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Unable to control facial expressions due to long term MDMA use?

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whoseanb

Bluelighter
Joined
May 4, 2010
Messages
227
Is this even a side affect? I'm pretty much a hardcore researcher when it comes to drugs weather I've done them or not, and I've never, ever heard anything about this..

Basically I've pretty much used X (not pure MDMA but pills which could be mixed with god knows what) for about 8 years. I've never just went flat out nuts in a night by taking tons of pills. Most I've taken in 1 night was 3 1/2. I did take at least a pill weekly for a month (probably twice) in those 8 years before I learned from this site that it was excessive and I could possible be causing long term damage to my brain. But when I think about it, 8 years popping these unknown pills is just flat out fucking stupid.

Yes, I've had the ultimate crashes were I feel like the most worthless piece of shit alive, blowing my brains out, life sucks, I don't want to go to work etc. (Y'all know the bad comedowns) But I feel completely healthy, happy and normal now. Workout and train boxing on a regular.

Luckily, I stopped taking pills for about a year and a half now, ( I won't lie, mainly due to the drought) but I noticed this about maybe 10 months to a year ago now that I seem to crack a smile without any control what so ever. Weather I want to or not.

I've been registered on this board for a while just waiting to see a similar problem because it seems that whatever you're experiencing, someone ALWAYS will be experiencing at least something similar and you'll find a thread on it. Yet, I've never seen this mentioned so now I feel like a complete weirdo but dammit after a year went by and I'm still noticing it I have to see if I'm alone.

I can literally be laying in my bed, at night, think of something that happened at work and just be smiling away like a fucking lunatic or something.
Or, if I'm at work and I see someone approaching me I'll just start smiling for no fucking reason. It's doesn't make any sense and I'm sure some people are wondering "what's up with this dude?".

Yea, I know it sounds minor compared to the major side effects such as SS and all but after a year of recognizing this it's just bugging me out. I thought it was just me tripping for a while but now something has to be related to my long term MDMA use.

I also find it hard to concentrate when someone's looking into my eyes talking to me. I duck my head or turn the other way becasue I feel so uncomfortable staring back at them. I've NEVER felt like this before. And I'm always trying to keep myself from laughing or smiling whenever someone is talking to me weather trying to be funny or not. IT's getting pretty annoying now. I wonder to myself almost everyday at work if anyone is catching me just sitting by myself smiling at nothing? It happens everday. I think about something that might be slightly funny or not funny at all and here I am smiling all by myself like a dumbass.

Weird.

Anyone?
 
I smile when I walk around because I can never get over how beautiful life is. As a matter of fact, I'm smiling right now =D

I've never heard of this and don't believe it's a side effect, but I'm no doctor or MDMA expert, so don't listen to me. %)
 
U know what they say it takes a lot less effort to smile than to frown so be happy that ur happy. Who cares what people think if anything they think ur one happy fucker who loves life! When I was lil kids in school used to make fun of me and call me smiley cause they said I was always smiling. I really didnt notice I was smiling I guess it was just habit. It didn't bother me. I didn't go around trying not to smile I just continued doing what I was doing.
 
"I also find it hard to concentrate when someone's looking into my eyes talking to me. I duck my head or turn the other way becasue I feel so uncomfortable staring back at them."

This sounds like typical social anxiety.(i have it too) The fact that you wonder if anyone is seeing you smiling at work is also social anxiety. (i also smile often when i exchange flirty-emails or think fo sth funny but i dont care about it)

The laughing sounds like some OCD symptom that was developped cause of social anxiety. Generally OCD can take any form...if you can search deep enough and maybe you ll find why your OCD manifested itself this way but WHY doesnt really matter.


The good news is that mdma didnt cause social anxiety...it just allowed it to surface so you can take notice of it and cure it.Lastly dont try to supress your laughing or anything, cause the more you try to resist it the worse it 'll become.Just ACCEPT it as something natural and it will go away eventually. Feel free to ask me anything although i might be wrong about my diagnosis ofc
 
Thanks a lot for the responses. I also figured it had to be some sort of anxiety but It's just weird how it just started recentl and I'm about to be 30. I never remember being so uncomfortable looking eye to eye at another human. Especially being a man, we're taught no one will take you serious if you're not looking directly in ones eyes. Here I am turning around like a little fucking kid when someones talking to me like I'm scared? I hate it. I just feel like I have no confidence if I can't stare at someone directly in their eyes while conversing. Especially to someone in a higher position than me like a manager. Shows signs of weakness, and that I am not.
 
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this may seem a little off but i have also used MDMA/MDA heavily in the past, as well as several anti-depressants (5-ht re-uptake inhibitors) and lastly tramadol, alll the drugs and butylone(very heavily used ) mess with 5-ht, after qiuting the MDXX family and eventually after abusing the living hell out of tramadol for 6 years daily, wich releases 5-ht, although not as potent as MDXX's....... have the same effect, but only in withdrawl or abstinence from serotonin releasers, a get jerky/tweaky my eyebrows are shaky if i open my eyes wide, and most similar to you i have a whole myriad of random facial expressions that are randomly on my face at anytime of the day, sometimes i will be in the opposite moood of the general expresion, sad but grinning, and its all without me conciously doing it, sometimes innapropriate for situations too, its bothersome .....I think its serotonins version of tardive dyskinesia( dopamine). it goes away if i go back on anti-depressants or tramadol mostly, i think or my theory is that ive messed with the neurocircutry and somethng is firing on its own, almost like seizure activity in a way. any way i think the emotional apects of serotonin releasers and the connection to emotion and facial cues (expressions) are linked and to much or to little 5-ht causes this phenominon, its weird and sometimes very troubling, i am BI-polar and have been on tons of meds but fully atribute this to serotonin releaser overuse and acute dosing regimines, does this sound anywhere similar? this also incudes heavy tryptamine usage- mainly 4-ho-dmt/DMT/5-meo-dalt/5-meo-dmt...... and the psilocybin at the formerly mentioned was a everyother day thing for 2 years of my teenage life, with 5years of daily dexedrine/adderall usage as a kid with "ADD", so i pretty much think there is some definite neurochemical changes not to mention the laundry list of psych meds ive been on or tried through my psychiatrist. i know i sound insanely stupid, as i was self medication a bi-polar disorder that was undiagnosed at the time, but the problems wee are talking about did not arise till post serotonin releaser/re-uptake inhibitor/agonist use was stopped.
 
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Plenty of facial sensations for the entire first year of recovery.
Quite a few small muscle tics as well, so small that most were not visible to others - but I could feel every single one.
And they were ALL on my face.

In particular between my eyebrows and just under my eyes the small muscles would twitch, often very rapidly - sometimes twenty to thirty individual contractions within a second or two!

I considered these to be micro-seizures and definite signs of altered rCBV, or regional cerebral blood volume.
The serotonin nerves in your brain, which serve as the connection between the intestines and the mind, strongly influence small blood vessels (or cerebral micro-vasculature).
The worst of these mild 'seizures' of the face occurred early on, in the first few months of recovery.
Prior to them was a rather disturbing case of nastygmus - otherwise known as seizures of the eyes.
This occurs while rolling for some people, especially on repeated doses.

Following the facial tics, which persisted for the first three to four months post Serotonin Syndrome, I began to experience rather persistent and debilitating head-pressure.
Sensations on the scalp were more common during this time, but the face continued to ACHE and hurt day after day. After day....
But the twitches really stopped by month six, and the pressure and aching did not relent until 13+ months!
Even now there are mild remnants from time to time.

There might have been times when my facial expressions were inappropriate, especially during social interaction.
But mostly I felt distant and disconnected - disembodied while around 'normal' people.
I managed most conversations remarkably well despite this even during the torturous times.

Specifically I remember not wanting to make eye contact during the hard days - somehow unable to handle the gaze of another person.
It was more like I couldn't handle the thought of looking back at them as if I were still inside my own head - because I wasn't, certainly not in a human sense.
I imagined that I knew what it would be like to be an animal trapped inside a human's mind - able to speak and listen (barely) - but unable to assign meaning or depth to any thought. Or word.

The eye contact problem seems to be a rather common phenomena among former SSRI users that are 'withdrawing' from their medication.
Those that suffer the greatest 'withdrawal' symptoms may be completely unable to look another person in the eye. Much less engage conversation.
Several have described themselves as unhuman robots, devoid of emotion and thought, and unable to process or understand others.
They look down at the floor a lot.

Sounds like a severe case of Aspergers, to be honest.
Right?

Smiling?
That I haven't heard specifically from any SSRi, MDMA, or stim user.
All the case studies....all the anecdotes....nope - you are the first.

But it isn't that hard to believe since the muscles of the face are directly wired into the brain.
And PLENTY of serotonergic drug users, and mentally ill patients, will describe facial phenomena.
Its too bad that doctors label such a symptom as schizo, paranoid, or psychotic.
In reality it is a REAL physical process that is related to nerves.

Did you know that your vagus nerve sends information from the intestines all the way to the brain - through a major cranial nerve?
Then it travels to the hypothalamus - the major site in the brain of MDMA toxicity.
And the heart of the endocrine and adrenal system...

Your gut, your face, and your emotions are all wired together in a very complicated and mysterious way.
That is the best answer I can provide.
I hope this helped.

Oh yeah - exercise.
 
peroxide said:
this may seem a little off but i have also used MDMA/MDA heavily in the past, as well as several anti-depressants (5-ht re-uptake inhibitors) and lastly tramadol, alll the drugs and butylone(very heavily used ) mess with 5-ht, after qiuting the MDXX family and eventually after abusing the living hell out of tramadol for 6 years daily, wich releases 5-ht, although not as potent as MDXX's....... have the same effect, but only in withdrawl or abstinence from serotonin releasers, a get jerky/tweaky my eyebrows are shaky if i open my eyes wide, and most similar to you i have a whole myriad of random facial expressions that are randomly on my face at anytime of the day, sometimes i will be in the opposite moood of the general expresion, sad but grinning, and its all without me conciously doing it, sometimes innapropriate for situations too, its bothersome .....I think its serotonins version of tardive dyskinesia( dopamine). it goes away if i go back on anti-depressants or tramadol mostly, i think or my theory is that ive messed with the neurocircutry and somethng is firing on its own, almost like seizure activity in a way. any way i think the emotional apects of serotonin releasers and the connection to emotion and facial cues (expressions) are linked and to much or to little 5-ht causes this phenominon, its weird and sometimes very troubling, i am BI-polar and have been on tons of meds but fully atribute this to serotonin releaser overuse and acute dosing regimines, does this sound anywhere similar? this also incudes heavy tryptamine usage- mainly 4-ho-dmt/DMT/5-meo-dalt/5-meo-dmt...... and the psilocybin at the formerly mentioned was a everyother day thing for 2 years of my teenage life, with 5years of daily dexedrine/adderall usage as a kid with "ADD", so i pretty much think there is some definite neurochemical changes not to mention the laundry list of psych meds ive been on or tried through my psychiatrist. i know i sound insanely stupid, as i was self medication a bi-polar disorder that was undiagnosed at the time, but the problems wee are talking about did not arise till post serotonin releaser/re-uptake inhibitor/agonist use was stopped.
Click to expand...

Man this is EXACTLY what I'm talking about. No lie, just today a friend at work was telling me that he just got off the phone from someone telling him his friend died in a car accident. In the middle of him telling me I find myself GRINNING! I tried my best to throw him off by saying "Damn man I'm sorry to hear that" but at the same time grining. What the fuck is this shit. It's been over a year now since I've used. But it has to be serotonin related.

I haven't done NEAR all the drugs you have but the symptoms are definitly similar. Used Mdxx more than any other drug. I've dabbled in 2c-e,2c-i and MXE.

ANd now that I've read First Bad Comedowns post it just hit me. My muscled twitching has gone. I had it around the eye area a lot. And a shit ton in my biceps. It would keep me from sleeping at night. Shit would just start randomly jumping. I just ignored it and just now I realized I haven't had that in a While. Probabaly 6 months or more.

Now this random facial expression shit is extremely bothersome. I have to tell myself over and over to control myself but no matter how hard I try, I can't. I guess I just have to ride it out. Thanks for the responses.

P.S. I exercise A LOT
 
It's never just full out laughing. (Now that'll be really fucking creepy) It's just the smiling, grinning. So damn odd man.
 
magnesium supplementation is very good for twitches and in combination with tonic water is great for night time restless legs and twitching from working out, if not the most potent otc remedy i have found thats in the realm of safety( depends on dose and tolerance) is a phenibut/quality valerian root extract combo, if im not mistaken this covers both GABAa and GABAb recptors( correct me if wrong), and is quite potent and sedating so be careful with that one, valporic acid(depakote) is a potent ant-convulsant and is derived from valerian. the anti-oxidants:b-complex,l-theanine,vit-c,alpha lipoic acid,and fish oil are excellent for maintaining a good free radical balance in the body, with milk thistle too, if you want any other remedies for the subject matter let me know i personally have tried and use all of these,
 
Ya, It looks like you got focal dystonia. I have a similar thing and it has been with me for about twenty years. I just live with it and take botox shots every so often from a neurologist.
 
Too many long ass posts here, the MDMA to my knowledge had nothing to do with this man. If it did you would've seen a thread like you said yourself. The best way to handle it is just like when your in a bad trip, just don't fight it. Let you be you, I love that I laugh and smile when I think to myself. That means that my brain has such a vivd memory of the amount of serotonin that was released at that moment that you can feel it again. The brain loves to relive the good times if you just let it. Don't fight yourself just smile, it's what I do.
 
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