Jabberwocky
Frumious Bandersnatch
good info thanks tobala
The Big & Dandy DOC Thread (Part 1)
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tobala
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The thing to remember is that--like LEO's, you never gain anything by giving information to an MRO. Name, rank, and serial number--that's it. If they accuse you of anything, ask for proof and never admit--you won't get in "trouble" for using this strategy.
Thus, your personal life is none of their fucking business so don't feel the need to share. I realize that this is getting into legal and drug-testing issues, but I feel anyone who experiments in their personal time with things like DOC should know this, and in this respect the information is on-topic.
Thus, your personal life is none of their fucking business so don't feel the need to share. I realize that this is getting into legal and drug-testing issues, but I feel anyone who experiments in their personal time with things like DOC should know this, and in this respect the information is on-topic.
Tryptamine*Dreamer
Ex-Bluelighter
CRICKETBEE said:
Taking less would lead to a somewhat shorter trip, but would be less intense too.
You might get a shorter trip if you snort or plug it. It definitely comes on a lot faster that way, 30 minutes instead of 2.5-3 hours. I know the trip is quite a bit shorter if you do that with a 2c-x chemical. I don't know how much it would shorten a DOC trip. I do know that it seemed to be a shorter trip when I did that, but I wasn't keeping track of the time.
An IV injection would probably lead to a much shorter trip. I know it does with the few psychedelics I have IV'd at a high enough dose to produce full effects.I'm not recommending anyone to try this. I don't know how safe it will be. Be VERY careful if you try doing this. Start low. I IV'd 0.5mg of DOI once and felt significant effects, it was enough for a +2 IIRC. I would have felt little or nothing from eating or even snorting that amount. I'm pretty unsure of just how strong it was and how much was used. It was a long time ago. It may be 3-4x as potent when IV'd compared to oral, possibly even more.
CRICKETBEE
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thanks all for the great advice
1. about drug testing. very good advice on personal liberties. i had NO idea and was only going on what someone had said earlier in this thread. wasnt trying to worry too much
just know i get tested for amphetamines on friday.
also, great info on plugging and such. never tried that route so thanks.
1. about drug testing. very good advice on personal liberties. i had NO idea and was only going on what someone had said earlier in this thread. wasnt trying to worry too much
just know i get tested for amphetamines on friday.
also, great info on plugging and such. never tried that route so thanks.
tobala
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^^^^ Well even if DOC were to trigger a positive on the preliminary screen, I think enough time has elapsed for it to clear from your system in any event, so I don't think it will happen.
If, for whatever reason, you get the call to come see the MRO, he might try to force an admission of drug use from you. As I said before, don't fall for it. Admit nothing and demand the confirmatory test--it will clear you.
Re the worries: your employment is damned important, and your concern is absolutely justified. That's why knowing the rules of the game is so important. But relax, you're gonna be fine...
If, for whatever reason, you get the call to come see the MRO, he might try to force an admission of drug use from you. As I said before, don't fall for it. Admit nothing and demand the confirmatory test--it will clear you.
Re the worries: your employment is damned important, and your concern is absolutely justified. That's why knowing the rules of the game is so important. But relax, you're gonna be fine...
fastandbulbous
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Well the fact that there's an entirely separate test to the amphetamine screeeing to test for MDMA sort of says that anything based on amphetamine with a degree of ring substitution isn't going to give a positive.
As for admitting anything, I'd go as far as saying never admit to any recreational drug use, but it's useful to know that ephedrine/pseudoephedrine can trigger a false positive for amphetamines, so saying you'd recently had some Pseudofed (as it can be bought OTC without a prescription, they can't peanalize you for using a legal medicine to treat a condition) because your sinuses were congested will force them to either shut the fuck up or do a GC/MS type analysis while not leaving the door open for them to be snidey fucks and imply that you've been taking amphetamines.through innuendo
As tobala said, the confirmation test is a lot of additional expense for them and if you've given a reason for a false positive (never let them know that you know ephedrine can cause a false positive, just ask if it could and let them come to their own conclusions), they're a hell of a lot more likely to just believe that and save the cost of an additional analysis
tobala
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Well I for one am of the opinion that you should confront any MRO with a solid foundation of knowing what they're up to. I've snagged my knowledge from lurking on forums dedicated to MRO info. They don't like it when guys like me come around, and they even say that they are against using the info on their public forums as a means to subvert the drug testing industry.
Thus, I lurk and acquire information, but never contribute because there's no need. In my many hours hanging out with these MD's, I've found they fall into two categories:
1. The type that don't want to see lives disrupted by drug testing. They will listen to explanations for positive results and don't feel good about reporting them. But, of course, it's their job and their concerns are valid when testing truck drivers, airplane pilots, etc. They are skeptical when they send a potential CompUSA employee as positive because who gives a fuck if the guy who's trying to sell you a modem smoked pot over the weekend? The senior mod of a forum I lurk on doesn't even believe that testing for prescription drugs is a good idea because people tend to share prescriptions and he ultimately feels it's a waste of time. Needless to say, I respect and like this individual because he has values that extend beyond generating revenue for an industry...
2. The type who like drug testing as a means of social engineering. These guys are like LEO's in that they don't care if your test is positive for amphetamine because you ingested ephedrine or pseudoephedrine. They exist to validate the drug testing industry that employs them, and will do whatever they can to force an admission of drug use out of you. Don't even cater to them by admitting anything. Tell them to prove you are drug-positive by providing a GC/MS confirmation. Ask to see it and demand that they prove your result conforms to the spectra that they compare your results to. Trust me, they will go right on the defensive because your lawyer is waiting for them to fuck up, right?
Basically, these guys will behave as LEO's in that they will try to coerce an admission of drug use based on a preliminary screen--i.e., inconclusive evidence. In my opinion, there's no reason to go on the defensive with them, in fact I would come out swinging and say, "Fine, the preliminary test was positive, but let's see what the GC/MS confirmation says. If it doesn't confirm for whatever you're looking for, go fuck yourself."
Don't let an MRO dictate the course of your life. He needs to back up his results with proof via chemical testing which includes a reliable (and expensive) GC/MS confirmation. He doesn't want to do this because he will have to spend more of his time and more of the company's money.
But make him do this and act like you know exactly what you're talking about, because if he fucks up you will sue the shit out of him for fucking up your livelihood based on an imprecise preliminary screen.
Thus, I lurk and acquire information, but never contribute because there's no need. In my many hours hanging out with these MD's, I've found they fall into two categories:
1. The type that don't want to see lives disrupted by drug testing. They will listen to explanations for positive results and don't feel good about reporting them. But, of course, it's their job and their concerns are valid when testing truck drivers, airplane pilots, etc. They are skeptical when they send a potential CompUSA employee as positive because who gives a fuck if the guy who's trying to sell you a modem smoked pot over the weekend? The senior mod of a forum I lurk on doesn't even believe that testing for prescription drugs is a good idea because people tend to share prescriptions and he ultimately feels it's a waste of time. Needless to say, I respect and like this individual because he has values that extend beyond generating revenue for an industry...
2. The type who like drug testing as a means of social engineering. These guys are like LEO's in that they don't care if your test is positive for amphetamine because you ingested ephedrine or pseudoephedrine. They exist to validate the drug testing industry that employs them, and will do whatever they can to force an admission of drug use out of you. Don't even cater to them by admitting anything. Tell them to prove you are drug-positive by providing a GC/MS confirmation. Ask to see it and demand that they prove your result conforms to the spectra that they compare your results to. Trust me, they will go right on the defensive because your lawyer is waiting for them to fuck up, right?
Basically, these guys will behave as LEO's in that they will try to coerce an admission of drug use based on a preliminary screen--i.e., inconclusive evidence. In my opinion, there's no reason to go on the defensive with them, in fact I would come out swinging and say, "Fine, the preliminary test was positive, but let's see what the GC/MS confirmation says. If it doesn't confirm for whatever you're looking for, go fuck yourself."
Don't let an MRO dictate the course of your life. He needs to back up his results with proof via chemical testing which includes a reliable (and expensive) GC/MS confirmation. He doesn't want to do this because he will have to spend more of his time and more of the company's money.
But make him do this and act like you know exactly what you're talking about, because if he fucks up you will sue the shit out of him for fucking up your livelihood based on an imprecise preliminary screen.
fastandbulbous
Bluelight Crew
^ Personally I'd treat them with the contempt they deserve if they fell into the second group; not at all difficult to do & get away with if you have a reasonable knowledge of pharmacology & related topics. I had an interviewer try to pull that sort of shit when I went for my teacher training interview because I once had a lump of hash fall out of my lab coat while doing my lab project in the final year of my degree. Obviously somebody there had said something rather disparaging to the TT interview panel and they had me labelled as a major drug fiend (moi? 
) who should never be let anywhere near a classroom full of kids. Next day they got a letter from me demanding to know what had been said & who had said it with a view to taking them to court for defamation of character and that I'd be seeing my solicitor later that day so they could expect notification of legal action sometime in the near future...
Got a phone call the day after from the TT place that was almost grovelling in its apology for such a thing ever occuring (I still made noises about legal action unless the name of the person who had initiated all this shit was forthcoming for a few weeks, just to make sure they knew I was not to be fucked around with). Of course I never even went anywhere near a solicitor's office, I just knew that they'd royally fucked up by acting on hearsay and decided to make a point. The whole time I was in the teacher training program, nobody ever brought up the subject of drugs with me again, so I must have made an impression (if they'd done a urinalysis, I'd have been a bit buggered, but this was the late 80's and drug testing in the UK wasn't even a glimmer in some twisted fucker's mind)
) who should never be let anywhere near a classroom full of kids. Next day they got a letter from me demanding to know what had been said & who had said it with a view to taking them to court for defamation of character and that I'd be seeing my solicitor later that day so they could expect notification of legal action sometime in the near future...Got a phone call the day after from the TT place that was almost grovelling in its apology for such a thing ever occuring (I still made noises about legal action unless the name of the person who had initiated all this shit was forthcoming for a few weeks, just to make sure they knew I was not to be fucked around with). Of course I never even went anywhere near a solicitor's office, I just knew that they'd royally fucked up by acting on hearsay and decided to make a point. The whole time I was in the teacher training program, nobody ever brought up the subject of drugs with me again, so I must have made an impression (if they'd done a urinalysis, I'd have been a bit buggered, but this was the late 80's and drug testing in the UK wasn't even a glimmer in some twisted fucker's mind
)
bluedolphin
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^^^
That's unfortunate. Almost certainly there was no need for hospitalization.
For long acting amphetamine-based psychedelics it is nice to have a benzo handy just in case. Certainly beats a trip to the hospital!
That's unfortunate. Almost certainly there was no need for hospitalization.
For long acting amphetamine-based psychedelics it is nice to have a benzo handy just in case. Certainly beats a trip to the hospital!
cegli
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I wouldn't worry too much, I'm sure he'll be fine. There's a report on erowid of two people accidentally taking 16mg of DOI thinking it was 2C-I, and they were perfectly fine. DOI is generally harsher on the body too.
Are you sure it was measured right? He must have been very sensitive! I wish him the best.
Are you sure it was measured right? He must have been very sensitive! I wish him the best.
Tryptamine*Dreamer
Ex-Bluelighter
4-OH said:My friend has been hospitalized after taking DOC. He took 3mg and was tripping for 24 hours + and it obviously didn't hold off. I'm now really worried
Do you know how he measured the dose? Most of us do not have a scale or balance capable of measuring such small amounts (I do, though).
If he used liquid measurement, there are a couple of ways the dose could have easily been miscalculated.
1. He could have had a larger amount than he thought. Some people have got as much as twice the amount paid for. If he paid for 100mg and was given 200mg, he would have taken double the intended dose unless he weighed it before dissolving.
2. Some people have tried measuring using drops of liquid, where one drop is supposed to be 1ml or something. In reality, the drop could be 2 or 3 times that. That is not a good way of measuring.
A mistake can easily be made unless the instrument can weigh very small amounts or a known amount is dissolved in liquid and measured very carefully.
It could be that he is unusually sensitive, or just had a difficult trip. I personally think DOC is one of the most physically benign psychedelics out there, but I have had some mentally difficult trips. My first DOC trip was really tough, and that was with a 4mg dose.
I would not worry too much about trying it myself, unless there was some trouble with your friend's vital sign (Blood pressure, heart rate, etc.) measurements at the hospital.
I've checked my blood pressure and heart rate while on a pretty good dose of DOC, and it was within its normal range. I don't think it typically causes much of an increase in BP or HR, unless you are feeling anxious or panicky.
I was the one who weighed it out. I weighed 17mg out on a mg scale, and put this in 17 mls of water. I dosed 3.5mg (3.5ml), and the him and someone else 3mg. It just looks like he was extremely sensitive to it, as that was the second time I did it, and the last time I did 2mg.
There was no real need for him to go the hospital, he was just worried and was tripping and thought that was the best idea.
There was no real need for him to go the hospital, he was just worried and was tripping and thought that was the best idea.
cegli
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Yep, some people are just really sensitive to things. My first 2C-E trip my friend and I took both took 14mg and he was fine, but I got my ass kicked. During the peak I could barely see and kept falling into random visions that I thought were real.
My friend just sat there happily with his headphones on, watching me, haha.
Glad he's okay!
My friend just sat there happily with his headphones on, watching me, haha.
Glad he's okay!
first time doing 2mg DOC the other day. very very good except some sort of something in my chest.i think it was my muscles or breast plate. something along those lines. dont think it was my heart. and another thing down by my pelvic region . around the area where that V is. some pressure or a knot or something is what it felt like. besides that it was good. peaked in 2-3 hrs which suprised me and then started to weaken very slowly for another 10-11 hrs. think i like it better than 2c-e so far though there is still a lot of experimenting to do.
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Jakeperson
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Getting two tabs that may contain DOC, due to the bitter taste and length of other's experiences.
Is there any huge dangers in combining with MDMA?
Or is it a definite no no?
Is there any huge dangers in combining with MDMA?
Or is it a definite no no?
bluedolphin
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DOC + MDMA is like LSD + MDMA ... but more focused, intense, and "in the moment"...
But it sounds like you're not even sure if you have DOC, let alone the dose. I'd test the waters gradually.. you can always boost a DOC trip by eating more a couple hours after eating a small amount. It's not like LSD where tolerance kicks in almost instantly.
But it sounds like you're not even sure if you have DOC, let alone the dose. I'd test the waters gradually.. you can always boost a DOC trip by eating more a couple hours after eating a small amount. It's not like LSD where tolerance kicks in almost instantly.
heartofalion
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bluedolphin said:
So if you need to chill out for w/e reasons xanax can help? I ask because i always keep a supply of benzos when i trip "just in case" and i had read somewhere that benzos cant stop the trip like it can with lsd if need be.
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