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Tryptamine truth

Wutang_Forever

Bluelighter
Joined
May 21, 2015
Messages
190
The tryptamine substances such as DMT, mushrooms, DPT, and 5-meo-dmt seem to resonate more deeply and intensely into the human psyche; stripping ego, while presenting a cathedral like mental state of spacey truth. LSD cannot reach these depths, nor have any phenethylamines I've met. High dose tryptamine experiences are particularly profound.
Does anyone else feel this way? I'm interested in whether or not this feeling is subjective.
 
I think you're going to be met with a handful of contradicting opinions on this one, as it's a very personal thing I've noticed. While the effects are generally the same, everyone's headspace will be different to some degree.

I wouldn't be surprised if there were just as many people with the polar opposite feelings as there are those who agree, tbh.
 
I follow you to a certain degree.

For me, tryptamines are personal, universal, and function at the level of the soul.
Phenethylamines manifest more on the side of the psyche and socio-cultural level, again, for me.
 
I will say this... 4-subsisted tryptamines, but particularly mushrooms, has been the most "interesting" substances I've encountered to date. LSD, dmt, and dpt has been slightly less "intellectual" but every bit as profound. These drugs leave the biggest impact the longest (besides for the hppd which phenethylamines and ergolides seem to be the primary culprit of in my experience). A good trip from a tryptamine or ergolide, is, convincing, for lack of a better term. I myself was a big proponent of the idea that psychedelics somehow drew back the veil and exposed reality for what it really is, and I probably still am when asked under the influence of a quarter of mushrooms. But as I sober up and get "back to my senses", the irony that I call the effect of hallucinogens "reality", is not lost on me. So in the end I was just frustrated, when trying to approach the question "what is going on when I trip" scholarly like, for I am definitely no scholar.

"5-ht sub receptor agonist" means nothing to me, but I know that's what causes the effect of the drug. At the very least the sites of activity have to be incredibly meaningful to the human condition. The best I can describe is other opiate/gabba agonist create intoxication, psychedelics create experiences. I know thats a cheap way out, I am just trying to explain why that receptor agonist explanation is not enough information to suitably explain the variety or manifestation of the psychedelic trip. Did I mention I'm a high school drop out trying to learn about brain chemistry through wikipedia articles? Like I said, I'm not a scholar, but I am getting to a point. There are characteristics to high dose psychedelics that have manifested in a number of ways through my many experiences. Tryptamines seem to induce a philosophical mindset, like I can't help but think about life, death, the big picture, we all know the topics. And as the experience intensifies and my senses bleed, making any sense out of the psychedelic soup becomes harder and harder, and I loose my ability to comprehend that I could at one point even comprehend in the first place. I believe this is what most call "ego death". The randomness of what follows is what truly terrifies me.

I have seen the void and I have been an echo echoing off itself for all eternity. Or if you'd rather I not use hippy metaphors I have seemingly experienced the act of non-existence, as well as the act of being cause and effect without a beginning or an end. It is common to experience both in the same trip. As the peak dies down, and the ability to form thoughts begins. This is the space I truly hold in high regard. It is characterized by a sharp and deep introspection. The place thoughts often turn for myself is towards the paradoxical information I have and use to interpret my view of the universe, and beyond. At these times my mind consists of thoughts directed to 1 notion, that truth is beyond human perception, and not to be scared by this, but freed. I look at the universe and its mechanisms and cause and effect seems to underlay everything. I ask why I am here?" That question inevitably leads to"why is the universe here?" The big bang. Something from nothing. As fundamental a paradox as has ever existed to my mind. And you know what occurs to me under the influence of mushrooms? That I can't comprehend the blankness that is the nothing I was before my biological computer turned on at birth. And yet here I am. I can not comprehend something coming from nothing, but here it is. And when I get really scared or sad about having to turn my computer off at some point in the inevitable future, and I remember that all my memories and hopes and loves and fears and experiences will be washed down the drain that is the void, I am not to despair, and I intellectualize the paradox that sums up the "tryptamine truth" to me: something will come from nothing and return to nothing, and this process will continue indefinitely. You will be the universe, unable to experience the conscious its biological computers create. You will be the conscious, unable to know you are also the universe.

Also as I come down there is a certain importance I always feel, because prior to ego death, I always, always, ALWAYS, forget that no matter how far you go you will always come back. I can't comprehend that I will ever be able to comprehend again. So when I begin to comprehend, if I can organize myself beyond amazement at the experience, I often think of self betterment, a definite drive to find the places where I don't meet my own expectations, and how to amend the past and better the future. This humanist drive seems almost alien installed, and has hung around, even through periods of abstinence.

So it is no lie to say I asked mushrooms "why am I here" and they replied "just do better". I feel accomplished now doing better, even knowing it'll be washed down the drain. I create meaning where there was none, after seeing "reality" in a drug induced hallucination.
 
I have seen the void and I have been an echo echoing off itself for all eternity.
^tryptamines summed up, almost like it allows you to truly experience the vastness that is your mind. lifts some sort of mental veil and allows for a deeper perception.
 
moe.ron , ever heard of the Bhagavad Gita ? I believe it might be of interest to you :)
 
moe.ron , ever heard of the Bhagavad Gita ? I believe it might be of interest to you :)

Someone gave me a copy of "Bhagavad-gita: As It Is" probably 7-8 years ago at a music festival, though to be honest I never have read it. After a couple minutes of looking at my bookshelf I was able to find it. Is this version an alright translation or should I seek another source online? Stuff like Alan Watts use to resound with me a lot, until i took it to literally and had to step back for a bit. Nowadays my intellect is more critical while my heart is more open minded. In this way I am beginning to truly appreciate the great metaphors for what they are, feeling them resound within me, content that it resounds without trying to intellectually justify it.
 
I dont know about that version. I'm using the one translated by Eknath Easwaran and it resonates with me.

I have to add, it's not a metaphor (although the book is situated in a war situation while it clearly propagates non-violence against all beings, but thats beside the point im trying to make). It is a straightforward message of how it is when man lives in the spirit, and a guide for doing so. I came to it after reading Be Here Now, another classic. Especially of interest if you have extensive experience with psychedelics.
 
For me, LSD seems to make everything feel a lot more profound/significant than other psychedelics. I put this down to the mania this drug causes me. Grandiose thinking, racing thoughts and increased excitability are all characteristic of the LSD experience.

LSD is the only psychedelic that does this to me; I attribute this to its dopaminergic activity. Tryptamines and phenethylamines have a much more chilled out and rational feel to them - they don't make me feel like a crazy person.
 
Tryptamines definitely feel more profound and spiritual, yes.
 
Tryptamines generally make me feel like I've been posioned. I would hardly call them "spiritual". They provide what I would describe as "dirty" highs, at least the few ones I've tried (DMT, DPT, psilocin). Makes me feel like my nerves are on fire, blood pressure all over the map, twitching, nausea, paradoxical somnolence, .45 caliber pupils, etc.

I really like LSD and the phenethylamines though. They play nicer with me.
 
Tryptamines generally make me feel like I've been posioned. I would hardly call them "spiritual". They provide what I would describe as "dirty" highs, at least the few ones I've tried (DMT, DPT, psilocin). Makes me feel like my nerves are on fire, blood pressure all over the map, twitching, nausea, paradoxical somnolence, .45 caliber pupils, etc.

I really like LSD and the phenethylamines though. They play nicer with me.
Weird.

For me, 4-AcO-DMT and psilocin are the only psychedelics I find enjoyable right from the get go. They have a very smooth and rapid onset.
The come-up on LSD can be a bit 'jarring'.
And as much as I LOVE 2C-E (it's my favorite psychedelic), it has a very rough and lengthy come-up. During the come-up there is a very unpleasant body load... most of the time 50mg cyclizine works fine but occasionally I require 4mg ondansetron as well. I've never actually vomited while on 2C-E but it can feel pretty nauseating during the come-up.
 
Tryptamines definitely feel more profound and spiritual, yes.

Subjective. Many people can say the same about LSD. One could say LSD creates more spiritual space, it goes straight for the states of unity with universe. You feel one with everything. Again, this is very subjective. The trip is in your mind, not in the drug!
 
To me, LSD is cleaner, almost surgical. Mushrooms seem more involving, emotional.

Mescaline feels like it connects directly to your soul.
 
Tryptamines are great at forcing your mind to completely leave normal "reality" behind, more readily than phenethylamines/ergoloids, however personally I don't think this makes them more profound by any means. The raw power of high dose tryptamines is truly an astounding experience, it's like a full mental reset, but personally over time I've found it harder to make tryptamines generally useful in comparison to phenethylamines & LSD (tryptamines were great when I was younger for really forcing my mind/eyes open though).

The fogginess of the tryptamine experience makes it hard to sort things out the way I can on say DOC or LSD, as well since tryptamines are much harder to control I can't really guide the trip with them as much. I know what I need to work on in my trips, so I don't need something as pushy as mushrooms when I can take other drugs (which I also prefer for the recreational aspects of the psychedelic experience) & push my mind in the directions I already know I need to be going.

The clarity of phenethylamines makes them useful in ways I couldn't have even imagined before using them! As well for my body/mind I'd actually say drugs like DOC feel more natural, more personal, & certainly less "dirty" than mushrooms. With tryptamines it also often feels like I'm circling around some great truth, which I never actually get to see...on phenethylamines, I actually see the great truths with complete clarity, and since I have more control over the headspace I'm much better able to more permanently change my ways of thinking & behavior (still a slow, ongoing process, but still).

LSD's an interesting one since it has so many characteristics of both sides (as it's chemistry shows)...my main area of interest with LSD now though is taking the doses to the extreme, due to it's much lower toxicity than phens, my strong preference for LSD over tryptamines, & that I have much less experience with extreme LSD dosing than extreme trypt dosing (due to scarcity & past monetary issues). With tryptamines my main area of interest now is DMT, the way I see it, DMT is like the ultimate expression of the tryptamine experience (with my favorite DOC being the ultimate expression of the phenethylamine experience, although I'll admit I've experienced fewer phens than trypts so far - either way DOC is the ultimate psychedelic for my brain chemistry).
 
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From personal experience, I would echo that which others have mentioned. Tryptamines (4-HO-MIPT and DIPT) felt more scattered and emotionally driven while phenethylamines (2C-E and 2C-I) are wonderfully clear minded. During one of my best 2C-E trips, I recall just sitting on my bed in what I can only call a "pure" state of mind. No emotions, no racing logic, no impulses, no feelings of any kind, just simple divine existence, as if my mind was wiped clean and I was one with a more natural state of being. It was not euphoric, it was not terrifying, there was no thought process which could be examined. In that moment I forgot I was tripping. That was a special moment that only the phenethylamine could provide imo.
 
If tryptamines represent the truth of my transcendence and connection with the universe, kappa-opioid agonists represent the truth of my individuality and my inner truth.

Tryptamines are the branches and leaves and kappa-opioid agonists are the roots.

I'm the trunk.
 
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