Dissociatives Tripping for Dark Experiences

[F.U.B.A.R.]

Dark experiences on psychedelics will find you.

There's no need to go looking for them...

 

[golego55]

That might be one the quickest and most genuine acknowledgement of a mistake that I've seen on the internet in some time. Good for you. I do think that I was a little harsh regardless, in my defence I did post in another thread on the same day about a friend or maybe just an acquaintance eventually that seems to have decided to kill himself after a few months where on at least on occasion he did have a very bad time on some hallucinogens, so I guess that was maybe kinda in my subconscious or something.

I'm glad you understood my point despite that, though. But I do see there is a more forgiving way to answer this, I think it's more accurately or sensibly or whatever just having an extreme curiousity with the potentially fairly difficult and macarbe aspects of psychedelic and dissociative experiences, which I do kind of get, the time has to be right but I have found enjoyment in the awareness of how loopy things are getting even when they are at least threatening to get kind serious... That's slightly frightening excitement, it's natural it would feel at least a little good.

As far as "darkness"... Dissociatives IMO are consistently darker, just in general, but, conversely, it's easier to bear more darkness on dissociatives than it is on psychedelics.... maybe I'll think some more about this later.

I apologize for going back to media but an idea I've come across was one in the movie Inception. It's not really a good analogy (and I'm not trying to use a "cool movie reference") but to me what we talked about feels a little like that movie.

Some people make it out of the experience/trip fully intact. Some make it out but suffer from debilitating and long lasting effects. And some people never make it out to the other side of the trip at all.

I've read a little (and an even smaller amount of scientific literature) about DXM. But unlike LSD I haven't come across any real mentions of flashbacks years after having gone on a DXM trip. (this may not be an example of what you meant by "easier to bear more darkness on dissociatives than it is on psychedelics", but that's what it made me think of).

I'm really grateful to you for helping me come to a better realization about DXM (and drugs). In the future I hope we can discuss the subject (in general and any specific drugs) more.

 

[Vastness]

I apologize for going back to media but an idea I've come across was one in the movie Inception. It's not really a good analogy (and I'm not trying to use a "cool movie reference") but to me what we talked about feels a little like that movie.

Some people make it out of the experience/trip fully intact. Some make it out but suffer from debilitating and long lasting effects. And some people never make it out to the other side of the trip at all.

I've read a little (and an even smaller amount of scientific literature) about DXM. But unlike LSD I haven't come across any real mentions of flashbacks years after having gone on a DXM trip. (this may not be an example of what you meant by "easier to bear more darkness on dissociatives than it is on psychedelics", but that's what it made me think of).

I'm really grateful to you for helping me come to a better realization about DXM (and drugs). In the future I hope we can discuss the subject (in general and any specific drugs) more.

Please, no need to apologise any further, I would do well to remember that Buddhist sentiment sometimes about "not speaking unless it is going to improve upon the silence"... Although I must say since starting to smoke weed again I'm finding myself a lot less inclined to rage at whatever random nonsense on the internet.

I actually don't think bringing up media is particularly out of place when it comes to dissociatives and especially ketamine which I have the most experience of and back in the my own ketamine heyday before it seemed to be causing any issues I would pretty much just get catatonic and watch weird TV shows. I think that this experience is not rare - there's just something about the level of full immersion into this alternate reality witnessed through a screen that honestly I haven't found with any other drug.

I hadn't really considered Inception in that sense but it's not an inappropriate analogy, although in fact it can be extended far beyond just drug experiences to an expression of the general sentiment that you never really have any way of knowing how many layers deep you are within the reality that your mind presents to you, and people get trapped in some fairly dark levels of some kind of dream (or delusion, perhaps - or just nonsensical self-destructive belief systems, in most cases) without any exogenous intoxicants even being involved.

A few shows that really resonated with me during my disso-honeymoon were The OA, Altered Carbon, and Westword - and I believe to this day that the first seasons of each, at least, have some genuine life lessons which are, perhaps, more easy to spot (or imagine ) while under the influence. The OA is a fantastically unconventional if visually fairly mundane thought experiment as to how reality could be a construct of a wildly different nature to anything that we could possible hope to perceive short of random chance or, more likely, a gift of insight from a supernatural being. Westworld is a conceptually fascinating look at the nature of consciousness and how it might emerge unexpectedly given sufficiently advanced AIs - it was from that show I discovered the "Bicameral Mind" theory that posits that sentience as we understand it is actually a far more recent evolution, whereas previously there was simply a speaker, who decided on actions, and an actor, who acted upon them, neither having their own individual agency in the same way as the integrated mind does. I don't think the theory is given much real credit amongst those who actually kinda know what they're talking about but it's still pretty fascinating IMO, especially when you consider the bizarrely nonintuitive behaviours that can result from full hemispherectomies or severing the connecting between the 2 hemispheres in humans. And finally, Altered Carbon - very easy to understand from a dissociated perspective because in this future sci-fi world, the bodies we inhabit are largely unimportant - because people can be "resleeved" into entirely new bodies at will. And in actual fact - it doesn't require that this technology exists to understand that any lessons we can learn from the idea that it might be possible, might still have value. We are all just passengers, incarnate into bodies we did not choose, barrelling towards destinations unknown.

So yeah if you haven't seen any of those shows I highly recommend them.

 

[foodcrisis]

i got really obsessed with world war two while tripping for a couple days or weeks. i imagined other times of history and was thinking of movie ideas about different time periods or planets with humans where they must've done some real sick war crime shit in the vein of withcraft. i was thinking about time periods where they must've been testing drugs on people at a high rate, maybe not even on this planet, but i felt like it went on some where. maybe the information from that planet i'm imagining was sent to earth so it's not all the time or of often a bad thing... prob might be hard to read what i'm thinking... i was hearing a lot of weird stuff during this time period. i wasn't enjoying myself. i had a real hard time clearinig my head. i'm glad it went away. i heard some girl IRL saying she had images of war victims in her head from tripping too. i get some real realistic imagery from tripping on acid. haven't had any realistic visuals with shrooms or any other drugs, but with acid, it can be like being forced to watch movies with my eyes closed.

also sometimes i listen to death metal and stuff and that's pretty dark, but i always imagine a lot of the singers to be like muppets or animal impressions or something, so it's a good time.

i think of a ton of movie ideas that are probably bad to even talk about. i think the world has made me pretty dark. i feel like i could be a film maker similar to quintin tarintino, but i have no idea where to start and am way to lazy to go about accomplishing film making...

I'M ACTUALLY EDITING THIS POST AND TAKING OUT MY MOVIE IDEA BECUASE I DON'T WANT THAT ATTATCHED TO MY NAME TALKING ABOUT THAT ON A WEBSITE LIKE THIS WHERE PEOPLE MIGHT BE EASILIY INFLUENCED... lol.. i wrote a pretty good paragraph, not sure if anybody cought it in the few minutes i left it up, but that's bad karma to be writing about even if it is a tarintino-esque movie idea about alternate history's use of witch craft.

 

[Doctor Steve Brule]

I don't see anything dark about tripping in a cemetary. Seems very peaceful unlike my dark thoughts about entropy and diarrhea.

 

[SpiralusSancti]

Well truly dark and a bit scary, makes you feel alive feeling are two very different things. I neither find elementary neceseraly bad place to trip or visit during trip but neither a best for most people.

I used to watch horror movies with one ex partner during comedowns of many acid and some other psychedelic experiences. That wasn’t with an intention of causing any kind of dark experience, it was simply matter of taste. Dark music during trips also isn’t inherently bad/negative.

I never saw much corelation with fact some drug feels kind of dark and real bad trips. Like K can be dark experience often but yet isn’t really bad even than. While generally "on the bright side stuff" but with serious mindfuck, like acid is, tend to produce hard experience from time to time and when, it depends a lot on set & setting, a lot more than with K.
Dissos might not feel like something where dark aspects are more pronounced than positive, fun, healing side is, but they do become with time if abused.

 

[golego55]

Thanks for your reply. I was surprised by how many I got. I'm going to do some more thinking on what you (and the others wrote). Nightmares have never really been a thing for me so I'm interested in seeing ways of confronting darkness in other ways. I'm absolutely not advocating for being immature or being an irresponsible drug user but I like reflecting on and experiencing such things.

 

[Procka]

there is a difference between dark trip and a acutal trip to hell where the devil traps you within your own mind for trillions of years tortouting your soul with the worst pain you could ever imagine. I have had dark trips and seeing fucked ups hit and I have been to literal hell with the devil and it took me years of healing to get past the trauma of that trip, feeling pure pain and fear in every atom in your body.

Horror films and ghosts dont scare me on acid. Acutal hell does,

The last time i ever k holed i went to hell for eons and never touched it again. Sometimes you see shit you wish you could unsee, Unspeakable horrors im glad the ket induced amensia blacked out some of the more horrific parts of the k hole. I have been to dark places on ketamine but never to that level where you acutal soul was tossed into a cosmic blender and the devil and his army of demons rip it apart. I was praying to the lord jesus to save me and begging for gods forgiveness. I was so far removed from reality that i thought i was most likely permentally insane.

Tread carefully.

I was lucky to make it back. I was shaken for a while after that k hole, it was noticeable aswell people would ask me if i am okay going about my daily life. I was so shaken to the core of what had occured i became a hermit for a month to process what the fuck i had experinced

Thank you for sharing this. Seeking dark experiences seems unwise.

 

[Bitchniggaz]

I think we need to be clear what we mean by "dark" experiences here.

Becauce there is a clear difference in wanting to have a "bad trip" or explore more heavy or dark energies within a certain experience...

For example most often enjoy quite dark and doomy music while trippin.
Esp darkpsy or dark psychedelic trance music.
The first time i was at a darkpsy rave i took mushrooms and had quite a bad time.
But then i learned to deal with the emotions that the music was bringing forth.
So nowadays i feel pure euphoria when listening to it.


Also when doing ketamine my goto activity is watching movies or series with serious undertones.
Not really horror stuff, but i enjoy menacing scifi or violent stories esp from historic times.
I dont do it to feel bad or scare myself, its more that those kind of flicks gets my mind going.
The occult in general interest me, not in the way that i want to summon demons LOL.
But ketamine has a very supernatural feel to it.
So when I watch movies about magic or witchcraft my imagination gets stimulated bigtime.


DXM works similarly imo, my first time i watched Dredd with Karl Urban and was blown away!
Never before had i been so immersed in a movie.
It was just unreal for me.

So now im basicly addicted in finding new movies/series that fits the bill of what my taste prefers.


Fear of the dark is not healthy, we need to work with our shadow self to not be controlled by it.

And for me ketamine while binging a cool series is the way.

 

[golego55]

I think we need to be clear what we mean by "dark" experiences here. [...]

Becauce there is a clear difference in wanting to have a "bad trip" or explore more heavy or dark energies within a certain experience... [...]

Fear of the dark is not healthy, we need to work with our shadow self to not be controlled by it.

Thanks for the perspectives. You definitely have some good points.

 

[Zowman]

You are powerful, you have the possibility for what you are seeking.

A funny analogy that comes to mind is Star Wars, "the force". Think of the disso as "the force"

The force is just energy it can be used in any direction you wish.

Are you curious? what are you seeking?

I am writing here out of love and and as a warning.

What you are searching for, you will find. But if you do find what I know you can find in those realms. It will break you in ways that no experience or story in this third dimensional realm could even come close to.

Are you aware that we exist in many potential realities?

From one loving being to another: You cannot escape the darkness, in fact it guides us to the right directions. But why search for it? seeking the darkness through tryptamines and dissos? Your soul will be raped repeatedly until you become one with it. Seek the light instead. And if this duality bullshit doesn't quite cut it, then go for the middle path, not the path of darkness not the path of light, the path of gray = transcendence

 

[Opana313]

"So delighted with a new understanding, there's something about a little evil that makes that unmistakable noise I was hearing, that unmistakable sound that I know so well" APC

IDK why but Maynards words come to mind when reading this thread.

 

[Bitchniggaz]

You are powerful, you have the possibility for what you are seeking.

A funny analogy that comes to mind is Star Wars, "the force". Think of the disso as "the force"

The force is just energy it can be used in any direction you wish.

Are you curious? what are you seeking?

I am writing here out of love and and as a warning.

What you are searching for, you will find. But if you do find what I know you can find in those realms. It will break you in ways that no experience or story in this third dimensional realm could even come close to.

Are you aware that we exist in many potential realities?

From one loving being to another: You cannot escape the darkness, in fact it guides us to the right directions. But why search for it? seeking the darkness through tryptamines and dissos? Your soul will be raped repeatedly until you become one with it. Seek the light instead. And if this duality bullshit doesn't quite cut it, then go for the middle path, not the path of darkness not the path of light, the path of gray = transcendence

Thats why i really love a good psytrance festival with mixed music.

During the daytime they play music with more uplifting and light energies.
Then as the night comes the tunes get more wicked and dark.
Do a 24h bender and you get the full spectrum of energies, you dont need to seek for either.
Just hang out, dance and let the full circle of the "force" into your being.

 

[Asante]

Atropine and Atroscine have a knack of making things both more visual and Dark.
I recommend against it but 1 seed of Datura metel taken by a healthy person in addition to psychedelics will cast a Dark shadow. Medieval Evil.

I'm contemplating comedicating a low Dissociative dose of Memantine with 25mg of Diphenhydramine to remedy the slime and snot and fire up the caverns of closed eye visuals.
Synergism is expected. I'm still researching it. It may not be safe.

 

[Bitchniggaz]

Atropine and Atroscine have a knack of making things both more visual and Dark.
I recommend against it but 1 seed of Datura metel taken by a healthy person in addition to psychedelics will cast a Dark shadow. Medieval Evil.

I'm contemplating comedicating a low Dissociative dose of Memantine with 25mg of Diphenhydramine to remedy the slime and snot and fire up the caverns of closed eye visuals.
Synergism is expected. I'm still researching it. It may not be safe.

I took a very small amount of datura tincture and amanita muscaria on the tail end of a San Pedro trip.
Def nothing extreme but it made the afterglow more gloomey.

The reason i use tincture is to get a even dose.
Becauce datura is known for having very uneven amount of alkaloids even in the same plant.
So I made a alcohol solution with some dried leaf.
Mostly used it for external use, but its quite weak so even +10drops barely does anything.
Dont recomend anyone playing with it though, to dangerous to chance.

However Amanita muscaria is a great additive to use in the end of a trip.
It will make you sleepy and gives a misty/dark vibe to the visuals.

Works esp well with psilo mushrooms and cacti.
But also quite nice with LSD or just cannabis.