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Wade Davis at Massey

Teotzlcoatl

Bluelighter
Joined
Feb 5, 2010
Messages
779
Please listen to the wonderful Mr.Wade Davis!

http://castroller.com/podcasts/CbcRadiosMassey/1302930

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wade_Davis

wadedavis.gif



Wade Davis is one of the only serious ethnobotanical research of psychoactive plants in the modern day.
 
He claimed TTX, a common neurotoxin that is quite deadly but certainly not psychoactive in any interesting sense, turned people into virtual zombies. There is literally no empirical evidence for this and every specific claim he made about what the active ingredient in his magic zombie powder may be has been pretty thoroughly debunked. Why the hell he thinks TTX acts as some kind of hypnotic sedative at the right dose is beyond me, but calling him a serious researcher is just stupid. Maybe he has something interesting to say about Haitian zombie myths, but saying empirically falsifiable things just makes him sound like another strung out idiot hippie.

Kinda like... Oh, never mind. Have you even read the criticism section of the wiki page you so helpfully linked to? You can read for yourself what TTX is and decide whether you consider his claims on that front remotely credible.
 
but calling him a serious researcher is just stupid.

have you seen all his shows on Nat Geo and such?

i think he is a very serious researcher

he's done alot more than just write that one book

with mckenna and RES dead... him and Dr.Grob are about the only serious ones left

I'm not saying he wasn't incorrect about the zombies or w/e, just saying he does do some good work.

I'll look into it more.
 
In my opinion, when someone very publicly decides to put their reputation behind claims that are just not true, they only become a detriment to 'the movement', as it were. I would doubt the value of his research in general if he can come to such preposterous conclusions, but maybe he's got some other worthwhile work, I dunno. McKenna was alright most of the time, Leary should have just kept his fucking mouth shut pretty much as soon as he won his Supreme Court case, but in general most of the 'personalities' that have emerged around psychedelic research have utimately only worsened psychedelics' public reputation with, well, crackpot theories about common neurotoxins turning people into zombies when used in some special magic Haitian voodoo powder and stupid shit like that with no basis in actual empirical evidence. He's the type who paints a vivid story and then finds the facts to suit him - an interesting read, maybe, but not a scientist.
 
I'm just glad somebody is out there doing SOMETHING!

And Wade Davis is taken pretty seriously among the scientific community.
 
Wade Davis has contributed some fascinating perspectives on anthropology and ethnobotany...though perhaps he's more of a big picture guy and lacks the scientific rigor required for gaining credibility as a 'serious researcher' in the Western world. I don't know enough to say for sure one way or the other.

However, in his defense, it doesn't seem that the tetrodotoxin hypothesis was the core element of his zombie interpretation, although from his wikipedia page, you'd guess that he'd claimed it as the crowning achievement of his entire career.

According to wikipedia, "TTX, which blocks sodium channels on the neural membrane, produces numbness, slurred speech, and possibly paralysis or even respiratory failure and death in severe cases. It is not known to produce the trance-like or “mental slave” state typical of zombies in Haitian mythology, or Davis’ descriptions."

From a quick search, however, it appears that Davis never claimed that TTX produces a trance state. Rather, he says that this phase of 'zombification' involves a culturally-specific psychological predisposition to possession (unique to the psyche of select groups of rural Haitians) often in combination with the use of the deliriant, datura. Davis seems to offer a more multifaceted argument than is appreciated by critics. According to a book review, Davis' critics ignore much of his thesis and "pounce on the tetrodotoxin samples as the only issue to be considered."

My feeling is that Vodou zombies are likely the result of psychological rather than than pharmacological manipulation...but, regardless of the truth of the TTX hypothesis, Davis seems to have made many worthy contributions to the fields of anthropology and ethnobotany, which should not go unappreciated.
 
Perhaps. At any rate, I don't give a shit about Haitian rural culture or the neuroses it produces, and unless he's pretty well read in Lacanian theory I doubt I'd have more than a passing interest in his conclusions on that front. Sounds like interesting anthropology. The TTX claim was from an article back in 1983, so maybe he moved on to less stupid ideas and came up with something interesting to say later. Or maybe he's another in a long list of semi intelligent crackpots whose main claim to fame is saying a few really crazy things somehow related to drugs and getting other drug users fascinated... I don't care much either way.

Datura makes a hell of a lot more sense than TTX or dead human flesh, at any rate.
 
Yeah, fuck this swalliow guy.

Hey swilow, how nice and mature of you to show interest that's probably at least a little genuine in at least the general subject area. I'm sure the OP with his much publicised attempts to try again at reaching out to the BL community won't take a nice big shit on that olive branch or anything. That would just be stupid and downright immature, wouldn't it?

Oh, wait, I get it, you just can't spell the 6 letter name of the guy you've randomly decided to pick your next fight with even though he's one of the only people who seems to have a little patience or at least non-hostile humor left for you. Good luck with that rebranding campaign for Project Pretend Teotzlcoatl Is Someone Intelligent With Interesting Things To Say By Repeating The Same Bullshit. You should probably start with a better name than the one I just gave you. Don't worry, doubt it'll stick.
 
Teo, your immaturity is not appreciated.

Swilow, your immaturity is very much appreciated. ;)
 
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