Speeding Ticket Appeal Advice - Tried to avoid self incrimination

sonic

sonic

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I am appealing a ticket (probably months from now), and I would appreciate any advice. I basically didn't answer ANY of the officers questions. This pissed him off, but I'm hoping that can help me in court. I knew I wasn't going to be able to talk my way out of it with this prick, so I just decided to exercise my rights and not incriminate myself at all.

Here's what I'm thinking about saying in court:

I was driving home around 7pm after working overtime to help pay for my
mortgage. Near (Town Name) I went around a sharp corner, and saw a police
officer driving in the opposite direction. I looked at my speed-o-meter
and I was going 40mph. The officer put his lights on and turned around. I
was surprised to see that the officer pulled behind me when I pulled over
to let him go by.

When he approached my vehicle I asked him, "Good evening officer, why'd
you pull me over?" The officer ignored my question and asked for my
license and registration. He then asked me if I knew what the speed limit
in the area was, I did not answer his question and he seemed to take
offense to the fact that I didn't want to incriminate myself since I was
honestly unaware of what the speed limit was. He also asked me how fast I
was going and I did not answer his question. I told him that "I do not
have anything to say". He replied with a rude comment such as "Gee, you
just don't know much of anything tonight do you?" I informed him that I
was just trying to exercise my rights and he replied, "well I'm going to
go exercise my rights now too".

I believe this officer had no respect for my constitutional rights and
gave me a ticket out of spite due to the fact that I didn't answer his
questions.

I know that I was going 40mph (the posted speed limit) when I first saw
the officer, and before that I was negotiating a sharp corner so I do not
believe I ever exceeded 40mph.

** Off the record, I have a radar detector and it went off well in advance, so by the time we intersected I was well under the speed limit. He claims he clocked me at 54mph, but I believe that is just a lie.

Also.. I was out of state, and I think the cop jumped at a chance to give an out of state resident a ticket. I don't think it's worth mentioning that in court though.

So do you think I stand a chance or what?
 
When U say that U R "appealing" the ticket, what exactly do U mean by that?

Generally, an appeal follows a conviction or finding of guilt.
 
PottedMeat said:
When U say that U R "appealing" the ticket, what exactly do U mean by that?

Generally, an appeal follows a conviction or finding of guilt.
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On the ticket:

"CHECKBOX 2. I REQUEST A COURT HEARING. I deny that I am responsible for the infraction(s) charged on this citation, and I request a cvil hearing before a court magistrate"..... etc
 
In about half the cases the cop wont even show up and you get out of it
 
There R numerous sites devoted to fighting speeding tickets. It is extremely difficult to completely outline the process of fighting a ticket. Nevertheless, here R a few suggestions:

1. U need to offer proof that your speedometer is accurate. U can go to most dealerships and they will be able to test your vehicle and provide U with a certified statement as to the accuracy. These records R generally admissible as an "offer of proof".

2. U can challenge the accuracy of the speed detection device used by the officer. Most radar guns must be properly maintained and calibrated on a regular basis.

3. Request information that may establish that the cop has a history of writing false citations. U can find out how many cases the officer has had challenged and the basis for the challenges.

4. On occasion, the officer may not even bother to appear in court to try a speeding ticket case. U can make a motion to dismiss the matter but, be warned, it is possible that the officer or the DA can re-file the matter in a higher court if the judge does not dismiss the matter with prejudice.
 
^^^ Good advice. Also, I don't know were you are, but here there are MANY companies out there that will be your agent in court that are experts in winning speeding tickets. You look like you have a good chance at winning... you were coming around a corner (and since you had the radar warning I'm sure even if he "clocked" you at 54 it was only for a few seconds.. maybe the radar gun couldn't accurately gauge your speed coming around a corner).
 
CreativeRandom said:
Just challenge that there is no evidence of you speeding.
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Well, he did claim to get me on radar at 54. So that's why I'm incorporating the whole constitutional rights part into my defense. I will surely challenge the main issue that I wasn't speeding, I'm just going to elaborate a little more about the whole incident. Does that sound reasonable?
 
PottedMeat said:
In case U R interested, here is some helpful information regarding your rights and tickets. www.nolo.com

Highlight "Rights & Disputes" and click "traffic tickets".

Fight the power!
Click to expand...


That site is useful I guess, but you can never be fully prepared for a traffic stop. You just have to know your rights and know when to exercise them I guess.
 
i'd take the whole "excersing my rights" bit out of your arguement. people in authoritative positions don't like you to have rights, nevermind to use them. also it is a bit irrelevant to whether or not you were speeing, since he clocked you at 54. dont take offense, but your arguement makes you sound like a punk kid trying to rebel against authority, with all the talk off knowing and excersing my rights, and the thing about the officer writing the ticket in spite of you. it justs seems a bit lame
 
If your sure about never speeding, challenge the equipment and if it was calibrated. Happens all the time, cases just get thrown out. He has to prove it was callibrated at the time of the case and all that crap.
 
s0nic said:
He then asked me if I knew what the speed limit
in the area was, I did not answer his question and he seemed to take
offense to the fact that I didn't want to incriminate myself since I was
honestly unaware of what the speed limit was. He also asked me how fast I
was going and I did not answer his question. I told him that "I do not
have anything to say". He replied with a rude comment such as "Gee, you
just don't know much of anything tonight do you?" I informed him that I
was just trying to exercise my rights and he replied, "well I'm going to
go exercise my rights now too".
Click to expand...

AHAHAHAHAH. What an absolutely silly response. You should have said 'forty, isn't it?' Or perhaps fifty, if you were looking for an out. This 'stand on my rights' bullshit absolutely guaranteed that you would get a ticket.

I believe this officer had no respect for my constitutional rights and
gave me a ticket out of spite due to the fact that I didn't answer his
questions.
Click to expand...

Police actually aren't the business of randomly accusing people of speeding. Since it was clearly what he pulled you over for, it's very likely that he clocked you at a higher speed before you noticed him. 'Constitutional rights', my ass. :D

Off the record, I have a radar detector and it went off well in advance, so by the time we intersected I was well under the speed limit. He claims he clocked me at 54mph, but I believe that is just a lie.
Click to expand...

Radar guns can have a long range. You could have been hit by a laser gun. It's also possible that the gun was elsewhere (on the ground somewhere, a speed trap.) Radar detectors don't always work perfectly either.

So do you think I stand a chance or what?
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I think you're screwed unless he just doesn't show up on the court date. There are no constitutional issues at hand; the only question is if he actually clocked you at that speed, and convincingly arguing that he didn't would be difficult. Since you admit that you HAD been going faster, the logical explanation is that he got you clocked before your slowed down. Maybe he tacked on a few extra MPH for good measure because you decided to go weird and defensive on him. :D
 
^^^ Those R some valid points. Presented in a somewhat negative tone, but nevertheless valid.

I will take exception with your assertion that "police actually aren't [in] the business of randomly accusing people of speeding." I personally was written a speeding citation on which the officer lied about the speed I was travelling. I was on cruise control at 65mph in a 55mph posted zone. I apparently usurped the officers authority by having the nerve to pass him as opposed to the countless other lemmings that formed a single file line behind the liar. Like most persons in a position of authority, cops can and do abuse their power on ocassion. Additionally a cop will stop someone under the false pretext of a moving violation to investigate other possible illegal activities of drivers. It does happen and I know for a fact that it does. Obviously, not all cops lie about a matter.

Lastly, I believe a lazer speed detection device requires that the unit be stationary at the time of the measurement.
 
I personally was written a speeding citation on which the officer lied about the speed I was travelling. I was on cruise control at 65mph in a 55mph posted zone.
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They can ticket you for ONE MPH over in most places. Your assumption that you would simply be granted a 10 MPH buffer strikes me as foolish; I would expect to be pulled over every single time for a full 10 over.

How much did he hit you for? Most speedometers aren't perfectly accurate, and cruise control can vary up and down a little; if it said 65 and he said 67, I wouldn't be too quick to call bullshit on it. Of course, maybe he was just so impressed that you would have the nerve to openly speed in front of a cop car that he did bump it up a bit. I do agree that police are often dishonest.
 
Thanks for all the insults. I USED to appreciate you and your site, now I've kinda lost respect for you. Didn't you read that I honestly didn't know what the speed limit was? Why do you have to act like such an elitist punk? I didn't know that you were a cop lover. I judged this cop's character immediately, and I pretty much knew I was getting a ticket. I decided to try something different. Maybe it won't work, oh well.

EDIT:
Maybe he tacked on a few extra MPH for good measure because you decided to go weird and defensive on him. :D
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Yeah, that's really something to smile about. Here I am busting my balls trying to pay for my house and all my bills by working overtime. I have to drive over 400 miles every week, and some pig making $75,000 a year wants to take away my hard earned money over some stupid civil infraction. I consider myself to be a very safe driver. I just speed a little on roads I know to get home a little quicker. I'm sure you've done it too.

Thanks for the support *sarcasm*.

TheDEA.org said:
AHAHAHAHAH. What an absolutely silly response. You should have said 'forty, isn't it?' Or perhaps fifty, if you were looking for an out. This 'stand on my rights' bullshit absolutely guaranteed that you would get a ticket.



Police actually aren't the business of randomly accusing people of speeding. Since it was clearly what he pulled you over for, it's very likely that he clocked you at a higher speed before you noticed him. 'Constitutional rights', my ass. :D



Radar guns can have a long range. You could have been hit by a laser gun. It's also possible that the gun was elsewhere (on the ground somewhere, a speed trap.) Radar detectors don't always work perfectly either.



I think you're screwed unless he just doesn't show up on the court date. There are no constitutional issues at hand; the only question is if he actually clocked you at that speed, and convincingly arguing that he didn't would be difficult. Since you admit that you HAD been going faster, the logical explanation is that he got you clocked before your slowed down. Maybe he tacked on a few extra MPH for good measure because you decided to go weird and defensive on him. :D
Click to expand...
 
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Thanks for all the insults. I USED to appreciate you and your site, now I've kinda lost respect for you.
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Your reaction to the situation was weird and illogical, guaranteed to cause problems rather than avoid them. If you're looking to be patronized by somebody that thinks getting caught speeding means you've been wronged, I'm not your man. You WERE speeding. YOU made a hash of the police interaction.

Didn't you read that I honestly didn't know what the speed limit was?
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Then that should have been your pitch to the cop.

Yeah, that's really something to smile about.
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When somebody tries to invoke their constitutional right against self-incrimination over being asked if they knew what the speed limit was...that's absolutely hilarious! I didn't just smile; I laughed out loud. And I bet I wasn't the only one.

and some pig making $75,000 a year wants to take away my hard earned money over some stupid civil infraction.
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Yes, it sucks. But you knew what the game was, and decided to play anyway. If the occasional ticket isn't worth the saved time, then don't speed. (Very few police make that much money, for what it's worth.)

I consider myself to be a very safe driver. I just speed a little on roads I know to get home a little quicker. I'm sure you've done it too.
Click to expand...

You bet I have! And I've gotten caught. I agree that the fines are often savage, primarily intended to raise revenue so they don't have to raise property taxes on those nice big houses the politicians live in. But we knew that before we hit the gas.
 
and some pig making $75,000 a year
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Haha, man! If that was true, I'd have dropped out of high school years ago and entered police academy. Try 20,000!

I always drive the speed limit, unless heavy commuter traffic. I love heavy traffic. Not congestion, but like the kind you get in the morning when all the dumbshit drivers are not on the road, only hardcore 3 hour commuters who know how to drive. The only reason I like it is because I get to speed. I love speeding, but rarely ever do it. Some rare occasions I'll "get it out of my system" and fly down a backroad I'm sure a cop isn't on.
 
Just a few points:

  • The moment your radar detector went off, the officer had your speed. Radar detectors are basically useless in such a situation as you were in.
  • Telling the cop that you wanted to excercise your rights was probably a bad idea. He obviously took offense to this, and may have chosen to lie about what speed he actually clocked you at.
  • If the officer is lying, and his equipment is valid, there is nothing you can do to prove him wrong.

A lot of times, if you are honest with an officer, they will be more likely to cut you a break. You can always take a case to court, but in my experience that never works out well.

I have about 400K miles worth of driving experience, and have been pulled over about 25 times for speeding. Out of those stops, I have been able to avoid tickets all but 3 times, just by being polite and honest with the officer.
 
TheDEA.org said:
They can ticket you for ONE MPH over in most places. Your assumption that you would simply be granted a 10 MPH buffer strikes me as foolish; I would expect to be pulled over every single time for a full 10 over.

How much did he hit you for? Most speedometers aren't perfectly accurate, and cruise control can vary up and down a little; if it said 65 and he said 67, I wouldn't be too quick to call bullshit on it. Of course, maybe he was just so impressed that you would have the nerve to openly speed in front of a cop car that he did bump it up a bit. I do agree that police are often dishonest.
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U R correct. I made a mistake about the 65 in a 55. I was traveling 65 in a 65.

He cited me for 75 in a 65. I had my speedo. tested and it read 65 when I was actually going 64.
 
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