Misc Question about Collapsed Veins

[noobster]

After reading multiple threads about veins collapsing and veins being seemingly 'crunchy' I have a few questions about these issues. I love drugs and am certainly a connoisseur of almost every type. That said, I try to avoid needles thanks to some of the horrible IV related topics I have read on this board (note: not judging those who IV, it is simply a personal choice). So please note the former if you find these questions ignorant, as I have no experience myself.

1.) What is / what causes a 'crunchy' vein?
2.) Why does IVing cause veins to collapse and what exactly is a collapsed vein?
3.) Are collapsed veins dangerous? I assume there must still be some level of blood flow... is this a correct assumption?
4.) Is a collapsed vein caused by the drug use, adulterants/fillers, or simply the act of repeated penetration with the needle?

Thanks in advance for responses!
Noah


Sidenote:
I've had this forum account for a long time, yet this is one of my first few times posting. I've recently become active again in reading these forums, which are spectacular and consist of much more mature conversation than any other "drug forum" I've encountered. Just thought I would throw that in; also, thanks to the moderators for keeping posts within the guidelines - - just kill/move this post if I've violated any of the rules.

 

[jamesBrown]

I really want to answer all those questions for you but it would simply take too long to answer them 100% correctly and thoroughly. And im in too much pain right now to do it, but I can tell you that some of the questions you asked have somewhat complicated answers(i.e. more than one answer/depending on the situation etc...)

But just cuz i wanna help out.

1. Veins should NEVER be crunchy. If they are you probably have a serious infection. I highly doubt that many people(even IV drug users) get crunchy veins ......ever.

2. There are many answers to this question. Also, a collapsed vein is exactly what it sounds like. Its a vein that has collapsed so that the walls of the vein are touching each other like a rubber tube being squished together. This can happen MANY ways. Lots of times its a result of the vein becoming inflamed from repeated drug use.

3. This depends on the individual situation. But, yes, in general collapsed veins are dangerous and should be attended to immediately by a doctor. And depending on the situation and the severity of the damage to the vein there still could be blood flow.

4. Collapsed veins can/and are caused by all of those things. Believe it or not they can also be caused by suction on the plunger when there is a needle in a smaller vein. I think they even talk about that in more detail on wikipedia if you wanna look it up some more.
In fact, you probably could have found all of this on wiki.

Anyway, thats just a quick run down of the answers to your questions, and like I said, the answers are more complicated than that in some circumstances but I believe the answers i prrovided you with will give you a good base to go off of.

 

[noobster]

Thanks for the reply James. The "crunchy" vein was literally in a thread posted right below mine and it is what sparked me to ask these questions in the first place. It seemed a bit... scary to say the least. You say that people should see the doctor for collapsed veins... yet IV users always talk about how they can no longer find veins. Are these veins simply recessed or have a large majority of their veins collapsed?

All of the other answers are thorough and perfect, and I understand you don't have time to post more through answers. I hadn't even thought of using google by the way, the first thing that came to my head was to post a question on here regarding the topic (sorry!). Anyway, thanks for the actual response without taking the easy way out and simply telling me to search for it.

 

[affasd]

I posted in another thread saying i had the crunchy vein thing. Thats not really what I meant though I just read it in another thread and it was fresh in my mind lol. What it really is is the needle kind of ripping through the layers of tough fibrous scar tissue, this is only when you have a really bad track when you use the same spot over and over and the scar tissue builds up real thick, which shouldn't happen if you use fresh rigs every time and rotate spots. The reason I got it was cause I was reusing rigs a lot and always use the same spot so like I said sometimes when the needle(especially a dull one) would go in it would kind of tear through the built up scar which will kind of feel like your tearing through a hard vein which I think is why someone called it crunchy. So basically its caused by always going in the same spot over and over again and reusing needles multiple times, and there is so much scar built up that it feels almost hard and it is harder to push the needle through.

Thats what I meant by it at least hopefully the person who made that original thread meant the same thing cause I don't know anyone who literally has a crunchy vein

 

[jamesBrown]

Thanks for the reply James. The "crunchy" vein was literally in a thread posted right below mine and it is what sparked me to ask these questions in the first place. It seemed a bit... scary to say the least. You say that people should see the doctor for collapsed veins... yet IV users always talk about how they can no longer find veins. Are these veins simply recessed or have a large majority of their veins collapsed?

All of the other answers are thorough and perfect, and I understand you don't have time to post more through answers. I hadn't even thought of using google by the way, the first thing that came to my head was to post a question on here regarding the topic (sorry!). Anyway, thanks for the actual response without taking the easy way out and simply telling me to search for it.

Yes I am quite aware of that "crunchy vein" thread...I even posted in it...its a few weeks old. Trust me, that thread was an oddity...."crunchy veins" are almost unheard of. Its just not something that happens normally when you IV drugs. Im sure its possible to get some sort of weird infection that causes your veins to feel sort of crunchy, but even then its more likely that its just scabs that you are mistaking for veins. Its common to get scabs over regularly used veins.
Anyway, as far as IV drug users and there inability to "find a vein" to shoot up in, that probably has more to do with the fact that scar tissue builds up very quickly when you are injecting drugs on a regular basis and this scar tissue basically makes it much harder and more "thick" or "rubbery" around your veins as compared to a normal vein which is normally surrounded by soft supple skin thats easy to break through and find a vein. Of course some addicts that have poor injection techniques may actually have infections in there veins that cause them to have difficulty finding a vein to shoot up in...i mean, it would probably be hard to inject some heroin if your vein is covered with black, red, and purple inflamed skin that has puss and hurts likle a bitch. But for the most part, when an IV user says he/she cant find a vein, that just usually means that all there usable veins have been used too much and they are either inflamed, have too much scar tissue, infected, or just simply have bee used too many times and are damaged somehow that makes it hard to inject.....most the time its not a collapsed vein. In fact I would say collapsed veins are relatively rare considering how much IV users tend to inject drugs(several times a day, every day, for months or even years).

 

[noobster]

These responses cleared up all of the questions I had. I've always wanted to slam an opiate (personally I was interested in dilaudid) just to experience the rush that is so coveted by those that do IV. I'm assuming the high is similar to an opiate taken orally/intranasally, just much, much more intense and euphoric. Seeings as I've never IVed I have no real understanding of what the rush actually feels like besides the descriptions online, which to say the least, make it sound amazing.

Anyway, thanks for the fast and descriptive responses. After seeing the risks (collapsed veins/fillers/adulterants/infections/etc) I think I will steer clear at this point in my life. This experience reminds of when I first started using pot/opiates to be honest. At first I told myself I'd never smoke, that I'd never do opiates. Once you try it and experience the high it is so much harder to be content with the little things / less dangerous highs.

Thanks again,
Noah

 

[jamesBrown]

good luck man

peace

 

[Captain.Heroin]

A vein can collapse due to a drug (antihistamines such as promethazine or hydroxyzine when injected into usually small veins can cause them to collapse, and hydroxyzine also causes hemolysis when injected intravenously), or due to repeated injections.

It is more likely to occur when people are injecting frequently, and when people are reusing needles. As needles become increasingly dull, they cause more damage to the vein. If you don't rotate your injection sites, it is also likely that not allowing one site to heal will cause it to pinch and eventually collapse, if you don't give it time to heal.

My understanding is that collapsing veins is rough on your circulatory system, and that if you collapse enough veins, this can lead to death (I believed this actually happened to someone). It's also my understanding that if you collapse a vein, it can come back, or it may not. I think it's more likely the case that it's not going to come back.

A highly acidic or basic solution can also cause a vein to collapse, along with a very horrible burning sensation.

Furthermore, certain solvents such as ethanol, if not diluted properly, will cause what is known as an ethanol emoblization.

 

[edarrin]

Veins should NEVER be crunchy

While I can't argue with that statement in real world situations they most certainly do 'crunch'. I use the term 'snap, crackle, pop. It is from repeated injections causing scar tissue that snap,pops and crunches when penetrated.
Callouses (sp?) form which narrow the lumen (hole) and eventually blood flow can stop although that usually takes a whle. If you use dull needles it ill greatly speed up this process. Sort of parrellels my decreasing spelling ability (he he)

This can indeed lead to circulation problems. Rotate your sites. Always use new clean needles ( here we have harm reduction centres that supply free clean sterile equipment).


here are tons of guides etc on this site and others. I think you'd be hard pressed to find a long term IV user that doesn't have screwed veins.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

While I can't argue with that statement in real world situations they most certainly do 'crunch'. I use the term 'snap, crackle, pop. It is from repeated injections causing scar tissue that snap,pops and crunches when penetrated.
Callouses (sp?) form which narrow the lumen (hole) and eventually blood flow can stop although that usually takes a whle. If you use dull needles it ill greatly speed up this process. Sort of parrellels my decreasing spelling ability (he he)

This can indeed lead to circulation problems. Rotate your sites. Always use new clean needles ( here we have harm reduction centres that supply free clean sterile equipment).


here are tons of guides etc on this site and others. I think you'd be hard pressed to find a long term IV user that doesn't have screwed veins.

That probably depends on what you mean by "long term".

 

[jamesBrown]

While I can't argue with that statement in real world situations they most certainly do 'crunch'. I use the term 'snap, crackle, pop. It is from repeated injections causing scar tissue that snap,pops and crunches when penetrated.
Callouses (sp?) form which narrow the lumen (hole) and eventually blood flow can stop although that usually takes a whle. If you use dull needles it ill greatly speed up this process. Sort of parrellels my decreasing spelling ability (he he)

This can indeed lead to circulation problems. Rotate your sites. Always use new clean needles ( here we have harm reduction centres that supply free clean sterile equipment).


here are tons of guides etc on this site and others. I think you'd be hard pressed to find a long term IV user that doesn't have screwed veins.

I am a VERY long term IV drug user who lives in an area with no needle exchanges and consequently I reused my needles 30 times atleast before I moved on to another one. Or I usually just used it until it fell apart and then i tried to find another one. So, trust me, I know ALLLLL about bad injection techniques and the scar tissue that results from it...but out of all the horrendous scar tissue I have ever have(and still do have), I have NEVER had "crunchy" veins. It just doesnt feel crunchy. Scar tissue is hard, thick, rubbery, and difficult to inject through, but it by no means is crunchy in my opinion. And I do not know ANYONE who has had "crunchy" veins as a result of poor injection techniques and I have known dozens and dozens of people who used the same horrible IV practices that I used, and none of them have had crunchy veins. I believe it might be possible for someone to have crunchy veins, but I think that would be a very rare circumstance and it would be an indication of a serious infection or disease....not scar tissue. Scar tissue just doesnt cause your veins to feel crunchy. Unless your talking about scabs, but scabs arent scar tissue, and scabs are most definitely not your veins......so maybe someone had scabs over there injection sites and thought that meant they had crunchy veins because the skin was"crunchy" as a result of the scabs...i dunno...but I do know that scar tissue, is not crunchy.

 

[Laladior]

After reading multiple threads about veins collapsing and veins being seemingly 'crunchy' I have a few questions about these issues. I love drugs and am certainly a connoisseur of almost every type. That said, I try to avoid needles thanks to some of the horrible IV related topics I have read on this board (note: not judging those who IV, it is simply a personal choice). So please note the former if you find these questions ignorant, as I have no experience myself.

1.) What is / what causes a 'crunchy' vein?
2.) Why does IVing cause veins to collapse and what exactly is a collapsed vein?
3.) Are collapsed veins dangerous? I assume there must still be some level of blood flow... is this a correct assumption?
4.) Is a collapsed vein caused by the drug use, adulterants/fillers, or simply the act of repeated penetration with the needle?

Thanks in advance for responses!
Noah


Sidenote:
I've had this forum account for a long time, yet this is one of my first few times posting. I've recently become active again in reading these forums, which are spectacular and consist of much more mature conversation than any other "drug forum" I've encountered. Just thought I would throw that in; also, thanks to the moderators for keeping posts within the guidelines - - just kill/move this post if I've violated any of the rules.

You’re officially my first response and reply.. actually this is the first time I’ve ever written anything at all on here. Seeing this post is over 10 years old, though- I’m guessing you either got the help you needed, or may not even need this info anymore.. but if you do- I’ll be happy to help.