Can anyone provide some guidance on the relative potency between the toad secretions containing 5MeO-DMT, and the actual freebase molecule? I know there's obviously variation in the potency of the toad secretions. For a moderate dose of freebase 5MeO-DMT, I believe that's approximately 10mg - how much toad secretion would one have to smoke in order to achieve the same effect?
Tryptamines Toad vs. Freebase 5MeO-DMT dosage
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Didgital
Bluelight Crew
5 to 15%.
Low range. 10mg ÷ .05 = 200mg
Mid range. 10 ÷ .10 = 100mg
High range 10mg ÷ .15mg/mg = 66mg
so quite the range for such a potent compound. 66-200mg...
All that said, 10mg of freebase is actually approaching a strong dose. I would consider 5mg to be a "moderate" dose. Due to the pretty large variation, i would start slow. Safe travels.
Sources:
pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
"Since a toad yields about 0.25–0.50 g of dried secretion from a “milking session,” with a 5-MeO-DMT content of up to 15% (Erspamer et al. 1967), a single toad may generate 75 mg of 5-MeO-DMT in its secretion that, when smoked, is already psychoactive in humans at doses as low as 3–5 mg"
The most abundant representative of 5-hydroxyindolealkylamines is, as in numerous other toads, bufotenine (up to 3 mg per g dry skin), the most abundant representative of 5-methoxyindolealkylamines, O-methylbufotenine. In parotoid and coxal glands as much as 5–15 per cent of the dry weight is made up by this compound
Low range. 10mg ÷ .05 = 200mg
Mid range. 10 ÷ .10 = 100mg
High range 10mg ÷ .15mg/mg = 66mg
so quite the range for such a potent compound. 66-200mg...
All that said, 10mg of freebase is actually approaching a strong dose. I would consider 5mg to be a "moderate" dose. Due to the pretty large variation, i would start slow. Safe travels.
Sources:
A single inhalation of vapor from dried toad secretion containing 5-methoxy-N,N-dimethyltryptamine (5-MeO-DMT) in a naturalistic setting is related to sustained enhancement of satisfaction with life, mindfulness-related capacities, and a decrement of
5-methoxy-N,N-dimethyltryptamine (hereinafter referred to as 5-MeO-DMT) is a psychedelic substance found in the secretion from the parotoid glands of the Bufo alvarius toad. Inhalation of vapor from toad secretion containing 5-MeO-DMT has become ...
pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
"Since a toad yields about 0.25–0.50 g of dried secretion from a “milking session,” with a 5-MeO-DMT content of up to 15% (Erspamer et al. 1967), a single toad may generate 75 mg of 5-MeO-DMT in its secretion that, when smoked, is already psychoactive in humans at doses as low as 3–5 mg"
The most abundant representative of 5-hydroxyindolealkylamines is, as in numerous other toads, bufotenine (up to 3 mg per g dry skin), the most abundant representative of 5-methoxyindolealkylamines, O-methylbufotenine. In parotoid and coxal glands as much as 5–15 per cent of the dry weight is made up by this compound
Fire&Water
Pumpkin King
Leave those toads alone
they were my cats other buddy
experience to extremes
they were my cats other buddy
experience to extremes
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Thanks for the info, that basically corroborated what I had heard anecdotally. I got the 10mg number from Martin Ball's Entheogenic Liberation book. He gives dosage guidelines as follows for the freebase molecule:5 to 15%.
Low range. 10mg ÷ .05 = 200mg
Mid range. 10 ÷ .10 = 100mg
High range 10mg ÷ .15mg/mg = 66mg
so quite the range for such a potent compound. 66-200mg...
All that said, 10mg of freebase is actually approaching a strong dose. I would consider 5mg to be a "moderate" dose. Due to the pretty large variation, i would start slow. Safe travels.
Sources:
A single inhalation of vapor from dried toad secretion containing 5-methoxy-N,N-dimethyltryptamine (5-MeO-DMT) in a naturalistic setting is related to sustained enhancement of satisfaction with life, mindfulness-related capacities, and a decrement of
5-methoxy-N,N-dimethyltryptamine (hereinafter referred to as 5-MeO-DMT) is a psychedelic substance found in the secretion from the parotoid glands of the Bufo alvarius toad. Inhalation of vapor from toad secretion containing 5-MeO-DMT has become ...
"Since a toad yields about 0.25–0.50 g of dried secretion from a “milking session,” with a 5-MeO-DMT content of up to 15% (Erspamer et al. 1967), a single toad may generate 75 mg of 5-MeO-DMT in its secretion that, when smoked, is already psychoactive in humans at doses as low as 3–5 mg"
The most abundant representative of 5-hydroxyindolealkylamines is, as in numerous other toads, bufotenine (up to 3 mg per g dry skin), the most abundant representative of 5-methoxyindolealkylamines, O-methylbufotenine. In parotoid and coxal glands as much as 5–15 per cent of the dry weight is made up by this compound
5-10mg - moderate
10-15mg - strong
15-20mg - very strong
20-30mg -
I did a recent session with a practitioner where we I did a first round of 19mg followed by a second round of 23mg of toad, so that would be the equivalent of .95-2.85mg for the first round and 1.15-3.45mg for the second round had I used the freebase molecule. Pretty low overall. I am returning in a week to do a larger dose, hopefully it will be more effective therapeutically.
emkee_reinvented
Bluelighter
Seeing the sad lonely Bufo Alvarius sitting alone behind glass.
I can see they would make great Pets,
don t know if the Toad would agree though ?
But better then being prisoned in the ZOO, i think.
And they are real cute, do they move i wonder,
never saw that one move.
Sat like a living statue, same spot every time i visited.
I can see they would make great Pets,
don t know if the Toad would agree though ?
But better then being prisoned in the ZOO, i think.
And they are real cute, do they move i wonder,
never saw that one move.
Sat like a living statue, same spot every time i visited.
You know what's strange though? That article says that toad secretions contain up to 15% 5MeO-DMT. But then farther down, they analyzed 5 samples of toad and show the following data in this table:
The minimum concentration of 5MeO-DMT in that table is >20%. That's a bit of a contradiction within their own paper.
The minimum concentration of 5MeO-DMT in that table is >20%. That's a bit of a contradiction within their own paper.
Didgital
Bluelight Crew
Good find, I only perused it for the key word.You know what's strange though? That article says that toad secretions contain up to 15% 5MeO-DMT. But then farther down, they analyzed 5 samples of toad and show the following data in this table:
The minimum concentration of 5MeO-DMT in that table is >20%. That's a bit of a contradiction within their own paper.
So what's the consensus?