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The Ferguson thread / additional race discussion

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Oh please. Really? Maybe reread the list. Im sure the protestors will be peaceful and nonviolent too right? What about the matter of protesting for a justified case. This dude was asking to get shot and it happened. There are so many other cases where cops killed a totally innocent person. How bout the one recently where a bunch of cops basically suffocated this older man to death while his wife filmed it. This is just an excuse to act out which gives them no credibility.

I am far from pro-cop but this is the wrong way to go about trying to make a change.
 
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Would looting less then 500 dollars of shit be considered minor law breaking? What is exactly minor law breaking? I could totally see how cops could this list of demands as evidence in a way that would excuse them from any discipline if anything went to court.

How do they really think cops are going to respond to that? Print copies of it and give it to every officer? Ok guys, remember what they have told us to do. Its probably going to fuel some cops desire even more to make an example out of these people. Really smart move from whoever decided to do this.
 
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I'm a courier and use that road to deliver narcotics to cancer patients. I'm a mother on the way to work, or to pick up my kids, and my day is already full. Take your protest somewhere else. Out of the street. Quit expecting society to stop for you. Get on the fucking sidewalk.
 
Escher's Waterfall said:
A protest that blocks a road, or something like that.

Technically breaks a few laws on the books, but I'm fond of the Bill of Rights.
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Blocks a road? Well I hope your there to make the distinction for everyone.

Its a shame this young black kid had his life end the way it did but I think it needs to be shown that he was not a martyr. He wasn't doing something noble or fighting for any kind of rights, civil rights, equality etc. According to the evidence its not really a surprise the way things played out. Why ride on the back of that? Ride on something that has some movement to it, that can make it somewhere in the courts. A situation that race doesnt matter but just the fact a cop used deadly force on an unarmed person who posed no threat to him. Thats not uncommon these days. They are doing it all the time. Instead they are going to use this situation where they can't even bring charges in the first place on this cop. About a case that can end up in a place where maybe can make some much needed change on the police brutality in this country and everywhere.

I saw another video the other day where they had an older man who was mentally ill and homeless surrounded by cops. Maybe 20 of them with guns drawn. He was on the ground too not standing. They released the K9 and this man i guess had a little pocket knife. The cops unloaded on him with something like 120 plus rounds being fired off.
 
Blocking roads is a really effective form of protest in a world that ignores people's voices.

The interests of corporations, thinktanks, lobby groups, churches, those who contribute financially to the campaigns of powerful political interests all have easy access to media, to influence discourse and take place in political discussions.

Those of us with no influence amongst the political classes don't have this voice.
The corporate media and two-party political system have done a very good job of marginalising dissent.
Most "peaceful protests" these days don't even make the local news (in my experience).

So civil disobedience has its place.
I'm not taking about looting - but in regard to blocking traffic...I don't see the big deal.

People might be inconvenienced. Yep, that's not ideal.
But neither is police brutality or corruption.
Is that less important than traffic congestion? I don't really see motor vehicles as being the most important thing to keep running in society.
If emergencies are caused by people disrupting the flow of traffic, that is unfortunate - but in the case of genuine emergencies (such as an ambulance or fire truck attempting to get through) every demonstration I have ever been part of would clear a path to let them through, no question.

Is civil disobedience an effective way of having your voices heard?
Absolutely - there are plenty of examples of this.
And while people are quick to accuse demonstrators of property damage, vandalism etc - these are extremely isolated cases in every protest I've witnessed, taken part in or read about in the last 20 years.

Using the actions of a minority to condemn the whole is a pretty standard way of attacking protestors - but hey, we're all talking about it, aren't we?
Had the protestors (in this or any post-WTO Seattle protests, which changed the whole political response to mass demonstrations) played by the rules and stayed on "the fucking sidewalk" - then the media, cops, politicians, etc - could all ignore the message of the protest, as it wouldn't be newsworthy.

Again, I'm not advocating looting, violence or damage to property.
The right to assemble without being beaten senseless by police is something worth fighting for, no matter what you think of it.
You never know, you might have a much-ignored, strongly held opinion you wish to stand up for one day.

Motorists' convenience doesn't trump the importance of living in a "free society", controversial as it may be to say such a thing.
 
A list of demands is not actually a bad idea. Organized militant groups use that method all the time that way the cops really can't fling back at you that you where asking outrageous demands. However one important thing to note is that if violence does break out in a case like this you had better hope the police start it because it will look fairly amateurish if you don't hold up your end of the bargain first. But then again as i can't see the cops giving into any demands i seriously doubt that will be a problem.
 
What 23 said:
I'm a courier and use that road to deliver narcotics to cancer patients. I'm a mother on the way to work, or to pick up my kids, and my day is already full. Take your protest somewhere else. Out of the street. Quit expecting society to stop for you. Get on the fucking sidewalk.
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i'm a murderer on the way to kill your family. that protest saved their lives. thanks protesters!

alasdair
 
legalizeall said:
Good one. (disclaimer: sarcasm)
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you seem reasonably smart so i'm sure you can see how the two following statements are equally valuable (i.e. not) in moving the discussion forward:

"I'm a courier and use that road to deliver narcotics to cancer patients."
"i'm a murderer on the way to kill your family."

alasdair
 
I think mine- what I mentioned are a little more likely to occur. Not to say what you're saying doesn't have some validity.
 
Have roadblocks ever been tried in America as a form of protest? I know it was standard practice in Ireland (so where ambushes on the police and military forces at the roadblocks) but i have never heard of it being used in America. Although the tactic can certainly work it also has potential to get out of control rather quickly. The best option i think if that was to be put in practice would be to let civilians and any non state forces get by (you don't want to piss everyone off by doing this) while stopping police and military personal. But i could easily see such a tactic turn into a blood bath if the cops went off their head at the thought of merely being shown up. Id much rather deal with military then police as the military are much less trigger happy and unlike the police tend to come from the working class. Granted that could easily be a Pyrrhic victory of sorts for the activists and a real propaganda victory in the press in the long run.
 
Cops aren't from the working class?

Ferguson protesters- some had plan to shut down I-70- an interstate highway that is very busy. I'm pretty sure, but not totally, that shutting down the roads or standing in them was a source of a lot of the trouble with earlier protests.
 
What 23 said:
Cops aren't from the working class?

Ferguson protesters- some had plan to shut down I-70- an interstate highway that is very busy. I'm pretty sure, but not totally, that shutting down the roads or standing in them was a source of a lot of the trouble with earlier protests.
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Most pigs i have known tends to come from that godforsaken class known as Petite Bourgeois. Thus they have actual interests in the state and as most seem to have some kind of fucked up inferiority disorder they look down upon most working class citizens with contempt. Most soldiers i know aren't exactly fond of the police and usually vice versa. They tend to come from the working class (hell i was nearly stupid enough to sign up until i realized that Canada did far more damage to my island then any foreign threat) and i don't think would be so gung ho to gun down their own countrymen.
 
Being tolerant of minor law breaking could mean just about anything. Afaik people already can legally protest although I don't know all the ins and outs. Either way all the document reads at least to me is "let us break the law and have no accountability while the police do nothing".
 
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