RCs Pyrazolam for sleep

[lyma]

Just a query about R/C. Doe pyrazolam have sedative hypnotic properties compared to etizest. My friend was trying to taper from one to other to avoid tolerance and only needed sleep. He does not do any other R/C for any other purpose ie highs, has a professional role and works shifts but he cannot sleep well. Long term he doesnt want to take Z or stronger antihistamines takes melatonin each night with other R/C OR Promethazine which has irreversible long term effects such as tardive dyskinesia.
He tried diclazepam and found it relaxed him but not strong enough for sleep. Any advice welcomed.

 

[crazycatman]

Not really no, maybe if you're really sensitive to benzos or take a huge dose. But normal (0.5mg - 1mg) doses shouldn't be all that hypnotic. Of the 'rc' (ok, etizolam isn't a rc) benzos the best ones for sleep are etizolam and diclazepam (don't know about flubromazepam since I haven't tried it). What doses did your friend take? I know some benzo equivalency charts put 1mg etizolam at the same strength as 10mg diazepam but lots of people (me included) would put it closer to 1mg etizolam .. 5mg diazepam. And diclazepam is (for me anyway) half as strong as etizolam (so 1mg etizolam ... 2 mg diclazepam .. 5 mg diazepam) but lasts longer. Also, if he's expecting to just be knocked out by the benzos the doses required go way up (not that I'm suggesting it).

Now all that being said using benzos long term for sleep is in most (like 99%) cases a bad idea because they stop working (the hypnotic effect is one of the first ones you develop tolerance for) and you become addicted.

The pharmaceutical treatment of insomnia is good for people with occasional problems but for chronic insomnia it mostly sucks. The only thing that worked for me was GHB (if used just 1 or 2 per night tolerance and addiction shouldn't be a problem or at least weren't for me). However due to the whole date rape drug label it has it's practically impossible to get it legally. And if you decide to dose more often you will get addicted and have a really bad withdrawal.

 

[bunge]

Ime pyrazolam isnt any good for sleep. It has a mild anxiolytic effect and a decent muscle relaxant effect but almost zero hypnotic effect (the bit thats good for sleep).
Its all very individual obviously as everyone experiences benzos slightly differently but dont expect pyrazolam to match etizolam as their completely different beasts.

 

[lyma]

Thanks for the info. My friend would love to sleep normally but takes regular etizolam 2 to 3 times week may one or two, plus 9mg melatonin each night. On the other nights melatonin plus 50mg promethazine which causes really bad side effects long term. Zopiclone 15mg some nights and tolerance has been an issue. So as Docs will not prescribe hypnotic he had to try alternatives to get just 4/5 hours sleep. I know nothing about R/C just have greater knowledge of prescription medication as a health occupation is familiar to my friend and me. Tremors, eye twitches, memory loss, hangover effect the next day are all side effects he gets due to long term use over 3/4 years. Just wished there was something to help him sleep without the side effects. His GP wont prescribed the guidance of diazepam in the Ashton manual to withdraw so its difficult as he cant work without sleep especially in the professional work he carries out.

 

[bunge]

Its a shitty deal that us chronic insomniacs get because theres alot of shortterm aids for sleep but very little for longterm use.
Mirtazapine might be an option though. Its a mild antidepressant but in small doses has a very strong antihistamine effect (much more so then promethazine) and side effects-wise just causes some weighgain and daytime drowsiness. If your friends ok with these side effects then the docs shouldnt have a problem prescribing it longterm as its not considered addictive.

 

[Psychonauticunt]

Just a query about R/C. Doe pyrazolam have sedative hypnotic properties compared to etizest. My friend was trying to taper from one to other to avoid tolerance and only needed sleep. He does not do any other R/C for any other purpose ie highs, has a professional role and works shifts but he cannot sleep well. Long term he doesnt want to take Z or stronger antihistamines takes melatonin each night with other R/C OR Promethazine which has irreversible long term effects such as tardive dyskinesia.
He tried diclazepam and found it relaxed him but not strong enough for sleep. Any advice welcomed.

Compared to etizolam and benzodiazepines, pyrazolam has absolutely negligible sedative/hypnotic properties. It is highly specific in its anxiolytic action and I only found it to be sedative at high doses combined with alcohol. Etizolam is far more sedative. Even when administered intravenously pyrazolam was decidedly non-sedative.

 

[Repulse]

Compared to etizolam and benzodiazepines, pyrazolam has absolutely negligible sedative/hypnotic properties. It is highly specific in its anxiolytic action and I only found it to be sedative at high doses combined with alcohol. Etizolam is far more sedative. Even when administered intravenously pyrazolam was decidedly non-sedative.

Exactly.
Diclazepam is excellent for sleep, by the way. Better than Etizolam IME

 

[Moreaux]

Please tell your friend not to venture too far down the road of xxx.pam pills. They are so highly addictive, and the withdrawal will literally tear your soul from your body. Also, one cannot quit cold turkey after using them for any length of time without horrible, lasting seizures. Has your friend tried Trazadone - granted, not pleasant, but it is both efficient and non-habit forming. Personally, after a ten year benzo run, I use both Trazadone and melatonin for sleep and they work - no high, but I can sleep.

 

[.:Holy::Toast:.]

Just from anecdotal reports, pyrazolam doesn't possess the sedative properties that other benzos have, or not to the same degree.
It is generally used more as an anxiolytic and a functional benzo because you can take it during the day and not really get sedated

 

[dopemegently]

Imo this is no sedative, but I sleep very well on it, as it really slows down your racing thoughts (a problem for me).

The thing with pyraz is, I find it highly effective, but only at high doses; say 3mg at least. I think a lot of people are writing this drug off because they're simply taking too low doses. The drug is far cheaper than other rc benzos, and I think the vendors are compensating for this by making the doses so low ie false economy.

 

[velmwend]

Insomnia plagues me, too, and I've found that 2 nights a week etiz and 1 night a week phenibut, helps. I know it's only 3 nights but it's good for maintaining at least *some* level of half decent sleep, if spread out over the week.

Mirtazapine was horrendous - I felt groggy and tired all day. Ceased after three weeks. Amazing dreams though.

Trazodone cured my insomnia but killed my sex drive stone dead and I had to cease taking it due to cardiovascular troubles.

Interestingly, I took 1mg pyrazolam last night, and I slept okay, but it's not as effective as etiz.

Like Bunge said, insomniacs get a shitty deal, and we have to find our own way. All I get from my doctors is 'too bad, try drinking warm milk and reading a boring book'.

 

[Moreaux]

Please keep in mind that while people give their opinions - not discounting their opinions - it is still a benzo and will still cause copious amounts of issues with long term use. If you decide to go this route, use sparingly to avoid addiction. Benzos have a nasty withdrawal.

Kind regards and hoping you good sleep!

 

[benzoman12345]

This should answer ur question about Pyraz, every morning My Mrs brings me in a cup of tea in bed and I take 8 pellets, 4mg Pyrazolam , empty stomach because it's water soluble, 10 minutes later I wake up and get the kids ready , do what I have to do that day , weather it be working or going to the gym, these tablets wake me up in the morning and lift my mood, They are not sleepers. They are like speeders to me.

Diclazepam will get u a sleep but a I think u may be a bit groggy the next day,

Etizolam makes me violent and aggressive ,

Zolpidem 5mg , 10 at the very most is nice a little hypnotic just enough to make me in the mood for going to bed, a lot better than Zopicline that does nothing for me,

Trazadone or Amitriptyline will knock anybody out at the correct dose, but does your friend want to take anti-depressants? I personally have had a great experience with Amitriptyline fall asleep before u even know ur tired , deep deep sleep, bouncing out of bed early bells with eyes like black puddings absolutely buzzing, if there was something I had to do that day it got done ! Mind you that was 150mg

Your friend could rotate between Etiz and Zolpidem, and tire him/herself out maybe with excersise or a nice spliff, rotating 2-3 drugs that aren't the exact same family.

Depending on what kind of person ur friend is codeine with anti-histamines 1 night, Fairly high dose hypnotic benzo and a z-drug combined the next.

I used to use Largactil (Chlorpromazine) for sleep , I still have them for case of emergency , they knock me out, regardless of what drug ur friend takes if ur friend smokes weed it will always potentiate it , just a few ideas.

My personal choice - Amitriptyline with a cheese spliff and Zolpidem for back ups %) ...