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valium addiction how long?

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atm23 said:
not sure I agree with that one, its a bit of a sweeping statement and would require you to fully define addictive, how hard a substance is to withdraw from also doesn't really have scale and would clearly depend on both the initial habit, the individual and a whole heap of other variables.

I agree people often don't take the addiction and withdrawal potential seriously enough but to put them at the very top of the scale doesn't sit right with me although I'd be interested as to how you would substantiate that position.
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Once you have done a ton of opiates and benzo's for years on end, (Extremely heavy doses of both). You will see which is worse, obviously benzodiazepines are the harder drug to withdraw from, because the physical withdrawals can last months to years.

There is no other drug where the physical withdrawals can last months to years like benzodiazepines.

Google 'Benzodiazepine Withdrawal' and take a look at the Ashton Manual.

Opioids are a cake walk to come off compared to Benzo's. And I have used a ton of opioids for years including fentanyl, very high doses of hydromorphone, oxycodone, and morphine.
 
I've read the Ashton manual and tapered more than once from 100Mgs + a day so I have a little experience, but you talk about physical addiction as if it can be made as a blanket statement.

There is clearly a difference between addiction potential and withdrawal, from both and individual, physical and physiological standpoint.

I thin your one liner "Be careful. Benzodiazepines are the most physically addictive drug on planet earth, they are the hardest drug to come off" doesn't bare a great deal of weight, whilst I agree with the sentiment, I'm not convinced by the actual fact in the 2 assertions, in particular the addiction potential.
 
hydroazuanacaine said:
^the dose and frequency slowly grows. even though it goes up and down on the short term, overall it slowly increases. not saying it isn't worth it.
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In has done (slowly increased) on occasions within the last year. But I've always been aware of the increase and reacted by going on a bigger break, and making sure I don't up the dose. Since say, the first month, I've not noticed any tolerance build up at all.
 
^glad to hear it. yeah, there are fluctuations like that. but what i am saying is over the years the base line slowly increases. you can make that happen really slow though.
 
atm23 said:
I've read the Ashton manual and tapered more than once from 100Mgs + a day so I have a little experience, but you talk about physical addiction as if it can be made as a blanket statement.

There is clearly a difference between addiction potential and withdrawal, from both and individual, physical and physiological standpoint.

I thin your one liner "Be careful. Benzodiazepines are the most physically addictive drug on planet earth, they are the hardest drug to come off" doesn't bare a great deal of weight, whilst I agree with the sentiment, I'm not convinced by the actual fact in the 2 assertions, in particular the addiction potential.
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The reason I say they are the most addictive drug on planet earth is because the physical addiction part sneaks up on you, unlike with opiates where you at least notice it. There is no other drug out there besides benzodiazepines where the physical withdrawals lasts months to years besides benzodiazepines & barbiturates.

Anyways, I think the answer to the OP's question has been answered. I don't know why this thread hasn't beed closed yet.
 
After 4 weeks of continuous use

33% of patients exhibit Benzodiazepine withdrawal symptoms with abrupt stoppage of medication

Though, I'd estimate the time needed for anyone to become physically dependent is 8-12 weeks

Take drug "holidays" or something... moderate your use
 
I am dependant on Benzos because of panic disorder. I would rather not be. At this point the dr's say it would be safer for me to stay on them rather than taper me off. They worry my panic disorder will come back and worse and I might not be able to handle it. I have been on benzos daily for over 4 years for severe panic disorder. I have gotten the panic attacks in check, I still have anxiety. The dr's will never take me off. I have ran out a number of times...WD is HELL. I will NEVER let it happen again. I made a stockpile..... Now I am working on a taper.. Not to be completely off but I only want to use meds on an as needed basis.

I want to taper off myself just because I'd rather not be dependant on any drug, and that includes the opiates for my back problems. Sadly my back hurts so goddamn bad I don't think opiates as needed are an option but I can "take less" on better days.....

My advice on the benzos is to wish you the best of luck! If you ever need to talk feel free to PM me!
 
laCster said:
this^

..and if you are trying to get off, ask your doctor about a valium/klonopin taper and lyrica. a taper + lyrica would be a walk in the park compared to cold turkey.
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This +1.

I tapered off 12mg alprazolam, 120mg diazepam and 2mg flunitrazepam starting with 6mg clonazepam + varying amounts of lyrica daily.

Compared to the last time when I had seizures coming off about 30mg alprazolam daily.

Playing with benzo's is akin to playing with fire, if you don't watch it. You get burnt.
 
Supeudol said:
The reason I say they are the most addictive drug on planet earth is because the physical addiction part sneaks up on you, unlike with opiates where you at least notice it. There is no other drug out there besides benzodiazepines where the physical withdrawals lasts months to years besides benzodiazepines & barbiturates.

Anyways, I think the answer to the OP's question has been answered. I don't know why this thread hasn't beed closed yet.
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You've just added barbiturates into the mix, I'm not not nit picking at you but your original statement has no basis in real fact, it is at least missing any real detail. Many people, come off Benzos on a slow taper with little to no poblems.

I wouldnt want any other readers to panic becuase of your, IMO extreme assertions around of Benzos, being the ultimate evil of all drugs, that the last thing they need to be doing.

Anyone can taper off given the time and support, agrred though the Heather Ashton manual is a must read:-

Heather Ashton Manual

In fact MS Ashton contadicts you at almost every turn, I suppect you've had a reallt bad tie with benzos at some point, fr which you have my sympathy, but demonising them won't help others.

Addiction is more than brain chemistry, it about the indivdual, their reson for usage the amount they used, their own physiology and so on. I tend to binge out on Benzos for 2-3 mothns the taper back to nothing which I've done twice now with no real issues, Where as giving up drink (even while in the benzos) has been a real struggle. I also gave up nicotine 15 years ago but still struggle not to go back to it.

Benzos are the only substance I have ever succesfully tapered off of (I know you have to to avoid the risk of siesure) and I know many people who did'nt think they had an H habit until one day they woke and reailsed they had a big problem, alcohol is just the same.
 
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Studies have shown ( according to my Doc dont make me site the source further than that) that..
The valium addiction I had for about a year 15 years ago means I would be addicted again within 2- 3 weeks

:( Know I dont want to ever go back there!! Be careful .. Still like the odd couple but am not going to cane them.
 
valium has a very long half life in the range of 200 hours if you count its acted metabolites, IIRC so its building up a good bit in your system without you realizing, the dose you are taking is in fact much higher if you take it everyday. For this reason valium would likely build dependence faster than other benzodiazepines like xanax, and when you quit it takes longer for it to leave thereby keeping you on it longer. I would guess around 4 weeks to have real WD's. Less than that you would still prob feel off, but it wouldnt be anything you would freak out about.
 
^^^^

Its all about the long slow taper, going cold turkey from a serious benzo habit is asking for biog trouble, but lets not demonize the stuff planety of people come off all the time with little in the way of major issues as long as they follow a proper and appropraite taper program.

The half life can be as long as 200 hours but this is an advantage when tapering but soemthing that should be born in mind when comming off as WDs may continue for longer than expected, you can get pills down to 2MGs and the split them so the eventual cessation could be from a very low dose.

I'm not defnedning the substnace or advocating its use but at the same time theer are controlled ways to withdraw (if thats what you want to do) and in thr mean time it is relatively low impact on normal life, many people take it for years and years and experinace little in the way of significant side effects compared to say Amphetamines or opiates
 
atm23 said:
You've just added barbiturates into the mix, I'm not not nit picking at you but your original statement has no basis in real fact, it is at least missing any real detail. Many people, come off Benzos on a slow taper with little to no poblems.

I wouldnt want any other readers to panic becuase of your, IMO extreme assertions around of Benzos, being the ultimate evil of all drugs, that the last thing they need to be doing.

Anyone can taper off given the time and support, agrred though the Heather Ashton manual is a must read:-

Heather Ashton Manual

In fact MS Ashton contadicts you at almost every turn, I suppect you've had a reallt bad tie with benzos at some point, fr which you have my sympathy, but demonising them won't help others.

Addiction is more than brain chemistry, it about the indivdual, their reson for usage the amount they used, their own physiology and so on. I tend to binge out on Benzos for 2-3 mothns the taper back to nothing which I've done twice now with no real issues, Where as giving up drink (even while in the benzos) has been a real struggle. I also gave up nicotine 15 years ago but still struggle not to go back to it.

Benzos are the only substance I have ever succesfully tapered off of (I know you have to to avoid the risk of siesure) and I know many people who did'nt think they had an H habit until one day they woke and reailsed they had a big problem, alcohol is just the same.
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LOL.. Are you saying an H habit is worse than a benzo habit? Buddy, I am talking about if you have ABUSED benzodiazepines in heavy doses like me. I have done ever Benzodiazepine there is available in North America, including some benzos that are only available in Asia and Europe. I am talking about 2 week blackouts with Benzo's.

I have also had a huge OPIATE habit, I'm talking about 800mg of Oxycodone a day, and it is a FUCKING CAKE WALK to beat an Opiate Addiction compared to a Benzo Addiction.

Obviously you haven't abused drugs hard enough to know what is Physically Addictive and what is not. Are you one of those fucked up people who think Cocaine is physically addictive and you get withdrawals from it? Jesus.
 
atm23 said:
^^^^

Its all about the long slow taper, going cold turkey from a serious benzo habit is asking for biog trouble, but lets not demonize the stuff planety of people come off all the time with little in the way of major issues as long as they follow a proper and appropraite taper program.

The half life can be as long as 200 hours but this is an advantage when tapering but soemthing that should be born in mind when comming off as WDs may continue for longer than expected, you can get pills down to 2MGs and the split them so the eventual cessation could be from a very low dose.

I'm not defnedning the substnace or advocating its use but at the same time theer are controlled ways to withdraw (if thats what you want to do) and in thr mean time it is relatively low impact on normal life, many people take it for years and years and experinace little in the way of significant side effects compared to say Amphetamines or opiates
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You are saying Amphetamines have more Side effects than Benzodiazepines? What the fuck man? You call me out for not providing sources, well neither do you. I am the one who first said to read the Ashton Manual, and than all of a sudden you start posting about it.

There are absolutely no 'PHYSICAL' withdrawals from Amphetamines buddy, all you do is sleep it off.
 
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