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  • AADD Moderators: swilow | Vagabond696

So i'm visiting an Indian Call Centre

please - how aren't these people in foreign countries taking australian jobs?

Look at Telstra - one of the biggest employers in Australia. They have shut down most of their Aussie call centres, costing thousands of jobs and the livelyhood of many Australians. They have moved these call centres off shore to people that are not australian, who do not have families here to support who do not have aussie mortgages to pay and you are telling me that they aren't taking aussie jobs? Most of them you can't even understand, and let's be frank - who doesn't work, live or know someone that is sick of receiving calls from indians with thick accents that you can't even understand?

If other companies follow this outsourcing trend then I would be very surprised if within the next 10 years there are even any call centres in Australia. Given that call centres provide hundreds of thousands of jobs to Australians you can't tell me that Australia won't suffer in the long run.

Prove me wrong, please, because this is one thing that I would love to be wrong about.
 
Okay, electreauxbella. Listen careful like, cause its muy complicado. The companies who are moving their call centres overseas are the ones taking Australian jobs. Don't hack out on a bunch of Indian grad students who jump on this bandwagon because they get paid 10x the average wage. I'd like to see you resist a similar offer. The companies are the ones that are PAYING to move these jobs overseas to facilities where they can pay shitloads less, its an investment for them. So if you have a problem with the inevitable loss of Australian jobs due to outsourcing, then you should blame the ones responsible for the decisions to move, i.e managment teams in all the fucking companies who think its a great idea to exploit the globalised economy and its population to the max.

-plaz out-
 
Im not disagreeing with you that it is also the fault of Australian companies, but the plain fact is that these people are accepting jobs knowing very well that they are taking work from Australians.
 
Woah, woah... hold up there cowgirl. There's a big fat chunk of assumption in there. You're assuming that they all know the jobs came from Australia. Do you enquire, when you go for a job here, as to whether they're outsourcing from another country, and make your decision based on that? Secondly, if they were offering 10x the average wage, would you give a damn?

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for universal worker solidarity against the exploitation pushed by the global capitalist class. But realistically, these workers shouldn't be held responsible for the decisions of a management thats not being called to account here for this sort of activity.

-plaz out-
 
electreauxbella said:
Im not disagreeing with you that it is also the fault of Australian companies, but the plain fact is that these people are accepting jobs knowing very well that they are taking work from Australians.
Click to expand...

electreauxbella, everytime you accept a position in this country, you're taking a job away from another australian.

think about that.
 
hmmm... calls are coming from Australia... no Australian call centres...

I don't think these people in India (or anywhere else in the world) are too stupid to work that equasion out :\
 
Opportunity cost!

You having a job takes away the opportunity for another person to have that job.

It's the same concept.
 
electreauxbella : Its spelled equation actually. And you'd be surprised at the number of stupid people who won't think about their jobs and what they do. I still fail to see how its possible to blame the individual workers for something that's the fault of management. They need jobs as much as we need them, probably more, so of course they're going to snap up any job they're offered. Personally, if I had a family to support, you think I'm going to give two seconds thought to the poor underprivileged downtrodden Australian who could have had the job had it remained in Australia? I don't think so.

*edit: I'm willing to change it for you preacha* ;)

-plaz out-
 
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^^ the correct spelling is 'underprivileged'
don't be a spelling nazi if you won't hold yourself to the same ideals
 
^ what the? :\

but - to the topic, i mean seriously, i think if everyone just reversed the situation, would you honestly be able to state that if you are:

a)living in a 3rd world country (economically speaking) where your chances of getting offered a job that actually is able to support you is extremely slim
b)Get offered a job that is able to support you

That you are going to then make some ethical stand, on the behalf of a country you are not a citizen of, and refuse the job?

I call bullshit.

It is no-one's fault except the parent companies - there is NOTHING unethical about taking a job that is going to be still offered whether you accept it or not - it's the underlying principle of the capitalist world (like it or not, we live in one) - fend for yourself.

I really do not honestly think anyone would be able to confidently say that they would not take a job in the aforementioned circumstances.

Besides, as anna! and others (preacha and plaz?) have mentioned it's opportunity equation in action...why do you begrudge someone from another country having a job? They are still people, in fact, they're people who probably need those jobs a lot more, and inevitably, if it's the economy you're worried about, it can only help that by reducing the labour cost.
 
Bravo Bravo!

Thanks - Mary P, Plaz, Preacha!!!

Anyway, off to Bangalore next week - the heart of the call centre. Will get the inside gossip on the low down of the call centre debacle.

BTW - I'm in India atm - to do some work for India's large company... Who made a net profit of ~14 Billion Rupees (458 Million AU) last year.

Considering the size and profitability of this organisation, you may be surprised that they are considering outsourcing their own facilities to a call centre. Why? The same reasons the rest of the world is doing so – Profit.

All the Indian bashers here have to realise that this world is driven by money. Without it – you are basically screwed. Accept it. Most senior executives have a results driven salary. The more they achieve the more money they receive. The easiest way to cut costs is to find someone who will do it cheaper.

I don’t think, and rightly so, people in India give a fuck that they are stealing your jobs. I bet you don’t complain when you buy a piece of clothing from India and get it at a fraction of the price. I bet you would complain if the government said ‘no more imports’ we’ll make all our own goods and suddenly the prices rose a few hundred percent.

India, like most other developing countries are simply offering a service. We have to understand that they are not threatening or forcing us to sign with them. Why do you buy certain products when others are available? Think about it. We could choose to have use Australian resources – yet we choose not to. Someone has done the calculations and said ‘No, it is better (for whatever reason) to go with the overseas provider.’

....


RaVPup - What the fuck dude? haahha
 
preacha said:
electreauxbella, everytime you accept a position in this country, you're taking a job away from another australian.

think about that.
Click to expand...


but at least an australian is getting the job rather than handing them all out to third world countries.
 
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Keystroke, what the hell do you have against 3rd world countries man? Your comments, hopefully do not reflect what type of person you are...

You sound like a little kid who's complaining because he's suddenly been asked to share his toys.

BTW - In Telstra, Optus, Primus - most of the call centres are filled with students - alot of them overseas students who through visa restrictions can only work 20 hours a week (perfect for a call centre). So when you say at least an AUSTRALIAN has a job - you are once again - wrong.

Most people I know loathe to work in a call centre. It's on the very bottom of the list alongside fast food outlets. We actually have a shortage of people to fill positions.

Australians in general DO NOT like service orientated roles... and actually do a shit job at them.

F
 
but at least an australian is getting the job rather than handing them all out to third world countries.

an episode of Southpark sums it up nicely, called "Goobacks"

Yeah, why the hell do those brown people deserve jobs anyway? You're too much man, you really are.

Don't any of you naysayers know any basic economics, and the fallacy of the 'stolen' job? These people aren't STEALING jobs, they are filling a demand in the market because australians have by in large more jobs than before. More jobs, in fact that demand in some business sectors for employment outstrips demand. Checked seek lately? That fucking place is cholked with ads falling over eachother trying to recruit people into callcentres.
If in a growing economy nobody offshored anything, you would get problems with skill shortages and economic bottlenecks that put the breaks on everything and start interest rate rises etc.

But hey, sure is easier to find a bunch of other folks overseas to blame for everything...
 
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I am saying I'd rather the jobs goto Australian citizens in Australia, the unemployment rate here is ridiculous.

when you goto the supermarket and see "australian made" or "australian grown" do you purchase that or do you look around for the cheapest product regardless of the poor quality?

the same applies to employing someone that cannot fully comprehend the english language to the ability that's more than often needed for a call centre job.
 
Originally posted by keystroke
but at least an australian is getting the job rather than handing them all out to third world countries.


i honestly don't understand that logic. i'm happy to help the australian economy, and i'm happy for australians to get jobs, but why are we more deserving than people in other countries? that just makes no fucking sense.

and if we're talking about unemployment levels...well, i suspect australia isn't really doing too badly in comparison to the rest of the world.
 
the unemployment rate here is ridiculous?

Australia's unemployment rate is absolutely fantastic atm (both compared to other comparable countries and compared to what we have suffered through in the past) the best new is, it is steadily declining!


Here is proof courtesy of ABS - Australia's unemployment rate is 5.0%! (Up to date as of August 05)

This is slightly better/on par than/with most comparable 1st world western countries

Article stating Uk's unemployment is 4.7% (september 15,2005)

Link to World Factbook - America's Unemployment is at 5.5% (2004 est.)

This is a GOOD RATE OF UNEMPLOYMENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Now let's compare it to India

OMG! 9.2% - practically DOUBLE australia's unemployment!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

But - I suppose that is irrelevant because we only want Australians to be employed, correct?

It is a well-known fact (at least I thought it was) that - regardless of anyone's personal criticism of the Howard government, it has actually put Australia's unemployment in a pretty good position...it wasn't that long ago when we were enduring a recession (that's when unemployment was similar to what india's is now!!!!!!!). Whether or not this has come at the cost of effective social policy is irrelevant to this topic and would be appropriate for refugee/politics thread.


And now - for my final trick, as Thoth so wonderfully suggested, here is a link to a search page on seek.com, for full-time call centre/cust. service jobs, in any location in australia.

OMG!!!!! 3119 JOBS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! There appears to be a veritable glut of call centre jobs!

Ok. that is all. my blood pressure has risen significantly writing this post, so i am off to bed.

edit: no! wait! i spoke too soon - i forgot to add in that for all those persons deeply concerned with the australian economy, do you not all realise that employment is not the only factor? by reducing labour costs, this does indeed still help the economy...as it is AUSTRALIAN companies making the profit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
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