Psychedelics and fear of psychosis...

[Material541]

Hello everyone, I would like to hear what you all have to say about my situation. I actually posted a similar thread in PD but due to my inept computer skills I kind of lost track of it. But only did I recently discover The Dark Side and I feel a thread here would be a good idea, where I can focus more on my psychological state rather than the drugs.

Anyway, to put it very briefly, I had a panic attack on 4-AcO-DET & JWH-018 and have been sporadically feeling anxious and depersonalized since.

A few months ago I had a very frightening trip on the aforementioned substances where I wrongly believed I had accidentally cut my finger and spilled blood all over my bed sheets. In reality, I was simply tricked by the artstyle of my bedsheets. Nevertheless, I was thrown into a state of extreme panic when this happened. I remember looking at my fingers and seeing dark blotches on them. I quickly realized everything was okay. But I spent the rest of the trip pretty much panicking and wondering what the hell had happened.

For the next few weeks, I was feeling rather depersonalized and anxious. Constantly worrying about my mental state and what was wrong with me. I didn’t feel quite right at all. Almost as if I wasn’t in control of my actions, as if I was trapped in some strange body. These effects have slowly subsided (that is, until I smoked a bit too much weed the other day. The feelings have kinda returned, but I understand what I am experiencing this time and expect them to subside once again).

My main source of anxiety is that I am somehow going to go crazy. Or that I am already crazy. Everytime I would hear a strange noise or something strange would happen, I would second guess my self and fear that I had imagined the whole thing. This would often lead to minor panic attacks, where I would feel as if somehow I was being stuck in time. Very difficult to explain.

When I was at my worst, I would read symptoms for various mental illnesses (such as schizophrenia) and get panic attacks, even though I didn’t really fit the criteria of the illnesses. Even now my heart races a bit when I read up on psychosis and things like that.

Any ideas on why I have been experiencing this? It seems so bizarre…

I have seen a psychologist, who has attributed most of my symptoms due to low self-esteem and problems with assertiveness, and things like that. But this was my psychologist at school (at a 4-year university, to be exact) so I presume I could get better help elsewhere. Having neither money nor insurance, this is not currently possible.

Prior to this series of events, I had no prior psychological problems at all. No panic attacks, anxiety, or anything like that. Just low self-esteem, undecisiveness, things like that. Nothing really concerning.

I want to say that I have mild HPPD, but its nothing more than some tracers, visual snow, and shape shifting objects if I focus really hard on it. From what I’ve read though, that is relatively normal.

Since then, I have had the occasional alcoholic drink (maybe once every two weeks or so. But this strangely make me a bit anxious and depersonalized for some reason), used O-Desmethyltramadol regularly (very relieving in my symptoms), some cocaine on three occasions (strangely, felt no effects at all), and inhaled some nitrous oxide perhaps every other week (caused a minor panic attack once). I haven’t had a psychedelic drug since that event. But I had smoke weed occasionally since then, even though it would cause some anxiety if I did too much. After a terrible experience couple of night ago though, I will give up weed for good. In fact, I will give up all the aforementioned drugs starting today.

Another reason why I wanted to create this thread is because I plan on going on a road trip this following week (SoCal to Seattle) and want to take a small dose of a psychedelic drug. Specifically 4-AcO-DMT, and specifically a dose of perhaps 8-10mg. Would this be a particularly bad idea?

Hmmm, I think that is all I have to say for now.

I would like to hear what you all have to say! Thank you very much for reading.

 

[n3ophy7e]

Hi Material, firstly it really sucks you had such a bad trip, but it's good that you've done the right things afterwards by seeing a psychologist and working through the issues related to the bad trip, and now by quitting weed. That is awesome man, good work

If you want my honest answer regarding the road trip?? I think it's a really bad idea to try 4-AcO-DMT again after you had such a bad reaction to it last time. It's not worth it man. There's a chance that you might enjoy it and it might be great. But what if it is just as bad as the last trip, or even worse? Not worth the risk in my opinion.

But only you know how your current mental health is, and whether or not you think you could cope with the anxiety occurring again.

Just saying that if it was me, I definitely wouldn't take 4-AcO-DMT again.

Have fun on the road trip though man, with or without the drugs. Let us know how it goes

 

[Material541]

Hi Material, firstly it really sucks you had such a bad trip, but it's good that you've done the right things afterwards by seeing a psychologist and working through the issues related to the bad trip, and now by quitting weed. That is awesome man, good work

If you want my honest answer regarding the road trip?? I think it's a really bad idea to try 4-AcO-DMT again after you had such a bad reaction to it last time. It's not worth it man. There's a chance that you might enjoy it and it might be great. But what if it is just as bad as the last trip, or even worse? Not worth the risk in my opinion.

But only you know how your current mental health is, and whether or not you think you could cope with the anxiety occurring again.

Just saying that if it was me, I definitely wouldn't take 4-AcO-DMT again.

Have fun on the road trip though man, with or without the drugs. Let us know how it goes

Thank you very much for your input! You are right, it probably isn't worth the risk at all. I think the main reason I wanted to do it is just so that I know that I could handle it, you know? But having another bad trip would surely take me several steps backwards.

Oh and another thing, I am pretty confident it was the JWH-018 that was the primary cause of the bad trip. In fact, I was having one of the best trips ever before I decided to take a couple of massive hits.

I think I will prepare a capsule for my friend and myself and carry it along. If I feel I can handle it, then I'll take it. If not, then I'll have no regrets

 

[n3ophy7e]

Yeah you're probably right about the JWH man, I'm hearing an increasingly large number of negative psychological reactions to synthetic cannabinoids. Nasty stuff!!

Sounds like a good plan if you take a small amount for you and your friend each to have, and if you're in the right headspace and feel like you'll enjoy it, give it a try. Perhaps this time around if you're aware of what the possible bad trip feels like, you could potentially see it coming before it hits, and try to manage it before it gets too bad. Know what I mean?
Good luck, and let us know how you went if you do end up taking it

 

[blahman8000]

Like n3ophy7e said, it's good that you're taking the necessary steps to tackle these problems you've been dealing with. I have some experience in similar issues, myself. After a bad psilocybin mushroom trip back in 2006, I was having the most awful panic attacks imaginable. I'd spend excessive time reading up on mental illnesses and becoming convinced that I was suffering of them, schizophrenia being one of the big ones. I'd also contemplate all kinds of extremely nihilistic philosophies (I don't suggest ever doing this) and I'd become convinced that they were true. Every time I'd take even just a few hits of pot, I'd feel like I was going nuts.

I've tripped a few times on DXM since then without any bad experiences but never psilocybin, and now I'll probably never trip again. After what I went through following that bad trip, it's not worth it.

If you utilize your time in more positive and productive ways, I think you'll find yourself in a much better place. I managed to pull myself out of all that panic/excessive thinking by channeling my energy in healthier ways: getting out more, making friends, focusing on my job, playing music, writing, etc. Beforehand, I was always wondering how I could think myself out of these mental issues somehow, but that was always counterintuitive. I really don't suggest trying to trip again, but obviously that's for you to decide. If you do decide to give it a go, then try to take it slow in terms of dosage, and maybe have some benzos around in case things get bad. And good luck.

 

[Ixchellian]

I've never had a bad trip on LSD, psylocybin (or muscaria), or mescaline. And for the last two years of high-school, I did a lot of good ol' LSD25. I'm talking for weeks, I'd take a trip and as soon as I was feeling like I was getting back to "normal", I'd drop another couple sugar-cubes or sweet-tarts. Acid was actually easier for me to get than pot or likker, because I had a best friend who was a chemical engineering student at Michigan State and he made LSD because he could, and to help pay his tuition.
Oh, it was G0oD LSD. He never screwed with trying to make blotter tabs or any of that bullshit; he sold either the sweet-tarts, or in my case just vials because it was easier and I bought "weight".

Anyways... you actually feel the effects of LSD after the drug has left your system. And it's only in there for a few seconds, before it reaches the spinal fluid system and disappears. LSD basically rampages through your brain, rewiring neural connections and doing other stuff that medical science hasn't figured out yet.

Now... the cool thing about LSD is that when you trip, the conscious part of your mind (Id, or whatever you wanna call it) is partially partitioned off from the experiencing part of the brain. That's how normally we realize that it's a trip, and can actually control yourself instead of turning into a raving lunatic. Now.... the conscious part is actually working good, it's just that the connections between the two partitions are all scrambled up.
BUT.....
By force of will and reasoning in the Id, those connections can be still be managed, instead of going completely haywire. That's how you can control a trip; through music, conversation, light-displays, or focusing on the one thing in the room that isn't melting....
And mindset before taking a full excursion with LSD makes a big difference too.... If you go into it thinking about things being beautiful and enjoyable, then I can promise you'll never experience a bad trip. But if there's even that little doubt, that maybe you'll have a bad one, then that's what'll happen.... because it's the Id which is really controlling the trip, not the experiencing part. Unpleasant things will happen only if you let them.
Except....
The caveat is that if someone already experiencing some form of mental instability or neurosis takes LSD, their already tenuous grasp on reality and emotion will likely dissolve those remaining bonds, and because they can no longer differentiate between the experiencing and the observing, it can send them into a full-blown bad trip or psychosis.

I was quite the psychonaut for a lot of years, and I became very familiar with the different hallucinogens, as did my close friends. Together we made a sort of study-circle, and over time compared notes, etc. Common experiences we especially noted, since many things experienced during a psychedelic excursion are purely subjective.
Now... there is a big difference between a pure hallucinogen like LSD, and a potent disassociative like DXM. They're more.... messy, and it's a lot harder to actually control oneself during say.... a 3rd plateau DXM trip. At that level, all you can pretty much do is let go and enjoy the ride.... unless it makes you stumble and totally eat sidewalk, along with your teeth.
While I could go to Disney World and operate in a fairly coherent manner, I don't suggest it on any disassociative. Find a comfortable spot, put on some tunes, and fly away.

 

[Ixchellian]

How I just wrote all that on 60+ hours of no sleep is beyond me, since right now I can barely tie my shoes or figure out how to work the tv remote. Not that I care to, since it started pixellating & flashing colors all on it's own.

neato.

 

[Orangutangpsychopa]

'd say scary ideas come and most should silence. It won't happen if normal to get 6 numbers right many times but it should be lowest standard for being free...Never ever start to explain parents or friends any invented. They then explain back later that their on effexor and dexamphetamine and won't loose the game. Otherwise depending on culture it's slavery to some,usually some-one is helping to get on. Isn't addictions ridiculous to others. I just came by to say i didn't take anything but teleported 3 times, everything went shut like cat's eye, feeling more then 2400mg DXM(taken about 1600mg most), now my back hurts but i can see. I don't see any point to mention that humans are aggressive together. JWHs scare because something they explained elsewhere that kidneys, eggs and brains go to shit. Snitching it's called, if something very scary happens i can't remember it after, there are few points in memory that are messed with family traditions and school learnings of what possible did happen.

Some drug neuropsychiatric lesson in internet should explain what causes "Alice in wonderland", is it the dissociatives, something in zippo fluid and butane or SSRI/SNRI if purificated DXM or whatever. Or with what combinations...It's not embarassing that teleporting to think that what if i went nuts and huffed. But why white mushroom and other memory pictures. Their size doesn't change to others. Propably many forest mushrooms are kidney toxic. My back was hurting as a kid for a year, it's not delusional that connects to this current point. It's possible, even Desmond Leslie and George Adamski faked all to get extra money. they were UFO writers, does they complain why readers go nuts and believes. Or Terence McKenna. But that all kind of sooo networking ideas and cornishess exist that mind gets connected to some travel network which is pretty or kiddish.

Is it common that some unbalanced complain irregular things and happenings, some people like church roofs and can't stand ideas worse than violence. What it takes some time to get a important something because otherwise it's just television and fattening. Some just are curious and love life, but naturals could have DDT, it's poison, sprayed. Nothing forces to read some comics is almost a point. And if doesn't shame clothes it's good case. The problem lies in that that FOM is the mad case but some reason can do whatever or have medicines or quick case on mental hospital. He knows nothing from area outside laughing i claim. Realistic maybe MDMA overdose with sober girlfriend in a movie theater and can't remember or won't explain what the fuck. Seizures doesn't have any insides isn't true.

 

[Tenninethousand]

Like n3ophy7e said, it's good that you're taking the necessary steps to tackle these problems you've been dealing with. I have some experience in similar issues, myself. After a bad psilocybin mushroom trip back in 2006, I was having the most awful panic attacks imaginable. I'd spend excessive time reading up on mental illnesses and becoming convinced that I was suffering of them, schizophrenia being one of the big ones. I'd also contemplate all kinds of extremely nihilistic philosophies (I don't suggest ever doing this) and I'd become convinced that they were true. Every time I'd take even just a few hits of pot, I'd feel like I was going nuts.

I've tripped a few times on DXM since then without any bad experiences but never psilocybin, and now I'll probably never trip again. After what I went through following that bad trip, it's not worth it.

If you utilize your time in more positive and productive ways, I think you'll find yourself in a much better place. I managed to pull myself out of all that panic/excessive thinking by channeling my energy in healthier ways: getting out more, making friends, focusing on my job, playing music, writing, etc. Beforehand, I was always wondering how I could think myself out of these mental issues somehow, but that was always counterintuitive. I really don't suggest trying to trip again, but obviously that's for you to decide. If you do decide to give it a go, then try to take it slow in terms of dosage, and maybe have some benzos around in case things get bad. And good luck.

It's comforting to know that someone has been through the same mental confusion that I have. After a bad trip, I too convinced myself that I had random mental diseases or problems and would totally have panic attacks after smoking lose amounts. I now am in school and do not have as much free time to let my mind wonder and what not. I'm overcoming my problems but it was a frightening experience.