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using psychedelics for brain change

T

the seeker

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Nov 1, 2004
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timothy leary suggested that you could use psychedelics for brain change. however, he was pretty vague in terms of what he actually meant by this.

has anyone here had success is uisng pychedelics for brain change and what does brain change mean to you?
 
Well, I think they proved that buddhist monks changed their brains physically as well as functionally (of course it's interrelated) by meditating often... using psychedelics is on the one hand like very intense meditation, on the other hand it's something many of us don't do all the time (but there are also many who do :) ) plus meditation happens directed, naturally and consciously while tripping remains artificial.

If you look at it like that it's not that giant a leap though is it?
 
I thought it obvious we were talking radical change here, that is to say: significant.
Let's not nitpick over what defines significance, we mean measurably or noticeably more than average, than usual or 'before use'.
 
everything is significant. many little things make up a big whole. nothing of great significance will change after one meditation. why is a psychedelic different? it may initially seem to lean more to the 'whole' side. but the change they may bring is nonetheless by means of the small "insignificant" ones. no giant leaps here.
 
Yes I wouldn't pay too much attention to Leary. He and alot of others of that time period thought that LSD WAS the key instead of viewing it as a catalyst for positive change in a person's life. I must admit his books like Your Brain is God are pretty good reads.
 
Yes they do. They dissolve boundaries by destroying the ego. Once the ego has been lost, you already know the way to lose it and can turn it off and on like a button (or at least I can).

They are also responsible for profound life changing experiences, just as, if not more intense as a near death experience. They also teach you how to live life happy by showing you the finer things in it, such as: friends, family, nature, philosophy, etc.
 
Well ok then maybe psychedelics will not just change your brain, but they can - being catalysts. How many peoples lives are changed by multiple experiences, the brain must be a reflection of that.
The change is normally not sustainable, we all know that acid causes artificial enlightenment but many old patterns will just creep in again if you don't use the tool and work with it.
No, I don't think psychedelics will automatically better your life but they enable you in many ways, good and bad.
If you trip very often I assure you that there will be psychological consequences, you can get way too open that way, more than you can grow into and therefore handle. It makes you believe more than you really should.
But if you trip often but not too often, and you develop yourself in the right direction I am positive your physical biology as well as your (spiritual) psyche may change for the better.
 
Of course, but that doesn't mean there are no markers or measure, that it is an amorphous mass of black boxiness...
You could measure brain waves. Gamma waves are linked to intuition, empathy, creativity, and ‘aha’ moments such as when we solve a problem or experience an insight. I bet that tripping, and not the passive kind but the active kind in which you actually take part in the change yourself, you could develop yourself to increase gamma waves exactly the way meditation does.
The more you would do this, the higher the gamma activity I presume. If you could establish this correlation that would constitute successful use of psychedelics to change yourself and your brain. I'm not sure of the intensity of this effect but like I said I bet it is there to some extent or other.
 
OK what I'm really hoping for is something more definite from the OP, whatever Leary did or didn't mean. Markers & measures are good but does this actually prove that psychedelics bring about measurable changes?
Personally I interpreted what was posted as being more to do with a subjective counsciouness change than measurable activity - however it's vague enough for anyone to project their own preferences onto.
 
I think the chances are in favor of this being about the 8 circuits of the brain that Leary talked about and Robert Anton Wilson as well. Personally I highly prefer the latter.
Apparently the idea was that certain substances influence the way we function regarding these circuits. There is an interesting idea behind it and in a way it's useful to think about but I don't feel it holds enough actual truth in the end, this is pretty simplistic psychology and we should hope we're kinda past that.
 
B9 said:
however it's vague enough for anyone to project their own preferences onto.
Click to expand...

qft. such vagueness for the sake of vagueness usually only serves as a shoddy cover up for an inherent internal lack of coherence. if the reader is expected to fill out these kind of gaping blanks himself regarding such a fundamental level of the text, i cannot help but wonder why the author bothered to write in the first place. i prefer a gnostic blank page over that.
 
In all fairness to the OP he says "what does brain change mean to you?"
But still, a carte blanche in this context steals away from the coherence and value of the question and discussion.
 
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