Benzos Switched from 30mg Diazepam/day to 6mg Clonazepam/day...

[Supeudol]

Okay, so anyway.. my current doctor (who is really good). Right now I am trying to stabilize on the OxyCodone CR 60's, two tabs twice a day. So total = 240mg of Oxycodone per day, and I am still getting opiate withdrawals, even with being on Lyrica 300mg BID as well too. Because I got so used to sniffing very high doses of Hydromorphone for 2.5 years of the 9 year part of my addiction.

Anyways, right now I am working on trying to get my life back. Been to different Rehabs, etc, that's not going work for me. Anyways, I also have a severe Benzo dependency. I know Diazepam is the best for tapering BZD's. But currently we are not working on tapering the Benzo's, just trying to stabilize first. So instead of getting 10mg Diazepam TID, I switched to 2mg Clonazepam TID.
From all the charts I've read, most of them state that 0.5-1mg = 10mg Diazepam roughly.. So, I switched from 30mg Diazepam per day, over to 6mg Clonazepam per day. Now, I shouldn't feel Benzo withdrawals right? Because 6mg of Clonazepam per day is a fairly decent to high dose.

I just wanted to know what some of you BLers think about Diazepam or Clonazepam. Now, keep in mind that I have tried and used pretty much every Benzodiazepine available in North America. I have a VERY high tolerance to both opiates, benzo's, and Lyrica. So I have a few problems on my hands that I have been trying to get my tolerance down.. Right now, my opiate tolerance down. I think my body just needs to get used to Oxycodone again, as opposed to crushing and snorting Hydromorphone all day.

So, don't take this post the wrong way, because I switched to Clonazepam because it has a longer lasting duration than Diazepam does, but not a longer half life. I know this from experiences, and research as well.

Anyway, should I have smoother days being on 6mg Clonazepam per day, as opposed to 30mg of Diazepam per day. Because my doc was not going to raise the Diazepam any higher than 30mg/day.
I've been on Clonazepam in the past and its worked quite well, I just hope it hasn't lost its "magic".

So, smart choice for now? Because I am not tapering the BZD's for awhile yet. Its the opiates I need to get down first.

Sorry for the long post, and the reason I posted this is in OD is because it involves more technical information, and more pharmaceuticals I am on.

Thank-you. Cheers!

 

[tricomb]

DAMN, 30mg diazepam to 6mg clonazepam? I have no idea how you guys got to 6mg/day, that's redankulously high and you're going to have the worst withdrawals in the world when it's time to wean off. Clonazepam is the methadone of benzodiazepines.

I myself would have stayed on the 30mg diazepam, possibly trying 40-60mg/day before considering a medication change, and I certainly wouldn't consider clonazepam but that's because my body metabolizes it into sugar haha, or menthol whatever, point being, to me clonazepam is nothing more than an expensive breath mint. I really like diazepam.

6mg seems like an obscene dose for your causes. For someone who was on 30mg of diazepam to go to 6mg clonazepam... well, that's just taking two huge steps back.

Thats one of the reason I hate clonazepam. It doesn't fucking work. Duration of action is definitely different from half-life. I've also tried pretty much every benzodiazepine in North America and even some imported ones..... And I think that diazepam is the best choice.

Once I was out of town and had forgotten my alprazolam (I was on alprazolam primarily back then) and I started severe withdrawals, like so severe that I had to leave and it really ruined the occasion, but that's not the point, the point is that I tried to use benzodiazepines interchangeably (I took 10mg clonazepam and another 10mg of lorazepam that day before I decided I had to go home, and neither of those benzos did a thing to make me feel ANY better), and they really are NOT drugs that you can expect a clean transition going from one to the other.

 

[Supeudol]

^^ Yeah, but my benzo history from before was insane.. like 12mg of Lorazepam + 36mg of Bromazepam + 30 - 60mg of Flurazepam per day while on Suboxone back in 2009... it was ridiculous..

BTW - how do you know your body metabolizes Clonazepam into sugar? Just wondering how you got that conclusion?

 

[xxxyyy]

BTW - how do you know your body metabolizes Clonazepam into sugar? Just wondering how you got that conclusion?

he was joking because like me he finds clonazepam to be a vastly overrated and rather useless all around. clorazepate would be an alternative i recommend, it has strong anxiolytic properties while being only very slightly sedating, has a fairly long mode of action and a very long have life. 15mg of clorazepate is the equivalent of 10mg diazepam, and in my experience that seems about right. i know the highest they come is 15mg in america (in germany it's 10mg, 20mg and 50mg), so that maybe something to think about. and i've known people who took a fuckload more benzos every day, and quitting is always a nightmare once you're physically dependent, like almost all gabaergics the withdrawal is pure hell. but there are a lot of benzos better suited to your situation, like oxazepam and chlordiazepoxide.
a friend of mine, has been trying, and failing to get off clonazepam for fucking ever. he got down to 0.125mg a day but never managed to completely quit it because he often took a shitload of it when he has a bad day. but i've heard other accounts that clonazepam is of the long acting benzos the hardest to quit. weird that they used it in detox to dose down my roommate who had a 50mg-100mg a day flunitrazepam habit.

 

[Supeudol]

he was joking because like me he finds clonazepam to be a vastly overrated and rather useless all around. clorazepate would be an alternative i recommend, it has strong anxiolytic properties while being only very slightly sedating, has a fairly long mode of action and a very long have life. 15mg of clorazepate is the equivalent of 10mg diazepam, and in my experience that seems about right. i know the highest they come is 15mg in america (in germany it's 10mg, 20mg and 50mg), so that maybe something to think about. and i've known people who took a fuckload more benzos every day, and quitting is always a nightmare once you're physically dependent, like almost all gabaergics the withdrawal is pure hell. but there are a lot of benzos better suited to your situation, like oxazepam and chlordiazepoxide.
a friend of mine, has been trying, and failing to get off clonazepam for fucking ever. he got down to 0.125mg a day but never managed to completely quit it because he often took a shitload of it when he has a bad day. but i've heard other accounts that clonazepam is of the long acting benzos the hardest to quit. weird that they used it in detox to dose down my roommate who had a 50mg-100mg a day flunitrazepam habit.

chlordiazepoxide is DEFINITELY not a good benzodiazepine, in fact, it is rather a dirty weak benzo, and I have tried to detox with it, and its absolutely horrible. Does not have strong anxiolytic properties at all. Oxazepam has a very LONG onset, probably the longest out of all the benzodiazepines, so oxazepam and chlordiazepoxide would be out of the question for now. I've just found Diazepam to have lost its anxiolytic effect on me. I agree, Clonazepam is vastly overrated especially on this forum.

But most addiction doctors here in Canada will ONLY use two benzodiazepines, and thats clonazepam, or diazepam. Those are basically my only two choices..If I was not benzo dependent, than I could be on a variety of different benzo's to choose from. But I would probably choose Bromazepam (Lectopam) as its anxiolytic effects work very good for me, and Bromazepam is very underrated on here.

 

[xxxyyy]

yeah chlordiazepoxide is a fucking disgrace of a benzo, probably the worst one i ever took. only anxiolytic in (single) dosages of 200mg+. i just mentioned it because it's one of the classic detox benzos. oxazepam i rather like but i agree that it has a very slow onset but is otherwise a rather decent benzo. here they come in 50mg pills and those are rather excellent. however if clorazepate is out of the question diazepam seems like an infinitely better option than clonazepam. even is you take a higher dosage, it's still one of the best benzos out there for a slow taper. me, i'd take clorazepate over any other benzo for this indication.

 

[Supeudol]

^ Yeah, Librium is only good in doses of 200mg+, I agree. Oxazepam isn't bad, its one of the easiest benzo's on the liver. Here they come in max dosage of 30mg pills. Anyways, thanks for your opinions.. I wish Flurazepam was an option for me, because of its super long half life, and strong hypnotic/anxiolytic effects. I would have to say that Flurazepam is near the the top of of my list of favourite Benzodiazepines. Flurazepam I would rate as #1 or #2 on my list of favourite benzo's, with Bromazepam being a close second.

I have to go back to my doctor next week anyways, so I'll see how I do on the Clonazepam, since I am not tapering the benzo's right now. Just focusing on getting off the Narcotics, which is going to be a slow process as well. Even though I've never touched the needle. I've smoked H, snorted H. But the H we get here locally is pretty much all garbage. I have tried from various different people here, and I don't think I have even gotten high off the H here. Maybe once, a long time ago when my tolerance was lower. But my heavy use of snorting Hydromorphone shot my tolerance right up, same with the occasional snorting of Fentanyl. But, my gosh is Hydromorphone withdrawal just awful - I find it far worse than Oxycodone withdrawal.

I don't snort my Oxycodone CR either, because the B/A of Oxycodone orally is quite a bit higher, and lasts longer as well. I think I have got a dependency to Lyrica as well, I don't even notice any effects when I take my Lyrica (Pregabalin) now anyway. And I am on 300mg BID. But one thing Lyrica does well, is potentiate benzo's and opiates if timed rightly. Lyrica also helps me sleep.

Ahh.. I dunno, I just want my life back. Too many years opiate/benzo abuse. I'll see if the Clonazepam helps me at this dosage at all, or if I notice any difference between Clonazepam and Diazepam. The thing is, my doctor will not go higher than 10mg TID of Diazepam (30mg/day). Yet he is okay with 2mg TID of Clonazepam. (6mg/day).

 

[AlphaMethylPhenyl]

That's a very high dose based on your diazepam dose by every conversion.

 

[MartinFn]

Hallo mates..i think you forget smth, so common and well-known for all of us who deal with drugs all the time..every drug is different for (almost) every person..i mean diazepam has recreational value for me, even at doses 70-80mg and over, (Supeudol my benzo tolernce is fucked up too..), when clonaz hasn't..BUT if i take a 2mg clonaz pill, except of the menthol taste tricomb says, it has an effect on me, not anything super, but, a litl relax etc., while when i take 50 mg of diaz has NOTHING at all (unfortunatelly..). The thing with the clonaz is that is the one of the 2 only benzos i don't have the tend to abuse (xanax is the other, and i find it so so so weird that it's maybe the most preferable benzo among the Bl people..anyway8)..). The benzo i abuse is flunitrazepam, and i start to slight feel the effects from 5mg (on empty stomach, otherwise..fuck it..). What i want to say, is that yeah, 6mg of clonaz is WAY more than 30mg diaz, but maybe it would be easier for you to get your tolerance lower, because clonaz it's not euphoric (even at high doses), while diaz can be, atleast for me. Another one example bromazepam...you like it, but i don't, at least under 60-72mg..(and of course, we're not kids to brage about high tolerance, as a matter of fact i'm rather ashamed of it, it shows how stupid i am). Oh, and smth else, that i might had said from the beginning. All of the benzo use i do, have NOTHING TO DO WITH ANXIETY AND OTHER USUALLY MEDICAL ISSUES THAT BEING TREATED WITH BENZOS, I ONLY TAKE THEM FOR RECREATIONAL PURPOSES. Sorry, i had to said that in the beginning. Anywawy Supeudol, i'm sure you'll made it..%)



MartinFn