• Current Events & Politics
    Welcome Guest
    Please read before posting:
    Forum Guidelines Bluelight Rules
  • Current Events & Politics Moderators: deficiT | tryptakid | Foreigner

Vegas Mandalay Bay mass shooting / Gun Control 2017 Thread

malakaix

malakaix

Bluelighter
Joined
Apr 12, 2008
Messages
3,054
I think this just happened or is currently happening, seems to be little information at the moment. There's some twitter posts mentioning 20+ dead but nothing confirmed.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...r-reported-Las-Vegas-Mandalay-Bay-Resort.html

UPDATE: 58 Dead. 515 Injured. Suspect committed suicide before SWAT teams reached his room.

At least one active shooter has been reported on the Las Vegas Strip after an unknown gunman reportedly opened fire on crowds from the Mandalay Bay Resort and Hotel.

Victims were also reported at the Route 91 Harvest country music festival, which was occurring just over the road from Mandalay Bay.

It is currently unclear whether the violence has been caused by multiple shooters, or a single gunman.

Dozens were seen on aerial footage fleeing the building, which was reportedly on lockdown.

At 1:26am ET, Twitter user Stefinatrix wrote: 'I'm on the 6th floor [of the Mandalay Bay]. Shots reported on floor 29 now.

Listening to LVPD scanner feed. Security guard shot on 32nd floor.'

She also said that the gunman was firing on police cars from the 32nd floor earlier, according to LVPD scanners.
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
So they proved this wasn't a terrorist attack? The term assault rifle is redundant because hunting rifles are more powerful. The average citizen here can't get automatic weapons. I don't know how people still don't understand that.
 
What a shit show. This was a very well planned attack. I'm no expert but from the video it sounded like the shooter had a full auto weapon.
 
cj said:
What a shit show. This was a very well planned attack. I'm no expert but from the video it sounded like the shooter had a full auto weapon.
Click to expand...

Yeah it seems he had a military grade weapon with what their suspecting might of been a belt feed for ammunition or a large drum.

50 dead. 406 injured transferred to hospitals.

It would of been like shooting fish in a barrel from his position at the Mandalay on the 32nd floor. The lights from the stage would of made it really hard for anyone to see the muzzle flash to know where the shots were coming from. It was really well planned, unbelievable.

vegas-shooting-map-abc-ml-171002_16x9_608.jpg
 
Last edited:
Sad!

If only everyone had been fully armed, none of this would have happened. So I heard...
 
4 posts, that's how long it took.

Everyone loves to talk about how horrible this is, oh what a tragety, etc etc.

You know what I see? Vultures. Before the bodies have even been carried out the political opportunism starts on both sides.

Can't dare spend any time thinking about the dead, theres politics to be played, blame to be assigned, ignorance and assumptions to be spread. It sickens me. It's not about the dead, you don't care about that at all. Its about making your stupid little point. About being right and proving that as fast as you possibly can. God forbid any time be wasted giving a shit about what happened. That's not what matters. What matters is the politics. I swear I think some people are a little delighted when shit like this happens. Cause everyone for every tangentially related political point can use it as ammo for their never ending war of words.

The funniest part, all these political sides, progun Antigun anti Muslim etc etc. They're all just like each other. Liars and opportunists waiting for the next tragedy to seize upon.

EDIT: Oh and the worst part. You don't give a SHIT that you might be advocating points of view the victims might not have agreed with. Using their death to argue against what they might have stood for.

I find it all disgusting.
 
Last edited:
I suspect it's because people actually do care about the dead and are tired of shootings that they want to debate solutions, and aren't willing to settle with mere platitudes of condolence and prayers once again. In the words of Elizabeth Warren:

Thoughts and prayers are NOT enough. Not when more mothers and fathers are going to have to bury children this week. Not when more sons and daughters are going to grow up without parents. This has happened too many times. We need to have a conversation about how to stop gun violence in America. We need to have it right now.
Click to expand...
 
Jess, Are you scolding us? I haven't seen any lies yet. If someone makes a point in a snarky way, that's not disrespecting the dead somehow.

You can't pretend these things aren't political though. There's nothing about pointing out how this is a stupid American institution--random citizen hosing down his fellow countrymen for no known reason--that is opportunistic, it's gotta be in the top two reasons people hate our gun culture. If anything, people don't take enough opportunity to argle bargle after these. If the issue that you have an issue with just happened, isn't that the time to talk about it?

And you're right, I don't give a shit what the victims thought about any related issues, much less their music tastes. You know why? I have a feeling a few might have changed their minds before they bled out.

I'll proudly "use their deaths" to advocate against their deaths, whether they would have liked it or not, when alive.



*I actually don't think mass shootings can be prevented without a total overhaul of US gun culture, too severe to happen any time soon. Twenty dead first graders only got the parents harassed by conspiracy nuts.
 
Except that's not what's happening. This isn't a constructive debate about what to do, it never is. It's just shouting at each other that I'm right and you're wrong, and using the dead as your justification with no interest in what they might have thought about being used in such a way.

I've seen more threads like these than I could count, for years and years. They do the same thing every time, in exactly the same way.

It's not about preventing more death, if it were them everyone wouldn't be so obsessed with being right and convincing everyone to agree. They'd be interested in constructive debate and such pointless wastes of time like these wouldn't be what happens every time.

So no, that's not what this is about, that's the justification used to excuse it. A smokescreen used to cover up the truth of what's actually happening. It has nothing to do with preventing more deaths. People who really care want to know what we should do, nobody in these arguments ever does. They decided long ago, all this is about is proving they were right.

If you want to believe that either to make yourself feel better because either the truth is depressing or because you engage in it yourself, go right ahead. Nobody is going to be stopped by my protest, people enjoy fighting far too much to stop just cause of anything I've said. I just wanted to say what's really going on. I have no desire to argue it. By all means, continue.

But it IS disgusting. The best I can say about it is I think a lot of people who participate in it probably do have good intentions buried somewhere. But they've long been forgotten by the time they post here. And it's not reflected whatsoever in how these threads go.

But like I said, my disgust will change nothing. I wouldn't normally post in this sort of thread at all. But I every so often I need to remind myself why I don't.
 
Scrofula said:
Jess, Are you scolding us? I haven't seen any lies yet. If someone makes a point in a snarky way, that's not disrespecting the dead somehow.

You can't pretend these things aren't political though. There's nothing about pointing out how this is a stupid American institution--random citizen hosing down his fellow countrymen for no known reason--that is opportunistic, it's gotta be in the top two reasons people hate our gun culture. If anything, people don't take enough opportunity to argle bargle after these. If the issue that you have an issue with just happened, isn't that the time to talk about it?

And you're right, I don't give a shit what the victims thought about any related issues, much less their music tastes. You know why? I have a feeling a few might have changed their minds before they bled out.

I'll proudly "use their deaths" to advocate against their deaths, whether they would have liked it or not, when alive.



*I actually don't think mass shootings can be prevented without a total overhaul of US gun culture, too severe to happen any time soon. Twenty dead first graders only got the parents harassed by conspiracy nuts.
Click to expand...

Yes, I'm scolding everyone who participates it. Lies are more than untruths. They are selective truths, deliberate ignorance of realities you don't want to believe, they are distorted truths. The best lies involve nothing that isn't factual said whatsoever.

I don't care if they're political. You wanna start a gun control thread go ahead. I'd still call it pointless but I wouldn't be so disgusted by the display combined with the pretense of giving a shit about people who've only JUST died and disinterest in what they might have thought as you've just said you don't have, and worse still have decided on their behalf to have potentially changed.

My problem is not only does this shit ALWAYS happen in threads supposedly about some horrible tragic loss of life, but that it is so ubiquitous and happens so fast, no one even thinks that it's anything off topic.

And no, the time isn't when it's JUST happenened. That's a huge problem with our society. Until enough of the right people die, we do NOTHING. And often not even then. We SHOULD wait at least until the dead are buried to discuss it. Or maybe even till they've been identified. Or maybe we could discuss problems BEFORE they materialize. Any time other than now, or anywhere other than here.

It's a thread about the people who've died, but the argument involves just about everything EXCEPT the people who died. And that is not ok.

I have no desire to participate further. I've said all I wanted to say.
 
The roots of gun violence could be discovered with government research, but congress blocks it every time. Instead, we have to rely on independent sources, all of which have their political biases. There isn't one single study available from the U.S. Federal Gov that analyzes why the rate of massacres is increasing. The partisan hacks in congress and the NRA lobby stops it from happening.

So the public, the media, and the hacks are all left to spin their wheels and debate this subject endlessly in the vacuum of knowledge. It's utterly pathetic. A democracy needs facts to stay informed and this is the one thing we are denied on this topic.
 
How about we discuss problems before they materialize? OK, how about today, cause the next one is statistically going to happen tomorrow.

IDK Jess, normally I think you're all about sincerity, but this is just anti-gun control talking points. I mean, when a plane goes down and kills everybody, nobody ever breaks in to a thread to scold people for suggesting better hours for commuter pilots, when we still haven't ID'd all the victims. It's a great tactic for the NRA crowd, because the only change to ask for after these things is gun control.

I'm not giving a "pretense" about caring for the victims, because I don't know them any more than you; but I don't pretend to be disgusted for them and their potential pro-NRA beliefs, either. Most people could at least imagine themselves at that venue (different performer) though and how we don't want to get shot ourselves.
 
If EVERY thread about EVERY plane crash sparked a heated and ultimately pointless and always identical argument of both sides saying the same thing about how they were right while utterly uninterested in constructive and reasonable discussion about a view that the planes occupants likely had opinions on as well, I'd think that was wrong too.

The problem isn't the talking about gun control, it's about everything to do with how it's being done that I have a problem with. There are already periodic gun control threads without every mass shooting being used as an excuse to start another one. And it's not just gun control, it happens with terrorism and various other subjects too for other atrocities.

I can imagine myself at that venue, I wouldn't want my death being used like this. There are at least 50 people dead, odds are decent that no matter what view you have it would have been disapproved of by one of them. Don't think it's one particular side I have a problem with here. I grew up around gun nuts and they do this shit too. I hate it just as much from either side.

This isn't about solving the problem. Problems don't get solved arguing like this. This kind of arguing is the reason they DON'T EVER get solved. Real solutions come from compromise and both sides trying to understand the others perspective. That's not even close to what this is. This is about being the one to shout the loudest and argue the best. It's about trying to win. And using the victims to do it.

Nothing will change regarding gun control in America as a result of this incident, and you know why? Cause neither side will move an inch, both hate and mistrust and refuse to understand or listen to the other. This and countless similar arguments are just reflections of the wider problem. So no, this is not how you solve the problem, in addition to being disrespectful, it's also the cause of the problem.
 
^ Eh, I think Scrofula pretty much nails it here.

If you don't want to talk about this incident or gun control, that's cool - don't.

However others do. And acting all indignant because they dare to speak out about it sounds ridiculous, as does your attempt to pretend you speak for the victims or the moral high ground.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top