i didnt have weed to smoke, id sleep all day. Lol thankfully ive grown up and learned better ways to cope with that. it also sucks because its so cold out, i want to excercise and move around but im stuck inside and it makes me anxious too, unless im benzoed out or on opiates. your right. i quit smoking weed for a week or two to get a job and i didnt know what to do with myself. it was like i had to re learn how to live. like life went from being on automatic to manual. so know that u mention it, i think id have a much harder time to try and stop smoking bud, than i would benzos, which means alot. thanks for that. it makes perfect sense, but i was overlooking it. after today im going to do something i havent done in 3 months. take 5 full days off and see how i feel. if im okay, im taking my 4 weak benzo break. but if i feel really weird and out of place, i may take the next step down (if necessary) and go to .75mg kpin/.75 valium. do you think its a bad idea to use both to taper? ive been using both about the same, so i figured it would make sense to. im also drastically reducing my etizolam. i know i can do it, ive just gotta get my mind right and quit looking for reasons to take them. thanks for putting that into a perspective i get. when i quit smoking i dont even eat for a day or two, and it has that same depression, and lack of amusement. when listening to music sounds like a bad idea, i know somethings not right. maybe i just let it get to me more on the shitty weather days. thanks again chrom, you're always giving me good advice. thanks man : ) -aphex

 

[budsnbars712]

i have used benzos for over a decade and can take breaks with no wd or problems others than insomnia so give it a go as you may not need to taper. remember that if you are to suffer wd it will not truly start till a couple of days after last dose.

Completely innacurate. Idc what benzo you are prescribed or on, stopping cold turkey is dangerous as fuck. Second off, the withdrawals do not start days later. That is just an ignorant statement by a drug abuser. If you did know your shit, which you clearly don't, you would know that each benzo has a different half life and stays in your system for a different amount of time. For example, valium has a much longe half life than xanax or ativan. Valium's half life is something like 20-100 hours. Xanax is only 6 hours, therefore the xanax is out of your system way quicker. I suffer from withdrawals as quick as hours later, search rebound anxiety darkinthepark....And you will see how innaccurate you really are.... It pisses me off when people post shit that isn't accurate, especially to people who are trying to better themselves.....

P.S.- I am suffering from rebound anxiety right now as I have not taken xanax yet today and take .5 (5 times a day) and am extremely irritable and jittery. Probably why this shit pissed me off easier.

 

[Aphex747]

Lol yea dude im such a nice guy when im high and where i want to be, but when im not, i just really dont want to be bothered or feel like doing anything. im tellin ya bro. if your down to that low of a xanax taper you could be done if you got ahold of 10mg of kpin. and please trust me, get some valerian root, it kills anxiety bro i promise. its cheap, they sell it at walmart, and it works almost as good as valium. it says take 3 before i bed. on my days off benzos i take 3 capsules when i wake up and i have that motivation i was looking for. it also makes me feel cool as a cucumber. it works.i got pulled over by a state cop the other day and just 3 valerian root, no benzos and i handled it like a pro. i was in such a good mood from the V root, i even leaned out my window and told the cops to be safe out there! which isnt something id normally do. also for sleep, id recommend melatonin. you may have to take two tabs to sleep but they will get you yawning and comfy. and they give better sleep than benzo sleep. no mattter how much etizolam i take before bed, i never stay asleep long. to me, its like drinking berr to fall asleep. sure, you'll be unconscious and snoring, but 4 hours later you wake up thirsty as a MOFO, but then its easy to go back to sleep once your hydrated. etizolam is great at making me drowsy, but it doesnt knock me out. ive found the best knockout/sleep benzo to be phenazepam. i mean that shit makes your body melt into the couch, but you have to find the sweet spot. 10mg is waaaaaay to much, but i find 4-5mg to be ideal. you can feel it 10 minutes after you take it lightly, and it slowly builds until it peaks at 4 hours. i want to stay up and see how it goes at the 5 and 6 hour mark. ive had trouble finding the peak plasma levels on phenazepam. just that it peaks at 4 hours, but nowhere can i find, how long that peak plasma level lasts. my next research experiment with it, i will do it when im wide awake around this time 10am and document how long the peak plasma level lasts. im good at noticing when things start declining so i think it wont be too hard. if it takes 4 hours to hit peak plasma, im guessing it stays at peak plasma longer than most others. and p-zam IS recreational. you just have to find that sweet spot between "this isnt doing much" and im going to bed. just make absolute sure you wait 4-5 hours and see how relaxed you are. its one of the heaviest body buzz benzos ive done, and best for sleep. and never redose the same day. if you write down how much you take and what time, you're on the right track. p-zam is actually a pretty cool thing, but not if your a junkie/pill popper with no self control or concern towards your own body. this stuff has the greatest potential to fuck you over, if you redose and try doing it regularly. once a month, twice a month, at doses no higher than 5mg (with no redose) i find to be quite therapeutic.

 

[BananasAndOranges]

i have used benzos for over a decade and can take breaks with no wd or problems others than insomnia so give it a go as you may not need to taper. remember that if you are to suffer wd it will not truly start till a couple of days after last dose.

what?!

if I missed 48 hrs after my last dose I would be having a seizure or hallucinating or dead ...... This is bad information but interesting if you're not trolling

 

[budsnbars712]

not really looking to taper. I am not tapering. I have been on this dosage for as long as I have been taking xanax, but I do splurge sometimes (not all the time) on days off and take a little more. Maybe 3-5mg tops. Just trying to figure out how to not deal with these rebound affects. I might get some Valerian Root just to have it and try it, but I dont know when I would take it...

 

[Tarnum]

Damn that sounds like me...ill type more later cuz in on a phone its hard to type haha

 

[tricomb]

i have used benzos for over a decade and can take breaks with no wd or problems others than insomnia so give it a go as you may not need to taper. remember that if you are to suffer wd it will not truly start till a couple of days after last dose.

@all, Please disregard this post if you care about your health and wellbeing. I have absolutely no idea why this person thought this would be appropriate to post, I'm pretty much at a loss for words.

Do you have any idea that the advice you gave could be lethal?

 

[tricomb]

@OP, I would work on eliminating the poly drugs. The etizolam + diazepam + clonazepam is way too much GABAergic action. I'm surprised you find this pleasurable. Anyways, I would stop taking the etizolam completely and then either commit to tapering with clonazepam OR diazepam.

 

[shreddedlettuce]

@OP, I would work on eliminating the poly drugs. The etizolam + diazepam + clonazepam is way too much GABAergic action. I'm surprised you find this pleasurable. Anyways, I would stop taking the etizolam completely and then either commit to tapering with clonazepam OR diazepam.

Well said

 

[bunge]

OP, As tricomb rightly said, poly drug use should be eliminated first as thats setting you up for a big fall. I would then taper with diazepam as its got a good half-life for tapering and you will be able to taper it to an extremely low dose before stopping. This will make your WDs alot easier. You might have to raise the dose of diazepam a little at first to compensate for the loss of the clonazepam as it pretty powerful stuff but that should only be for a week or two and is still alot safer then using benzos with multiple half-lifes and potencys. Good luck with it, however you deicide to do it.

 

[Aphex747]

i just wanted to update, ive got my benzo use and opiate use down to 1 day a week , i take a few etizolam (3mg a day) if i feel weird, but ive been doing a successfull taper. 10 mg of hydrocodone spaced 4 hours apart and 3 valerian root...whooo! slept for 8 hours straight Lol but i needed it. yea i started using valerian root to taper my etizolam use as well. its working for me, but not suggested for the faint of heart

 

[Blind Melon]

@OP, I would work on eliminating the poly drugs. The etizolam + diazepam + clonazepam is way too much GABAergic action. I'm surprised you find this pleasurable. Anyways, I would stop taking the etizolam completely and then either commit to tapering with clonazepam OR diazepam.

Perfectly said. Except: People who suffer constantly from anxiety can find extreme pleasure in loading up on the GABA drugs, myself included. I redose benzos like crack when I have them. To me they can be extremely euphoric. But to somebody who is usually a pretty relaxed person, a benzo is going to be pretty boring.

 

[Aphex747]

i agree melon, if your anxious by nature the are VERY enjoyable. like being told the family dog has returned safe. not everyones brain chemistry works the same??

 

[bunge]

^^
I suffer with bad GAD, insomnia and panic attacks. Finding benzos was an amazing relief for my anxiety. Unfortunately that makes them worse than opiates for me addiction-wise. Apex747, well done with your progress so far, its great to hear about a positive benzo taper , it gives the rest of us hope. I never tried etizolam,its not that I wouldnt like too, its just that hypnotic benzo-type drugs are so damn moreish for me!lol