Health psyche habit - attached to transformation?

[sigmundfloyd25]

This is a long winded and honest view into my life, so I think I'll start with the question. Has anyone had a similar experience with psychedelics and how did you/(could you?) reform your relationship with them in a balanced and mindful way?

To me, psychedelics seem to be the least addictive class of drugs in their psychological effects, extreme introspection, the revealing of memories and emotions that have been buried, they force us to face our inner demons and skeletons in the closet through an intensely magnified lens. I always think of these tool lyrics,

I've been crawling on my belly
Clearing out what could've been.
I've been wallowing in my own confused
And insecure delusions
For a piece to cross me over
Or a word to guide me in.
I wanna feel the changes coming down.
I wanna know what I've been hiding in

My shadow. My shadow.
Change is coming through my shadow.

I wanna feel the change consume me,
Feel the outside turning in.
I wanna feel the metamorphosis and
Cleansing I've endured within


I've been attached to that transformation for a long time now. So I suppose I always trusted in their truthfulness, trusted they would 'tell me to stop' when the time came. I was waiting for some kind of psychological disturbance, some huge fear that just said NO! but it never came.

I find myself in a strange and unbalanced relationship with them at this point. I've been tripping at the very least once a week for over two years. I've explored LSD and mushrooms to a great extent, some RC's and many plant drugs like amanitas, salvia ect. I've done and loved Ketamine on a few occasions but always kept a distance knowing that a truly addictive psychedelic would ruin my life without question. I've gotten to the point where even in the midst of some ridiculous combination i can still find myself bored and unimpressed. I also have a very heavy pot habit, stoned as often as possible whenever I'm awake. Smoking a lot of pot usually brings me back to a half tripping mindset, so essentially I could feel like i was tripping all the time. The negative effects of the pot habit are very obvious, depression, forgetfulness and general a-motivational effects. I suppose I couldn't separate the effects of the pot habit from the psyche habit and went back and forth blaming one or the other.

In many journeys of deep introspection I would see myself addicted to pot, but I would always forget about it (because I was smoking pot). Recently in a LSD trip I decided that this was the moment to take control and i decided to stop smoking pot for at least two weeks to clear up my head and get some energy and motivation. Just a few days later it became obvious that I would just end up compensating with all sorts of bizarre cocktails to stay high all the time. I decided that it was time to quit all drugs for a month out of respect for myself and the powerful substances. My last trip was my first time taking mescaline in the form of Peruvian torch, and proved to be a great choice, very calm and peaceful yet powerful perfect for preparing me for the strange month ahead. It's only day two with no drugs of any sort, still feel like I'm tripping. I wonder how long that will take to fade or if I have some sort of HPPD. Not too worried about it, I was basically asking for it anyways.

I want to establish meditation as my daily practice to achieve that higher state instead of pot. I want to approach myself and psychedelic drugs with the respect love and balance that they deserve. I don't want to fall back into old habits after this month. Buddhism is so right, attachment to anything, even these drugs that seem to free us of attachment, is always suffering. Any suggestions, similar experiences or insights would be greatly appreciated. Thanks so much for taking your time to glimpse into my life!

 

[magic wedel]

I read your post, your writing is clear and concise. I don't mean this in a rude way at all, but how do you live, like money-wise and such? And Do you have other passions besides psychedelics that you could pursue?

 

[RhythmSpring]

Attached to transformation is nearly a paradox. For transformation usually involves the de-attachment from something that kept us down, a release of a mode of thinking to become more free.

It's not that you're attached to transformation, it's that you are just in a transformational period. It sounds like you would be able to tell if you were becoming attached to it all-there would be ego inflation, fear, desire, unhappiness, etc. Transformation isn't like a thing like an object or a food or an activity that can be grasped and thus be addicted to. It's just something that happens.

But for sure, there needs to a point where you actualize your transformations in real tangible involvement with the world. And that will require taking a lot less psychedelics. Right?

The frequency of your use boggles the mind. I echo the questions above.

 

[Papa1]

Yeah, you need a change. "Bored and unimpressed" while tripping balls is surely a sign that it's time to step back from psychedelics and reassess. Tripping weekly is not good. Where did you want these substances to take you? Did they get you there? Could you stay?

If you want some advice, do anything you can to leave your apartment and associate with the world - take a painting class, go to the theatre, watch a movie, a poetry reading, anything. Heck, hang out with your mom. Get those feet back on the ground, that mouth talking to people, and that head thinking about new things.. Posting on here was a wonderful first step.

 

[grimble crumble]

if you find yourself having this relationship with pyschedelics I think you should quit them all together. seems like your seeking something from them that theyre not giving you, maybe its because they cant give what your searching for. I say this because I feel like i had a similar (though not as severe) problem.

I think sometimes people think psychedelics will give them all the answers to lifes hardships so they just keep doing them searching for something to believe in. the truth is psychedelics dont give you the answere they show you the question. the answers come from you.

try quiting for a long time and i mean really quiting this means not thinking about them all time, things of that nature and start to ask yourself why your realy taking them? is it because you answers? you think they will bring you happyness? really re-evaluate yourself.

learn to have good life without them then if you ever come back to them approach them with the attitude that they are tools, nothing more.

 

[sigmundfloyd25]

Thanks for all the feedback,

"how do you live, like money-wise and such? And Do you have other passions besides psychedelics that you could pursue? "

The way I live is a situation that I can't talk about, which has a lot to do with this situation I'm in with drugs. Everyone I know and love is involved in this situation to some degree. I've started on the path out, but it's hard, it's a way of life you know. I do have other passions, music/(noise) and of course art, I'm an art student, but over the years these interests have become filled with a strong psychedelic flavor. It's difficult, I have become one with psychedelics. They are forever a part of me and I'm thankful for that.

"Attached to transformation is nearly a paradox. For transformation usually involves the de-attachment from something that kept us down, a release of a mode of thinking to become more free."

This is the root of the problem! A "Psychedelic Addiction" is extremely paradoxical. It's confusing because I don't know anyone else who has used so many psych's for so long, other people who use so many drugs almost always use other escapist drugs like heroin and alcohol which I have no desire for. I guess I always thought of it like some people go to church every week end to see god, and I eat psychs to do the same thing. And I think people can become very attached to transformation. Even Buddhism warns of this in many ways. I think one of the keys to becoming free from this cycle for me will be overcoming daily pot smoking. Once I'm free from the constant pot high I feel I will be able to build a stable meditation practice which will hopefully give me a balanced foundation to build my spiritual practice from. It's not that I am searching for some answer or ultimate truth that i dose week after week in search of. I just can't get over what these drugs show us, the amazing potential of our brains! sobriety just seems like such a narrow vantage point to view this ridiculous experience from! I've discovered that i can't be high on psychedelics all the time, I'm going to be sober for a month, 29 days left! It will be a new kind of transformation.

 

[stillmind]

I think psychs can become addictive in the broadest sense when one feels they are indispensible for achieving a certain desired outcome. In my case the outcome I sought was a cure for my OCD, along with more general desires for "enlightenment". In your case the desire for spiritual transformation seems the primary impetus. But whatever the specific motivation, I think the problem is when you start to see psychs as "The Answer".

I think you correctly identify the most important first step out of this, which is abstinence. And I think your desire to delve more deeply into meditation is great. However, be careful that you don't start to see meditation as the answer, because if you view it that way, in my experience, you'll be disappointed. I meditated very consistently for almost a decade (an hour every morning, a weekend every few months, and one gruelling week long retreat per year) and what I ultimately realized is that seeing meditation as the answer allowed me to avoid making necessary changes in my daily existence. I'd think, well I hate my job/girlfriend/george bush/insert current complaint but I'll just suck it up for now because soon I'll be enlightened. To her credit, my teacher saw this danger very clearly but I was heedless to her warnings.

I guess my point is this: life often is (or is judged by us to be) mundane and disappointing and painful and face-meltingly boring. To try to escape that misses, I think, the very essence of Zen and arguably psychedelics. It is by accepting these negative feelings - and accepting their transitory nature - that we truly transform.

But I think you get this already - you have a clear insight into your situation, and so long as you can stick to your commitment for the next 29 days, I really think things will start to get a lot better for you.

 

[SwingBreed]

What you describe is real.

I once confronted the idea that the reason I may be catapulting myself into dense periods of self-destructive patterns and behaviors was actually a hunger for the experience of overcoming them when I'm forced to. It's like overeating awful food just to have that great shit to get it all out -- except the emotional/mental equivalent. I used a phrase, "addicted to the purge", like emotional bulimia. I've gone through to notion of the high of catharsis being so great that I'd found the habit of pushing myself to point of needing catharsis. Why would Greek tragedies be referred to as Dionysian when Dionysis is the god of revelry? Perhaps some of us revel in the experience of stripping ourself to bare bone?

I'm sure this may not be exactly what you're going through, but I think it's an interesting way to express something similar to the idea of "attached to transformation".

My only suggestion is perhaps you should turn away from the internal and try to facilitate an environmental transformation. Direct your transformative tendency toward the world you're associated with. Maybe make a big move or tamper with your paradigm significantly somehow. Since you still have to be feening for some kind of change -- try to make it a kind of change that you haven't yet become accostumed to.

 

[psilocybonaut]

I agree with the above posters. But something that no one has mentioned yet, that is kind of unfortunate, is that posting regularly in this forum can make your brain focus on psychedelics/drugs more than they normally do. I mean the whole topic of this forum is Psychedelic Drugs.

I believe that if you want a better chance of being successful at abstinence, do not expose yourself to things that could tempt you or cause your mind to wander in the wrong way. Unfortunately, I believe this forum could further your thoughts and temptations towards drugs, and also make your mind 'focus' on drugs and drug chat, more than you should. I would recommend

This is just my humble opinion. Because, I know that if I were serious about abstaining from drugs/psychedelics for a period of time, this forum would be a 'trigger', and it would keep my focus on drugs and not on regular everyday life.

Focus on keeping yourself as healthy as possible, and try your best to focus on positive things rather than any sort of substance use. I would recommend starting to exercise regularly. I notice that when quitting certain drugs (especially marijuana), regular exercise can make you feel a lot better (probably due to endorphins). I would recommend running, or something like that. Also, make sure you take a comprehensive multivitamin, and keep yourself as healthy as possible.

 

[sigmundfloyd25]

Thanks for all the thought! Very much appreciated!

I've gone through to notion of the high of catharsis being so great that I'd found the habit of pushing myself to point of needing catharsis. Why would Greek tragedies be referred to as Dionysian when Dionysis is the god of revelry? Perhaps some of us revel in the experience of stripping ourself to bare bone?

SwingBreed has hit the nail on the head! I love the idea of catharsis. It's about being free from the greatest constraint, ourselves! It's about being forced to let go. It's very evident in the music/noise i listen to. My favorite music/noise is usually composed of ear piercing screeching noise or minimalistic droning tracks that go past the 20 minute mark. I like to live in the outer realms of consciousness, not in a self destructive way, it just helps me feel alive and in the moment. thanks for the insight.

posting regularly in this forum can make your brain focus on psychedelics/drugs more than they normally do. I mean the whole topic of this forum is Psychedelic Drugs.

I believe that if you want a better chance of being successful at abstinence, do not expose yourself to things that could tempt you or cause your mind to wander in the wrong way. Unfortunately, I believe this forum could further your thoughts and temptations towards drugs, and also make your mind 'focus' on drugs and drug chat, more than you should. I would recommend

This is just my humble opinion. Because, I know that if I were serious about abstaining from drugs/psychedelics for a period of time, this forum would be a 'trigger', and it would keep my focus on drugs and not on regular everyday life.

Thanks psilocybonaut, but my fascination with psychedelic drugs could never be suppressed. They are a part of my every day life if I use them or not. This month of abstinence isn't just for me, it's also in honor of the powerful tools. I think this forum is helping me a lot in finding like minded people. Despite the headaches, snappiness and sleeplessness I'm experiencing from the pot withdrawal, I feel I have no temptation to spoil my plan, I have 100% confidence that I will ride the month out. Taking a drug before the end of this trial would be disrespectful to me and the drug. I will still lovingly care for my cacti garden and my Bufo toads, and study Pihkal and Tihkal. I'm not doing this to quit using psychedelics, I'm doing it to get more power out of them and really respect them for the powerful mirrors and lenses that they are. So I guess what I'm looking for is how to build that balanced relationship with them.

 

[stringtheory]

I too used to take weekly trips - that went on for about a year and a half. But I always got something very precious out of each and every trip. I counted on the clarity and insights that it provided to live out the rest of the week at a very high level. But eventually my inner voice literally told me to quit in no uncertain terms. So what else could I do? I counted on this discourse with my higher self as the main reason for taking acid, so I quit. Walked away, but replacement was slow.

Eastern philosophy and meditation appeared somewhat magically as a replacement, but it was certainly no quick fix. After years of meditation, I was able to find a portion of what I had lost, but merely a portion.

I have always believed that taking LSD was like getting a chance at the higher levels of awareness that we hadn't really earned, and therefore weren't allowed to stay there. I soon came to appreciate what a gift it had been while it lasted, because it is a lot of hard work to try to change your life to come even close to what once had come so easily.

Like I said, for me at the time it was meditation...but it can be anything. Find your own path to personal bliss and plunge in wholeheartedly, no matter where it takes you. Do that and the drug element will fall away of its own volition.

 

[elbroski]

Wow. Swingbreed, I also have a similar addiction to catharsis. I can absolutely relate to the need to emotionally/spiritually "sweat" out my own negativity. People often see me as lazy and amotivational, but for some reason I find great pleasure in pushing myself to the brink, stripping my body and soul bare, and then battling my way back to health. I was told my friend (half jokingly), that I loved the withdrawls of heroin. This was back when I had a pretty strong habit, and I would revel in the anticipation of that week of withdrawl. I would sit there and sweat, and puke, and suddenly I was clearheaded. I needed to be at my breaking point to feel at peace. I'm sure this isn't healthy (lol), but I just thought I'd comment but I have felt similar states of mind.

 

[SwingBreed]

Thanks friends. That was actually the first time I'd ever articulated that feeling to others. I'm quite happy to hear that it's relevant and even shared.

 

[jalapenohippie]

You remind me of myself a few years ago when I had my serious drug problem with RCs, mainly psychedelics, but also some stimulants. I got up to a point where I was tripping two times a week, mostly at least once a week. I started out slowly by tripping once every few months and then it quickly progressed to something similar to your experience.

I also began to smoke weed every evening. I could still somehow function at my job and in my relationship, but that all ended in a very bad way when the drug abuse caught up to me and I hit a pretty big bottom. I'm convinced that I was self-medicating with the psychedelics because of my bipolar disorder, something I didn't know I had until recently. I ended up in a mental hospital, getting left by a woman I was involved with for many many years, and having my family not want to even talk to me. Once I hit that low and I realized shit had to change, I changed it.

... I have 100% confidence that I will ride the month out. Taking a drug before the end of this trial would be disrespectful to me and the drug. I will still lovingly care for my cacti garden and my Bufo toads, and study Pihkal and Tihkal. I'm not doing this to quit using psychedelics, I'm doing it to get more power out of them and really respect them for the powerful mirrors and lenses that they are. So I guess what I'm looking for is how to build that balanced relationship with them.

That seems to me like a very unhealthy obsession, to be studying about the drugs you are trying to avoid, to be talking about respecting the drugs. It doesn't seem like a good thing, mostly because this reminds me of how I was when I had a big problem.


It seems to me that you have a pretty serious drug problem to be using psychedelic compounds so often. I know, you probably think like I did, that psychedelics can't be damaging, that you can't be addicted to them, and that you can't abuse them. Unfortunately, they can be damaging, you can be addicted to them, and you sure as hell can abuse the hell out of them.

I'm glad that you are going to try as hard as you can to go a month without them, but I'd suggest going even longer without them. Sort out your life a bit more by spending a hell of a lot more time clean and sober so you can do what you need to do in order to live a productive life. Trip every few months, or once a month if you can. I'm telling you that this shit can and probably will come back to bite you unless you change the way you're going about things. Even the weed needs to be treated with respect because it can cause a lot of problems for people. I've had it happen to me and I've seen it happen to others.

I don't know your full story, and I don't know you personally, so all I can do is share what comes to mind. Try not to take anything as an insult because that's not how I intend it at all. I just hope that something I've written here will help you in some way.

 

[sigmundfloyd25]

I'm convinced that I was self-medicating with the psychedelics because of my bipolar disorder, something I didn't know I had until recently. I ended up in a mental hospital, getting left by a woman I was involved with for many many years, and having my family not want to even talk to me. Once I hit that low and I realized shit had to change, I changed it.

That seems to me like a very unhealthy obsession, to be studying about the drugs you are trying to avoid, to be talking about respecting the drugs. It doesn't seem like a good thing, mostly because this reminds me of how I was when I had a big problem.

It seems to me that you have a pretty serious drug problem to be using psychedelic compounds so often. I know, you probably think like I did, that psychedelics can't be damaging, that you can't be addicted to them, and that you can't abuse them. Unfortunately, they can be damaging, you can be addicted to them, and you sure as hell can abuse the hell out of them.

In my experience I have known for years that I have bipolar disorder, and in a way I do self medicate with psychedelics. I have been medicated off and on for depression and ADD since the fifth grade, by my senior year in high school I was on Lithium, Adderoll, Lamictal and wellbutrin every day prescribed by my doctor. It was actually psychedelic drugs that helped me break out of the nihilistic view of existence that I had harbored for years. I quit all my meds cold turkey and never went back to the psychologist. I feel that alot of my problems were amplified by my treatment, "I really have to take ALL these drugs just to feel ok every day!? What has my life come to!?" kind of cycle. The years since then have been the happiest and most emotionally balanced (and most tripping) times of my life. I'd rather take psychedelics and talk to my true inner being than pay to talk to a shrink who will fill me with stimulants and anti-psychotics. It's just what works best for me and the last few years have proven that. I'm well aware that psych's can be damaging and hold a great potential for abuse, that's why I'm taking the time to clear my head this month and build a balanced relationship with them before I get hurt. I'm not doing this because psychedelics are ruining my life or that I'm compromising the people I love for drugs, I'm just not getting what I want out of psychedelics anymore. I will be taking them much less frequently in the future, and will not be using any drug on a day to day basis. I think this will require A LOT of respect. They're not toys, they're tools! anyways I really appreciate the insight you could offer from your experience. thanks.

 

[jalapenohippie]

sigmundfloyd25: I'm glad that you will be taking it easier on the tripping. I seem fine doing the odd bit of LSD now and again. It amazes me that it works at all since I take Seroquel, but it definitely does the trick still. I just try not to use it too frequently. I think, and the professionals also think, that marijuana was what really did a number on me going into full mania with psychosis, thinking I was Jesus, the president, a FBI agent, and a few other things.

Fortunately, my horror story of a manic journey this past summer did come to a very happy ending. I'll resume classes this upcoming Tuesday, I've been in an intensive day program for aftercare/recovery for six months and have done wonderfully, ready to start the Spring semester and, if that goes well, start working again. I don't drink anymore, don't smoke weed, just a trip every few months if things go well.

As for self medicating, I now see that I was in a very deep depression during the time period that I started experimenting with drugs at age 24 (late bloomer) until this past summer. I think that I preferred the many long hours of euphoric bliss and mania-like states that the psychedelics provided me in order to forget about my depression, failing classes, and just wanting to lay in bed for days feeling sick and hopeless.

For me, finding the perfect combination of meds has really helped tremendously in my life. I went through the same type of thing in my teen years. From 17 to 20 I was on about 5 or 7 medications at any given time and nothing worked; they just made me feel so much worse, dead inside, and bloated me up with a lot of weight gain. I'm 5'4" and I was around 230 pounds while on Lithium and Neurontin!

I went unmedicated from 2003 until this past summer of 2008. For the most part I did wonderfully, or so I thought. I had a 4.00 GPA, got into a national academic honors society, held a job for many years, had a serious 4-year relationship. Looking back, now that I have my life in order and I'm properly medicated and have gained a shitload of coping skills/symptom management, I now see that I wasn't doing well at all during that time. Things are so much better now with the medications.

A part of me still hopes that I'll be able to do things right this time as far as limiting my strictly-LSD experiences. So far so good. The time between trips is growing longer and longer and longer. I'm at a pretty good place in life and I hope that you get there, too, fellow Bipolar brother.

 

[sigmundfloyd25]

Thanks again for all the insight! psychopharmacology sure is crazy huh! So difficult to find the right combo for each brain. And I agree it is strange how people totally undermine the power the daily pot use can have over your psyche. Psychedelics sure can do a number on you but its impossible to stay high on them all day every day (or maybe just extremely difficult), with weed its all too easy. I doubt very much that I will ever take any pharmaceuticals for psychological issues again, my goal is to maintain balance without any drug in my day to day life, so when I do choose to use a drug on occasion it will be that much better, and I will have a balanced place to come back to instead of needing to take the drug again so soon. I know my goal is within reach. It's just going to take a lot of patience and persistence, but I am dedicated. thanks again, I'm glad that you have found a balanced place in your life.

 

[gwelymernans]

I just wanted to comment as someone who has been involved romantically with you for the past two years. I've been with you for this crazy ride, and I thought it might be useful to shed some light on your personal life. I have watched you trip as much as you do (and as hard as you do) while dealing with some pretty intense life issues (and still keeping your shit together). Through all this you have gone to school and made some pretty amazing art. We have curated and executed an exhibition of our work. You have made an impressive library of your own music and even played shows. You have held a full time job, that is really intense and difficult. I think from reading this people might assume that you are some sort of spaced out spunion or reckless drug fiend. I think you have a healthy respect for drugs, but I think your relationship with them is unbalanced. I don't think you look at them as the answer. I think you love the insights they provide. I'm really proud that you have decided to take a break. You are trying to tare down your relationship with drugs and rebuild it into one that works better for you. I have a lot of respect for that, and I know you will make it the month and maybe even further if you want.

 

[Xorkoth]

Sounds like you're a lucky guy.

 

[B9]

I too used to take weekly trips - that went on for about a year and a half. But I always got something very precious out of each and every trip. I counted on the clarity and insights that it provided to live out the rest of the week at a very high level. But eventually my inner voice literally told me to quit in no uncertain terms. So what else could I do? I counted on this discourse with my higher self as the main reason for taking acid, so I quit. Walked away, but replacement was slow.

Eastern philosophy and meditation appeared somewhat magically as a replacement, but it was certainly no quick fix. After years of meditation, I was able to find a portion of what I had lost, but merely a portion.

I have always believed that taking LSD was like getting a chance at the higher levels of awareness that we hadn't really earned, and therefore weren't allowed to stay there. I soon came to appreciate what a gift it had been while it lasted, because it is a lot of hard work to try to change your life to come even close to what once had come so easily.

Like I said, for me at the time it was meditation...but it can be anything. Find your own path to personal bliss and plunge in wholeheartedly, no matter where it takes you. Do that and the drug element will fall away of its own volition.

That's an interesting post & it resonates with me - to a degree anyway.

My personal experience is of taking psychedelics in bursts of several years then laying off them for several years.

I suppose the question arises why would I or anyone go back to them.

Possibly because we seek answers to impossible to articulate questions, or because it can be great fun.

May I ask for how long you've been abstaining from psychedelics?