n1ghtcrawl3r
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Because I relapsed. It's hard to meditate when you're messy everyday.
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H&R Moderators: VerbalTruist
Treatment Queen Buprenorphine and the Chronological Dragon
- Thread starter n1ghtcrawl3r
- Start date
The good news is that this will most certainly change. Things always change. How they change, at least in part, depends on the skillfulness of the choices you make for yourself though - especially in terms of your willingness to make explore, mistakes, pick yourself up and learn.
Anyways, I most definitely know what you meanRushing through life had me chasing my tail, running in circles for years and years.
Do you like to read? There are a lot of books that really really helped me wrap my head around this stuff. Happy to share the names of some of them with you if you'd like.
Something that I also really benefited from (my experience of mental illness is related to PTST, depression and anxiety/social phobia) was outpatient based mental health treatment. It is sooooooooooo much better than most substance use disorder programs. It's really incredibly.
With you mental health stuff, do you feel like it's under control or do you still struggle? I'm sure you've heard the story of how important a therapist AND psychiatrist is, but of course it can take a lot of effort find ones who are right for you (I feel like it's 1/10 at best of those I try).
Also, of course, there is my all time favorite (the missing piece of the puzzle that helped me get off opioids and move away from harmful drug use generally), mindfulness based practices. If you live in a major city there should more than a couple places. If you want any suggestions lemme know. Therapy and psych meds are significantly more effective when combined with mindfulness based practices.
If you can find a way to integrate what you're doing to manage your mental health stuff, substance use stuff and mindfulness stuff - that's the ticket to success IMHO.
Id really like to have the names of the books you’d suggest. My therapist also mentioned mindfulness as I have horrible, intrusive, depressive thoughts. But she only gave me one brief example and it hasn’t worked at all. Could you go into what works for you and how? I’d like to try medititating but I have quite a bit of pain at times, and it’s so hard to sit still. The only time I can seem to think ru to meditate is in bed when I wake up after just two hours of sleep and I’m still so tired... which is every night. I guess that’s not meditation though, just trying to go back to sleep, but sleep being just beyond my grasp.
I am so glad that you posted. You sound DELIGHTFUL!
I am in the same boat, having jumped from 2mg sub at 9 days. I am wrapping up day 2. I found that a half dose of clonidine contains the sweats and twitches. I am very sensitive to clonidine so I am careful. Since it is a very common BP medication, it may be easy for you to find.
Today I began having thoughts that started out as introspective and inspired. but quickly turned negative about myself. I stopped it and took a single drag of mmj. I feel like my emotional clock has been reset.
I think you are amazing for taking this trip unaided. The unknown is terrifying for most. But I also think that you are ready to be done with illicit addiction.
Please don't read this wrong. I come from an extended family of self-"medicators". My sister started by 13 and was a heroin addicted prostitute at 16. She has ALWAYS struggled with feeling comfortable in the world and has been unable to function in an emotionally healthy way in her 50+ years. She's been non-using for decades but it brings her little comfort.
I think that some folks may simply benefit from healthy supplementation of things they cannot create on their own.
Your success and relief on Suboxone are important. Your behavior changed. Your emotions have changed. This is huge! Perhaps the answer for you is this opiate maintenance program with support services. I am afraid that you may push yourself into needless suffering only to return to self-medicating. I suspect there is a world inside you that deserves exploration before you can be independent of drugs. There is nothing wrong with this.
I am in the same boat, having jumped from 2mg sub at 9 days. I am wrapping up day 2. I found that a half dose of clonidine contains the sweats and twitches. I am very sensitive to clonidine so I am careful. Since it is a very common BP medication, it may be easy for you to find.
Today I began having thoughts that started out as introspective and inspired. but quickly turned negative about myself. I stopped it and took a single drag of mmj. I feel like my emotional clock has been reset.
I think you are amazing for taking this trip unaided. The unknown is terrifying for most. But I also think that you are ready to be done with illicit addiction.
Please don't read this wrong. I come from an extended family of self-"medicators". My sister started by 13 and was a heroin addicted prostitute at 16. She has ALWAYS struggled with feeling comfortable in the world and has been unable to function in an emotionally healthy way in her 50+ years. She's been non-using for decades but it brings her little comfort.
I think that some folks may simply benefit from healthy supplementation of things they cannot create on their own.
Your success and relief on Suboxone are important. Your behavior changed. Your emotions have changed. This is huge! Perhaps the answer for you is this opiate maintenance program with support services. I am afraid that you may push yourself into needless suffering only to return to self-medicating. I suspect there is a world inside you that deserves exploration before you can be independent of drugs. There is nothing wrong with this.
simco
Bluelight Crew
Hey OP, You asked if I’m on bupe...I got some black market subs a few days ago and have been taking those as I try to rein in a relapse I fell into recently. But the subs are nearly gone and I don’t have a line on any more, so pretty soon I’ll be naked again, opiate-wise.
Sorry, I’m usually more engaged on BL than I have been recently. Bad depression blah
Blah blah.
But I wish you all the best.
Sorry, I’m usually more engaged on BL than I have been recently. Bad depression blah
Blah blah.
But I wish you all the best.
n1ghtcrawl3r
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Hey ElleAZ !
You sound delightful too, and thanks heaps for the message. Today is day 4 having jumped from subs (can't believe we both jumped at 9 days!) .. I felt terrible today when I woke up and was in a bit of a panic. I ended up taking about 200mg of codeine, and I called the local sub prescriber and had my script transferred across from Melbourne. Ugggghhh.
Man I feel like such a POS today ... I sent my ex a text saying "Merry Christmas (her name)" and I never heard back. We aren't really on talking terms. I wish that would change but I also don't want to intrude on her personal space. I need to man tf up and move on ......
Whatever .. I haven't taken any suboxone tonight as the script starts tomorrow. There's a part of me that doesn't want to go to the chemist tomorrow, and there's a part that knows I will .. I guess I always end up underestimating the power of withdrawal :/
I feel like I'm rambling and that I haven't addressed any questions or points that are relative to anything ..
I feel like what Simco said .. You know the depression blah blah blah ..
You sound delightful too, and thanks heaps for the message. Today is day 4 having jumped from subs (can't believe we both jumped at 9 days!) .. I felt terrible today when I woke up and was in a bit of a panic. I ended up taking about 200mg of codeine, and I called the local sub prescriber and had my script transferred across from Melbourne. Ugggghhh.
Man I feel like such a POS today ... I sent my ex a text saying "Merry Christmas (her name)" and I never heard back. We aren't really on talking terms. I wish that would change but I also don't want to intrude on her personal space. I need to man tf up and move on ......
Whatever .. I haven't taken any suboxone tonight as the script starts tomorrow. There's a part of me that doesn't want to go to the chemist tomorrow, and there's a part that knows I will .. I guess I always end up underestimating the power of withdrawal :/
I feel like I'm rambling and that I haven't addressed any questions or points that are relative to anything ..
I feel like what Simco said .. You know the depression blah blah blah ..
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n1ghtcrawl3r
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"Your success and relief on Suboxone are important. Your behavior changed. Your emotions have changed. This is huge! Perhaps the answer for you is this opiate maintenance program with support services. I am afraid that you may push yourself into needless suffering only to return to self-medicating. I suspect there is a world inside you that deserves exploration before you can be independent of drugs. There is nothing wrong with this."
................
This makes me feel a lot better ..
Thank you
................
This makes me feel a lot better ..
Thank you
n1ghtcrawl3r
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God damn f***ing loneliness man ..... As if humans are supposed to feel so lonely all the time.
n1ghtcrawl3r
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- Dec 22, 2017
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Sorry, I'm just being a little b*tch. I'm ok now. I found a little flask of whiskey in the cupboard and succumbed to its allure ..
I just tired of having all of these negative thoughts, and I know (hope) that the Suboxone tomorrow will eradicate most of the suffering. I don't want to be calling my ex man ... That's super lame. She's having someone else's kid ffs. What am I doing ? ..
God damn it I'm rambling again ..
Alright, probably gonna put the TV on, have a nice big cone, and pass tf out.
Wow my thoughts are erratic.
Peace x
I just tired of having all of these negative thoughts, and I know (hope) that the Suboxone tomorrow will eradicate most of the suffering. I don't want to be calling my ex man ... That's super lame. She's having someone else's kid ffs. What am I doing ? ..
God damn it I'm rambling again ..
Alright, probably gonna put the TV on, have a nice big cone, and pass tf out.
Wow my thoughts are erratic.
Peace x
I am aching for you right now.
This quote that I found recently floored me: "Friendship is not a remedy for loneliness. Loneliness is part of our experience, and if we are looking for relief from our loneliness in friendship, we are only going to frustrate the friendship. Friendship, camaraderie, intimacy, all those things, and loneliness, lived together in the same experience." Rich Mullins
I am lonely in a room filled with loved ones. Always have been. I don't seek out new relationships because they are unfulfilling to me. I adore my family, but my self love is what I seek. Not being able to function like other people is isolating, but when I go with MY flow, I am content. Does that make sense?
If you are also lonely and not comforted like other people, then you can't find your resolutions like other people do. Time to go off course.
I asked my son, whom I homeschooled until he was teaching me, this question:
If we can reduce any human experience into the basic components of how it makes us FEEL, then we are talking about brain chemistry. People will say with absolute conviction that they cannot live without certain things like romantic love, parental love, drama, peace, sex, ambition, etc. Without these things, life isn't worth living.
And then they will see the person who feeds their brain chemicals directly as inadequate. Weak. Addicted. But isn't supplementing brain chemistry directly the same pursuit?
In fact, I would say that the person who finds balance via supplementation is less injurious to society because they don't use other people to get their mentally gratifying experiences.
His response is that, like the difference between taking a multi-vitamin and eating a balanced diet, the supplementor misses the additional benefits of these experiences. But, I asked, what if the person simply cannot absorb the nutrients of those experiences without a period of calibration? Or, what if they just cannot do it alone period, like my sister? Why isn't there grace for these people?
All that to say that there is no shame or inadequacy in using medication as an instrument to get through difficult times. Suboxone can stabilize you while you actively create a life that is fulfilling to you uniquely. And then when you have to taper down, you can use Robert_325's plan.
I suspect that you are also still withdrawing from your DOC. If you go back on the suboxone, remember to keep it as low as you can. Be patient during induction. How you start may effect how you finish. Then fill your days with new habits and new pursuits that will help to reset your course. It's a tool like any other and if you look at it that way, you will be in charge, not dependency.
You're brave. You have the capacity to do big things. That's not a common characteristic. Changing your life is brave. So is asking for help.
Please keep posting.
This quote that I found recently floored me: "Friendship is not a remedy for loneliness. Loneliness is part of our experience, and if we are looking for relief from our loneliness in friendship, we are only going to frustrate the friendship. Friendship, camaraderie, intimacy, all those things, and loneliness, lived together in the same experience." Rich Mullins
I am lonely in a room filled with loved ones. Always have been. I don't seek out new relationships because they are unfulfilling to me. I adore my family, but my self love is what I seek. Not being able to function like other people is isolating, but when I go with MY flow, I am content. Does that make sense?
If you are also lonely and not comforted like other people, then you can't find your resolutions like other people do. Time to go off course.
I asked my son, whom I homeschooled until he was teaching me, this question:
If we can reduce any human experience into the basic components of how it makes us FEEL, then we are talking about brain chemistry. People will say with absolute conviction that they cannot live without certain things like romantic love, parental love, drama, peace, sex, ambition, etc. Without these things, life isn't worth living.
And then they will see the person who feeds their brain chemicals directly as inadequate. Weak. Addicted. But isn't supplementing brain chemistry directly the same pursuit?
In fact, I would say that the person who finds balance via supplementation is less injurious to society because they don't use other people to get their mentally gratifying experiences.
His response is that, like the difference between taking a multi-vitamin and eating a balanced diet, the supplementor misses the additional benefits of these experiences. But, I asked, what if the person simply cannot absorb the nutrients of those experiences without a period of calibration? Or, what if they just cannot do it alone period, like my sister? Why isn't there grace for these people?
All that to say that there is no shame or inadequacy in using medication as an instrument to get through difficult times. Suboxone can stabilize you while you actively create a life that is fulfilling to you uniquely. And then when you have to taper down, you can use Robert_325's plan.
I suspect that you are also still withdrawing from your DOC. If you go back on the suboxone, remember to keep it as low as you can. Be patient during induction. How you start may effect how you finish. Then fill your days with new habits and new pursuits that will help to reset your course. It's a tool like any other and if you look at it that way, you will be in charge, not dependency.
You're brave. You have the capacity to do big things. That's not a common characteristic. Changing your life is brave. So is asking for help.
Please keep posting.
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n1ghtcrawl3r
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- Dec 22, 2017
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I will keep posting I promise, I'm getting a lot out of talking to you guys and it's making me feel less isolated.
ElleAZ, you've pretty much managed to summarise my personality in a few paragraphs haha. I'm a relatively outgoing person, and I have an amazing support group when it comes to friends and family, but inside my chest I have a hole the size of the sun. There's a chronic longing for self love and connection that I've never been able to resolve without the use of medication.
The pursuit of money, love, fame, friendship, health and education is the pursuit of trying to obtain happiness externally. My addiction with opiates is that same pursuit. It's the the stigma associated with drug addiction that makes me feel so socially inadequate. I can over look this though, as I know there's a part of it that's not my fault. I don't WANT to be a drug addict. I have never wanted to be in so much pain, but somehow my life choices have led me down this path, and although I take full responsibility, I can not control my own mind 100% of the time.
I just can't .. Whether that's because of a "mental illness" or not remains unknown.
And oh yeah ... When I have my flow, I'm unstoppable. But that's only available in sporadic and unreliable waves. I have no real mental stability happening atm lol.
Anyways .... To the point ->
Today was day 5 without any REAL opiates (I don't really count codeine anymore as the buzz is non-existent). I dosed 2mg of Suboxone this morning (sublingually), and I think the BA for sublingual Suboxone is like 15-30% .. Right now I feel normal. The relief from my own thoughts was pretty much instantaneous, and after chucking the 2mg under my tongue and driving into town, I noticed that by the time I got home I was really excited to call my friends and see what they are doing today.
Over the last 5 days (having been naked from opiates [haha I like that term so I'm using it now!]), my physical withdrawals have been tolerable. I've experienced RLS, hot & cold sweats, that horrible back pain, and a very aggressive colon lol. My psychological withdrawals, however, are the worst.
Alright ... I'm gonna make a coffee and check back in later. I feel like my posts aren't making a lot of sense at the moment, but maybe that will change once I have levelled out emotionally.
Love
ElleAZ, you've pretty much managed to summarise my personality in a few paragraphs haha. I'm a relatively outgoing person, and I have an amazing support group when it comes to friends and family, but inside my chest I have a hole the size of the sun. There's a chronic longing for self love and connection that I've never been able to resolve without the use of medication.
The pursuit of money, love, fame, friendship, health and education is the pursuit of trying to obtain happiness externally. My addiction with opiates is that same pursuit. It's the the stigma associated with drug addiction that makes me feel so socially inadequate. I can over look this though, as I know there's a part of it that's not my fault. I don't WANT to be a drug addict. I have never wanted to be in so much pain, but somehow my life choices have led me down this path, and although I take full responsibility, I can not control my own mind 100% of the time.
I just can't .. Whether that's because of a "mental illness" or not remains unknown.
And oh yeah ... When I have my flow, I'm unstoppable. But that's only available in sporadic and unreliable waves. I have no real mental stability happening atm lol.
Anyways .... To the point ->
Today was day 5 without any REAL opiates (I don't really count codeine anymore as the buzz is non-existent). I dosed 2mg of Suboxone this morning (sublingually), and I think the BA for sublingual Suboxone is like 15-30% .. Right now I feel normal. The relief from my own thoughts was pretty much instantaneous, and after chucking the 2mg under my tongue and driving into town, I noticed that by the time I got home I was really excited to call my friends and see what they are doing today.
Over the last 5 days (having been naked from opiates [haha I like that term so I'm using it now!]), my physical withdrawals have been tolerable. I've experienced RLS, hot & cold sweats, that horrible back pain, and a very aggressive colon lol. My psychological withdrawals, however, are the worst.
Alright ... I'm gonna make a coffee and check back in later. I feel like my posts aren't making a lot of sense at the moment, but maybe that will change once I have levelled out emotionally.
Love
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wolf359loki
Bluelighter
Anyways .... To the point ->
Today was day 5 without any REAL opiates (I don't really count codeine anymore as the buzz is non-existent). I dosed 2mg of Suboxone this morning (sublingually), and I think the BA for sublingual Suboxone is like 15-30% .. Right now I feel normal. The relief from my own thoughts was pretty much instantaneous, and after chucking the 2mg under my tongue and driving into town, I noticed that by the time I got home I was really excited to call my friends and see what they are doing today.
Over the last 5 days (having been naked from opiates [haha I like that term so I'm using it now!]), my physical withdrawals have been tolerable. I've experienced RLS, hot & cold sweats, that horrible back pain, and a very aggressive colon lol. My psychological withdrawals, however, are the worst.
Love
I have been quietly to reading all your updates. I am now at about the 42 hour of my battle with WD. So far I have been sticking to my plann.
But I need to call you out on that codeine comment. It was my go to drug for me. I don't want to even think about all the hand fulls I have done. Please you can't be a bit of a junkie (yes that word). Just like you can't be a bit pregnant hahahah. Throw them away love.
So far i have been sticking to my plan too. I haven't had to suffered to much, but I am using every trick I could find to increase the Bio availability. The alcohol mouth rinses has been great. I don't really drink so no worries there.
I brroke up my 10 pills and carefully weighted it out and split the suboxone up. It was about 2am I took about half the tablet and surprisingly it wasn't that bad of a taste. It took a bit of time but that old familiar feeling of you WD moving away. Except not as much as normally get.
Like I mentioned before I made some gelatin capsules of various thing. Mostly health stuff like vitamins and stuff. Nothing but OTC. It also contained 4 blotters/doses of LSD. It has worked surprisingly well!!.
LSD is not something to be taken lightly. T would not recommend this to most other peropl. I have used it a lot in my 20 (nearly 50 now). I was tripping wonderfully.
I will using more for sure. Maybe the weekend.
i will check in again later or in the morning.
Stay strong.
n1ghtcrawl3r
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- Dec 22, 2017
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Hi All,
Sorry for the late reply, I've just been super busy this Christmas holidays and have been catching up with old friends. Today is my 3rd day back on 2mg Suboxone and although I'm disappointed in myself for not being able to accomplish sobriety so easily, I feel happy.
And also reaaaaally tired lol .. So I might have a little nap and come back a bit later on. I feel as though I'll be able to make more of a contribution if I have a little nanna nap
Zzzzzzz ......
Sorry for the late reply, I've just been super busy this Christmas holidays and have been catching up with old friends. Today is my 3rd day back on 2mg Suboxone and although I'm disappointed in myself for not being able to accomplish sobriety so easily, I feel happy.
And also reaaaaally tired lol .. So I might have a little nap and come back a bit later on. I feel as though I'll be able to make more of a contribution if I have a little nanna nap
Zzzzzzz ......
n1ghtcrawl3r
Greenlighter
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- Dec 22, 2017
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Day 5: Just a really quick update (I have been off camping with some friends and haven't had reception) .. Still feeling pretty good. Obviously there's still a part of me that is really doubting my decision, but there's also a part of me that is really enjoying the contentment that I'm feeling at the moment. I guess I just feel like a normal person. I'm sure that I've felt like a normal person in the past, but I guess there's just something about buprenorphine ..
I will perhaps have some more to say tomorrow, but for now, goodnight
I will perhaps have some more to say tomorrow, but for now, goodnight
n1ghtcrawl3r
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- Dec 22, 2017
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Day 6: Still chipping away .. Nothing has really changed and my mood is still pleasant. My brother actually ended up coming home early as he was withdrawing from opiates, but that's a story for another time. I have a lot of stuff that I would like to say but I just don't seem to have the motivation to write much lately. I've decided not to force myself into updating this thread/journal as I don't want to ruin a good thing and write long and extensive messages if I'm not in the mood.
I hope everyone is enjoying the new year and I wish you guys all the best xoxo
I hope everyone is enjoying the new year and I wish you guys all the best xoxo
n1ghtcrawl3r
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- Dec 22, 2017
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God damn it ... I just wrote out a massive update and then copied it to my clipboard. I then proceeded to lose all of my information like a dickhead 
I was basically just saying that it's day 7 and I feel content and chill
I'll post again soon, and I hope everyone is having a killer holiday !! xoxo
I was basically just saying that it's day 7 and I feel content and chill
I'll post again soon, and I hope everyone is having a killer holiday !! xoxo
wolf359loki
Bluelighter
Hello
Hope everything is going well for you. I am doing better now and still tapering down my suboxone. At 0.5mg a day now and will cut that in half by Sunday. Next week I will start using some peptides instead of the recommended benzos and other drugs suggested here for comfort.
I had Semax and Selank on hand and will start taking them on Monday or Tuesday. I want to settle at 0.25mg of suboxone first and allow my body to get used to that level. I don't think I will go down lower as it gets harder to measure such small amounts. Instead I will space out my doses farther apart. From every 24 hours to 30 hours, then 36 hours and so on until I reach a point where WD is setting in. I think that should be at about 48 hours between doses. Then I will step off and hope the peptides work to reduce the mental side effects.
On a positive note I have noticed a measured increase in my sex drive. It had of course suffered due to the opioids in the past year or so. Before that my drive was always very high. I am very glad it has started to return.
Hope everything is going well for you. I am doing better now and still tapering down my suboxone. At 0.5mg a day now and will cut that in half by Sunday. Next week I will start using some peptides instead of the recommended benzos and other drugs suggested here for comfort.
I had Semax and Selank on hand and will start taking them on Monday or Tuesday. I want to settle at 0.25mg of suboxone first and allow my body to get used to that level. I don't think I will go down lower as it gets harder to measure such small amounts. Instead I will space out my doses farther apart. From every 24 hours to 30 hours, then 36 hours and so on until I reach a point where WD is setting in. I think that should be at about 48 hours between doses. Then I will step off and hope the peptides work to reduce the mental side effects.
On a positive note I have noticed a measured increase in my sex drive. It had of course suffered due to the opioids in the past year or so. Before that my drive was always very high. I am very glad it has started to return.
n1ghtcrawl3r
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- Dec 22, 2017
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Hey Wolf,
Sorry for the late reply mate, and I hope everything is going OK for you too ! (It definitely sounds like you're making some good progression there).
So this means that today would be your 5th day on a low dose of 0.25mg ? .. How are you feeling at this dose ? .. I am interested in knowing what kind of mental side effects you're experiencing (if any) as I can only imagine that I'll be in a situation that is very similar to yours over the next 12 months.
Currently, I am still on 2mg a day, and today would technically be day 14 back on the subs. I had a bit of a slip up on Monday and ended up taking 4mg in one day, as I had a left-over takeaway at home.
Glad to hear your sex-drive is back too hahaha. Always an important part of life
Looking forward to hearing back from you
Sorry for the late reply mate, and I hope everything is going OK for you too ! (It definitely sounds like you're making some good progression there).
So this means that today would be your 5th day on a low dose of 0.25mg ? .. How are you feeling at this dose ? .. I am interested in knowing what kind of mental side effects you're experiencing (if any) as I can only imagine that I'll be in a situation that is very similar to yours over the next 12 months.
Currently, I am still on 2mg a day, and today would technically be day 14 back on the subs. I had a bit of a slip up on Monday and ended up taking 4mg in one day, as I had a left-over takeaway at home.
Glad to hear your sex-drive is back too hahaha. Always an important part of life
Looking forward to hearing back from you
wolf359loki
Bluelighter
So far the adjustment has been the toughest yet. I really noticed the lower dose and it has been uncomfortable but I am managing to deal with it. I haven't added the peptides yet as I want to first settle a bit and know I am not going to increase up as that has been very tempting. I may split the dose to every 12 hours to help. Not had to yet but it's an option.
I will update in a day or two and let you know how it's going. Been reading a lot on here and that has helped keep me motivated for sure.
I will update in a day or two and let you know how it's going. Been reading a lot on here and that has helped keep me motivated for sure.