questions on injecting

[tintincancan]

10 noob questions on injecting. Before I ask them: please don't say "UTFSE" (a lot of these are questions which could be a matter of opinion, and I want to hear from a range of people). Also, please no general warnings or judgements: I am well aware that to say it is better not to inject drugs would be an understatement, and that I am a fool for even thinking about it. But I am unfortunately an insatiably inquisitive fool who has to try everything once (as time allows). I'm highly educated, have a pretty much encyclopediac knowledge of (psycho)pharmacology, and am merely looking for practical advice on the one aspect of drugs that is new to me, which is needles. So you will be doing a much better job at reducing harm by giving tips on best practice, rather than trying to persuade me out of it.

(Sorry for the tone there....just a disclaimer to ease your consciences: I know you bluelighters are a truly progressive and caring bunch, and I want and will be very grateful for your wisdom and don't want you to feel as though you are encouraging me by giving it!)

So here's my questions. Not expecting answers to all of them... just know there are a lot of people here with a lot of knowledge on his subject and would like to tap the collective mind.....

1. How dangerous is the "air in the needle" thing really? Obviously one should try by all means not to inject any air, but suppose one believes a small bubble may have have got in... is this cause for panic?

2. When pulling the plunger out to check if you got a vein, is it important there is no air in the syringe? It occurred to me you might just be stretching the air otherwise and not have the suction to pull any blood out even if you are in a vein

3. What actually happens if you hit an artery? How easy is it to do, and any tips on avoiding?

4. Would there be any big problem if you missed a vein and took the shot anyway? Surely you are in that case just injecting intramuscularly instead, and so the worst that can happen is you semi-waste your shot?

5. Someone said a rig should be used no more than twice ideally... is this really true? And why: because sharper=more accurate/less painful, or because blunter=more vein damage?

6. I know K should only really be injected IM as regards making the most of it. Similarly H and IV. Any drugs which should specifically NOT be injected one way or the other? And of those like coke which work both ways, what are the pros and cons?

7. I heard crack can be injected after heating with citric... I had very little success with this: lots of gunk was left on the spoon (no alkaloids from the taste of it...assuming it was whatever bicarb + citric reacts to...sodium citrate?) and no hit at all

8. What does it take for a vein to collapse? And when it has collapsed, will it carry on functioning as normal?

9. There are obvious injection sites with prominent large veins, such as the inside of the arms. Any less obvious ones? Any to be particularly avoided? Does it really just come down to where the biggest veins are? What is the typical sequence of sites a heroin addict will go through as each become unviable due to collapsed/sunken veins? (if there is a typical one)

10. How do abscesses form? And what other nasty things can be avoided?

I could probably think of more...... maybe I will come back and edit if I do. I would also be generally very interested in some of the non-screamingly obvious do's and dont's about injecting. In fact please just tell me what you think is important to know!

Thankyou!!

 

[subutex_junkie]

1. I've injected around a tenth of a ml of air several times with no negative effects (that I know of..) but IMHO I think a small air bubble is harmless, just something to avoid whenever possible.
2. It doesn't matter, if an air bubble is in the syringe and you pull back while in a vein, the blood will fill the syringe, if you're not in a vein then it creates a vacuum and stays like that until you get a vein. Having a tiny bubble can actually help if you need to register several times.
3. It's pretty easy to accidently hit an artery but if you do, you'll know. It will hurt to inject into, the blood is more oxygenated so it's usually a lighter colored red/pink then a vein is and arteries tent to have a pretty strong pulse if you feel it with your fingers before shooting. If you do hit one, pull out right away and put pressure on the hole until it stops bleeding.
4. If you miss a vein, the drug goes under the skin and forms a bubble which hurts like hell and can cause awful infections and using a muscle can be just as bad, yeah, you get your shot but let's just say that every infection I've ever heard about started with someone missing a shot.
5. It's actually no more then once and it's because needles dull quickly, look up a photo of a syringe used only 5 times under a magnification and you can see how bad it really gets. Also, not to mention that after using a syringe once, bacteria will start forming inside the syringe too.
6. I can't really answer this as I've only done a handful of IM injections on myself.
7. When I slam crack I don't cook it, just add the liquid then stir the rock around until it completely dissolves and I always get a good shot, you may have cooked it too long or maybe it was just weak crack, try not cooking it next time.
8. Veins collapse from repeatedly poking them, especially with dull needles and once they collapse they're done from what I understand.
9. Avoid the groin at all costs, it's right next to a major artery. IV users mainly just hit the good veins like the crook of the arm but as scar tissue forms, it's harder and harder to get the same spot so they move on to the next best vein. I personally used up both my crooks after about 2 years shooting daily then moved down lower on my arm. I've lost a few more since then and sadly, I'm on my last big, easy to hit vein right now and idk how much longer I'll be able to use it for before it either collapses or is too hard and surrounded by scar tissue.
10. Abscesses form when bacteria gets under the skin and causes an infection. As for any basic tips to someone new to the IV, all the obvious "don't share needles" and what not apply. Really, just be careful and use common since, some of the worst things I've seen came about from people fiending out and throwing common since to the wind, one of the worst was someone who had broke a needle off in their arm after he fell out from a shot but instead of seeing a doctor, he just left it until he almost lost an arm then went to the ER, syringes are a deadly game and I'd read up on harm reduction as much as you can if I were you.

 

[Bob Loblaw]

1. How dangerous is the "air in the needle" thing really? Obviously one should try by all means not to inject any air, but suppose one believes a small bubble may have have got in... is this cause for panic?

It's a popular misconception that a tiny air bubble is super dangerous. It's not. You have to inject multiple cc's of straight air to do significant damage.

2. When pulling the plunger out to check if you got a vein, is it important there is no air in the syringe? It occurred to me you might just be stretching the air otherwise and not have the suction to pull any blood out even if you are in a vein

Yes, it's better to get all of the air out before you inject. Not only is it healthier, but it makes registering (the process you're describing) a lot easier.

3. What actually happens if you hit an artery? How easy is it to do, and any tips on avoiding?

It's pretty fucking bad; you can search here for more info. It's not that hard if you know how to find a vein, but that's something that comes with experience.

4. Would there be any big problem if you missed a vein and took the shot anyway? Surely you are in that case just injecting intramuscularly instead, and so the worst that can happen is you semi-waste your shot?

It's actually going to be subcutaneously injected & that is NOT something you want to fuck with if you have street drugs. It would hurt like hell first off & it could easily lead to an abscess, requiring medical treatment of antibiotics at best.

5. Someone said a rig should be used no more than twice ideally... is this really true? And why: because sharper=more accurate/less painful, or because blunter=more vein damage?

Both.

Used needles can also harbour lots of dangerous bacteria if not cleaned properly.

6. I know K should only really be injected IM as regards making the most of it. Similarly H and IV. Any drugs which should specifically NOT be injected one way or the other? And of those like coke which work both ways, what are the pros and cons?

Way too vague for me to answer.

7. I heard crack can be injected after heating with citric... I had very little success with this: lots of gunk was left on the spoon (no alkaloids from the taste of it...assuming it was whatever bicarb + citric reacts to...sodium citrate?) and no hit at all

Ummm, all right? Mixing hard & white vinegar always worked for me.

8. What does it take for a vein to collapse? And when it has collapsed, will it carry on functioning as normal?

Once a vein has collapsed, it is done for. Permanently.

9. There are obvious injection sites with prominent large veins, such as the inside of the arms. Any less obvious ones? Any to be particularly avoided? Does it really just come down to where the biggest veins are? What is the typical sequence of sites a heroin addict will go through as each become unviable due to collapsed/sunken veins? (if there is a typical one)

Almost everyone starts there. The arms contain many relatively safe & easily accessible veins that most go for. Unless you get bad off, you can generally rotate injection sites & keep shooting in the arms for years.

10. How do abscesses form? And what other nasty things can be avoided?

In a nutshell bacteria gets into the bloodstream & your body begins fighting the infection. If it can't do it alone, you get an abscess. In my signature you can check out OD's IV complications megathread. I recommend it highly.

 

[Swain]

10 noob questions on injecting. Before I ask them: please don't say "UTFSE" (a lot of these are questions which could be a matter of opinion, and I want to hear from a range of people). Also, please no general warnings or judgements: I am well aware that to say it is better not to inject drugs would be an understatement, and that I am a fool for even thinking about it. But I am unfortunately an insatiably inquisitive fool who has to try everything once (as time allows). I'm highly educated, have a pretty much encyclopediac knowledge of (psycho)pharmacology, and am merely looking for practical advice on the one aspect of drugs that is new to me, which is needles. So you will be doing a much better job at reducing harm by giving tips on best practice, rather than trying to persuade me out of it.

(Sorry for the tone there....just a disclaimer to ease your consciences: I know you bluelighters are a truly progressive and caring bunch, and I want and will be very grateful for your wisdom and don't want you to feel as though you are encouraging me by giving it!)

So here's my questions. Not expecting answers to all of them... just know there are a lot of people here with a lot of knowledge on his subject and would like to tap the collective mind.....

1. How dangerous is the "air in the needle" thing really? Obviously one should try by all means not to inject any air, but suppose one believes a small bubble may have have got in... is this cause for panic? Unless your injecting pure oxygen you are fine. I have done literally thousands on top of thousands of injections with a small air bubble. It gets expelled through your lungs. A small air bubble though like maybe 5 units at most

2. When pulling the plunger out to check if you got a vein, is it important there is no air in the syringe? It occurred to me you might just be stretching the air otherwise and not have the suction to pull any blood out even if you are in a vein. Ideally you start with no air in the syringe.. theres really no reason to have a bubble. For me it'd be because I am out side in a bathroom or in a big rush, but you can still create suction with a small airbuble. If you have a big air bubble it just makes it more difficult to register and you have to pull back further to create suction. its not ideal.

3. What actually happens if you hit an artery? How easy is it to do, and any tips on avoiding? If you hit an artery there will likely be enough pressure that the blood will flow into the syringe on its own and maybe even push the plunger back, it will sting like a bitch and probably bleed a lot more than a typical injection. If you push even 1 unit, you are in fore a ride and can potentially lose your arm. You will get pain and swelling starting from the injection site traveling away from the heart; It may get to the point where it feels like your arm will explode its getting so big. IF you ever inject ANYTHING into an artery go to the hospital right away. There is no reason to hit an artery unless you are digging deep. Like i said I've done thousands upon thousand sod injections and only hit an artery once. In my case I didn't know I was in an artery till Ip ushed a unit and the next hour was hell. I survived and my arm is intact. This was with ECP. If you push black tar into an artery.. well, goodbye sir.

4. Would there be any big problem if you missed a vein and took the shot anyway? Surely you are in that case just injecting intramuscularly instead, and so the worst that can happen is you semi-waste your shot? You are not injecting intramuscularly. To hit a muscle most people need 1" minimum tip. What you are doing is missing your shot, wasting your solution, and letting potentially insoluble particles get trapped under your skin. You are setting your self up for failure in the form of an abscess. This is pretty much the stupidest most rash thing anyone can do... get annoyed they can't find a vein then just push the solution. You are better off shooting it into your nose.

5. Someone said a rig should be used no more than twice ideally... is this really true? And why: because sharper=more accurate/less painful, or because blunter=more vein damage? This is true and is pretty much the golden rule of injecting if you want longevity for your veins. After 3 peircings the needle has dulled tot he point where you can really feel it tear the skin and vein instead of pierce it. Its a good way to cause unnecessary trauma to the vein and injection site, it will make it harder to register inject, it will make veins roll easier because they can push to the side instead of piercing through. You should use a new syringe for EVERY SINGLE INJECTION. They are disposable. They are free at needle exchanges. Over here you can walk into any exchange and walk out with 50-100 syringes. Or go to a pharmacy and buy a box of 100. The law over here is you can only buy 10 at a time, so I pretty much pick up one pack a day when I am using. It costs me about 20 bucks a week. and my veins look un used and I've been icing coke and dope a long time. My friend on the other hand will use a syringe till the numbers wear off and his arms look disgusting and he will sit for 2 hours straight trying to hit a vein because he's god dam stupid.

6. I know K should only really be injected IM as regards making the most of it. Similarly H and IV. Any drugs which should specifically NOT be injected one way or the other? And of those like coke which work both ways, what are the pros and cons? K can be injected iv or IM... Heroin and cocaine should only be injected IV unless you are micron filtering. You are putting your self at risk of abscess otherwise. The only drugs you can safely IM without micron filtering are pharmaceutical grade that are diluted for IM injection

7. I heard crack can be injected after heating with citric... I had very little success with this: lots of gunk was left on the spoon (no alkaloids from the taste of it...assuming it was whatever bicarb + citric reacts to...sodium citrate?) and no hit at all. I much prefer to just get good powder coke, but I have successfully used whtie vinegar to shoot crack. Tried citric once but it didn't work for me. This does a lot more wear and tear on your body and cardiovascular system. Just get cocaine, or if you get crack smoke it.

8. What does it take for a vein to collapse? And when it has collapsed, will it carry on functioning as normal? Repeated injection to the same site, trauma, scar tissue, clotting can all lead to collapse. Also creating too much of a vacuum, and or not releasing the tourni can blow a vein. When it collapses your body no longer uses it, no blood flow is making it through. If the trauma is not that bad it can come back. This is why you want new needs for EVERY SINGLE POKE of the skin. You don't want to be tearing the skin and causing scar tissue to form. Imagine sipping through a plastic straw. when scar tissue starts to form its like you are squeezing the middle, it restricts blood flow. At first you won't be able to register right, you'll get a trickle instead of a plume of blood (do not inject in that case find a new site). Eventually the vein is dead, you can't register, it will no longer bulge when you tie off, and it will likely never ever come back. Again, you only have one set of veins, use them wisely. Injetion when done right can be done for years. I know from experience.

9. There are obvious injection sites with prominent large veins, such as the inside of the arms. Any less obvious ones? Any to be particularly avoided? Does it really just come down to where the biggest veins are? What is the typical sequence of sites a heroin addict will go through as each become unviable due to collapsed/sunken veins? (if there is a typical one). Avoid anything below the waste. The You want to inject as close to your heart as possible. Heroin users usually start with crooks of elbows, and cephalic undret the base of the thumb. This all depends on how bulgy your veins are. Usually as a last resort they will inject in the neck and as an ultra last resort in the femoral vein which a clot can go straight to your brain and kill you instantly. Your blood circulates less the further from your heart..

You want to rotate as many sites as possible. for every injection. give your veins time to heal. There is no reason you EVER have to have a vein collapse. Ive been shooting ECP heroin and cocaine like I said for a long time often 10+ shots a day. Do the math. I only ever had one vein collapse and after a month or 2 of not using it it came back, but if you do enough damage it will never return. I don't ever use that vein because its only good for a few shots before it temporarily dies due to swelling around the area that will restrict blood flow and the already present scar tissue which you can't really get rid of

10. How do abscesses form? And what other nasty things can be avoided? Abscesses form from improper injection technique. reusing old needles, not filter properly, missing a shot, injecting shitty drugs. If you really want to avoid abscesses and you suck at injecting get leurlock syringe barrels and micron filters .22um and filter every shot before you inject that way if you miss you should be in the clear. You want to clean the top of the skin by rubbing with an alcohol swab prior to injection. you don't wann push dirt particles into the blood stream. bacteria can live on top of the skin and does on most human beings. If you ever think your getting an abscess go to the doc to get antibiotics so it doesn't get to the point where it needs lancing. OR WORSE

I could probably think of more...... maybe I will come back and edit if I do. I would also be generally very interested in some of the non-screamingly obvious do's and dont's about injecting. In fact please just tell me what you think is important to know!

Thankyou!!

See my answers above in bold

edit: also you never really want to be cooking anything your shooting. If it dissolves readily in water great, if not, don't shoot it.

Here is a quote from a post i made for someone else the other day

Proper injection technique is not something you are inherently born with. No one picks up a bicycle the 1st time a bolts away.

These are the best tips I can give you (not necessarily in order from most important to least important):

Always inject toward the heart. The bevel should be facing your eyes (up) so as to not block the liquid from shooting the direction of the blood flow. No matter WHAT you are injecting, you should not feel any pain EVER; if you do, something is wrong/. You may have slipped out, you may be using a half dead vein, etc..

use a new syringe/needle for every time you puncture the skin. I don't mean a new barrel but the actual needle part. They dull VERY quickly. Sharp needles can literally make the difference between heaven and hell injecting. A dull needle rips the skin and veins, that's if it does not just roll/push the vein to the side. A sharp n eedle puncture the skin and veins. This makes injecting easier and healing times way quicker. A proper injection will have no pain during or after the injection besides the initial puncture of the top layer of skin.

The plunger should move freely when you are in a vein and injecting, as freely as it would if you were shooting the substance into the air like a water gun. IF you encounter resistance, pull out and start over aggain, you missed or slipped out of the vein. Avoid learning to inject with cocaine, as it is the hardest drug to inject if you are new to the game. If you slip out you will not feelt he miss as it is a topical anesthetic and will numb the area. It causes vasoconstriction so it becomes easier to loose the vein mid shot

pick and choose your veins, certain veins may looks easier but are actually harder to hit for instance veins on the underside of your wrist, avoid those at all costs no matter how easy they might look to hit/. I am a bit fat for instance. When I first ever injected the only visible veins were in my hands and they were mad small/ Naturally I thought I should be using these. I found my most reliable vein/site to be the cephalic. I hit it a few inches under teh base of the thumb (injecting toweard the hard of course). WHen you tie off you will see the skin bulge and it will feel squishy and have an elasticity to it. You may not ever see the green/blue vein underneath.

Don't use one single injection site. EWveryone has veins. and if you are a boy you have better veins than girls (generally speaking). Being overweight I thought injecting was going to be impossible. I dont think I missed a hit in the last 2000 shots I did, and I literally have no VISIBLE usable veins (like those dudes you see sometimes with massive veins bulging out of everywhere... You will learn with time. Soon you will know exactly where to hit.

use the vacuum technique. Use it right. The right way is to puncture the skin a few MM deep, pull back 1-3 units to create suction, then continue to move the needle until you see a plume of blood. When you initially inject you want a shallow angle and to use a stabbing motion. You want to be precise but if you move too slow youo will roll the vein (depending where you are hitting). The wrong way to use this technique is to stick the needle all the way in (through both sides of the vein) then create suction and start to pull back until you see the plume. This creates a second puncture on the bottom side of the vein./ This causees you to have leakage whcih wastes drugs and lets foreign particles out of your veins putting you more at risk for infection. Do not pull back more than 5 units of air because too much suction can collapse a vein, especially on smaller ones like hand veins furthest from the heart.

When you are looking for the flash ofo blood in the barrel, it should flow in nearly as freely as liquid would. If it trickles in do not proceed to inject, you need a new site or vein. Avoid injecting into valves (you will know a valve because it will be a lump along the vein if that makes sense.

Once you register, anchor your needle. You entered at a shallow angle, so once in. the bottom of the barrel should pretty much be touching the skin, I push down to anchor so as to not allow the needle to move 1mm eithe rway be it in or out. I also like to register another unit of blood half way through the shot. But unless your injecting coke, you will know if you slip out, you will start to feel a slight to sharp pain. DO NOT PROCEED TO INJECT. Before you inject and after you anchor your needle, REMOVFE THE TOURNIQUET then proceed to inject. If you are new, it may be easier to leave the tourniquet on but loose, to cause a slight restriction in bloodflow but not fully. You never watn to tie off for more than a minute or so. IF you cant inject by then, remove tourniquet and wait a few minutes then try agian.

If you are havin trouble injecting and end up with coagulated blood in the barrel, shoot it up your nose, do not try to force it though the needle into your body.

the closer you inject to your heart on any one given vein, the thicker and easier it is going to be to hit. That being said, certain areas of your body are more likely to have "rolling" veins than others.

For me the best and most reliable spots are cephalic under the base of the thumb on each arm, and the large veins in the crook of your elbow. Avoid thin little veins like in hands. Avoid injecting below the belt, always.

Oh yeah, always filter your shots with atleast cotton. Ideally you micron filter espeically if oyu shoot pills. Forcoke and dope cotton is enough IMO.

ROTATE INJECTION SITES AND USE A NEW NEEDLE EVERY TIME. I can not stress this enough. This will make the difference between collapsed veins in a few months to perfectly functioning veins after thousands of injections (speaking from experience).