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Trying to get off the kratom merry go round.... Suggestions?

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amadorsober

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Jul 26, 2016
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So, 2014/2015 was my time to get sober. I had been a functioning, then not so functioning alcoholic for 2 decades. I checked myself into a detox, and began an almost 12 month journey to put together this 9.5 months continuous sobriety I have now. Along the way, I lived I in a sober living environment for a while. I was having emotional/depression/anxiety issues, and was hurting. Someone suggested I try this "herbal supplement" called Kratom, and that quite a few people where using it for similar symptoms. Ha! If I only knew. It started off as just a teaspoon in my coffee every few days, and is now roughly 25g a day. I started this part of my journey in late December, I would guess.
Fast forward- still sober, and realize I am way addicted to this stuff. I get super bad anxiety, restless legs, and cold like symptoms when I am over 8 hours without it. I have 2 jobs, am back with the family, and want OUT of this cycle. I am trying a 2 gram a day taper, and am not even a full 24 into it and feel anxious as heck, and have a runny nose. I have detoxed from alcohol, hydro, and finally suboxone. This seems every bit as bad. I can't believe I got myself into this.
How long does this last? Does anything help? Any help or ideas would be appreciated....
 
There are a number of people with more knowledge of kratom dependency here than I, so I'll leave it to them. But in the sense it is similar to an opioid, perhaps grab some loperamide (just a little, you won't need too much of the stuff) for the runs and such. That was always what was the shittiest part of withdrawal after the honeymoon period of opioid use ended. Keep up with the basics, getting rest, sleeping, eating and reaching out to people you're comfortable with.

You actually sound pretty stable. For me a whole hell of a lot of withdrawal is in my head, but it was really hard to train myself to realize during withdrawal! So try not to beat yourself up too much. Try warm baths.

Tapering requires time and dedication. It is worth it in the end IMHO, I could never just jump off a high dose of anything and be very successful. Of course you'll eventually have to make the jump, but don't take the taper too fast or too slow if you can help it. Listen to your body, it is going to be the secret in how you'll best be able to care for yourself.
 
I have tapered off of kratom twice, so here are a few chemicals that are good for kratom withdrawals
Pregabalin/Gabapentin
Cannabis
Nigella Sativa Seed oil (This one is actually surprisingly good for restless legs)

The best manner in which to taper would be to decrease your daily amount by 15-20% every 3 to 4 days. It will take some time, but i promise this is the smoothest way to handle it, and you wont receive withdrawals most of the time. So if you start with 25g, basically you would go down by 2-3g every 3-4 days. It works like a charm, and the black cumin seed oil helps potentiate the kratom as well, so that helps.
 
I had a 50 gram daily habit - So I know the pains of withdrawals of Kratom.
Like HeadHigh suggested; Gabapentin is a life savor.
I would suggest tapering 1 gram every 3 days.
It sucks I know how you feel.
The depression, anxiety, and restlessness was the worse for me.
I did feel much better after 2 weeks, I did cold turkey though.
A small dose of a benzo will help, but try not to get addicted to that either.

I'm here to offer you support and advice as well!
Much love my friend. It get's better!
 
Gabapentin and clonidine are trusted, true methods of aiding tapering and detoxing opioid patients. If would be ideal if you could see a doctor. Is this a possibility OP? Do you have a long time practitioner?
 
toothpastedog said:
Gabapentin and clonidine are trusted, true methods of aiding tapering and detoxing opioid patients. If would be ideal if you could see a doctor. Is this a possibility OP? Do you have a long time practitioner?
Click to expand...

I was going to recommend the same thing. You seem pretty open about your issues with alcohol abuse and have been to detox in the past - is it something your doctor already knows about? If so, it'll be a pretty easy conversation. If not, now is a fine time to mention what is going on with the Kratom and ask for the meds that toothpaste dog mentioned. I would also recommend something non-habit forming for sleep.

I would also suggest mentioning your past issues with depression/anxiety prior to the Kratom use. You might need some follow up care to deal with this as it may resurface when you eliminate Kratom.

Good luck!

- VE
 
Kratom isn't something to be toyed with.
Many people get that wrong. I take kratom ONLY at night (usually after 9pm) and I get restless legs + nightmares and bad sleep if I take it for too many days in a row and then do a sudden break. I can imagine how bad it is if your body is used to having it ALL of the time, all day. Don't taper from 25g to 2g...that's wayy too little! Go from 25 to 20 to 15, and so on and so forth. Try supplementing it with St. John's Wort or Valerian root. I wouldn't recommend doing a benzo or anything like that. Why substitute meds for meds?
 
Slow and steady wins the race - otherwise it doesn't really deserve to be called a taper (especially with a big habit, and since all habits can be relative, I'd say the OP has a bit of big habit with his kratom).
 
I guess I am the odd man out. I take it to combat the symptoms of the medication I am on, and I am able to take days off with no problem. I guess I am just used to feeling pretty crappy all the time. I am hopefully nearing the end of my medication regime, so I will post how I feel in this thread.
 
Well, it is like they say for chronic pain patients (which, for all practical purposes, I'd say you pretty much would qualify for, and then some, given what you've been though on your meds), how the rates of dependency leading to addiction are far lower. Who is to really say until you stop taking your kratom and current meds. Until then, I think you've been doing amazing, I wouldn't really change a thing. Keep doing what you're doing to get healthier and more stable :) <3
 
Thanks- yes, this process is going to be a head game for me on top of the physical. Yuck. restless legs and anxiety are starting, and it's only day two.i hope to only do 22/23 grams today...
 
To all-
This gabapentin- is it available non scrip? Some one suggested phenibut, which I got but have not taken yet. They said its some type of "gaba". Thoughts?
As far as going to my doc- he is painfully aware of my alcoholism. He has tried to get me to quit for years. I know him (small town) and don't think he will have much sympathy for me.
 
HeadHigh- where is all this stuff available at? Not the cannibus, but the other stuff? Restless legs are a bear, and I've never heard of the black cumin seed oil or how to use it. Or the other items. Thanks to you and everyone for all the help and advice. I can't exactly bring this up in an AA meeting....&#55358;&#56595;
 
Thanks to ALL of you who responded. Our AC went out last night, so I have been dealing with that as well and not been able to Che k these messages. I've read them all and tried to respond, and will watch that video later today when I get a chance.
i apologize if these posts are kinda scattered. I'm new here, hot, and in early, slow wd's.... Not exactly my A game...
 
amadorsober said:
To all-
This gabapentin- is it available non scrip? Some one suggested phenibut, which I got but have not taken yet. They said its some type of "gaba". Thoughts?
As far as going to my doc- he is painfully aware of my alcoholism. He has tried to get me to quit for years. I know him (small town) and don't think he will have much sympathy for me.
Click to expand...

Phenibut may be helpful, but it can be very habit forming with withdrawal much like GHB/benzodiazepines/alcohol. I have experienced a "hangover" from it and it was nastier than any I ever have. Personally I would recommend against it, specifically with your history of alcohol use. If your doctor wants you to quit, educate yourself about opioid withdrawal (and kratom withdrawal in specific) and the use of gabapentin and clonidine to treat associated symptoms.

There is literally no reason any doctor would not prescribe a course of ropinorole, as unlike gabapentin it can't give you any kind of buzz (not that gabapentin does if you're in withdrawal) and unlike clonidine it doesn't have any potential adverse impacts on your blood pressure. It seems fairly under utilized though.

You can pick up Tiger Balm at any CVS type mega pharmacy, or order it online as you can pretty much any OTC thing.

Get a list together with strategies to present to your doctors, not to "try" them necessarily, but to strategize with him and get his input. You should go to another doctor if he turns you down. Try to gentle make sure he understands you are struggling, want the same goals of getting off the stuff as he does, and that you are in pain. You don't need to try and present these things as safe or whatever, he should be able to recognize that (eventually) if he is halfway competent.
 
Honestly, I use ibuprofen for restless legs... that's partly because I jog and my body has gotten used to using kratom as a way to battle the soreness. So when I don't take it, my legs feel more restless than usual
 
Do not try phenibut, as mentioned earlier, its a nasty drug for this kind of situation. IF you are going to use it, keep it to only once a week. Gabapentin is a prescription drug, but its very easy to get since its a schedule 4 i believe. The nigella sativa seed oil is available online, somewhere like amazon may have it.
 
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