⭐️ Social ⭐️ Sick Of Heroin/Opioid stigma & misinformation

[lolis my thesis]

Man I must be lucky; also careful not to misuse my script, sometimes its tempting but would only leave me short. Because I get methadone and vicodin scripted every month; I do have 5 surgeries and 600 pages of medical records and have spent 60k on lyrica alone; in such desperate need for relief from pain. My pain doc thinks medicating my pain; is more conservative than me going under the knife. Over and over again.

If your doctor/pain clinic won't give you a full agonist pain killer for your killer pain; maybe find a different pain clinic, or perhaps one could go to a methadone clinic for addiction; but also receive the fringe benefits of extra energy and depression lift? Is that possible? I always worry that the plug is going to be pulled on my methadone any time.
I strongly feel opiates make me function better on the whole; I don't feel high from methadone, but I certainly feel pain relief and mood elevation from 30-40mgs/day.
Maybe it's possible to work within the system as it exists, if you are willing to go to a methadone clinic daily. Does anyone know if that is a viable option, for those who feel they need opiates but doc won't script them for pain?
Good luck to you and me too!

 

[lolis my thesis]

I would be interested in how to make bupe a full agonist; but not so much as to risk death from a heart issue. However as I just asked, would a methadone clinic offer you methadone if you are already dependent and at risk of going to street drugs to cope otherwise?

 

[DeathIndustrial88]

Yes man.You can make bupre full agonist with very strong action.Just need some blocker of P-glycoproteine eflux....than norbuprenorphine start to penetrate blood brain barriere and u know this metabolite is powerful full mu agonist,which is substrate of this proteine.Inhibiting this proteine means,that substance became active,despite of route of administration...just because this this P glycoproteine pump exist not only in small intestinal,but in liver also.....never tried this combo,despite than u can find it here online relatively easily....just because this practise could be dangerous because of unpredictable heart problems.The same medicine could be effective with loperamide-makin' him very easily penetrate bloodbrain barriere and acting like strong&long acting mu agonist.It's not proper to say the name of this med,'cause somebody with little brain can easily die.I am sure that u can find enough info in the web....but u can just replace bupe with methadone.....or some other pharma opioid

Ah,
I was asking if there were any natural peripherally acting opioid antagonists out there.
Like a nature's movantix. Something to keep bupe working in my CNS but not in my intestines. |
I've tried bupe with pgp inhibitors but have never noticed much. I did see something the other day that people who dealt with OIC on bupe were found to have more norbuprenorphine in their system than those that didn't. But I still feel like norbuprenorphine gets either pumped back out, blocked by the parent drug or never really reaches the brain to begin with. At least not in my experience.
One the best way I've read to deal with OIC is rotating opioids, but of course they don't allow that option for people on maintenance.

Man I must be lucky; also careful not to misuse my script, sometimes its tempting but would only leave me short. Because I get methadone and vicodin scripted every month; I do have 5 surgeries and 600 pages of medical records and have spent 60k on lyrica alone; in such desperate need for relief from pain. My pain doc thinks medicating my pain; is more conservative than me going under the knife. Over and over again.

If your doctor/pain clinic won't give you a full agonist pain killer for your killer pain; maybe find a different pain clinic, or perhaps one could go to a methadone clinic for addiction; but also receive the fringe benefits of extra energy and depression lift? Is that possible? I always worry that the plug is going to be pulled on my methadone any time.
I strongly feel opiates make me function better on the whole; I don't feel high from methadone, but I certainly feel pain relief and mood elevation from 30-40mgs/day.
Maybe it's possible to work within the system as it exists, if you are willing to go to a methadone clinic daily. Does anyone know if that is a viable option, for those who feel they need opiates but doc won't script them for pain?
Good luck to you and me too!

Yeah, unfortunately I now have suboxone/addiction on my record for the past 5 years.
So getting any kind of opioid is probably going to be next to impossible unless procured illicitly.
I've wanted to get on methadone, but there's no way I could go to a clinic every single day for it.
It would cost a lot in gas to go there daily + I struggle with energy/anxiety issues. So some days I don't even leave my bedroom, let alone get up and go out & drive.

I haven't had any surgeries or anything external that would validate to a doctor anything either unfortunately.
A lot of my pain seems like fibromyalgia or some other disorder. Which is harder to quantify than if I had had surgeries or something. So when I tell most doctors I'm in pain, they just kinda give me the whole "uhuh, yeah sure you are, well work on quitting smoking & blah blah blah".
Only thing I've been given was gabapentin & that was by my own suboxone doctor. It helped in the beginning but it's even less consistent than opioids are.
I just keep praying that one day I'll run into a heroin dealer again who really likes me, like I did years ago when I had hookups. I was lucky in my 20's. Had a mom prescribed opioids & a heroin dealer who was constantly popping over & giving me free uncut shit just cause he was my friend. Until he went to prison for murder & then my mom got sick & died. Which all abruptly happened within about 2 years, after I had been used to having opioids at that point for like 12 years. Now i'm stuck with shitty buprenorphine.

 

[DeathIndustrial88]

I would be interested in how to make bupe a full agonist; but not so much as to risk death from a heart issue. However as I just asked, would a methadone clinic offer you methadone if you are already dependent and at risk of going to street drugs to cope otherwise?

I think Nas47 is confused. I've never read any literature that buprenorphine's metabolite is toxic to the heart. It is a full agonist, but it's thought to not have much activity in the CNS due to it having to compete with buprenorphines pharmacology. Unless they read some literature that I haven't.


Loperamide is cardiotoxic though when allowed into the CNS.

And yes, a person could go to a methadone clinic, but they'd have to be willing to go every single day & all that fun stuff. Where as with Suboxone, you can get a 30 day scipt on the same day of that visit, which is much more convenient, but bupe is inferior compared to methadone I'm sure.

 

[lecroute]

My new therapist last week flat out told me I should just accept living in pain the rest of my life. Pushing that mindfullness crap (a whole other topic I don't wanna get into here).

First of all, reading your rant helped me feel a little better. I'm in bad mood right now because of some s... that happened earlier, and hearing/reading other people vent off usually kind of helps me get some of my own bad vibes out, too.

I never used opioid or heroin, and thankfully I don't suffer from chronic pain. But at some point in my life I knew a lot of of people who did. Some on and off, some like you for more than a decade. None of them were the "typical" junkie society likes to show in the media. Some I even knew a long time before learning they were using heroin without suspecting anything. Among those people were MDs (oh, yeah!), a genius-like engineer and a mother of two emotionally stable, well-raised and polite teens.

But what I like most was your reference to the way therapists swear that mindfulness as THEY see it is a solution for everything and everyone. I do mindfulness, in my own way. But no amount of mindfulness will help me in certain situations, and being pushed to do it while at the same time struggling with the other issues makes things only worse.

Sometimes a pill is the better solution. For me it is, and if on some days I need my benzos to function, so what? Not taking them would mean to call in sick or being unable to do even the easiest thing. That's not a solution at all.

 

[Rainman1964]

Thanks! @Rainman1964
Just woke up a bit ago & am already in pain for the day.
Specifically pain all through out my muscles (shoulders, neck, back, arms, the whole works).
Suppose to be seeing a new psychiatrist soon. If they start out with "i'm not prescribing your klonopin or gabapentin anymore", then I will be immediately turning around and walking back out.

Like Jimmy Hendrix once said, "I'm the one that's got to die when it's time when it's time for me to die, so let me live my life the way I want to."

V

 

[Rainman1964]

In the paperwork I filled out for the psychiatrist...
There was a section asking if I had any religion or cultural ideology that might affect the kind of care you receive.
I put "yeah, I think the drug war is wrong & ruins more lives than the drugs themselves". Not sure why a person can't just have their own moral compass & not have to express it through a "religion". I was heated that day.
So I wonder if they'll even still wanna make an appt with me. lol

Every time I go to a doctor -- primary care, dentist, whatever -- and I have to fill out any fucking forms at a doctor's office that I have been a patient at for a long time, or even first time visits depending on my mood, I answer the questions sort of like this:

Do you drink alcohol? Yes. How often in a month? Every chance I am awake & breathing How much do you drink in a month? Not enough.
Have you done or currently ingest illicit drugs? It depends on what you consider "illicit" is
If your answer is "yes, " please list the name of the drug, the duration you ingested drug & the last time you ingested drug.
I can't remember all of them (there are too many and not enough room on the front or back of the form), I can't remember the duration because I was either high or passed out somewhere. When I stop ingesting any of the drugs, I will be able to tell you, but for now, I'm still smoking, snorting, drinking, or licking it -- or "ingesting it" at a constant and committed pace.

I think you get the picture....

I have so much fun filling out the forms and writing in absolute outrageous responses that anyone who took time to actually read them would fall over -- laugh -- yet, after almost 20 years of cracking myself up, no one has EVER said anything to me.

Pretty telling, if you asked me.

V

 

[Zopiclone bandit]

Best way I've ever seen it summed up is by Henning Schmidt-Semisch: "the drug deaths are taken as an argument for more prohibition, whose victims they are in the first place".

WOW

 

[Zopiclone bandit]

Everyone hates an opioid addict till they themselves get into a car accident shattering their spine.

Like everything in life ppl only understand when it's happening directly to them.

This!!!!

 

[Nas47]

Every time I go to a doctor -- primary care, dentist, whatever -- and I have to fill out any fucking forms at a doctor's office that I have been a patient at for a long time, or even first time visits depending on my mood, I answer the questions sort of like this:

Do you drink alcohol? Yes. How often in a month? Every chance I am awake & breathing How much do you drink in a month? Not enough.
Have you done or currently ingest illicit drugs? It depends on what you consider "illicit" is
If your answer is "yes, " please list the name of the drug, the duration you ingested drug & the last time you ingested drug.
I can't remember all of them (there are too many and not enough room on the front or back of the form), I can't remember the duration because I was either high or passed out somewhere. When I stop ingesting any of the drugs, I will be able to tell you, but for now, I'm still smoking, snorting, drinking, or licking it -- or "ingesting it" at a constant and committed pace.

I think you get the picture....

I have so much fun filling out the forms and writing in absolute outrageous responses that anyone who took time to actually read them would fall over -- laugh -- yet, after almost 20 years of cracking myself up, no one has EVER said anything to me.

Pretty telling, if you asked me.

V

Fuck!Never any doctor,dentist or whatever ask me something like this.....yes it happens once,when i cured hep. C,but that's normal.....more than 90percent of old addicts from H days got it.

 

[DeathIndustrial88]

I got to see my best friend this past weekend. It was amazing. I haven't' seen her in over a year.
We hung out everyday for like 4 years & they were some of the best years of my life honestly. We were rolling in weed, heroin, meth, pills, everything. all the time.

I prayed & prayed to the morphine lords recently & managed to come across some tramadol.
Wow, I haven't had any tramadol in well over 2 years. When I use to have it every month for 10 years.
I actually got up and exercised this week. Felt incredible. No fibro-pain. Just the bliss of feeling like a normal functioning human being.
I always thought buprenorphine would kick tramadol's ass, but honestly, even for being so potent, it sucks for pain even compared to something weak like tramadol. At least for me. Of course I have to take about 300mg-400mg for tramadol to really work & I can definitely feel it wear off 8 hours later.
I'm assuming tramadol helps more (even though it's weaker) because it's metabolite is an active full agonist. Where as buprenorphine's metabolite is not active in the brain as far as I'm concerned. Plus tramadol has that stimulating-edge, which I like. I hate feeling lethargic & tired all day like I do on bupe,
It was an amazing week though. Would have preferred some diacetylmorphine, but I'll take what I can get.
Thank you morphine gods.
This feels like a dramatic journal entry or something. lol I welcome every one to use this post though to vent & get out your anger about the drug war. Feel free to speak up & tell your truth!

I hope everyone here who is struggling, in pain or just wanting to feel better here has a good weekend, at least to their ability. All the best!

 

[DeathIndustrial88]

Every time I go to a doctor -- primary care, dentist, whatever -- and I have to fill out any fucking forms at a doctor's office that I have been a patient at for a long time, or even first time visits depending on my mood, I answer the questions sort of like this:

Do you drink alcohol? Yes. How often in a month? Every chance I am awake & breathing How much do you drink in a month? Not enough.
Have you done or currently ingest illicit drugs? It depends on what you consider "illicit" is
If your answer is "yes, " please list the name of the drug, the duration you ingested drug & the last time you ingested drug.
I can't remember all of them (there are too many and not enough room on the front or back of the form), I can't remember the duration because I was either high or passed out somewhere. When I stop ingesting any of the drugs, I will be able to tell you, but for now, I'm still smoking, snorting, drinking, or licking it -- or "ingesting it" at a constant and committed pace.

I think you get the picture....

I have so much fun filling out the forms and writing in absolute outrageous responses that anyone who took time to actually read them would fall over -- laugh -- yet, after almost 20 years of cracking myself up, no one has EVER said anything to me.

Pretty telling, if you asked me.

V

I've seen some new doctors recently & was completely open with them about my pro-drug stance & I've actually come across some who totally agreed with me. One doctor wants me to get on medical cannabis ( hell yeah, I wish I could lol ).

I'm hoping the tides are turning. Some of the doctors do completely get where I'm coming from & they'd probably give me whatever I needed to have quality of life if they could, but our arbitrary laws stand in the way of that. Which is ridiculous, since me & my doctor should be able to do what's best for me without the state interfering because I might catch some dangerous "feelings of well-being" or something.

I had one doctor tell me I should move to Switzerland to get on their heroin maintenance. Of course she was just joking, but I felt she was implying that she knows this war against drugs (opioids especially) is bullshit & that people CAN live productive & functional lives using something like heroin, which has so much stigma behind it now a days.

Of course there's some that are all about complete abstinence & won't trust you, but I won't work with doctors like that at all.

 

[Pissed_and_messed]

I got to see my best friend this past weekend. It was amazing. I haven't' seen her in over a year.
We hung out everyday for like 4 years & they were some of the best years of my life honestly. We were rolling in weed, heroin, meth, pills, everything. all the time.

I prayed & prayed to the morphine lords recently & managed to come across some tramadol.
Wow, I haven't had any tramadol in well over 2 years. When I use to have it every month for 10 years.
I actually got up and exercised this week. Felt incredible. No fibro-pain. Just the bliss of feeling like a normal functioning human being.
I always thought buprenorphine would kick tramadol's ass, but honestly, even for being so potent, it sucks for pain even compared to something weak like tramadol. At least for me. Of course I have to take about 300mg-400mg for tramadol to really work & I can definitely feel it wear off 8 hours later.
I'm assuming tramadol helps more (even though it's weaker) because it's metabolite is an active full agonist. Where as buprenorphine's metabolite is not active in the brain as far as I'm concerned. Plus tramadol has that stimulating-edge, which I like. I hate feeling lethargic & tired all day like I do on bupe,
It was an amazing week though. Would have preferred some diacetylmorphine, but I'll take what I can get.
Thank you morphine gods.
This feels like a dramatic journal entry or something. lol I welcome every one to use this post though to vent & get out your anger about the drug war. Feel free to speak up & tell your truth!

I hope everyone here who is struggling, in pain or just wanting to feel better here has a good weekend, at least to their ability. All the best!

In recreaational, infrequent use Bupre is just holiday from emotional pain with the cost of extremely level, murdering boredom.

 

[DeathIndustrial88]

In recreaational, infrequent use Bupre is just holiday from emotional pain with the cost of extremely level, murdering boredom.

Bupe is insanely boring.
I miss how other opioids could make me feel fine doing nothing for hours & hours. I could listen to the same song over & over again & just be hypnotized by it. Feeling creative and inspired.
Or even doing hard things like exercising or taking super long walks. I would actually enjoy doing it, which is not something I do in my sober state.
Music was wonderful again this week. Running & lifting weights felt great. Although I didn't really feel "high", it was the ability to live again that felt so great. The ability to sit and do nothing & be content with it. It's peaceful.

I was much more toned up & muscular when I was using heroin, tramadol & other full agonists. Mostly because I loved being able to work out & not have to feel the pain of it, but still get the health benefits of it. lol Ever since I had to quit, I've stopped working out or doing hardcore cleaning altogether.

Now it's back to the same old, sore muscles & that ungodly bupe boredom & emotional flattening. Yuck.
I use to like bupe back in 2017 when I first really started using it. But it's deceiving. It can feel okay without a tolerance, but once you're use to it, it's just a chain around your foot dragging you down. It doesn't give me that "get up & go & enjoy it" factor that other opioids do. I'm not against maintenance or using opioids long term at all, I just wish people had options to choose from. I'd go with methadone if I could but there's no way I'm gonna get up and go to a clinic every single day. That's just ridiculous.

Anyway, I'm thankful for the week I had & getting a taste of how life use to be before it all went to hell. People should have the right to be able to feel this way. To be able to get active, to get creative, to function how they feel is best, to feel at peace with their surroundings & with their existence.

 

[Nas47]

Well normal man.u wanna feel effects of true opioid.Bupre is for somebody,who doesn't search effects.Different people,different bodies...i would not preffer somethin' other 'cause don't wanna get high on opies,uppers or anythin' else......just be able to work&feel peaceful....even smokin' weed is rare....enough to feel normal.....that is bliss.....to have some rest....to be me...may be suboxon is something different.idk.never tried.

 

[DeathIndustrial88]

Well normal man.u wanna feel effects of true opioid.Bupre is for somebody,who doesn't search effects.Different people,different bodies...i would not preffer somethin' other 'cause don't wanna get high on opies,uppers or anythin' else......just be able to work&feel peaceful....even smokin' weed is rare....enough to feel normal.....that is bliss.....to have some rest....to be me...may be suboxon is something different.idk.never tried.

Opioids make me feel normal, definitely. I just want better quality of life.
Bupe is like taking a heavy opiate, minus any of the good effects. So imagine feeling tired, heavy, constipated, but bored, flat and unmotivated at the same time.

Once in awhile bupe can be a little stimulating but it usually fades off into a tired blah feeling after a few hours.

 

[Nas47]

Well....don't take it.Why to feel like shit?Personally me ain't got feelin' nothin.....but this are patches without naloxone in it....if i get methadone feel high for example....or pod.trams-nothing...even feel bad....totally different reactions have people from certain drugs....lyrica-nothin'....tell u,that small amounts whiskey from time to time give me perfect feelin'.....good vodka also....gettin' old for drugs obviously

 

[DeathIndustrial88]

Well....don't take it.Why to feel like shit?Personally me ain't got feelin' nothin.....but this are patches without naloxone in it....if i get methadone feel high for example....or pod.trams-nothing...even feel bad....totally different reactions have people from certain drugs....lyrica-nothin'....tell u,that small amounts whiskey from time to time give me perfect feelin'.....good vodka also....gettin' old for drugs obviously

I've been on it for 5 years. So not taking it would mean a long, hideous withdrawal.
Subs may not make me feel the best, but I'd feel even worse without some kind of opioid.
When I have an opioid in my system, the desire to drink or chug DXM cough syrup, etc.. is lessened. Which is good for me, cause alcohol & other drugs have got me in much more trouble than opioids ever have. I'd probably be dead if I was still drinking vodka & cough syrup on the regular like I use to.
So I guess I can give bupe a little credit for helping with that, as I'm less inclined to use drugs in a self destructive manner when my opioid receptors aren't screaming at me.

 

[Hexenstahl]

I have reconsidered my stance on addiction after watching this.

 

[TheUltimateFixx]

I have reconsidered my stance on addiction after watching this.

Oh, him again. This guy has an obsession with addiction being all about one single thing and having one root 'cause', and it's reductive and blinkered. Reasons for developing addictive behaviours and the motivations that drive us are much more individual and varied.

Yes, various types of trauma and unmanaged mental health problems play a noticeable role in why many people end up addicted. Surprise surprise, if you're in pain you might want to escape it, if you can't cope with life you might want to switch off from it. Any idiot can draw that conclusion and he's trying to sell the bleeding obvious as some revolutionary enlightened insight.

There's plenty addicts who overdo their substance of choice because they simply enjoy the effects too much and can't curb their hedonistic tendencies. There's others whose only reason to keep doing whatever they're doing is that they've been doing it for so long they can't imagine any other kind of way to be anymore. It can be as banal and trivial as mindless habituation or pleasure-seeking, and a host of other things besides. Claiming excessive use always absolutely HAS to mean something tragic, deep and meaningful denies the life experience of every user who doesn't fit into that narrative.

The man's a charlatan and an egomaniac, a pseudo-intellectual who knows this kind of talk sells. All that seductively simplistic rhetoric is doing however is to encourage already troubled users to take on a permanent victim mentality and to convince them that they practically owe themselves a trauma, or else why could they possibly be using.

Beware of anyone who insists that there's such a thing as THE one and only explanation for any complex phenomenon.