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  • Current Events & Politics Moderators: deficiT | tryptakid | Foreigner

Conspiracies The Covid Narrative

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Jesus christ dude, okay I give up. Enjoy your walls of text. I hope you don't converse like this with people in real life.

"My rules", lol. I have simply asked you to address some points I have tried to make. In the climate change thread I even asked you one simple question, that had a yes or no answer, in an attempt to try to get you to actually reply to what I was saying. I'm not "manipulating" you and you haven't "disarmed" me, what you've done is talked to yourself in circles and used pages and pages of text to say what could have been said in a couple of sentences. I'm trying to engage you in a conversation and you just keep rattling on about narratives and brainwashing, over and over and over again. You have presented no counter-arguments or facts or even opinions about what I've presented and asked of you, it's all just "you're a sheep parroting toxic narratives". Do you honestly believe you're engaging in a conversation with me, or that you're arguing in good faith?

When I ask you if you believe that our energy consumption practices produce pollution and whether that is a negative thing we should try to improve, and you reply with 4 or 5 paragraphs, each of which is telling me I'm a blind sheep... that is not engaging me in conversation. Engaging me in conversation would be answering yes or no, and then explaining why you feel that way. I'm interested in that. I am not interested in hearing about how there are toxic narratives again. I already know you feel that way. I even agree with you that there are a lot of toxic narratives going on.
 
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Xorkoth said:
Jesus christ dude, okay I give up. Enjoy your walls of text. I hope you don't converse like this with people in real life.

"My rules", lol. I have simply asked you to address some points I have tried to make. In the climate change thread I even asked you one simple question, that had a yes or no answer, in an attempt to try to get you to actually reply to what I was saying. I'm not "manipulating" you and you haven't "disarmed" me, what you've done is talked to yourself in circles and used pages and pages of text to say what could have been said in a couple of sentences. I'm trying to engage you in a conversation and you just keep rattling on about narratives and brainwashing, over and over and over again. You have presented no counter-arguments or facts or even opinions about what I've presented and asked of you, it's all just "you're a sheep parroting oxic narratives". Do you honestly believe you're engaging in a conversation with me, or that you're arguing in good faith?

When I ask you if you believe that our energy consumption practices produce pollution and whether that is a negative thing we should try to improve, and you rep-y with 4 or 5 paragraphs, each of which is telling me I'm a blind sheep... that is not engaging me in conversation. Engaging me in conversation would be answering yes or no, and then explaining why you feel that way.
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Okay, take care.
As mentioned, you are generalizing all my responses down to being an attack against you and some conspiracy to tar you. Not at all. You wont accept it because conflict is what you want. Thats why most people are in this thread. Its got so heated, as have other threads on this topic, that many have stopped replying because its so toxic.

Its not so innocent, is it?
If most people have given up with the thread for the sake of preserving their own wellbeing and inner peace, why are you so adamant on continuing it? I am saying it shouldnt continue. You want me to provide evidence as to why that is even though its a debate nobody can win because nobody is supposed to win because its not about debate. Its about political narratives that are being pushed on the people for them to then assume the role of mercenary for the government et al while hiding behind the illusion of anonymity among the mob.

Look at all my responses. They are peaceful and seek an end to it all. But the responses I get in return promote the narrative continuing. The answers you seek are simply to reinforce your conditioning, not to challenge it, hence your response.

I dont like any of it. I think its all garbage. You like it because it gives you a sense of meaning and purpose and makes you feel part of something, despite not actually rewarding you with either of those things. It makes you like this, hostile towards anyone who doesnt live in the same bubble as you. And you have been taught to do this. Its what governments do to abdicate responsibility for actual visible intervention i.e boots on the ground, tanks etc. You just sow discontent, distrust and upheaval into society so that the people do that for you while acting like foot soldiers for your regime and ideology. China has the same way of doing it. Nazi Germany did too. As does N Korea. Its a well documented recipe. You are blind to it because you are not educated and informed about it so its just nonsense to you for your own convenience of not dealing with the reality.

And because its entirely political, that itself gets most of the doubt out of the way as to what is going on. Why? Because this stuff has happened before. The Western world has simply been coddled and bubblewrapped from the raw truth of how it really operates. Dont worry kids, these bullets are really flowers. Dont worry kids, that person isnt dead, hes just sleeping. Dont worry, Santa still exists and Disney Land really is like you see in the movies. Its all real life! Except the bits we dont want you to see *wink*

Your points are invalid. The whole premise of your argument is invalid. Its based on the intentions to not resolve the debate but to simply reinforce the mainstream narrative. There is no debate, as I have mentioned. That is why this entire thing is so toxic because debate is not encouraged yet social unrest and division is. We can attack one another yet not resolve this mutually. We can become almost militant extremists yet we cant debrief ourselves and each other and no longer have a bogeyman to attack. We can hurt one another and gaslight one another but we cant heal nor connect, unless under the conditions highlighted above.

Thats not normal. Its not healthy but its what you consider acceptable. Thats on you. Not me. Just like its on everybody else who feels the same way. Its all well and good until we realize WE are all we have got. This thing called reality WE ALL contribute towards. We make it. No-one else. The government doesnt or shouldnt. Science doesnt or shouldnt. Experts dont or shouldnt. When you take all that away, we are all there is and if we choose to burn down all we have, what do we have left? You might be able to live without me and maybe many others but eventually when you burn so many bridges and false narratives destroy your connection to YOUR society, there wont be anyone else left. You will be isolated. Vulnerable and exploitable.

There is no other. We are all on the same team. Or that was the script anyway. Thats what built our worlds. When you are convinced otherwise though? You are a danger not just to me and others but yourself too. It pays to think about what you preach and what you believe in and push on others. It pays to know your own reflection and understand how this reality works. It works by us all propping it up. You cant take me away or anyone else without the whole deck of cards crumbling down. Likewise and I cant take you away. Not unless we want to live divided and never work together to build the world we want to live in.

Everybody learned this at school. Most grew up pretty decenty. They knew how to play in the sand pit. When did we lose that ability? Just imagine us all now in that sandpit like it is in this thread. How pathetic.

Think about it.
 
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Dear [Name of Human Resources Officer or other appropriate supervisor]:

On [set forth date], I and other employees of [name of employer] were notified that all
employees must be fully vaccinated against COVID-19 and provide proof thereof or face
termination of our employment. This letter will serve as my formal notice to [name of employer]
of the following:

Receiving the COVID-19 vaccination would violate my sincerely-held religious beliefs,
practices and/or observances. The following is a description of my religious beliefs that prevent
me from receiving the COVID-19 vaccination: [include here a description of your religious
beliefs in opposition to receiving the vaccine. If possible, include references to religious texts or
statements by leaders of your religion supporting your opposition, although neither are necessary
to support a sincerely-held religious belief]. Under established law, including the U.S.
Constitution, the definition of religion is broad and protects beliefs, practices, and observances
which may be unfamiliar, so an employer must assume that an employee’s statement of objection
to a vaccination requirement is based on a sincerely held religious belief, practice, or observance.

Because receiving the COVID-19 vaccination would violate my sincerely-held religious
beliefs, I hereby request an accommodation of those beliefs with respect to the recently-imposed
vaccination requirement. Under Title VII of the federal civil rights laws, an employer may not
discharge or otherwise discriminate against an individual because of the individual’s religion. 42
U.S.C. § 2000e-2(a)(1). As the U.S. Supreme Court has held, this law requires an employer to
seek to accommodate an employee whenever there is a conflict between a requirement of the
employment and the employee’s religious beliefs, practices or observances. Trans World
Airlines, Inc. v. Hardison, 432 U.S. 63 (1977). An accommodation that fully eliminates the
conflict with my religious beliefs must be provided unless any and all accommodations would
impose an undue hardship. To the extent the law of the [State or Commonwealth where
employed] imposes a similar duty to accommodate the religious beliefs, practices or observances
of employees, I hereby invoke any and all rights under state law as well.

Having formally notified [name of employer] of the conflict between the COVID-19
vaccination requirement and my religious beliefs, I look forward to receiving in a prompt and
timely manner your decision on what accommodation you will provide. Failing that, I reserve my
right to pursue legal remedies available to me with the Equal Employment Opportunity
Commission or otherwise in accordance with established law.

Sincerely yours,

[Signature]

[Your name printed]
 
Just had a business dinner with the president of my company, two of the senior vice presidents, and my direct boss, who I just met for the first time in person. Flew to Texas earlier today for it. Went out to a nice restaurant and no one said a thing about covid at all, it was nice. Going to be going in to the office the next couple of days to work. I am feeling glad to be vaccinated right now, I'm much more comfortable than I would have been before I was. Not sure whether everyone there has been vaccinated or not but that's up to them. I'm kinda bummed because my old boss, who has become a good friend, isn't going to come in to see me because he hasn't gotten vaccinated and is too scared of exposure. I haven't seen him in 13 years and I was hoping I'd get to see him.

I have a big meeting in the morning where I am going to be presenting my ideas for the future development work to the senior team. Dinner tonight totally felt like I was being welcomed into the ranks of the upper levels.
 
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unherd.com

The most vaccine-hesitant group of all? PhDs

There has been much debate over how to get the unvaccinated to get their jabs — shame them, bribe them, persuade them, or treat them as victims of mis- and disinformation campaigns — but who, exactly, are these people? Most of the coverage would have you believe that the surge in cases is...
unherd.com unherd.com

​

A new study found that the most educated are the least likely to get jabbed​

 
Interesting, it's been the opposite in my immediate world, at least as far as the people I know well enough to know whether they've been vaccinated or not.
 
The Wizard of the Creek said:
They forced our hand to use it on them.
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No matter what Japan's government did or said, dropping atom bombs on cities is still murdering tens of thousands of non combatants.
The Wizard of the Creek said:
The US had to use these terrible weapons.
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No... They didn't really. They dropped the bombs to flex on the Soviet Union, pure and simple.

I wonder how differently people would talk about the war had those bombs been dropped on American or British cities? I'm willing to bet the dialogue would be vastly different.
 
The festival, which featured Foals and Gorillaz, asked all ticket-holders aged 11 and over to demonstrate their Covid-19 status through the NHS Covid app before entering. Face masks were not compulsory but were encouraged.

People who camped at the festival had to take a second NHS lateral flow test during the event and log their results in the app
 
deficiT said:
No matter what Japan's government did or said, dropping atom bombs on cities is still murdering tens of thousands of non combatants.

No... They didn't really. They dropped the bombs to flex on the Soviet Union, pure and simple.

I wonder how differently people would talk about the war had those bombs been dropped on American or British cities? I'm willing to bet the dialogue would be vastly different.
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What is your alternative approach?
 
Mr. Krinkle said:
and they all had to be vaxxed to get in....so 4700 breakthroughs
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you do realise that means that a huge number of lives were saved? the situation at the same festival sans vaccine would not have been pretty. breakthrough infections are a massive concern.... and there would be fewer of them if the entire population got vaccinated.

anyway, florida is up to the 'get stupid prizes' part of playing stupid games: https://uk.sports.yahoo.com/news/sc...r_a4jdMn4csB5wPRHwB2iP0BxtrtsXVtAR8o1QFF2BcQR

honestly think doctors should have started this ages ago. i would not admit unvaccinated covid patients who were eligible at this point, at least that way those 75 doctors wouldn't be pushed to quit, so they'd be able to care for the patients who weren't recklessly irresponsible,
 
The Wizard of the Creek said:
They just staged a walk out. They didn’t really have a walk out. It was organized to make a point that people need to get vaccinated so that they don’t have all of these needless hospitalizations.

They aren’t really walking out. They are just trying being dramatic. Of course they are not walking out. That would totally violate their oath the “do no harm”.

All of this is this is just theatrics, and will ultimately change no one’s mind concerning vaccines.
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yes- i should have been clearer in my previous post. the stupid prizes are the fact that they are filling up their ICUs again and stretching their healthcare workers to the point they are at, completely preventably.

doctors can't be expected to tolerate this forever, they will break eventually. it won't be a walkout, it will be one goes off sick, then the next, then the next. the only way we can prevent that is to mandate safety measures, harshly, and if that fails, revise what level of care eligible people who have chosen not to vaccinate can get.
 
The Wizard of the Creek said:
You should read a history book man. Once Japan knew that the US had the bomb, they refused to surrender. The US even invited some of their generals to witness the total destruction from these weapons, and still they refused to surrender. They forced our hand to use it on them.

After the first bomb was dropped on Hiroshima on Aug 6th 1945, the emperor refused to surrender. Even though Hiroshima was blown off the map, with over 80,000 Japanese citizens dying instantly in the blast, the Japanese empire, it appeared would rather be vaporized than surrender. A second bomb was then necessary and was authorized for use three days later on Nagasaki. This was to show the emperor that we will not stop using our bombs and will continue to destroy city after city until they totally and completely surrendered. The US was bluffing of course (we only had the two bombs at that time).

So tell me how the US use of atom bombs on Japan was completely unnecessary? Was the US pure unalloyed evil for dropping the bombs on Japan. Is it the US to blame for the emperor Hirohito’s never surrender kamakazi suicide mentality? Should the US have just let the Japs take out as many Americans as they could with suicide missions until either they were all dead, or until the Americans were all dead? That would have been a better? Isn’t it more evil (I disagree with the whole concept of evil btw), that the emperor was willing to sacrifice every single Japanese citizen, knowing that the US had a terrible bomb capable of destroying every city in Japan? Then, even after the US was forced to drop the A-bomb on Hiroshima, Emperor Hirohito still did not surrender and willingly sacrificed the people in Nagasaki. Was that evil to do to your own people?

The US had to use these terrible weapons. The Japanese empire would have never surrendered, and would have fought to the death until all Japanese people were dead, all while trying to take out as many Americans as they could. The argument that the Japanese government could have been brought to surrender through other means is ignoring the fact that Imperial Japan was willing to fight to the very last man. You can’t negotiate with that, and it wasn’t until the US proved that we could destroy every city in Japan, one by one, that Japan reluctantly surrendered. They finally came to their senses where they could no longer see any honor of being completely wiped out without even having the honor to be able to fight to the death.

The fact is, the use of nuclear weapons saved so many lives in the long run. Without the US dropping the atom bomb on Japan, the war would have lasted many more years. It would’ve become even more bloody and deadlier if the Allies were forced to invade the Japanese mainland. They would have never surrendered, and they were resolved to fight to the death until no one was left alive to fight.

Would that have been better?
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I have read quite a lot. They were eyeing a reason to use it and had no target to drop it on. Their testing up to then wouldnt show the magnitude of a nuclear bomb dropped on a population. They needed conclusive evidence, and so they dropped it. This is even mentioned by those who have come out on record about it. The final chapter was a real-life exercise. The idea was to always drop it. This is before we actually knew what they did to populations and so granted, much of the enthusiasm was premature. Roosevelt let everything happen deliberately to allow for US involvement in WW2. Most of the personnel were kept in the dark about Japan despite quite a bit of evidence suggesting the US had deciphered Japans diplomatic signals further suggesting the highest in command knew Japan were going to attack but left the ships grossly exposed. Roosevelt had positioned the US for the perfect entry into WW2.

Mainstream history and the heroes of war being the ones who sculpt reality is your typical 3 course meal and everybody eats it. The Western world is the good guy. Nuclear bombs fix problems. Blood spilled is always good. This end wars and the victors become immortal. Until they get home and their veteran services aid them in debilitating depression, drug addiction, violence and even suicide.

Politicians end wars as does policy change and drastic re-evaluation. And connected to that, this involves not creating false narratives to go to war. The US found a way into WW1 and they found a way into WW2. They found a way to go to war in Afghanistan by conspiring to create probably one of the biggest events in history on US soil, 9/11.
Xorkoth said:
Interesting, it's been the opposite in my immediate world, at least as far as the people I know well enough to know whether they've been vaccinated or not.
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What does it matter? Vaccines dont change the person or their relationship to you, unless you are fervently hostile to your own society and willing to divide it. Division is great for those who consolidate everything when you do their dirty work. Not so great for the victims who dont get to find peace and are always primed to spot and attack the "other" making them paranoid, fearful, anxious and wreaking havoc on their health and wellbeing. Its not natural to be primed to think and act like that for sustained periods of time. Its why past generations who lived in hardship for example had greatly reduced quality of lives. Primarily their environment propagated despair, isolation, hostility and deprivity. The culture permeated the darkness they lived in and this takes many generations to heal. You go willingly into that darkness at your own peril. Many dont return quite the same again. You could say its very similiar to PTSD in some ways and most of that is invisible.

We are not bulletproof. Our society does not remain immune to attacks against its foundations and for it to remain structurally sound. People suffer, winners and losers, whatever they are or mean. Whenever something has happened in our history that shook us, it shook us for a long time and changed the course of history, and not for the better.

Thats why being conscious of what you take for granted yet could be slowly poisoning the delicate balance is important. We live disconnected lives though, and so we have no conscious awareness of consequences when it seems like what we do is victimless and isolated. We live in bubbles and serve ourselves yet we pretend we have the right to pop other peoples bubbles.
 
The Wizard of the Creek said:
^^ utter bullshit my man, on all accounts. I have had the misfortune to accidentally read some of your tl;dr posts unfortunately, and all you are is a contrarian, nothing more. You are also a quite boring contrarian to that end (my opinion) and no offense. I have met people like you that speak in such a way like you do irl, and those types of people are genuinely despised by everyone. No offense to you personally my man. I have no idea who you really are irl, but if you speak the way you post here on bluelight, than I should say some prayers for you dude, maybe do a spell or two for you.

All I am trying to say to you is… I don’t believe you even believe the things you spout off here. I have never heard you ever agree with anyone’s point of view here, even if they agree with your nonsense. You seem to only exist here only to rile up peoples sensibilities and write very long winded boring ass posts that never say anything, and you never provide any evidence to support your positions. You are a contrarian, plain and simple, and that is all you are.

🧙‍♂️
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Quite an outburst. You really sh*t the bed with that one, didnt you? Are you okay? Will you survive? We can talk about this if you want?

Not everybody is desperate to belong "my man". I get the impression its all about fitting in with you yet the more you try the less you actually fit in. Some of us are perfectly capable of having independent perspectives and some of us spend our lives in environments that cultivate that i.e real good friends and real healthy stable and nourishing environments. You know, where you can say what you want and not anticipate getting attacked? It seems you struggle to understand those places do exist and that people hail from those places. Particularly those who like to keep a sane mind and dont play roles online to try and gain validation and approval from others. Lots of your response is posturing and male ego getting in the way. You feel threatened and so you are trying to make yourself as big as possible. There is always something missing when you do that. What is missing is just being yourself "my man" and sometimes saying f*ck it and going balls out in order to live your best life and be who you are. If that means you dont make friends with a man who thinks hes a wizard on a drugs forum, so be it. I cant say I have friends irl that play wizard roles tbh. Most have kids and wives and are settled and dont spend their time on forums trying to bash others for having different perspectives while throwing your toys out of the pram for not getting their own way.

The minute you made it personal was the minute I knew you werent a real wizard and that you've never even touched a book on arcane magic. I also knew it was the minute you probably are a little too unstable and volatile in your personal life right now to have a conversation without you turning into a triggered snowflake.

I have taken quite a bit of flack in regards to my statements. I still stand true to them. I still engage in debate. Mainly to dissect the psychology of groupthink, mob rule and propaganda and its effects on the masses. I stand true to my pursuits. I study this stuff and as someone with over a decade of experience in this field, its refreshing to meet a cancel culture snowflake who wants the books ripped up to make himself feel better when the debate doesnt go his way.

Nice meeting you "my man".
As for contrarian, absolutely. Linked to that is objectivity, rationalism and reasoning, logic etc. You must be able to turn course at any minute when the tide changes. We apparently pay journos to do exactly that. We pay politicians to do that too although their intentions are contrary to wholesome policies, whereas mine support wholesome policies (at the expense of hurting the feels of wizards on drugs forums that dont know what they are supporting). We pay authorities to do that, so they remain as impartial as possible. You need that in society. The opposite of that are yes men, complacency, groupthink and everybody walking off the cliff.

Who saves you in this scenario? Who shouts out "There is a sheer drop at the end!"? The contrarians as they diverge from the brainless drone-like behaviour of the masses and provide contrasting perspectives. How many actually turn around though? Thats upto them. Its not a superhero role and it involves being tough sometimes and detaching your emotions knowing you were doing the right thing anyway but you get rewarded ten-fold knowing you are the better person and a role model, a leader, a truth seeker, a genuine person whose not hiding behind a facade trying to make out life is about the fake acts he plays.

We usually value those people. They were the ones who wrote books on philosophy that now define the original foundations of Western society, for the most part anyway. We dont today because we are disillusioned and we hate ourselves and each other and want an outlet to take it all out. I guess thats where drugs come in too. You cant take it out on everybody all the time. At one point you have to suck it up and go on your own journey to work out what it all means. When you knock someone for doing just that, it speaks volumes about what you dont have. We usually call those people haters. Good luck with that.
 
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