The amount of CO2 in the atmosphere just hit its highest level in 800,000 years

[Xorkoth]

I entirely agree. Man, so many people are like, fuck nuclear energy, maaaaaaan! It's RADIATION! So much could go wrong! My girlfriend and I had this debate in the car last weekend on a long road trip. She doesn't self-identify as a hippie but she was raised by hippie parents and as such she has a lot of those kinds of ideas left over. She was like, well, what about Chernobyl? Meltdowns could happen at any time. Ah, but that was human error... these days it's automated and so much safer... to my knowledge no meltdowns not caused by natural disasters have happened in a long time. Well, what about Fukushima? Yeah, that was stupid to build a nuclear power plant within tsunami distance from the ocean on one of the most tsunami-ridden and geologically active islands in the world. Shouldn't have done that. We should build them all clustered in places where any natural disaster is extremely unlikely, such as the Appalachians, the Midwest outside of big tornado range, Siberia, etc. Well, the nuclear waste will kill the planet. No, it won't... it's a small amount of radioactive material. Encase it in lead and bury it. The radiation will stay contained. Well, what if it leaks? Okay, well there is radioactive material already in the Earth, it's not as big a deal as it seems.

And in any case, think about how much damage burning coal IS doing, year after year after year. It's one of the most destructive things we're doing and it's the leading cause of many problems. Think if Chernobyl hadn't happened and we had invested our focus on nulcear power for the last 6 decades instead, and stopped burning coal. We could be in a much different spot right now. But instead fear and propaganda from the fossil fuels industry(ies) have people thinking that a handful of hypothetical possibilities for something to go wrong with a clean energy source outweigh the very real, inevitable and staggeringly negative consequences of burning coal/other fossil fuels.

It's crazy though, around my neck of the woods there's this town with a nuclear power plant, and also sinkholes. Many people are convinced the sinkholes and nuclear power plant are connected. I'm like, no, the sinkholes are from mining, how would a nuclear power plant cause sinkholes? But logic doesn't seem to matter, they're convinced nuclear power is evil and sinister.

 

[JessFR]

To anyone who brings up Fukushima, I just ask them to tell me how many people died of radiation exposure as a result of Fukushima.

People are just stupid and ignorant. They just are. Totally ignorant of science. The media are responsible for a lot of it. Decades of telling people nuclear reactors can explode like a nuclear bomb, which is total fiction.

Chernobyl was comicly poorly made even for its time. It has no relevance to anything except to show how ignorant someone is if they bring it up.

The ONLY legitimate concern with nuclear power is long term storage of waste. A manageable problem that is a hell of a lot better than climate change.

I just try not to argue with people over this shit cause most have no idea what they're talking about yet assume they know more than me. Though I know when it's your partner it's not really an option.

Funnily enough, I think it was actually determined that the Simpsons has had a measurable effect on the publics perception of nuclear power negatively. It's so frustrating. Cause I love TV and movies and such. And there are films I love that depict all sorts of shit wrong. I don't wanna hate on media just cause people are too fucking stupid to comprehend that it's fictional. Worse still, if or when we do get nuclear fusion working, those idiots will oppose it too because it has the word nuclear in it. Even though it's entirely different technology. Not helped by the fact that all Sci fi fiction depicts fusion by simply taking fission and changing the name. Fusions gonna need some serious rebranding to get it ready for the public. I propose calling it "solar energy 2.0"

 

[zephyr]

Carbon dioxide and the level of it is always going to fluctuate and climate change is totally real, the acceleration of the global warming since the industrial revolution is obviously because of us humans, there will be people who dont see it thay way and thats fine really.


We just need to plant trees, trees and more trees to sop up the CO2, other greenhouse gasses cant be got rid of though


Other forms of energy which are well known, unlimited and cause a tiny amount of waste are easily developed so Im going to just say theres no money in having a limitless uncontrollable source of power so no ones really keen on having them.

Nuclear power would be a lot better and cleaner, the waste is a problem since no one wants it in their own back yard.

I remember France wanting to pay Australia to store their nuclear waste when I was a kid. That wasnt very popular.

Global warming is happening anyway even without us adding to it, clearly though the natural cycle the earth goes through is different as our population is too large.

Population control with us is the same with other animals- exhaust food, water and other needs and the population just drops to a lower sustainable number.

We will just take everything else with us unfortunately.

 

[Xorkoth]

I remember France wanting to pay Australia to store their nuclear waste when I was a kid. That wasnt very popular.

Australia is a good example of a place to store it, there's a trackless desert with very little population and a low plant and animal density. Yeah, don't dump it in the ocean, for sure, or put it literally in someone's backyard.

I just try not to argue with people over this shit cause most have no idea what they're talking about yet assume they know more than me. Though I know when it's your partner it's not really an option.

Funnily enough, I think it was actually determined that the Simpsons has had a measurable effect on the publics perception of nuclear power negatively. It's so frustrating. Cause I love TV and movies and such. And there are films I love that depict all sorts of shit wrong. I don't wanna hate on media just cause people are too fucking stupid to comprehend that it's fictional. Worse still, if or when we do get nuclear fusion working, those idiots will oppose it too because it has the word nuclear in it. Even though it's entirely different technology. Not helped by the fact that all Sci fi fiction depicts fusion by simply taking fission and changing the name. Fusions gonna need some serious rebranding to get it ready for the public. I propose calling it "solar energy 2.0"

Well fortunately my girl is a level-headed and intelligent person so it wasn't really an argument at all, it ended with her thoughtful and saying it still seems like I'm downplaying it but I had good points she can't refute.

And yeah I immediately thought of The Simpsons when I thought about poor public perception. I love The Simpsons but it's a probably entirely unintended consequence of the show, for sure.

 

[zephyr]

Australia is a good example of a place to store it, there's a trackless desert with very little population and a low plant and animal density. Yeah, don't dump it in the ocean, for sure, or put it literally in someone's backyard.

We dont have nuclear power yet but if we do then we can keep our own waste in our own area, bugger the French mate we aint their bin!

 

[Xorkoth]

Well I think the US desert is a good place to store it too. I think if nuclear power is to be used across the world instead of coal, it will need to be organized internationally without a "yours and mine" sort of mentality, because some countries, such as Japan, have no safe places to put it.

 

[JessFR]

There are lots of places on earth that are geologically stable, and have never had significant human populations and likely never will. There are ways we can mark such places for future civilizations too. Overall the risks are very low. Especially when compared to the risks of just continuing to burn fossil fuels. Obviously an ideal solution would be to just shift immediately to clean limitless energy, but it doesn't exist. We have clean energy, but it's almost all of the type where the more energy you need the more physical space you have to use. It can be unmanageable.

The best choice we have would be to use a mix of technologies. Wind and solar (especially solar) where appropriate. And nuclear fission to make up the difference. Perhaps other technologies I'm not thinking of or don't know of too.

In reality, no doubt countries like Australia who have huge quantities of land perfect for disposing of waste will sell the use of that space to other countries. In fact I'm pretty sure that's already the practice with other problems with waste right now. You get money or something else you need, they get to dispose of the waste, and then they don't have to dispose of it in a much worse place. Everybody wins.