• HEALTH & RECOVERY
    Welcome Guest
    Posting Rules Bluelight Rules Thread Directory 1 Thread Directory 2
    Mindfulness Links Addiction & Mind
    Sober Living Partner Program (SLiPP)
  • H&R Moderators: VerbalTruist | cdin | Lil'LinaptkSix

Pushing people away

Atelier3 said:
Snap. This could be me exactly. I have absolutely no problem initially interacting with people and (as far as I can tell) most people who meet me think I am a super nice stand-up kind of guy. I’ve basically never turned down an opportunity to help someone to the extent of my abilities and within the bounds of common sense (I’m not re-homing the homeless guys in my neighbourhood in my spare room for example).

Yet I basically have no friends except a few people who are weirdly persistent about staying connected to me but that I don’t really see often.

I’ve spent years trying to understand this because I actually feel really lonely in life. At different times in my life I thought it was different things. In no particular order:

1. My tendency to push boundaries when manic (way worse when younger). I would do risky things outside the bounds of what people around me would consider socially acceptable. People just felt I might unexpectedly embarrass them in front of their other friends/parents/employers.

2. My tendency towards introspection that makes me go silent for long periods. People apparently assume I’m angry with them or not interested in them or not engaged with being with them. In actual fact I just tend to forget that they are there while I’m thinking my thoughts.

3. My actual anger (way worse when younger). This was a non-specific anger not about anyone or anything in particular, but it would cause me to shut down people and conversations with a sarcastic, cruel, or dismissive one-liner. It was like I was daring people to keep liking me in spite of revealing myself to deep down be a cunt.

4. Being intellectually intimidating and making people feel insecure. I used to think I was always right and I never hesitated about making every question the topic for a winner-takes-all-debate in which I had to prove I was right. I most often was, but I really lacked any empathy for the other person because I thought only the idea mattered and it wasn’t personal. But people always take things personally unless they are actually in debate club.

Basically, I can/could put on really charming and engaging persona when first interacting with people but over time other aspects of my personality would start leaking out and scare/upset/alienate people. However, I don’t think I am psychopathic because that initial engaging persona was authentically me also - just not all of me. Though as I get older I think it is becoming a bigger part of me - but now I am gun-shy about trying to make new friendships/relationships.
Click to expand...
Wow. Excellent analysis. This is also me to a "t".

I tend to fall into codependencies with long term lovers, and the one or two friendships that I concurrently maintain show some aspects of codependency. I have had many of those friendships over the years, suggesting I also push them away only on my own timeline.

If I am using CM I don't make that good first impression, ever, except with other people who are high on almost anything. It might be the intensity of my sunken eyes, furrowed brow, clenched jaw and grinding teeth.
 
I think it went well. We got a drink and went for a walk by a river and talked for 5 hours. He said he enjoyed it a lot. We both seem to get along well, haven’t really had that with someone... before. It’s funny, he admitted the last girl he dated for 3 months and he only ever kissed her. Then as he dropped me off I kissed his cheek and he was ecstatic he even got a kiss 😂
 
Sirena Oscura said:
I think it went well. We got a drink and went for a walk by a river and talked for 5 hours. He said he enjoyed it a lot. We both seem to get along well, haven’t really had that with someone... before. It’s funny, he admitted the last girl he dated for 3 months and he only ever kissed her. Then as he dropped me off I kissed his cheek and he was ecstatic he even got a kiss 😂
Click to expand...
Can I ask you something? He doesn’t lose any points for taking things slow with you?

I have almost no ability to tell if a female is into me or not. She’s gotta be throwing some pretty strong signals, like basically refer to us bumping uglies in the future, for me to know 💯. In that case I don’t wait for the end of the date to kiss her, and I haven’t been wrong yet. I wouldn’t be on the date if I wasn’t already attracted to the woman, so unless she shoots a rocket or something goes catastrophic with her personality, I want to either:
1) seal the deal
2) get a second date
This is a secondary objective of course, I know primarily I want to show her a fun time being myself. But it gets really crucial near the end of the date.

Trouble is, too many times to count, I have made the call that she isn’t into me, not go for that first date kiss, only to find out she was only turned off because she thinks I’m a pussy for not trying to kiss her. I can’t remember the saying, I think it is German, but one of these women told me it goes something like “you can’t tell for sure until you kiss him”.

I’ve gone for it and been rejected a few times and my ego has always withstood those blows fine, so it’s not like I’m afraid of that. The other case is I know 💯 we weren’t compatible despite that initial attraction in which case I don’t really bother trying to progress to “I don’t like you much sex”.

edit: all the feminists I banged in college would chastise me for callling women chicks
 
jrws said:
Can I ask you something? He doesn’t lose any points for taking things slow with you?

I have almost no ability to tell if a female is into me or not. She’s gotta be throwing some pretty strong signals, like basically refer to us bumping uglies in the future, for me to know 💯. In that case I don’t wait for the end of the date to kiss her, and I haven’t been wrong yet. I wouldn’t be on the date if I wasn’t already attracted to the woman, so unless she shoots a rocket or something goes catastrophic with her personality, I want to either:
1) seal the deal
2) get a second date
This is a secondary objective of course, I know primarily I want to show her a fun time being myself. But it gets really crucial near the end of the date.

Trouble is, too many times to count, I have made the call that she isn’t into me, not go for that first date kiss, only to find out she was only turned off because she thinks I’m a pussy for not trying to kiss her. I can’t remember the saying, I think it is German, but one of these women told me it goes something like “you can’t tell for sure until you kiss him”.

I’ve gone for it and been rejected a few times and my ego has always withstood those blows fine, so it’s not like I’m afraid of that. The other case is I know 💯 we weren’t compatible despite that initial attraction in which case I don’t really bother trying to progress to “I don’t like you much sex”.

edit: all the feminists I banged in college would chastise me for callling women chicks
Click to expand...

For me, no he doesn’t lose points. We talked a lot before we met so I had a decent idea about him, then when we met and talked for so long we shared a lot of personal information most people would probably avoid on a first date (guys always say they just feel “comfortable” talking to me- but for the first time I actually felt comfortable telling him things too). When we texted I could tell he wasn’t like other guys because he never said anything sexual - I figured there’s either a problem in the bedroom or he’s just not a sleaze. When we met he wasn’t like other blokes I’ve dated, he didn’t touch me inappropriately at all. He actually *gained* points for that. I’ve been with a few guys that aren’t confident about “making the first move” and it seemed to fit this guy’s profile too. He told me he doesn’t even have sexual on the first date (new to me). Again, gained points because I only sleep with guys on the first date because they want to, not me. I prefer to get to know someone and have a proper “connection”. Maybe date 2 or 3. I need to know there’s potential to go somewhere- one date isn’t enough to suss that out for me. I’m not looking for a fuck buddy, I’m looking for a long term relationship. So although I haven’t slept with anyone in about 4 months and I’m thirsty af, I’d still prefer to wait with this guy too. Not 3 months though! It told me about his character though- not just that he probably isn’t the type to make the first move, but also that he’s not just in things for sex.

Personally I’m bad at letting people know I’m into them. I think this is the first time I felt comfortable to hint at it (only because I knew he wasn’t a sleaze so he wouldn’t take it as a signal to come fuck me)- when we looked at some of his photos on his phone I said he looked cute a lot. He eventually felt comfortable enough to sit closer to me, but not touch. It actually meant a lot to me. I digress- so I’m bad at making the first move too, even in a relationship. I’m usually just like “hey wanna fuck?” I’m not super subtle about it or try to seduce them... I’m just a dork. Eventually I will tell this guy the best way to tell me he wants to have sex without “telling me” (like kissing my neck) but often even that is too hard for some guys. Personally, I don’t hold that against them. I’m not looking for an alpha male, I’m looking for someone I’m compatible with on a deeper level so something like lacking the confidence to make the first move isn’t going to make a difference to me if he’s right in every other way. Besides, equality man, chicks can and should make the first move too.

Suggestion though- definitely kiss them on the first date at the end if you think it went well and you’re attracted to her. It’s a normal thing when dating, so you have nothing to worry about. It will tell you if she’s into you, too. I guess I can’t comment about the sex thing though as I’m probably maybe different in that I’ve had enough of fucking on the first date because a guy was pushy about it only to find I really didn’t like him anyway. I guess you have to flirt heavily and see how she reacts.
 
Sirena Oscura said:
Again, gained points because I only sleep with guys on the first date because they want to, not me.
Click to expand...
Thank for sharing so thoroughly. It is rare that I get an insight into the female psyche like this one.

I slept with my ex wife on the first date, and now I understand why her face would fall whenever I would reference our first date. If we were alone, she would chastise herself for sleeping with me that night, as she had resolved not to do just that prior to it happening. From what she was saying out loud, I couldn’t understand why she also seemed to resent me for it but now it makes perfect sense.
 
jrws said:
Thank for sharing so thoroughly. It is rare that I get an insight into the female psyche like this one.

I slept with my ex wife on the first date, and now I understand why her face would fall whenever I would reference our first date. If we were alone, she would chastise herself for sleeping with me that night, as she had resolved not to do just that prior to it happening. From what she was saying out loud, I couldn’t understand why she also seemed to resent me for it but now it makes perfect sense.
Click to expand...

Nice to know other women struggle with it too (I don’t have any female friends so I wouldn’t know how common it is that we sleep with guys before we actually want to). I also put myself down for not being more assertive and telling a guy no. Although telling a guy “no” one time didn’t make a difference so I think that’s where it comes from- the thought that if I say no, it won’t matter anyway so just go along with it. I’m not super keen on hurting someone’s feelings by rejecting them. It’s a bad quality... not an easy thing to learn though. Hence, not meeting guys for a while and pushing them away until I found this guy who didn’t give me that vibe.
 
Atelier3 said:
Snap. This could be me exactly. I have absolutely no problem initially interacting with people and (as far as I can tell) most people who meet me think I am a super nice stand-up kind of guy. I’ve basically never turned down an opportunity to help someone to the extent of my abilities and within the bounds of common sense (I’m not re-homing the homeless guys in my neighbourhood in my spare room for example).

Yet I basically have no friends except a few people who are weirdly persistent about staying connected to me but that I don’t really see often.

I’ve spent years trying to understand this because I actually feel really lonely in life. At different times in my life I thought it was different things. In no particular order:

1. My tendency to push boundaries when manic (way worse when younger). I would do risky things outside the bounds of what people around me would consider socially acceptable. People just felt I might unexpectedly embarrass them in front of their other friends/parents/employers.

2. My tendency towards introspection that makes me go silent for long periods. People apparently assume I’m angry with them or not interested in them or not engaged with being with them. In actual fact I just tend to forget that they are there while I’m thinking my thoughts.

3. My actual anger (way worse when younger). This was a non-specific anger not about anyone or anything in particular, but it would cause me to shut down people and conversations with a sarcastic, cruel, or dismissive one-liner. It was like I was daring people to keep liking me in spite of revealing myself to deep down be a cunt.

4. Being intellectually intimidating and making people feel insecure. I used to think I was always right and I never hesitated about making every question the topic for a winner-takes-all-debate in which I had to prove I was right. I most often was, but I really lacked any empathy for the other person because I thought only the idea mattered and it wasn’t personal. But people always take things personally unless they are actually in debate club.

Basically, I can/could put on really charming and engaging persona when first interacting with people but over time other aspects of my personality would start leaking out and scare/upset/alienate people. However, I don’t think I am psychopathic because that initial engaging persona was authentically me also - just not all of me. Though as I get older I think it is becoming a bigger part of me - but now I am gun-shy about trying to make new friendships/relationships.
Click to expand...
I would like to highlight this one, to shed light on the content, that kind of thing comes from profound analysis provoked by narcissistic parents i would say
 
- emotionally neglecting parents
- severe trauma with no help from anyone (8-10 panic attacks a day for 4 years until I found pot)
- learned to handle everything myself out of necessity
- diamond hard walls around me

So yes it's hard to relate..

I have a lot of difficulty judging how other people see me, always have. I am a deft conversationalist and very attuned to nonverbal communication. I am a flirt (or whatever for a guy)

But ultimately everyone leaves. So is that the opposite? I lost 20 friends when my ex wife divorced me (while I was in a coma.. like that one? heh. fuck that).

I get pushed. Maybe that's a separate thread.

I am a boy
 
Sorry for deleting this. Just felt like i was demonizing myself. @MsDiz did a great job helping me though.

Chilling with @ControlDaddy RN - he convinced me that it's helpful to people to have this real talk.

Y'all can take it away now.

Hopefully y'all can help each other out like y'all did me.
 
Things have been a bit emotionally charged between me and the guy I’ve started to see. I’ve had to reassure him I’m into him a number of times and now I’m worried I have or will reassure him too well and he won’t expect it/will be upset if things don’t work out between us. I feel myself pushing him away... he’s still using pet names (like babe) but I’ve stopped... sigh. I’m wondering if I’m doing the right thing or or I’m “pushing him away” pathologically. Only time will tell I guess...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top