Question Re: Buprenorphine Maintenance, Kratom & Detoxification

[TheManFromRlyeh]

Hi all,

I've been lurking in these forums for well over a decade, but this is my first post.

I've spent many hours looking for some insights regarding my question, but I feel I must resort to a new thread for lack of an answer. If I've overlooked an existing post that covers the topic, or if I've posted this in the wrong section, somebody sort me out.

My situation:

I'm a 24 year old opioid addict. Starting when I was 14, I followed the fairly common trajectory of hydrocodone --> oxycodone --> heroin --> IV heroin --> buprenorphine maintenance, where I've been for the last 4 years.

My hardcore IV junkie phase was actually relatively short compared to how long I've been on low-dose bupe (~1mg/day). It's helped me immensely to get my life back on track, I'm now battling the latter phases of physical dependence.

However, because I never obtained a script for the subs, I've been at the mercy of the black market. After several years without a dry spell (amazing luck), that day of reckoning has now arrived. It arrived two weeks ago, in fact.

Since then, I've been ordering quantities of plain powdered kratom leaf to get me by, until I can come up with a plan, and dosing about 10g/day. It's been a shitty fortnight, since, at least for me, kratom is way too short-acting to make for a good maintenance drug.

The upside is that I've been building some endurance and willpower, deliberately making myself suffer and pushing back doses as far as I can. I feel more prepared to go through withdrawals than I have in months.

Now to my question:

The last time I detoxed off of Suboxone I felt acute symptoms for about two full weeks. That period of time seems to be fairly consistent with other people's accounts, at least for those on long-term / low dose (not talking about PAWS, just the acutes).

I'm wondering, if I've waited out the 2 week detox period of bupe and have only been taking kratom in the meantime, should I now expect a somewhat shorter detox phase, as kratom has a shorter half life and eliminates much more rapidly?

I'm kind of hoping to trade off duration of detox for intensity of symptoms. I think at this point I'd rather have a couple days of hell than several weeks of lingering symptoms, as I've experienced when coming off of bupe before.

What do you guys think? Is there some logic to what I'm saying here, or am I overlooking something important? Huge thanks ahead of time.

 

[danequeed]

Everyone's body handles it differently I think. While there might be reason to believe shorter acting opioids will have a shorter kick, I think the body reacts more to the long term state of how things have been in the brain.. Think tolerance levels. Even with a couple weeks of sobriety your tolerance doesnt magically go away. Its a losing proposition when every little taste you get resets the clock. IMO you're prolonging the inevitable. I don't know very many people that felt good physically until at least like a month of complete sobriety. And for a lot of people I think they forget what "real" good feels like.

 

[TheManFromRlyeh]

Indeed, this was a factor I'd considered, the length of time I've been on the bupe. Haha unfortunately it makes sense that two weeks of abstinence from suboxone won't undo several years of daily use, especially as I continue to feed my receptors other opioids in the meantime.

Regarding prolonging the inevitable, you're definitely right, but in my own defense I only started taking kratom because my supply of Suboxone dried up. As is true for many opiate addicts, I'm terrified of having to go to school/work/etc. sick.

In some ways all of this is a good thing, since it's forcing me to consider kicking sooner than I likely would have if I had a consistent hook for the subs.

Another silver lining here is the fact that, at this point, I've at least eliminated most of the bupe from my system. Though I might now experience twofold withdrawal symptoms from the kratom and its own unique properties, at the very least I'm a couple steps ahead on the elimination aspect. Won't have to have that day or two of semi withdrawal before the real thing starts. Haha counting what few blessings I have at the moment.

Thanks for the response!