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The Ferguson thread / additional race discussion

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Kenickie said:
be a big boy. take some responsibility for yourself.


You sure have enriched this thread especially with the statutory rape comment. Really classy.

I do like how after you listed some of the excuses for not achieving your potential, you say take some responsibility. You sure give people alot of influence and power over your life. Are you not able to vote? All races of woman are trafficked. So these are keeping you from doing what? Do you think that nobody else wakes up with obstacles in their way? Do you think every successful person had it easy on their journey? You needed a dead thug in the street to get moving over these. What about all the other dead kids? What was wrong with them?

Im the one in control of my life and nobody else. The crying argument of you dont understand is weak. I understand i had nothing to do with any of the excuses you mentioned and Im thinking it doesn't effect you in the year 2014 either.

And spaceballs, another great joke. But I am glad you found a side to saddle up to now. Have a good one. Please though, put the bait away.
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Yet people remember the LA riots.

Does anyone talk about the sit-ins protesting the invasion of Iraq in 2003?
What did they achieve - a soundbyte here and there (for the millions of people that took to the streets worldwide)?
 
LosBlancos said:
On one hand we have people complaining that their communities are violent and police just show up after the gunshots to examine the dead body, and on the other hand we have Stop and Frisk which is the proactive approach and has resulted in the violent crime rate of New York City dropping substantially. Irregardless of what the police do, it seems there will be complaints.

Did it ever cross your mind the high-crime areas of NYC are inhabited primarily by Blacks? Do you think they would prevent any crime stopping and frisking middle-aged white guys in business suits in the middle of Times Square? If you "Black People Lives Matter" as the Ferguson protestors so proudly display on their signs you should support NYC's initiatives because they have resulted in a severely reduced murder rate. I wouldn't doubt that countless lives have been saved by Stop and Frisk either through the deterrant aspect of it, or actually finding a criminal illegally possessing a gun who had intentions of killing or robbing with it later.
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I honesty don't know if it's because the way you where brought up gives you no conception at all of what it's like be oppressed or if you are just ignorant. Of course mass sweeps are going to net mass arrest and convictions. Have you ever been in court yourself? It's rigged from the begging because only people with money can get a decent lawyer from the get go. Often it's plead to the best deal you can get because the lawyer hasn't the time to put into fighting it. Basically unless you have the cash to pony up for a good lawyer aka private lawyer your fucked because a good prosecutor may hurt you but a bad defense lawyer will fucking kill you in court. It's all politics and behind the scene deals where just some get fucked harder in the end. None of it has anything to do with justice.

Of course i am speaking of the Canadian court system not the American one but i can't imagine retainers being cheaper south of the border.
 
I honestly feel no guilt for sticking my penis in that 16 year old when I was 20. :)

I really don't know what you're trying to do bringing it up.

And spacehunk, 53 people died. 2,000 injured. Fuck Rodney King. And the rioters can burn in hell.
 
paranoid android said:
I honesty don't know if it's because the way you where brought up gives you no conception at all of what it's like be oppressed or if you are just ignorant. Of course mass sweeps are going to net mass arrest and convictions. Have you ever been in court yourself? It's rigged from the begging because only people with money can get a decent lawyer from the get go. Often it's plead to the best deal you can get because the lawyer hasn't the time to put into fighting it. Basically unless you have the cash to pony up for a good lawyer aka private lawyer your fucked because a good prosecutor may hurt you but a bad defense lawyer will fucking kill you in court. It's all politics and behind the scene deals where just some get fucked harder in the end. None of it has anything to do with justice.

Of course i am speaking of the Canadian court system not the American one but i can't imagine retainers being cheaper south of the border.
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So then it's not a racist court system after all? OJ Simpson or Ray Lewis, pretty much dead to rights on murder yet had fantastic legal teams. So it seems more favourable legal outcomes come to those who have more resources to retain a good lawyer.

What your ignoring is the sky high violence in neighborhoods that has community activists, leaders, ect practically begging for police officers to increase their presence their. Murders, robberies, rapes, multiple ones per night concentrated to various neighborhoods in Americas largest cities. NYC took a proactive measures of Stop and Frisk to combat this, their is less violent crime since they've implemented it. Simple as that. Whether I agree with it, I'm not sure. You have to choose between a few people doing nothing wrong yet being disgruntled about being Stopped and Frisked or more murders, robberies, rapes, ects.
 
Im not rich by any means and when i got a case that needed a lawyer, i just made payments. It was over a few years but he worked with me. Your right in that it is rigged from the beginning. Goes something like...take this minimal no contest plea and will maybe show some leniency regardless if your guilty or not. That doesnt matter. Or...take this too court and we will make an example out of you.

Which is also why that immature statutory rape cheap sucker punch has no weight. They wanted, if i went to trial and found to be guilty, to make me a registered sex offender for the rest of my life cause i pissed outside by myself when i was in a blackout. So no contest it was and all i got was a 45 dollar fine. Great system. But ya i have had experience with the pigs trying to keep me down.
 
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legalizeall said:
Nobody listens to violent protests either. Dont you think the rodney king trial riots 22 years ago should have done something. Those were way more violent than this with 53 people dying, billions of dollars in damage, and the worse they had seen for over a hundred years.
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It did do something and it focused Americas as well as Canada's eye on the trial. When the bastards got off i can remember my mom cursing and swearing about the police and them never being able to get away with doing that to some rich white kid. To the best of my recollections my old man had much the same view. I was only maybe 10 at the time but i do remember my mom telling me to come into the TV room and watch something. It took me a few years to grasp the significance out of it and to be honest it's sad alot more wasn't accomplished after that incident. I think things improved abit but i think these events may prove that patching things up with meaningless reforms is obviously not going to work either. I mean fuck what's it going to take Ferguson looking like Beirut or Belfast all of a sudden? Actually it was alot more peaceful in those places the past few nights most likely.

Something has to be done about the policing situation in America or sooner or later something much worse is going to happen. You can't expect to treat people like animals and not expect to get bit

LosBlancos said:
So then it's not a racist court system after all? OJ Simpson or Ray Lewis, pretty much dead to rights on murder yet had fantastic legal teams. So it seems more favourable legal outcomes come to those who have more resources to retain a good lawyer.
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My god the mans got it give him a nice single malt Scotch! Of course it has more to do with economics but it just so happens that there are more white people living a upper middle class and up lifestyle as opposed to blacks. Though the problem being that there are sill stupid people who look as a black person as nothing but a black person
 
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spacejunk said:
Yet people remember the LA riots.

Does anyone talk about the sit-ins protesting the invasion of Iraq in 2003?
What did they achieve - a soundbyte here and there (for the millions of people that took to the streets worldwide)?
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They probably dont. I saw a video where they showed some young people who didnt know much about 9/11. The only reason i say it was because i lived about 45 mins away from it at the time. But you dont advocate violence right. Which spaceball personality showed up today. The beavis and butthead fire, fire, fire one or the peace spreading, tolerant tree hugging fellow?
 
What 23 said:
I asked specifically about black mothers dying compared to in Africa, in America.

It's just hard for me to believe that blacks not having healthcare is because of something like racism.
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so sorry that real life racism is hard for you to comprehend or understand.

off topic under the cut.
NSFW:


A report released in August by the Center for Reproductive Rights, the National Latina Institute for Reproductive Health and Sistersong Women of Color Reproductive Justice Collective paints a distressing picture of the health conditions facing black and Latina women in the United States. The report, “Reproductive Injustice: Racial and Gender Discrimination in U.S. Health Care,” was written for U.S. government officials and the United Nations committee tasked with reviewing compliance with the International Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Racial Discrimination (ICERD). It makes a compelling case that the U.S. is in direct violation of ICERD based on the health care access and health outcomes associated with certain populations in the U.S.

One of the more frightening findings in the report, which focuses on black women in Georgia and Mississippi and Latinas in South Texas, is one that has received increased attention in recent years—the continued crisis of maternal mortality in the United States, particularly for black women.

Between 1990 and 2013, the overall maternal mortality ratio grew by 136 percent, from 12 maternal deaths for every 100,000 live births to 28 for every 100,000 live births. That increase coincides with a period during which a majority of other countries dramatically reduced their mortality rates. Our rates put us way behind most other developed nations. For instance, we have twice the rate of Saudi Arabia and three times that of the United Kingdom.

When you look at these statistics based on race and geography, the picture becomes even bleaker. According to “Reproductive Injustice,” over the last 40 years, the rate of black women dying in childbirth has been three to four times the rate of their white counterparts. And in many places where the white maternal mortality rate is so insignificant it can’t even be reported, black maternal mortality rates are way above the national average. For example, in Fulton County, Georgia, which includes Atlanta, there are 94 maternal deaths per 100,000 live births for black women—three times the national average. The white maternal mortality rate in the same county is essentially zero—too insignificant to report. In Chicksaw County, Mississippi, the maternal mortality rate is higher than those in countries of Sub-Saharan Africa, including Kenya and Rwanda.
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yikes? New Report says US Health Care Violates UN Convention on Racism
Black/White Disparity in Maternal Mortality: Report from National Library of Medicine
Black Women four times as likely to die of pregnancy related complications as white counter parts : Association of Reproductive Professionals


jenkies!
 
Was she talking to you, or me?

Is that a metaphor?

Really. Even at 32 in an ideal world I'd fuck a 17 year old. Not to say that's my predisposition for attraction but I'm not ashamed of finding a curvy body with breasts and hips fuck-worthy. Just last week a 19 your old African American girl took my load in her mouth. Why is that old enough, and 17 is not? Laws, I guess. Right. Maybe that's your point. But I don't attack people. I'm not violent like Rodney King and Michael Brown. I've never thrown a punch with intent to dominate or injure, though I've boxed a little. Even in fighting I've TRIED NOT to injure who I'm 'fighting' because for more of my life I was taller, stronger, etc, and never felt desperate. I'm analyzing myself here. Maybe the violent ones feel threatened more in some way. Hopeless.

Never intentionally stolen. I guess I can see the points you try to make though. Driving 110 on acid that one time I could have hit someone. Could be in jail. If I were black it might be more likely that I'd be poorer or wouldn't have the father I have- one who could afford a good lawyer. It wouldn't be necessarily because I was black per sey, in that anyone is directly to blame for victimizing me and throwing me in jail (I might be right now), but the 'system' would disproportionately 'target' me. I'm lacking the language but I think some should know what I mean.

In these senses... I sort of do understand and even appreciate the graceless loudmouths. But I don't agree with their methods and would defend myself against them.
 
Kenickie said:
so sorry that real life racism is hard for you to comprehend or understand.

off topic under the cut.

jenkies!
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White people are much more likely to die from skin cancer. Racism.

Real life racism isn't hard to comprehend, although I think you might like to know racism afflicts not only African-Americans but also Asians, Hispanics, Caucasians, ect.
 
though, of course racism exists... Not saying it doesn't. But I don't think the response to it is really that helpful, either. Though understandable. It is a fucked up deal and I really wish everyone would have gotten prosperous at the right time to where Blacks could have been successful in Africa and Europeans in Europe and Arabs in Arabia and we could have all met and been on equal, stable footing without the warfare and class warfare, and Etc. I really, really wish for this. In respects.

Understandably life isn't like that though... How we know it. As organisms we take advantage of others. And we are thrown together. In respects war and competition can benefit. If only we had from the beginning foreknowledge... In respects . In respects I argue.
 
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Guys, let's stop bickering. It's really painful to read through. Post constructive things about the topic at hand and don't attack other people's character.
 
alasdairm said:
good post.

why was there a grand jury in the first place? mcculloch could have just done what prosecutors do every day - charge the suspect. whatever you believe in the case, there are some facts on which we can all agree, right?

one fact is that wilson killed brown. nobody denies that, right?

let a jury decide whether the killing was legal or not. now they won't even get that chance.

but we have a prosecutor who has a history of siding with the police (source). fromthere:

"...the local prosecutor, Robert P. McCulloch, put the case to a grand jury, citizens who receive evidence under the instruction, questioning and watchful eye of the prosecutor to decide whether to press charges."

to me, that doesn't come anywhere near able to be described as "about as impartial an entity as is possible for human beings to construct".

alasdair
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Agree completely with that last sentence.
Is there a way for meaningful political/social change to come about within this legal framework?

Or must this change take place through other means?
 
Some lyrics from a Michael Brown rap song, rapping under the name Big Mike.

"“I’ll be counting money by myselfI’m a rich nigga so I got that wealth
I fuck three [???] hos by myself
While I’m smoking on this [!?!?]
When the sun goes down
You in trouble now.”
Another:
“With this Glock in your face
And you betta not make a sound
And I only like white men on my money [???]
Those who are last shall be first,
Whites on the bottom
He musta walked up and unloaded because there was no stopping him
Somebody else layin’ across the street, must be his partner
Damn.”"

https://soundcloud.com/bigmike-jr-brown


^There's the soundcloud page if you're feeling brave
 
I agree about the prosecutor, sj and Alasdair... It being questionable with him. I've read a little on that and wanted to bring some to this thread. But I've been lazy. Also it doesn't suit my normal position of racist stupid evil white guy. Not that that's really any of my reasoning for being lazy. I've just been lazy.

LosBlancos, good find. I brought that up earlier. I was thinking about that when I saw pictures of all the white people carrying "justice for Mike Brown" signs. I wonder if they even know or are they just part of the 'new wave of revolutionaries' who really don't have a fucking clue how things work at all.
 
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spacejunk said:
Agree completely with that last sentence.
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you're of course entitled to your opinion, but did you even read my last post?

a grand jury is a check on the power of a prosecutor. one of the last real checks that we even have to quell prosecutorial overreach.

the prosecutor presents the evidence to the grand jury and they tell him whether he's full of shit or not. without that, the system would become even more fucked up and biased. prosecutors could just charge anyone with a capital crime at their discretion, and it would fall on the defendant to go to trial and fight it. this would inevitably lead to even more bias against poor minorities who, for socioeconomic reasons, cannot afford proper counsel beyond a public defender.
 
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