Vegan Diet Supplements? Barrett's Esophagus / Hernia

[birdup.snaildown]

BACKGROUND.

I have been diagnosed with Barrett's Esophagus and GERD. I also have a sliding hiatus hernia. My diet has been super bad recently. Lots of junk food. Massive amounts of meat. Very few vegetables. So I have to take antacid every day to stop chronic reflux.

I was told to lose weight and I'm down to just under 70kg now (178cm male). This has helped with the hernia/reflux... I've tried going vegan before and found it fixes my acid reflux so I don't have to take antacids every day in order to avoid the Barrett's turning into Esophagus cancer. But, I've never done the vegan diet properly with supplements and what not and it has always left me feeling run down and tired.

QUESTION.

Can any long term vegans - who have had their levels tested over time - recommend what supplements to take and in what quantities?

I'm currently taking a multi-vitamin and a very high iron/vitamin-C combo, but some people have told me I need to take K2 and long chain omega-3 (which aren't in the multi-vitamin).

Any help would be much appreciated. Please don't tell me not to be vegan or that it's unhealthy. I am tired of feeling like crap all the time and am determined to stop eating animal products.

Thanks.

 

[December Flower]

First off: I need to tell you that being 100% can be very unhealthy, no matter if you like to hear that or not. I was vegan for 10 years, and wasn't careful, and now my sinews are fucked (but regenerating)

Omega-3 is a big concern, you'd either need fern or algae to supplement that, but I would suggest eating salmon once a month if there's no moral issue for you.

B12 is another concern. There is no known way of getting B12 naturally, other than by eating animal products.

I thought I could do it without unnatural supplements and failed. I can only advise you to cut MOST of your meat-eating, but don't cut it entirely, and only eat it on a few occasions. I'm at about once every 2 weeks I eat either meat or fish.

If someone made it happen with supplements though, I'd also like to hear from this (and made it happen I mean over 10 years, that's usually when the body is out of reserves) - since i'd love to go back to vegan out of moral reasons, but listened to my doctor that the supplements might just not cut it, and my sinews are my fucking work.

 

[birdup.snaildown]

I was vegan for 10 years, and wasn't careful, and now my sinews are fucked (but regenerating)

I know doing it without supplements is impossible... You did 10 years without supplements or with supplements? Are you saying I can't supplement B12 and omega-3? I was under the impression that you can supplement these. There doesn't seem to be a lot of consensus about what works and what doesn't. It's very confusing.

 

[December Flower]

I know doing it without supplements is impossible... You did 10 years without supplements or with supplements? Are you saying I can't supplement B12 and omega-3? I was under the impression that you can supplement these. There doesn't seem to be a lot of consensus about what works and what doesn't. It's very confusing.

I did sometimes take B12 and omega-3 but I wasn't careful at all, so didn't take them often, because I felt good - the thing with my sinews came very suddenly after roughly 10 years.

You can supplement those using meds, yes. But since I didn't do them very regularly, I can't attest to if your body will be able to absorb them fully if they come in pills. My doctor at the time said "don't take that gamble, and just start eating meat again, or you might carry permanent damage" - I'm a musician so that scared me into eating meat.

Eating healthy means doing just that. Eat as versatile as you can, and cut down the meat to very few occasions.

 

[birdup.snaildown]

Okay, thanks for taking the time to respond.

From what I've read, vegans have lower incidence of heart disease but higher incidence of other things like stroke, however this may be because people aren't careful with their supplements. I'm really looking for some feedback from people who have vigilantly taken supplements long term and had their levels tested regularly.

I'm not convinced that your doctor knows everything about the bioavailability of B12 / omega-3 supplements?

 

[December Flower]

Okay, thanks for taking the time to respond.

From what I've read, vegans have lower incidence of heart disease but higher incidence of other things like stroke, however this may be because people aren't careful with their supplements. I'm really looking for some feedback from people who have vigilantly taken supplements long term and had their levels tested regularly.

I'm not convinced that your doctor knows everything about the bioavailability of B12 / omega-3 supplements?

Na my doc is just a fan of natural medicine(and I am too, likely why I didn't pay much attention to taking my supplements), so "eating diverse" was a much better way for him to advise me in good conscience.

I'd also like to know from long-term vegans that didn't suffer from issues with bones, sinews, muscles, etc. For me, my doctor's words just made sense at the time, because I was in fucking pain 24/7. And I mean agonizing pain, I couldn't even think straight.

edit: What I can tell you, especially if you are on a meat-heavy diet right now, is that you can go a long time without having any issues. I'd try cutting meat entirely off the table for a year in your position.

 

[birdup.snaildown]

I'm a fan of natural medicine too. I tried to do the vegan diet naturally half a dozen times. Then, I got to a point where I realized it wouldn't work and I needed to get B12 so I started eating raw molluscs every day. I was on a grain-free raw vegan/mollusc diet, but even that didn't work...

I don't like the idea of taking supplements in pill form every day, but it's better than taking antacids (which increase the chance of stomach cancer, long-term, among other complications).

My plan is to never eat animal products again. A big part of that is being conflicted about the ethical part of it. I feel so much better spiritually when I'm not contributing to the suffering of animals. I am determined to make this work somehow. I'm not going to give up this time. I'm going to do it properly.

Thanks again for taking the time to respond.

 

[G_Chem]

There’s lots of conflicting information because frankly veganism doesn’t work for a majority of people in any form... I’ve watched firsthand veganism degrade mentally and physically a lot of people I hold dear.

You can eat meat products without contributing to a industrial meat supply that gives all meat a bad name. There’s farms that practice the “one bad day” model where the animals live happy healthy lives up until death.

Or do like I’m heading towards, hunt and fish your own meat. If you don’t want to, find someone that does that you know has respect for the lives he/her takes. Or find a local free range farm.

Natives took animals with reverence, we need to get back to that place.

-GC

 

[birdup.snaildown]

veganism doesn’t work for a majority of people in any form

Is there a scientific reason for this?
What can't you supplement and why?

I’ve watched firsthand veganism degrade mentally and physically a lot of people I hold dear.

What supplements did they take?
Did they take them every day?

How often did they get their levels tested?

 

[G_Chem]

Is there a scientific reason for this?
What can't you supplement and why?



What supplements did they take?
Did they take them every day?

How often did they get their levels tested?

Food is food, supplements don’t replace food.

And I’m not their keepers watching over everything they do and say but I can promise your far from the first person that felt they could do it.

If 98% of people out there can’t figure out this mysterious perfect diet/supplement combo that actually allows one to be healthy then in my opinion it’s not worth trying..

That said how healthy does it sound really to need to inject b12 and eat tons of supplements? Just how nature intended lol.

-GC

 

[birdup.snaildown]

I never suggested it was natural. Obviously taking supplements isn't natural. B12 can be ingested orally, from what I understand. 98% seems to be a number you just pulled out of your ass?

Food is food, supplements don’t replace food.

So your assertion is that all supplements have zero bioavailability?

That seems to be contrary to science.

 

[G_Chem]

I never suggested it was natural. Obviously taking supplements isn't natural. B12 can be ingested orally, from what I understand. 98% seems to be a number you just pulled out of your ass?



So your assertion is that all supplements have zero bioavailability?

That seems to be contrary to science.

Lol you got “zero bioavailability” from that? First off that doesn’t really make sense. Bioavailability varies greatly from one supplement to the next, and obviously most have at least some oral bioavailability otherwise they wouldn’t be used.

Vitamin D is a great supplement for many as it’s difficult to get it properly from the sun or diet in certain locations. Magnesium is another (magnesium l-threonate has the best bioavailability of them all) which much of the population is deficient in due to modern non-organic farming practices.

I also take omega 3’s which I think others could benefit.

Does this mean I can then discard foods with these substances in them? Of course not.

The bioavailability of these substances is often higher and easier for the body to handle when taken in food form, plus there’s many other nutrients that one often misses when just looking at one or two major constituents.

You eat however you want, let us know how it’s going in 5-10yrs when your teeth have fallen out, hair gray, no muscle, mind deteriorated, and all around aged far past normal.

-GC

 

[birdup.snaildown]

You said food is food and supplements can't replace food. I took that to mean that you can't effectively supplement things that are in food. Obviously a diet cannot consist of supplements alone. What you said wasn't clear, but I forgive you.

The bioavailability of these substances is often higher and easier for the body to handle when taken in food form, plus there’s many other nutrients that one often misses when just looking at one or two major constituents.

I know the bioavailability is higher in food. I have taken that into account. I'm not talking about supplementing one or two things. I'm talking about covering all my bases and getting tested regularly.

You could be right, but then deficiencies will show up on my tests and I will adjust my diet accordingly until I get it right. If I can't do so, I will give up on the idea of being 100% vegan and try supplementing with animal products occasionally.

I guess this is the wrong forum to get advice from people who've tried to do this. I said pretty clearly in my original post that I didn't want people telling me that veganism is unhealthy. If the number you pulled out of your ass is correct, 2% of people manage to do it correctly. So it can be healthy, even according to you. I'd like to be part of that 2%... although I'd prefer not to be coming out of or going into your ass.

Your anecdotes about people you know don't mean much to me, because (as you said) you don't know what supplements they were taking or how often or whether or not they got tested.

 

[Jabberwocky]

being vegan per se is not necessarily unhealthy. its just that you have to put a lot more time and effort into getting a balanced diet. i have seen vegans who live on chips and honestly looked worst than most junkies.

i was vegan, and according to my own ethics i still should be, but unfortunately i have a strong association between going vegan and the start of my anorexia. it was the start of cutting out foods that lead to me eventually eating only strawberries, kiwis, clementines and nuts in highly regimented and tiny quantities. i don't blame veganism for this, but i am really wary of going back because i can't face recovering from anorexia again, however small the risk, its not one i'm prepared to take. i'm still vegetarian and have been for over 25 years, i think i was kinda born vegetarian in that i didn't like meat and am a softy for animals, and am lucky my mum would cook me healthy meals and supported me when i made the choice to stop eating meat.

fundamentally veganism is a more ecological was to live, and if we are going to respect every person born on this earth's right to life then we need to start massively reducing the amount of animal derived foods we eat. it also really bothers me that most people don't seem to view animal suffering as important. i don't buy organic fruit and veg because its very anti scientific but i do buy organic dairy to at least relieve some of my guilt over consuming animal products.

get a vegan b vitamin complex. vitamin b12 cannot be produced by primates, gorillas etc tend to get theirs from bits of dirt they consume accidentally. other b vitamins can be obtained from a vegan diet but it takes a lot more effort. lack of b vitamins may have contributed to your feeling tired.

also maybe consider the fact that it might not be the dairy per se that is making you feel shitty, going vegan cuts out a huge amount of fatty stuff from your diet, processed meat, cream, cheese etc and this can be quite hard to digest. this may be why it helps your gastric symptoms, so if you find you really can't get on with a vegan diet, try reducing your fat intake.

 

[birdup.snaildown]

Thanks, chinup. Much appreciated.

 

[stephanieee94]

I see that you are using supplements. I would recommend talking to a physician about the doses and the kinds of supplements that you should be taking to treat your condition. I personally am a vegetarian and I do take supplements (vit D, resveratrol and grape seed extract) but Ive talked to my sister who is a licensed physician about my diet. Anyway, the point is that I can give you recommendations but I think it would be better if you research them first before using them.
The supplement I think you can add to your routine to really help with GERD is OPC which is basically grape seed extract. Theres tons of research about the benefits of OPC to manage inflammatory diseases so that why I'm suggesting this. Ill link a few sites you can visit to make a decision about using OPC.

10 Benefits of Grape Seed Extract, Based on Science

Grape seed extract is a dietary supplement packed with powerful antioxidants to boost your health. Here are 10 health benefits of grape seed

www.healthline.com

https://www.vitaminexpress.org/uk/opc-vital-opc-capsules