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The Ferguson thread / additional race discussion

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What do you mean? The looters and rioters don't need to do this at all. Them being less safe here is their own doing.

Looters robbed the same store that Brown robbed last night/this morning, among others. Rioters threw objects at police. Multiple police injuries reported. No injuries reported among protesters.
 
You're right. However I saw a shopkeeper with two automatic rifles. Set aside the fact he should have just sawed off one arm and attach a chainsaw --he could potentially kill someone over something trivial. This is why the police are supposed to be the ones you have faith in as well as citizens....Not looting shit?
 
No. It's deadly serious.



Yes. White people. Meanwhile black people live under a state of perpetual occupation with a fatality rate that is up there with Gaza on a good day. But, hey, your white so, like, give a shit. So long as they're not taking away your self-indulgent right to do drugs - it's like it's not happening



Well, it's *very* different to London or Athens but I find it interesting that the home of the free has been reduced to comparing itself with an *actual* warzone.

You really dont know what your talking about and its quite funny to watch you and your little buddy there bash america. Australia must be just perfect with no problems at all? Sure. It makes me laugh especially when spaceballs comments on the constitution. Im sure you know what thats all about. You guys dont have anything else to do i guess. I mean you dont post this article for reasons other then a to bash america which is pretty pathetic and gives a window into the kind of lives you lead. And obviously need some attention that your not getting in your current lives. Small worlds for some people i guess.

Again though, i wonder why its ok for bitman to be racist here
 
Police largely remained on the sidelines on Friday and into the dawn hours of Saturday morning as demonstrators descended on a number of businesses in Ferguson — pulling alcohol, lottery tickets, and merchandise from the vandalized stores.

My old vanguardian sense is tingling. Such a volatile, passionate and potentially revolutionary atmosphere entirely wasted on grabbing booze and lottery tickets. Without a sense of organization or united movement towards constructive goals, this whole thing is going to blow over just as these situations always do. The static for sparking something big is in the air, but there is no conducer to direct this energy away from the current social schema of consumerism and political isolation towards new, drastic upheaval.
 
Their emotions are easily read. The property owners want more security, the people want their security to be more accountable. Hire more cops, and attach each cop with a small camera on the person. If funds don't allow for that put a vote up for some sort of CCTV around the town. This way a cop can never not be on camera, thus adding accountability. Also, it would be added security. No need for a bunch of armed men. Basically what the mayor can do right now is address those two issues and wait out the verdict.
 
This doesn't threaten the life of another.

nothing more than he likes to rap? He likes to rap about killing, and robbing. and he robbed a store, and committed violence against a man, just prior to his death. and this whole thing is so big on how whites have caused all of this, and we were slavers, and all of that, and that's what america is known for, and here he is, these lyrics, showing his frustration and how he sees himself-- on the bottom. it's revealing. it might provide insight. maybe he had this music in him, and was wanting to fight the system he perceived, but he may have been going about it all wrong.

You obviously haven't listened to much rap music, for better or worse, criminal activity and murder are common themes throughout the rap genre, it is impossible to deny this. To argue that one likes to rap about killing and robbing is a testament to their character you would almost be as well to say that an interest in rap in general is a negative testament to their character. This goes especially assuming he had some kind of aspiration of making it in the rap world, as an African American male trying to break into the mainstream market it would be virtually impossible to avoid topics of crime and murder if one had any hope of success.

I have known kids in suburban Melbourne who have never so much as thrown a punch in their life to rap about all sorts of shit, murder, rape, high stakes drug dealing, this does not mean they are aspiring killers, it just means they have been heavily influenced by the mainstream rap, which they obviously listen to, where these topics are common themes.

There are plenty of references to murder and suicide in heavy metal music too, it doesn't mean people in heavy metal bands are all wannabe psycho killers, it is a form of artistic expression you can't take it as a literal declaration of intent.
 
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^ Seconded.

I would also draw people's attention the the #IfTheyGunnedMeDown hashtag. It involves young, successful, black men posting contrasting images of themselves in hip-hop type poses that could be interpreted as them being "thugs" with pictures of the graduating from university, or graduating from military school, or whatever. the point being, just because popular culture has a certain image it does NOT speak to the nature of the individual

Plenty if examples here

http://www.chron.com/news/article/IfTheyGunnedMeDown-hashtag-goes-viral-in-the-5684202.php

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...k-youth-michael-brown-death-article-1.1900415

http://www.ajc.com/news/news/iftheygunnedmedown-ferguson-shooting-sparks-debate/ngzYw/
 
You obviously haven't listened to much rap music, for better or worse, criminal activity and murder are common themes throughout the rap genre, it is impossible to deny this. To argue that one likes to rap about killing and robbing is a testament to their character you would almost be as well to say that an interest in rap in general is a negative testament to their character. This goes especially assuming he had some kind of aspiration of making it in the rap world, as an African American male trying to break into the mainstream market it would be virtually impossible to avoid topics of crime and murder if one had any hope of success.

I have known kids in suburban Melbourne who have never so much as thrown a punch in their life to rap about all sorts of shit, murder, rape, high stakes drug dealing, this does not mean they are aspiring killers, it just means they have been heavily influenced by the mainstream rap, which they obviously listen to, where these topics are common themes.

There are plenty of references to murder and suicide in heavy metal music too, it doesn't mean people in heavy metal bands are all wannabe psycho killers, it is a form of artistic expression you can't take it as a literal declaration of intent.

Excellent post.

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Good links from bp as well. This applies to literally hundreds of people I've come across.
 
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You obviously haven't listened to much rap music, for better or worse, criminal activity and murder are common themes throughout the rap genre, it is impossible to deny this. To argue that one likes to rap about killing and robbing is a testament to their character you would almost be as well to say that an interest in rap in general is a negative testament to their character. This goes especially assuming he had some kind of aspiration of making it in the rap world, as an African American male trying to break into the mainstream market it would be virtually impossible to avoid topics of crime and murder if one had any hope of success.

Why is this? People listen to music that resonates with them, right? If it wasn't them doing the raping murdering and robbing and disrespecting others, they probably had it done to them by their community, right? Or have connection? The FBI stats that I gave earlier in this thread, without getting into the reasons for them, aren't just crazy fabrications. ~49% of murders committed here are by blacks and ~48% whites. Blacks represent ~12% of the population, and whites ~72% (2011). I'm really not trying to implicate them and all who listen to rap about murder robbing and i'm a badassing because i've got more material than you-ing, but you can be sure there is a vibration of that going through that community. Your white friends have no real idea because they never make below what is it, 17 or 18 dollars an hour? Or even your black friends, but I think you'd be hard-pressed to find what we have in the U.S. in Australia. But I don't know.

I listen to Tool. In one song, out of many, he talks about "If consequences dictate, my course of action, I should play God and just, shoot you myself", and another where he says it will end no other way, but to claw your fucking throat away. I know, that these emotions are part of music, sometimes. It's art. But the themes of robbery, murder, disrespect, are rampant in rap. I even have gotten into listening to it, until I really take the time to listen to what I'm hearing, then, like many things, I shake my head and turn it to classical, or silence. You say rock has these themes, I would say they have it less so. And heck, maybe it's somewhat proportionate to the rate of certain crime-- I'm not sure. Again, not to say all who listen to it do this, or even most, but the fact that he has music he made clearly talking about killing people and wanting whitey on the bottom doesn't really help him, and it might be more likely to find criminal activity among those who associate with this music.

I have known kids in suburban Melbourne who have never so much as thrown a punch in their life to rap about all sorts of shit, murder, rape, high stakes drug dealing, this does not mean they are aspiring killers, it just means they have been heavily influenced by the mainstream rap, which they obviously listen to, where these topics are common themes.

I've known a lot of people, too. My friend tells me every time I see him that he wants to commit suicide, yet he's still here, years and years later. It doesn't mean he won't commit suicide. But maybe he won't. I also touch on this, about your friends, above. They hardly represent a statistical sample.

There are plenty of references to murder and suicide in heavy metal music too, it doesn't mean people in heavy metal bands are all wannabe psycho killers, it is a form of artistic expression you can't take it as a literal declaration of intent.

I am pressed to find nearly as much in rock, and it is usually done more artfully, or seemingly in a more benign way, than I often seem to see in rap.

I know that this is a hard argument to try, here, because I myself have been brought up on violent videogames. I played Quake around puberty, 12 hours a day sometimes. I continued on that. I've never been outwardly violent. I don't associate it with killing random people, though, I guess, but of actual war/battle. But I've been listening to rock my entire life, and I can say I can probably hear more about murder and robbery listening to a day of rap than I can in a year of mainstream rock. Maybe that's an exaggeration but it's not really that far off base.

With any of the above, which I admit may be a weak argument that I have attempted, I am not saying correlation equals causation, but there is likely a correlation, and the music might be representative of something, at least. Plenty of blacks don't listen to that kind of music, too. And they might be less likely to engage in their own life these things. I'd bet on it.

Maybe I should have avoided this, because it's similar to how people try to blame violent movies and videogames when people murdered others. One difference is that in videogames you often play some hero, and movies often have similar themes. Someone interested in just nasty shit constantly might be more likely to be nasty.
 
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Why is this? People listen to music that resonates with them, right? If it wasn't them doing the raping murdering and robbing and disrespecting others, they probably had it done to them by their community, right?


Who do you think bought rap cds?
Who do you think bought the products advertised on music video shows?
Who do you think was the target audience when investors chose which rap artists to invest in?


probably wasn't "them" :p
 
If you're talking about the US, that's pretty amazing. An automatic rifle is not exactly trivial to own.

Are you sure they weren't semi-automatics? That would make a lot more sense.

Yeah, but I also said they should have just went full out and went Evil Dead...But you're right I think semi-automatics.
 
Who do you think bought rap cds?
Who do you think bought the products advertised on music video shows?
Who do you think was the target audience when investors chose which rap artists to invest in?


probably wasn't "them" :p

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My old vanguardian sense is tingling. Such a volatile, passionate and potentially revolutionary atmosphere entirely wasted on grabbing booze and lottery tickets. Without a sense of organization or united movement towards constructive goals, this whole thing is going to blow over just as these situations always do. The static for sparking something big is in the air, but there is no conducer to direct this energy away from the current social schema of consumerism and political isolation towards new, drastic upheaval.

IE most were looking to profit off a manufactured cause/movement. Media cleaning up, phony civil rights leaders cleaning up, ghetto people cleaning up, etc
 
To argue that one likes to rap about killing and robbing is a testament to their character you would almost be as well to say that an interest in rap in general is a negative testament to their character. This goes especially assuming he had some kind of aspiration of making it in the rap world, as an African American male trying to break into the mainstream market it would be virtually impossible to avoid topics of crime and murder if one had any hope of success
Not true. There are many popular rappers that don't glorify crime in their rhymes. One of my favorite rappers is Lacrae. He is an extremely successful Christian rapper, many professional sports athletes and all kinds of people listen to him. He's been mainstream for some time now. Just one example of a famed rapper proving you can make good ryhmes with clean lyrics.
 
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