Treating medical grade insomnia with tryptamines?

[sleepypenelope]

Is anyone aware of research involving tryptamines and insomnia? I have lifelong insomnia that can be rather severe at times. I can go a couple of weeks only able to sleep 0-4 hours a night when it is strongest.

No RX tried has worked out over time, and I likely was prescribed everything but barbiturates for this over the decades. (The last RX tried was Xyrem(sodium GHB solution), and it did absolutely nothing for sleep duration, and had some crappy side effects to boot that cost me sleep.)

The insomnia is of the split body variety, neck up can get tired beyond the words I know for exhaustion, below the neck is raring to go like a shot of adrenaline. Beta blockers do not help this.
A random thought popped into mind in the wee hours that perhaps the issue is with my torso's serotonin system. What if I could fatigue it and deplete an excess somehow? Or maybe down-regulate receptors that are too populous or sensitive for my own good... Research for serotonin agonists eventually brought up tryptamines. This led to TiHKAL, and an investigation of legal versions available in my locality.

I've had gratifying success with this course over the last 5+ weeks, sleeping 5-6 hours almost nightly and waking up feeling like I had slept well for a change. It is not perfect, I've had a few rough nights, however they are traceable to specific events of that day or night. The insomnia has always been there, eventful day or not.

At this point I'm wondering if it is indeed the serotonin agonism, or if there were some other mechanism(mao related?) that might be at play. I have concerns about tryptamines as a daily treatment, mainly fear of the unknown long term effects. I may be worrying about nothing here, but such is the power of ignorance. Also, taking on that load every day can get a bit much. (Working in the chocolate factory syndrome, I guess )
The hope is if a mechanism of the tryptamines action can be postulated, I could research a less impactful RX or substance for daily treatment.

Does anyone have any thoughts or theories that come to mind?

 

[polarthedog]

Bump

 

[negrogesic]

A certain tryptamine is take by a huge number of people: melatonin (ie n-acetyl-5-meo-tryptamine)

 

[polarthedog]

Have you tried kava kava?

 

[polarthedog]

So does kava slow the breakdown of benzos? Or is it more of a multiplying effect like alcohol with benzos?

 

[polarthedog]

Hi mate yes absolutely bang on precisely this is the flip side of it it's not actually making either substance more toxic or harmful just more potent by a ratio of twice in my own experience and estimate that is how I became addicted to the combination of the two at exactly the same time two years ago.

Kava doubly potentiates benzos and increases the euphoria, disinhibition, feelgood and GABA effects, and vice versa. Accidentally replied so below lol this is and edit..

That sounds cool, I’ll probably try that then

I really like taking a combo of lyrica, morphine, Valium, and adderall

The lyrica multiplies the effects of both morphine Andy Valium, And then the addys keep you awake so you can enjoy the high without passing out

Maybe I’ll throw kava in 5e in the mix to substitute for the half a beer that I sometimes take with all that

I haven’t done that mix in years though, lost my Valium script, and I’m afraid to buy Valium or Xanax off the street because of the fent epidemic

 

[polarthedog]

Kava massively slows down the metabolising of Etiz. It increases plasma levels and maintains them.

A part of me decided a long time ago this is a large reason why I can actually go from enormous doses of benzo to nothing for a day if I choose and do not suffer any real adverse affect more mental torment than anything else.

Because the Kavalactone saturated system keeps me from running dry on benzo plasma levels, and also supports GABA function.

So it's both. Slowed processing. Amplified allround effects to each. And a safety net too.

I actually believe that having a system loaded with Kavalactones could possibly enable the impossible when withdrawing from benzos. By somehow supporting and regulating and gradually modulating the GABA system back into order and regularity.

I believe this may be possible and my experiences are supporting this but also it would interfere with a measured tapering process but I feel there could be a methodical way to work through this if you could just maintain a balance.

I have so many thoughts and ideas and theories on this since a long time ago because I was particularly observant of the interaction from the beginning.

My head really isn't there currently to expose my own thoughts.

I think that’s probably a good idea, assuming you know what your doing.

The only problem is less experienced people would probably just make things worse on their selves

I got off gabapentin two days ago, and I want to start taking kava every day soon, though I’m broke right now, I’m going to work on Wednesday (I work part time due to mental illness)

 

[polarthedog]

Kava massively slows down the metabolising of Etiz. It increases plasma levels and maintains them.

A part of me decided a long time ago this is a large reason why I can actually go from enormous doses of benzo to nothing for a day if I choose and do not suffer any real adverse affect more mental torment than anything else.

Because the Kavalactone saturated system keeps me from running dry on benzo plasma levels, and also supports GABA function.

So it's both. Slowed processing. Amplified allround effects to each. And a safety net too.

I actually believe that having a system loaded with Kavalactones could possibly enable the impossible when withdrawing from benzos. By somehow supporting and regulating and gradually modulating the GABA system back into order and regularity.

I believe this may be possible and my experiences are supporting this but also it would interfere with a measured tapering process but I feel there could be a methodical way to work through this if you could just maintain a balance.

I have so many thoughts and ideas and theories on this since a long time ago because I was particularly observant of the interaction from the beginning.

My head really isn't there currently to expose my own thoughts.

Have you ever tried mixing Nmda antagonists with a benzo? I love taking clonazepam with dxm, gets rid of all the nausea and amplifies the relaxation from both.

Though the withdrawals would be horrendous if you came off both at the same time. I’ve been weaning off of gabapentin and dxm for close to a month now and I’m still not done, and I was on low doses of both.

I need to take a break from those, I think I’m hurting myself taking dxm/gabapentin so much.

I have anxiety Andy depression issues, and gabapentin and dxm both help so much in the moment, and they are so cheap and available, it’s hard to say no.

I also really enjoy stealing from stores, so I have an issue with stealing multiple boxes of mucinex at a time

 

[polarthedog]

Well, I would take, mix everything and anything on the planet if it seemed like a good idea lol,

I always did. Still swear no other BLer has taken more legit MDMA overall by 2021, that I am aware of by report and testimony, and I stopped taking MDMA in 2005, I reckon over 325 grams comfortably up to 400 maybe.

But I'm allergic to everything now. I couldn't take any other psychoactives without paying for it allergenically.

I tired so much. You name it, I'll be allergic.

It has been officially whittled down to 5 drugs only.

Pure benzo powder (no pills or tablets whatsoever, not even zinc, calcium, b vits etc).

Kava. Home grown specially fertilised organic cannabis as I'm allergic to all balck market weed ferts.

Pure Lysergamides.

And black tea and coffee.

Kanna, kratom, salvia, Micropin, any type of stimulant except caffene (even caffeine powder shocks my nervous system).

If not for Lyme 16 yrs back, I would be a proper druggie lol.

One drug I really miss and would be using all the time is Psilocybin mushrooms I've not had them since 2005 and I would almost guaranteed be very allergic.

If I live long enough, I may get to sample and see. Because I feel that if I stopped using LSD and made regular use of magic mushrooms I could possibly completely sort out the disordered state my mind has gotten into from the acid abuse and life's traumas.

Right. I actually need some kava now. Just took an edible weed dose.

Normally, I would have taken about 10 mg's Etiz by now. But I needto stop that.

I’m sorry that that happened to you, that’s horrible that your so allergic to so many things

 

[polarthedog]

Thanks man. It's been indescribablly tough living. It simply does not come across. Because I am by nature phenomenonally strong, enduring, resourceful and such a hacker of the impossible.

Overall it's been a blessing. The education and development which ensued from the road I was catapulted down is invaluable.

I may be able to get back on my feet. Thought I had done it. Blown things too far, in a panic and despair but so much has hit this year and recent. Just maybe need some time and better fortune, some vital therapy too just never physically capable of going to appointments expec on even a weekly basis as allergies and fatigue are so rpund clock demanding and exhausting.

This hour though, thongs are looking up. I really went to hell just lately. And I'm back.

Too. For real. I had to actually singlehandedly fight the Emperor lol last week in the most awful soul crushing vivid nightmare I've ever had.

On his private battlecruiser top of the material plane/universe.

We’re you going through withdrawal?