Sub maintenance patient and combined intermittent use of high potency full agonists.. New complications have emerged..

[SuxOxone]

I'm sure this topic has been discussed and beat to hell but I'm desperate for other users to weigh in here because there isn't exactly a guide for how to go about doing this without suffering short of moving to Canada tonight and doing a monitored Bernese method Induction with a true "bridge" drug which is unfortunately illegal here in america and therefor not feasible as a solution.

For starters, I have been on subs consistently for about 2 years now. I've been maintained fine on the dose I'm at, fairly steady 8mg a day, but I often drop my dose to try to taper off myself bc I hate being on meds that don't get me high. I'm at least that honest with myself. The fact that the subs don't get me high just makes me wanna get more high If it doesn't fuck me up, I don't see the point in taking that pill or snorting that line. I want to want to be sober, but the reality is I'm human and sometimes I fuck up. I actively choose to relapse. I don't want to choose to do so but sometimes there's only that one thing that's gonna make what you're feeling stop and you know the feeling I'm referring to. Not glorifying, just saying. Yall know what I'm talking about....

This of course inevitably leads to relapses, especially given I posed high risk as it is with a consistent history of relapse and failed maintenance. It's not that I want to go back to that life every day, I just forget how bad it can be being on subs and I end up missing the high because after a while the subs just don't do it for me.

I would drop my sub dose to like 2mg over a few days, take none the day before I was gonna pickup, then id go cop, use for a couple days tops, and I'd switch back with no issue as soon as i got the sweats the morning after my last dose. I have done this MANY TIMES without issue.

Recently I moved and eventually got a new plug who's been giving me the infamous "purple dope" that is EXTREMELY potent. I also had this experience with some very strong "gunpowder" I got from someone else in the area. The last 2 times I've gone on short runs, has been with these 2 batches specifically, however my old plugs shit was straight fent and never caused the following side effects when returning to subs. Withdrawal comes on very quickly and intensely. By the 24 hour mark I'm basically crawling out of my skin; Quickly scoring a COWS score of ≈ 10 or greater, I wait roughly 12-24 hours or until withdrawal symptoms seem severe enough and when I tale my usual dose of 8 MG to transition back, I suddenly experienced withdrawals so severe I can only compare it to when I was on 125mg methadone daily and accidentally ingested 100mg of naltrexone oral tablets instead of 30mg mirtazipine as intended (long story). This happened with less severity the next time I went on a run and went back to the subs but I changed my induction and the run was much shorter because that experience made me horrified of PRECIPITATED WITHDRAWALS.

This time I waited until I was sweating and somehow freezing in an 85° bedroom and about to start spewing from both ends. I took 2mg. Felt a Little better after an hour so I took another 2mg. Sweats and cramps came back for a couple hours but nothing like my previous attempt to induct myself back on the subs and as i said, 1st dose of 2mg worked as well as can be expected but i was still not well. I managed to wait til later that day and take another 4mg, at which point I finally started to even out enough to get some much needed sleep with the assist of high doses of klonopin flexeril, and ambien ER.

I can take 100mg of oxy with hardly any noticeable effect. Tolerance is clearly an issue here but its gotta be deeper because Bupe has an insanely high binding affinity and has never failed me before no matter how hard of a run I went on, and I've been using for the last 10 years all.over the west coast but mainly Florida One key bump of the shit from the plug will have me on the floor for 3 hours. I'm assuming this new issue is due to the recent discovery of the lipophilloc effects of fentanyl and its many analogues and their street variations having vastly different elimination times, which has no doubt made timing your dose of sub a complete guessing game and completely takes away the benefit of easing you through withdrawal.

As early as 5 years ago people had to switch back to dope to get off sub/done and that was actually a common method discussed here for getting OFF bupe.

What the FUCK is going on? The only thing I can think of doing is somehow getting an emergency induction at a methadone clinic, but they never want to take patients without making them wait WAY too long given the mortality rate of illicit opioid use and I hate the weight gain I experienced with methadone. I'm currently trying to "wash out" any traces of the fent from my last run with am emergency stash of legit oxy but 40 mg is basically the equivalent a 0.5mg piece of sub for about 3 hours and while the oxy isn't getting me "high" by any means, I assume it will also require an abstinence period to avoid PW.

So where do I go from here? I'm HORRIFIED to even fall asleep at this point because I know how ill feel first thing in the morning and I know I'll instinctively be dying to take a sub but that early induction sure as shit has me hesitant to ever touch the bupe again... it's not even working for my cravings anymore even at 16 mg so maybe switching back to methadone is a must?

I don't wanna be a lifer.... I just don't wanna feel like this anymore and don't know what to do..

 

[somnilicious]

I'm sure this topic has been discussed and beat to hell but I'm desperate for other users to weigh in here because there isn't exactly a guide for how to go about doing this without suffering short of moving to Canada tonight and doing a monitored Bernese method Induction with a true "bridge" drug which is unfortunately illegal here in america and therefor not feasible as a solution.

For starters, I have been on subs consistently for about 2 years now. I've been maintained fine on the dose I'm at, fairly steady 8mg a day, but I often drop my dose to try to taper off myself bc I hate being on meds that don't get me high. I'm at least that honest with myself. The fact that the subs don't get me high just makes me wanna get more high If it doesn't fuck me up, I don't see the point in taking that pill or snorting that line. I want to want to be sober, but the reality is I'm human and sometimes I fuck up. I actively choose to relapse. I don't want to choose to do so but sometimes there's only that one thing that's gonna make what you're feeling stop and you know the feeling I'm referring to. Not glorifying, just saying. Yall know what I'm talking about....

This of course inevitably leads to relapses, especially given I posed high risk as it is with a consistent history of relapse and failed maintenance. It's not that I want to go back to that life every day, I just forget how bad it can be being on subs and I end up missing the high because after a while the subs just don't do it for me.

I would drop my sub dose to like 2mg over a few days, take none the day before I was gonna pickup, then id go cop, use for a couple days tops, and I'd switch back with no issue as soon as i got the sweats the morning after my last dose. I have done this MANY TIMES without issue.

Recently I moved and eventually got a new plug who's been giving me the infamous "purple dope" that is EXTREMELY potent. I also had this experience with some very strong "gunpowder" I got from someone else in the area. The last 2 times I've gone on short runs, has been with these 2 batches specifically, however my old plugs shit was straight fent and never caused the following side effects when returning to subs. Withdrawal comes on very quickly and intensely. By the 24 hour mark I'm basically crawling out of my skin; Quickly scoring a COWS score of ≈ 10 or greater, I wait roughly 12-24 hours or until withdrawal symptoms seem severe enough and when I tale my usual dose of 8 MG to transition back, I suddenly experienced withdrawals so severe I can only compare it to when I was on 125mg methadone daily and accidentally ingested 100mg of naltrexone oral tablets instead of 30mg mirtazipine as intended (long story). This happened with less severity the next time I went on a run and went back to the subs but I changed my induction and the run was much shorter because that experience made me horrified of PRECIPITATED WITHDRAWALS.

This time I waited until I was sweating and somehow freezing in an 85° bedroom and about to start spewing from both ends. I took 2mg. Felt a Little better after an hour so I took another 2mg. Sweats and cramps came back for a couple hours but nothing like my previous attempt to induct myself back on the subs and as i said, 1st dose of 2mg worked as well as can be expected but i was still not well. I managed to wait til later that day and take another 4mg, at which point I finally started to even out enough to get some much needed sleep with the assist of high doses of klonopin flexeril, and ambien ER.

I can take 100mg of oxy with hardly any noticeable effect. Tolerance is clearly an issue here but its gotta be deeper because Bupe has an insanely high binding affinity and has never failed me before no matter how hard of a run I went on, and I've been using for the last 10 years all.over the west coast but mainly Florida One key bump of the shit from the plug will have me on the floor for 3 hours. I'm assuming this new issue is due to the recent discovery of the lipophilloc effects of fentanyl and its many analogues and their street variations having vastly different elimination times, which has no doubt made timing your dose of sub a complete guessing game and completely takes away the benefit of easing you through withdrawal.

As early as 5 years ago people had to switch back to dope to get off sub/done and that was actually a common method discussed here for getting OFF bupe.

What the FUCK is going on? The only thing I can think of doing is somehow getting an emergency induction at a methadone clinic, but they never want to take patients without making them wait WAY too long given the mortality rate of illicit opioid use and I hate the weight gain I experienced with methadone. I'm currently trying to "wash out" any traces of the fent from my last run with am emergency stash of legit oxy but 40 mg is basically the equivalent a 0.5mg piece of sub for about 3 hours and while the oxy isn't getting me "high" by any means, I assume it will also require an abstinence period to avoid PW.

So where do I go from here? I'm HORRIFIED to even fall asleep at this point because I know how ill feel first thing in the morning and I know I'll instinctively be dying to take a sub but that early induction sure as shit has me hesitant to ever touch the bupe again... it's not even working for my cravings anymore even at 16 mg so maybe switching back to methadone is a must?

I don't wanna be a lifer.... I just don't wanna feel like this anymore and don't know what to do..

Don't have much to add but holy shit would PWD's hurt like hell from 125mgs methadone to 100mg naltrexone. Did something similar on a huge oxycontin habit but it was only 50mgs naltrexone. What makes it worse is that the precipitated withdrawal last for a day or more with naltrexone. Having precipitated wd for 2 days sucks.

My guess is that the purple stuff has a longer half life. A lot of the fents won't allow people to dose Suboxone till day 3 and 4.

 

[SuxOxone]

Don't have much to add but holy shit would PWD's hurt like hell from 125mgs methadone to 100mg naltrexone. Did something similar on a huge oxycontin habit but it was only 50mgs naltrexone. What makes it worse is that the precipitated withdrawal last for a day or more with naltrexone. Having precipitated wd for 2 days sucks.

My guess is that the purple stuff has a longer half life. A lot of the fents won't allow people to dose Suboxone till day 3 and 4

Yeah it was the exact opposite of what you would call a good time... I was basically fed Valium by my girlfriend and barely conscious for the next 4-5 days. I pretty much just remember the first morning after it happened when I was trying to direct my girl to the clinic I kept passing out, mind you, probably due to severe exhaustion and dehydration after that ordeal and still being in heavy withdrawal and coming straight from the ER.

I shit you not the ER gave zero fucks whether I'd died or not. They just wanted me gone. The only times I've heard similar descriptions of what I experienced the first 8-12 hrs are from NDEs.

As for the current state of affairs, I've been abstinent from that batch of street fent for nearly 72 hours now, however the only way I've been able to do so is with 50-100mg doses of real oxy every 12-24 hrs. My last dose of oxy was at 8:30 AM today; 70mg.

Currently on Zofran and about to take immodium because my stomachs in knots.

Currently: Feeling anxious as fuck, legs hurt like hell to the bones, muscles, joints up to the hip.
Lower back feels like I did 90 years of plumbing with no days off.
Woke up soaked in sweat. Within minutes, of waking sweats stopped. However all other systems seem to be at their worst when im tired and subside as I wake up
The idea of eating a meal makes me sick. Certain sounds immediately drive me FURIOUS. I'm extremely sensitive to smell.
I haven't checked pupil dilation however I imagine they're definitely like golf balls at this point.
MY CRAVINGS ARE HIGH however manageable if i just breathe and focus on my breath and lean on benzos and cannabis so im attributing this to anxiety about the upcoming induction.


This is likely when I'd typically take a trip to a detox center and check myself in for a few days at the detox and be promptly given a sub dose, basically completely avoiding the sick. I feel like I'm "not sick enough" to take a sub yet but the longer I wait the closer I get to the point I know I'll be so nauseas the taste of those nasty orange peel hockey puck subs is gonna Make me start vomiting before they can even dissolve halfway.

I Am thinking i should go as long as i can and get as close to 24 hrs since last oxy as possible before I try to dose sub and I'm also thinking I start with like 1, maybe 2mg sublingual and see if it helps before taking another small dose followed by another til I hit 12-16 mg, ideally to stabilize my bupe plasma levels back to what my body is used to and stop withdrawal, I just hope I don't have to suffer for 12 more hours to get back on my subs.

Hopefully I make it long enough to provide updates. Lol

 

[EvidenceOfTheResurrection]

I'm sure this topic has been discussed and beat to hell but I'm desperate for other users to weigh in here because there isn't exactly a guide for how to go about doing this without suffering short of moving to Canada tonight and doing a monitored Bernese method Induction with a true "bridge" drug which is unfortunately illegal here in america and therefor not feasible as a solution.

For starters, I have been on subs consistently for about 2 years now. I've been maintained fine on the dose I'm at, fairly steady 8mg a day, but I often drop my dose to try to taper off myself bc I hate being on meds that don't get me high. I'm at least that honest with myself. The fact that the subs don't get me high just makes me wanna get more high If it doesn't fuck me up, I don't see the point in taking that pill or snorting that line. I want to want to be sober, but the reality is I'm human and sometimes I fuck up. I actively choose to relapse. I don't want to choose to do so but sometimes there's only that one thing that's gonna make what you're feeling stop and you know the feeling I'm referring to. Not glorifying, just saying. Yall know what I'm talking about....

This of course inevitably leads to relapses, especially given I posed high risk as it is with a consistent history of relapse and failed maintenance. It's not that I want to go back to that life every day, I just forget how bad it can be being on subs and I end up missing the high because after a while the subs just don't do it for me.

I would drop my sub dose to like 2mg over a few days, take none the day before I was gonna pickup, then id go cop, use for a couple days tops, and I'd switch back with no issue as soon as i got the sweats the morning after my last dose. I have done this MANY TIMES without issue.

Recently I moved and eventually got a new plug who's been giving me the infamous "purple dope" that is EXTREMELY potent. I also had this experience with some very strong "gunpowder" I got from someone else in the area. The last 2 times I've gone on short runs, has been with these 2 batches specifically, however my old plugs shit was straight fent and never caused the following side effects when returning to subs. Withdrawal comes on very quickly and intensely. By the 24 hour mark I'm basically crawling out of my skin; Quickly scoring a COWS score of ≈ 10 or greater, I wait roughly 12-24 hours or until withdrawal symptoms seem severe enough and when I tale my usual dose of 8 MG to transition back, I suddenly experienced withdrawals so severe I can only compare it to when I was on 125mg methadone daily and accidentally ingested 100mg of naltrexone oral tablets instead of 30mg mirtazipine as intended (long story). This happened with less severity the next time I went on a run and went back to the subs but I changed my induction and the run was much shorter because that experience made me horrified of PRECIPITATED WITHDRAWALS.

This time I waited until I was sweating and somehow freezing in an 85° bedroom and about to start spewing from both ends. I took 2mg. Felt a Little better after an hour so I took another 2mg. Sweats and cramps came back for a couple hours but nothing like my previous attempt to induct myself back on the subs and as i said, 1st dose of 2mg worked as well as can be expected but i was still not well. I managed to wait til later that day and take another 4mg, at which point I finally started to even out enough to get some much needed sleep with the assist of high doses of klonopin flexeril, and ambien ER.

I can take 100mg of oxy with hardly any noticeable effect. Tolerance is clearly an issue here but its gotta be deeper because Bupe has an insanely high binding affinity and has never failed me before no matter how hard of a run I went on, and I've been using for the last 10 years all.over the west coast but mainly Florida One key bump of the shit from the plug will have me on the floor for 3 hours. I'm assuming this new issue is due to the recent discovery of the lipophilloc effects of fentanyl and its many analogues and their street variations having vastly different elimination times, which has no doubt made timing your dose of sub a complete guessing game and completely takes away the benefit of easing you through withdrawal.

As early as 5 years ago people had to switch back to dope to get off sub/done and that was actually a common method discussed here for getting OFF bupe.

What the FUCK is going on? The only thing I can think of doing is somehow getting an emergency induction at a methadone clinic, but they never want to take patients without making them wait WAY too long given the mortality rate of illicit opioid use and I hate the weight gain I experienced with methadone. I'm currently trying to "wash out" any traces of the fent from my last run with am emergency stash of legit oxy but 40 mg is basically the equivalent a 0.5mg piece of sub for about 3 hours and while the oxy isn't getting me "high" by any means, I assume it will also require an abstinence period to avoid PW.

So where do I go from here? I'm HORRIFIED to even fall asleep at this point because I know how ill feel first thing in the morning and I know I'll instinctively be dying to take a sub but that early induction sure as shit has me hesitant to ever touch the bupe again... it's not even working for my cravings anymore even at 16 mg so maybe switching back to methadone is a must?

I don't wanna be a lifer.... I just don't wanna feel like this anymore and don't know what to do..

I tried looking at other bernese threads and a paper about it. What drug(s) available in canada but not usa? I think bernese involved opioid agonist and bupe/sub

 

[SuxOxone]

I tried looking at other bernese threads and a paper about it. What drug(s) available in canada but not usa? I think bernese involved opioid agonist and bupe/sub

In Canada, a doctor who specializes in detoxing with the bernese method can actually prescribe short acting full agonists like morphine and dilaudid alongside subutex specifically because of harm reduction. They have the freedom to create a custom taper schedule according to each person's needs.

In america, unless you're already on oxy at a pain clinic for example, where they may just taper you down on oxy or hydrocodone; if a doctor were to prescribe a patient any opioid medication whatsoever for the purpose of treating Opioid Use Disorder they would lose their license with the exception of Buperenorphine/Methadone based meds, both of which are HEAVILY regulated in the states as it is. That means most addicts are stuck having to try to do the bernese method at home, with tablets of subutex, typically the 8mgs, which are super easy to take too much of and induce PW along illicit street dope, also way too easy to take too much of; instead of in a proper hospital setting with precise dosages and safe medications.

So let's say you've been relapsing on a super potent and long acting, lipophilloc fentanyl analogue that metabolites at a rate similar to methadone. Have fun trying to make it to the 72 hr mark (minimum) before you can take anything remotely containing bupe without getting violently sick(er) than you already are from bupe induced precipitated withdrawal. And it usually takes days at a minimum to get on methadone which is even more heavily regulated and typically not covered by insurance anyway. This leaves you with very limited options.

Essentially the bernese method is not an approved treatment method in the states, however I found it extremely effective for my specific situation. I would take increasing doses of bupe and decreasing doses of oxy over a 7 day period woth a starting dose of .5mg bupe/80mg oxy on the forst day til the final day in which i didnt have to take any oxy at all.. I've now successfully ceased using any full agonist opioids and am maintaining in an average of 8 mg subutex daily, while before I was doing about a gram a day of a very pure, potent mix of fentanyl analogues and found it impossible to go more than 12 hrs without using and being a zombie.

I intend to switch to the depot shot (Sublocade) in about a week.

 

[somnilicious]

Yeah it was the exact opposite of what you would call a good time... I was basically fed Valium by my girlfriend and barely conscious for the next 4-5 days. I pretty much just remember the first morning after it happened when I was trying to direct my girl to the clinic I kept passing out, mind you, probably due to severe exhaustion and dehydration after that ordeal and still being in heavy withdrawal and coming straight from the ER.

I shit you not the ER gave zero fucks whether I'd died or not. They just wanted me gone. The only times I've heard similar descriptions of what I experienced the first 8-12 hrs are from NDEs.

As for the current state of affairs, I've been abstinent from that batch of street fent for nearly 72 hours now, however the only way I've been able to do so is with 50-100mg doses of real oxy every 12-24 hrs. My last dose of oxy was at 8:30 AM today; 70mg.

Currently on Zofran and about to take immodium because my stomachs in knots.

Currently: Feeling anxious as fuck, legs hurt like hell to the bones, muscles, joints up to the hip.
Lower back feels like I did 90 years of plumbing with no days off.
Woke up soaked in sweat. Within minutes, of waking sweats stopped. However all other systems seem to be at their worst when im tired and subside as I wake up
The idea of eating a meal makes me sick. Certain sounds immediately drive me FURIOUS. I'm extremely sensitive to smell.
I haven't checked pupil dilation however I imagine they're definitely like golf balls at this point.
MY CRAVINGS ARE HIGH however manageable if i just breathe and focus on my breath and lean on benzos and cannabis so im attributing this to anxiety about the upcoming induction.


This is likely when I'd typically take a trip to a detox center and check myself in for a few days at the detox and be promptly given a sub dose, basically completely avoiding the sick. I feel like I'm "not sick enough" to take a sub yet but the longer I wait the closer I get to the point I know I'll be so nauseas the taste of those nasty orange peel hockey puck subs is gonna Make me start vomiting before they can even dissolve halfway.

I Am thinking i should go as long as i can and get as close to 24 hrs since last oxy as possible before I try to dose sub and I'm also thinking I start with like 1, maybe 2mg sublingual and see if it helps before taking another small dose followed by another til I hit 12-16 mg, ideally to stabilize my bupe plasma levels back to what my body is used to and stop withdrawal, I just hope I don't have to suffer for 12 more hours to get back on my subs.

Hopefully I make it long enough to provide updates. Lol

Yeah.... When I naltrexoned myself I was very young and I became delirious as well with vague memories. The doctor that gave me the naltrexone didn't describe it at all and I was looking for a magic bullet so I popped the pill. It didn't take long till I had my dad cornered aggressively, begging him for $20, which is what I was buying oxy 80's for at the time. My car had broke down when I drove it through a Hurricaine to cop so I biked it across town and then got in a screaming match with my dealer when he told me the price was going to raise $5.

I went home defeated and lay in bed in this delirious state, half in reality, half out. Then my mom came in and slapped me cause I wasn't wanting to get up to go to an NA meeting. I got in the car with pops and ride to this fucking NA meeting but I'm so fever dreamed that I think we're going to my grandmother's house. We arrive and my dad goes and gets a guy in the meeting, who took one look at me and said they couldn't let me in like that.....lol

I went home and barely remember the rest but that was my first real full withdrawal and I'll never forget that moment the naltrexone hit. Still gives me shivers.

I had 2mths clean from opioids from walking off 90mgs + extra street bottles of methadone but unfortunately I've had 20mgs oxy one day and small amounts of poppy seed tea the last 3-4 days but I already decided last night was it. Gonna have to pay the little piper.

 

[smokeymcpot42088]

I have heard of a couple people succeeding this way. Sub taper to about .25 mg a day----stabalize dose. Acquire benzos if possible, lyrica if possible, lots of good kratom, benadryl, immodium. When you feel ready go to every other day or just jump off. Wait three days. You will be at almost max sickness, Start taking kratom liberally along with benadryl and immodium. Apply benzos at night for respit if not sleep. (don't continue over 3 weeks). After about a week on kratom try dropping it and going to lyrica benzos benadryl and immodium. Drop the lyrica and benzos asap. This is the only way I have seen work personally out of alot of ppl who tried. Someone else is touting a similar method right now as well.

 

[SuxOxone]

I have heard of a couple people succeeding this way. Sub taper to about .25 mg a day----stabalize dose. Acquire benzos if possible, lyrica if possible, lots of good kratom, benadryl, immodium. When you feel ready go to every other day or just jump off. Wait three days. You will be at almost max sickness, Start taking kratom liberally along with benadryl and immodium. Apply benzos at night for respit if not sleep. (don't continue over 3 weeks). After about a week on kratom try dropping it and going to lyrica benzos benadryl and immodium. Drop the lyrica and benzos asap. This is the only way I have seen work personally out of alot of ppl who tried. Someone else is touting a similar method right now as well.

Are you talking about getting off suboxone/subutex?

this thread is in reference to a method (Bernese) known to be much more comfortable for people sensitive to suboxone induction who typically get thrown into precipitated withdrawal even when they're already scoring well above 10 on the COWS scale due to the variations in streat fentanyl as long as 72 hrs after theirnlast dose of whats suposed to be and behaves like a short acting full agonist synthetic opioid but causes difficulty inducing buprenorphine for, whether for Maintenance after relapse or generally transition over to that med for detox at the standard 2mg-8mg starting doses for a long time after thr last dose similar to methadone.. this is suspected to be due to the lipophilloc nature of these potent fent analogues constantly being made in random labs around the world for recreational markets.

However the bernese method is not legal in america as of yet. So I did something a lot like what I'd do to get off methadone mixed with the bernese methods basic priciples and it worked very well.

I took my last dose of the fentanyl dope I'd been on for 2 weeks instead of Bupe, waited til withdrawal started and did a 5 day oxy taper down to about 60 mg per day while slowly microdosing Bupe in increasing amounts about to 1MG, at which point I completely transitioned from oxy to bupe at steady 12 mg daily after I waited about 20 hrs since my last dose of oxy..

I already take benzos daily bevause PTSD so they aren't super effective with helping severe withdrawals like they used to be and this was the ibky easy I could get back on my subs without being violently sick the first few days on them post relapse.

 

[smokeymcpot42088]

Yes I am, my apology. I am US based so the bernese method is something to figure out at home as best as possible.

IME switching from sub to fet dope and back to sub (and this was a decade ago) was easier than something with a long halflife; like methadone before switching to sub. (remember it was a big issue for ppl switching from done' to sub) ahh and you addressed that. Sorry my comprehensive reading is not so good.

60 mg of oxy is still a fairly significant habit but ppl certainly C/T it all the time. (not me unless ive been grabbed up, still serious suffering). If I were you proceeding : if afford/available taper the oxy down to about 10 mg a day. Than maybe try switching to kratom for a week and kicking. Any other available comfort meds help. Add nyquil to the list as well. The kratom will just annoy you enough you WANT to get rid of it.

 

[SuxOxone]

Yes I am, my apology. I am US based so the bernese method is something to figure out at home as best as possible.

Oh well in that case you're sorta correct. Some people can just stop taking it. Like when I get pff subs I usually drop to 2mg per day over a few weeks then change to 1 or 2 mg every other day, then 1mg, then nothing. I used to just jeep going back and using the dirty bupe piss to get refills to sell bc we got em from a free program under trump lol..

Im am also US based which is why my bernese method was done rather haphazardly as i wasnt aure what dosages of which conbonations would be appropriate, i used a similar method od used to get off methadone; getting readdicted to a short acting opiate and discontinuing methadone. Then switch to standard sub taper.

IME switching from sub to fet dope and back to sub (and this was a decade ago) was easier than something with a long halflife; like methadone before switching to sub. (remember it was a big issue for ppl switching from done' to sub) ahh and you addressed that. Sorry my comprehensive reading is not so good.

You're good lol, again you're correct. Back in the day we were getting lab synthesized illicit fent from Chinese labs amd they were almost all exclusively short acting analogues based on femtanyl or were actual fentanyl, wither way it produced all the same metabolites and had similar Highs to them.

But then all of us decided the best shit ever was to have the hard hit of the fent along with the legs of H, and so longer acting, lipophillic combinations which store themselves in deep soft tissue like bone marrow as well as fat and spinal fluid for long periods of time allowed for these longer acting, super potent fentanyl analogues to become much more popular among current markets, at least here in Florida that's the case. I've read medical journals indicating were not alone here either.

It makes it extremely hard to get back into the subs, unlike it once was, and that precipitate s withdrawal is a real bitch to go through when you coulda gotten high instead...

60 mg of oxy is still a fairly significant habit but ppl certainly C/T it all the time. (not me unless ive been grabbed up, still serious suffering). If I were you proceeding : if afford/available taper the oxy down to about 10 mg a day. Than maybe try switching to kratom for a week and kicking. Any other available comfort meds help. Add nyquil to the list as well. The kratom will just annoy you enough you WANT to get rid of it.

I'm already back on my subutex and have an entire month's supply of 8mg tablets. I'm going to follow the same method I used last time and use its long half life and metabolites strong binding affinity that last up to 48 hrs when its built up over a couple weeks of stable dosages without illicit drug use in between like before on the receptors to my advantage to hopefully completely DC all opioids again however if I find the cravings and mental side effects too burdensome I'll simply swoth to the Buprenorphine monthly Depot shot which basically does the same thing as a liquid micro taper would of you had years to taper.im personally not that patient tho.

 

[smokeymcpot42088]

Oh man you pwned me in the first paragraph ive been payin out the ass for subs (like foreal breaks my budget every month) under trump and stuck actually taking them in fear of said fentoin concoction. Truth is the high from "heroin" became not euphoric but the addiction was still very real and the risk of death ever more present.

PWD scares me more than a bullet and switching back and forth is dancing with the devil for sure. Fuckin cartels, heroin isn't profitable enough?? Well I have called boycotte. (and im sure they are crying because they dont get my 100 a week lol)


eh still in the middle of a ten plus year benzo taper....starting on suboxone as I can't afford to continue paying 3 a month to talk to the guy than pill costs. Dope would be cheaper, but dying is not advantageous lol.