shulgin talking about datura

[wazza]

Found this nice piece about shulgin talking about what we call datura. Pretty much sums up what a lot of us people say, just thought you might like to read it people.

Datura, Thornapple,
Atropine & Scopolamine
Dear Dr. Shulgin:
I have heard that datura is a "dark, evil one." Is this true? -- Alis
What information do you have on the thornapple used by the Arabs? -- Michael
Dear Alis and Michael:
I have comfortably combined these two questions. The plants are totally different. Datura is the Genus name that consists of perhaps a dozen species found throughout the world. D. metel is found in China, in India, all around the Near East -- it is often combined with tobacco or cannabis and smoked in Africa and Asia. In the Western Hemisphere, the most common species is D. stramonium, often called jimson weed (a corruption of Jamestown weed) or thorn apple. In North America, there is D. meteloides and, in Mexico especially, there are several others, including D. inoxia, commonly called toloache. In South America there are several Brugmansia species, largely in the Andes, with many local names.
But there are several, quite unrelated plants, that should be considered here as well. There is the plant Atropa belladonna, with the common name of belladonna. This is derived from the use of it at modest levels to give eye dilation as a cosmetic -- hence the term, "beautiful woman." There is the plant Hyoscyamus niger, with the common name of henbane, the stuff of the witches' brews of the Dark Ages. There are several species of the Genus Mandragora, with the common name of mandrake, which was connected to the practice of magic back in the Middle Ages. There is the shrub Solandra guerrerensis, deeply involved in sorcery in several Mexican Indian cultures, especially the Huichols.
Why gather all these different plants into one place? Because their activity is largely due to the alkaloid atropine, and especially its close cousin scopolamine, or hyoscine. This is an extremely potent drug, one of the few that produces true hallucinations. The experiences, the visions, are totally real and believable to the subject, and are often clouded by a thorough amnesia. It has been used as an anesthetic for childbirth, as a punishment for misbehavior, as a weapon for controlling people, as a part of puberty rites, and for many other different purposes in different cultures.
You can walk into a closed door that appears to you to be wide open. You can converse with friends whom you know well, but whom no one else can see or hear. You can think you are sleeping in bed, but your observer will tell you that you tried to go outside to direct traffic. You are never sure when you are completely down, as you don't remember being up. Never use it without a baby sitter.
--Dr. Shulgin
taken from here

 

[apollo]

You are never sure when you are completely down, as you don't remember being up. Intimidating words from Shulgin...

You can walk into a closed door that appears to you to be wide open. You can converse with friends whom you know well, but whom no one else can see or hear. You can think you are sleeping in bed, but your observer will tell you that you tried to go outside to direct traffic. these are otherwise known as phantasms.

phan·tasm
n.
Something apparently seen but having no physical reality; a phantom or an apparition. Also called phantasma.
An illusory mental image. Also called phantasma.
In Platonic philosophy, objective reality as perceived and distorted by the five senses.
There's enough sour experiences in Erowids experience vault to make even the keenest tripper shit his dacks.

[ 20 November 2002: Message edited by: apollo ]

 

[insomnia]

Well, that pretty much sums it up. Thanks for that info wazza.
I won't be ever doing Datura.

 

[Tabernacle]

Sounds like a barrel of laughs, also the delusional phantasms sound quite like that of those produced by "recreational" doses of travel sickness tablets (dihydrazine i believe)

 

[wazza]

Sounds like a barrel of laughs, also the delusional phantasms sound quite like that of those produced by "recreational" doses of travel sickness tablets (dihydrazine i believe)
Woah, that brings back memories!! I first (stupidly) did this when I was about 16. Mainly got a few small visions and the like but nothing to the extent of what I have seen datura do to friends (after sitting them and talking to them about their experiences).
Oh well, a small trip (no pun intended) down memory lane.

 

[Timmy C]

i heard the hype, but it was interesting to hear it coming from a completely objective point of view.

 

[SeveredPsyche]

You are never sure when you are completely down, as you don't remember being up.
They sometimes give scopolomine in hospitals to help patients forget unpleasant procedures.
Scopolomine is also available in a common OTC medication as hyoscine hydrobromide. I used to combine this with pot a fair bit and it certainly did the job. A bit too upleasant for my tastes now, though. Aah...just read Tabernacle's reply.
Is there any particular reason to combine this with atropine and smoke it? (The drug, not the pills!)
[ 21 November 2002: Message edited by: SeveredPsyche ]

 

[Tabernacle]

Wazza i think there are several different chems in different travel sickness pills. My friends were stupid enough to take a blister pack each and ended up having pretty bad delusions- ie smoking ciggerettes that weren't there and waiting for a friend in a phonebox, only thing is the friend and the phonebox didn't exist! And they pay me out for sipping robo- bloody hypocrites!

 

[SeveredPsyche]

Tabernacle: Not sure about others, but there is one brand that contains only hyoscine hydrobromide & no other active ingredients.

 

[wazza]

Thanks for the info guys. I have no idea on what car sickness pills I had except I *think* the packets were maybe yellow with brown or black writing. Just word of mouth "these make you trip dude!" and back when I was 14-19. So a good 10-15 years ago.
I used to try out anything 'to pass the boredom' from where I lived. In a small SMALL country place 45kms out of Geelong with a grand population of around 60ish and the mail still doesn't get delivered there, you have to pick it up from the general store that closes at 7 or 8pm *sigh*
Oh well, I was young and dumb but at least I learnt from my experiences (didn't really have any BAAAD ones thankfully) but now I research everything I can before taking something (such as a drug). *thanks bluelight*

 

[-Thoth]

They sometimes give scopolomine in hospitals to help patients forget unpleasant procedures.
I believe the Nazi's experimented with scopolomine as an interrogation aid during WWII...

 

[d e v i a n t]

Originally posted by wazza:
I have no idea on what car sickness pills I had except I *think* the packets were maybe yellow with brown or black writing. Just word of mouth "these make you trip dude!" and back when I was 14-19. So a good 10-15 years ago.
i had dramamine travel sicness pills about a month or less ago.. they were an interesting trip

 

[BongoBongo]

Car sick pills Wazza ??? Could of they been called Advil by any chance? They turn rough mountainous nauesating seasickness into a chilled out-spaced-out fun time.

 

[ChrisV]

Those travel sickness pills that people sometimes eat a packet of are dramamine, as far as I know. The effect is hallucinations, but not visual hallucinations - the user just imagines things to be happening, kind of like in a dream.

 

[josh_nexus]

You can walk into a closed door that appears to you to be wide open. You can converse with friends whom you know well, but whom no one else can see or hear. You can think you are sleeping in bed, but your observer will tell you that you tried to go outside to direct traffic. You are never sure when you are completely down, as you don't remember being up. Never use it without a baby sitter.
This is the best explanation of datura I have ever heard. I know I hark on about this stuff but having had it twice I am loathed to let someone else make the same mistake without first knowing exactly what they are getting into.
*josh stops himself before he starts to rant*