Stimulants Problem with psychosis

[clean11]

I've had problems with psychosis since I started smoking weed for the first time when I was around 15. Even now, I get the feeling that the TV is talking about me specifically (very much the movie The Game).
Me and my "homeboys" usually watch standup comedy and you know how comedy can be about saying something real? But in a funny way?

Well I think they talk about me. Not in a general way that they observed something human, but about particular situations about me.
I've tried to write some of these situations down, but when I try to explain them they don't make sense. It is basically something I think subjectively and cannot explain, which can be extremely frustrating. But I have gotten over it, although it is still scary in the way The Game scares Michael Douglas.

I don't do drugs often at all. But in my everyday life I've come to believe in a Matrix-Buddhism hybrid theory (I basically believe that when I die, I will be God over the world much like the Construction program. But I cannot wake up or anything. If you really understand the Matrix trilogy, I would argue, it is that Neo never wakes up. It is a simulation in a simulation which is why Neo has magic powers in the "Real world"). But anyway, who cares right...

I do pretty well on amphetamines but if I'm awake for just one more hour than I should be awake, I start hearing voices/thinking intensively. I see pictures. I contemplate my life as it has been. (I'm a guy that never gotten a real break basically). And shit like staring intensively in the wall when I try to sort these stimuli/perceptions.

I have been hospitalized two times for psychosis. The first time my family thought I talked weird (and indeed I did!) and the second time I called 911. It might have been necessary but I'm not fucking calling 911 ever again. They took my Ritalin and I can never get it back.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to take some speed, I haven't taken since I got hospitalized the last time. I think if I tweak around breakfast time I will get some regular sleep (I think this is the most important factor in reducing psychosis risk). I'm taking speed because I really need to get shit done, like going to the gym (mmm!) and writing up some ideas I have (mmm! again).
And maybe reading some good math literature <-- really looking forward to that. On Ritalin this was very cozy!


Anyone have similar experiences? I feel pretty alone with this issue.

 

[orgone]

Personally I would not advise using meth if you are prone to psychosis. If you have a major disconnect when smoking weed then I'd also avoid psychedelics. Do you currently take any mood-stabilizers or AP drugs?

I have a close friend who abuses meth and regularly suffers from psychotic breaks. It's very depressing and frustrating to be around him or even communicate with him during these episodes. Totally irrational and paranoid. Many of his symptoms are similar to yours. You seem to be an intelligent person, why not just do those things sober and see how it goes? Working out while high on speed isn't very good either... your heart rate and BP are already high enough.

Also: If taking meth led to you calling 911 on yourself in the midst of a break, why in the world are you thinking about doing it again?

 

[clean11]

No not now, I took Seroquel before while taking Ritalin. I guess they worked (Seroquel) but they made the Ritalin really lose its effect.

Interesting, can you tell me more about your friends symptoms?

I guess I need to think twice about working out while on speed. Maybe in lower doses? I can never get myself to go to the gym. I am a true procrastinator.

Actually I took speed right after coming out of the hospital the first time. I wasn't ready to deal with it mentally, thus the second round.
I think I'm ready now. I think about speed every once in a while. Not taking it at all seems ruled out... at the moment anyway.

I get psychotic symptoms when I am awake for too long. I think to myself, if I do it earlier in the day, then I'll be OK.

 

[Quixote]

Honestly, I would avoid taking the speed if you can, especially if you're just using it to get shit done. If you feel that you procrastinate too much and are finding it hard to be functional during the day and still have problems with psychosis, it would definitely be worth while to make an effort to find a *good* doctor who will be able to assist you. I've always been weary of bad doctors and over-prescribed medications, but I have friends who have benefited greatly from having found someone they can trust in their doctor (be it a GP, or psychologist/psychiatrist) and a combination of therapy and being on a medication such as a mood stabilizer or ap.

The effects of stimulants on psychosis does not solely rely on the time you've been awake for, there are many other factors that will influence your experience. These can be factors like your mood on the day, things that happen throughout the day, interactions with others, anxiety or stress, other drugs you may indulge in while already on speed like weed or alcohol, etc. There are simply too many factors to ignore and pretend that going to sleep at the right time will help you avoid ending up in hospital again.

 

[clean11]

Thanks for the post.
I don't want to sound like a teenager refusing advice but I really can't see how a doctor can help me except with (overpriced) pep talk...
Or what did you have in mind?

I agree that there are other factors involved but in my experience (and according to the doctors at the hospital) sleep is the major factor.

 

[Morphling]

Is it really worth it to you to get locked up in a psych ward to get high on phets? This doesn't seem like a rational decision...

 

[clean11]

"I won't get locked up this time" :D

Seriously though, I don't think so.

 

[clean11]

Are there people with similar experiences of psychosis out there that manage to tweak anyway?

 

[Derschieber]

Many people find that whilst taking speed has certain benefits, there are also significant unwanted effects. More for some, less for others. Clearly you are likely run into problems with this drug. In this, you are certainly not alone. Better to stay away, is what I am saying to you.

Best wishes.

 

[Quixote]

Thanks for the post.
I don't want to sound like a teenager refusing advice but I really can't see how a doctor can help me except with (overpriced) pep talk...
Or what did you have in mind?

I agree that there are other factors involved but in my experience (and according to the doctors at the hospital) sleep is the major factor.

No worries, have you had any experience seeing someone on the regular like a psychiatrist in combination with appropriate medication before? I know how it feels to deal with doctors and I personally have had bad experiences with doctors who I felt did not care or were able to empathize or understand me. But I've also had some fantastic experiences with doctors who have actually helped me to make positive changes in my life: mentally, emotionally and physically. Sometimes it's helpful to have someone in your corner who is willing to help you and can provide you with an objective perspective on things that affect you in your daily life. I admit that sometimes it'll take a bit of effort getting to that stage (finding someone you feel comfortable with, and is eager to help you progress) but it makes an incredible difference, or at least it did for me and definitely a few of my friends that have been in very difficult situations dealing with being bipolar, psychosis, etc. Keep in mind I'm saying this having previously shared the same thoughts as you do on doctors being over-priced pep talks.

Anyway I think it could be something to consider, and again I don't think using speed to help get motivated to perform daily tasks like the gym or writing is beneficial to you, esp. when you know that there is always that risk of having the psychosis get out of control. But I also don't want to sound cunty or pretend that I have the perfect answer for you, I just hope you are careful and look after yourself, that's the most important thing!

 

[AlphaMethylPhenyl]

Thanks for the post.
I don't want to sound like a teenager refusing advice but I really can't see how a doctor can help me except with (overpriced) pep talk...
Or what did you have in mind?

I agree that there are other factors involved but in my experience (and according to the doctors at the hospital) sleep is the major factor.

Doctors have gone through eight years or more of rigorous academic study; they know what's best for you more than we do. That's just how it is.

I think I can understand where you're coming from. I was against doctors (and psychiatrists specifically) for a while, but after a few months I'm at a point where I can say they've truly helped me. Sometimes a doctor and their patient don't mix well, but there are many mental health professionals out there. Why not see a therapist for starters? All of the people who I've known who briefly stayed in a mental hospital said that the experience truly helped them. That's the worst that could happen. And, to be honest, its a break from life meant to rehabilitate, not a punishment or incarceration.

 

[hatrix]

Doctors have gone through eight years or more of rigorous academic study; they know what's best for you more than we do. That's just how it is.

I think I can understand where you're coming from. I was against doctors (and psychiatrists specifically) for a while, but after a few months I'm at a point where I can say they've truly helped me. Sometimes a doctor and their patient don't mix well, but there are many mental health professionals out there. Why not see a therapist for starters? All of the people who I've known who briefly stayed in a mental hospital said that the experience truly helped them. That's the worst that could happen. And, to be honest, its a break from life meant to rehabilitate, not a punishment or incarceration.

This is definitely true for helping to find issues and such with people, as you aren't going to get a diagnosis over the internet.

However, some doctors knowledge of drugs and what they prescribe along with the dosages prescribed are often times ridiculous. I'm speaking of clear interactions between prescribed drugs or prescriptions for hugely unnecessary dosages. This seems quite common. Doctors also seem to be a bit ignorant at times of truthful information regarding drugs, and it's sad to know people are being misinformed by their own doctor. Of course, this is more likely a problem with GPs other than someone in a specific medical field.

 

[clean11]

With regards to your comment on truthful information (I suspect you are referring to doctors with an incentive to push Big Pharma drugs), this is not a problem as I live in Europe, in particular a country with highly socialized medicine.

I totally agree with doctors knowledge of the drugs they prescribe. I wonder how some doctors even finished medical school.
My guess is that the quality of doctors is higher in the States. Generally speaking that is.

 

[pizzystrizzy]

Have you tried abilify? Unlike other atypicals-- like the seroquel you mentioned -- it is activating due to its unique pharmacology. It isn't recreational, but if you need help getting things done, and you want to take a dopaminergic drug but you don't want to become psychotic again, consider abilify.

Once you get to the point where normal stimulant doses provoke frank psychosis, it can happen again at any time. I really wouldn't risk it.

I experienced brief frank psychosis for a few hours after having written 125 pages or so in a week with little sleep and an extra dose or two of amphetamine, and it was one of the scariest times of my entire life. I became extremely paranoid and believed with delusional conviction that there was a massive global conspiracy and that I was going to have to go underground. I also saw and smelled what appeared to be smoke even though there was clearly no fire. The only doubt that I had was the lingering worry that after I went to sleep and woke up the next morning, I would go back to my former 'deluded' state of non-paranoia. Luckily, that happened. That was several years ago, and I've never told anyone, and it hasn't happened again, but I'm in regular contact with a physician on a weekly basis so I feel like if something like that happened again, it would be noticed and I'd get helped pretty quickly. I also take a neuroleptic every evening and never ever ever stay up the entire night.

Be careful with your mind. Without that, what do you have?

 

[AlphaMethylPhenyl]

How are you doing?

 

[EarthBounded]

Are there people with similar experiences of psychosis out there that manage to tweak anyway?

Yes I have taken plenty of Amphetamine while in states of Psychosis, You will probably have a good time and get alot done and possibly feel more normal.

MAIN PROBLEM, LONG TERM EFFECTS - The following days you will probably feel like shit and more psychotic, I have been hospitalized my self and when I continued to use I just realized how stupid I was

 

[clean11]

Have you tried abilify? Unlike other atypicals-- like the seroquel you mentioned -- it is activating due to its unique pharmacology. It isn't recreational, but if you need help getting things done, and you want to take a dopaminergic drug but you don't want to become psychotic again, consider abilify.

Once you get to the point where normal stimulant doses provoke frank psychosis, it can happen again at any time. I really wouldn't risk it.

I experienced brief frank psychosis for a few hours after having written 125 pages or so in a week with little sleep and an extra dose or two of amphetamine, and it was one of the scariest times of my entire life. I became extremely paranoid and believed with delusional conviction that there was a massive global conspiracy and that I was going to have to go underground. I also saw and smelled what appeared to be smoke even though there was clearly no fire. The only doubt that I had was the lingering worry that after I went to sleep and woke up the next morning, I would go back to my former 'deluded' state of non-paranoia. Luckily, that happened. That was several years ago, and I've never told anyone, and it hasn't happened again, but I'm in regular contact with a physician on a weekly basis so I feel like if something like that happened again, it would be noticed and I'd get helped pretty quickly. I also take a neuroleptic every evening and never ever ever stay up the entire night.

Be careful with your mind. Without that, what do you have?

Thanks for this post!
I recognize myself in your text, ("go back to my former deluded state of non-paranoia").

I was prescribed Ritalin for about 2 years (got my ADHD diagnosis late). Everything felt great. I started talking about the regular stuff ADD people usually talk about: "it was like someone switched on the light", "I suddenly feel normal, so this is what you all have been feeling?!" etc etc. The usual stuff.
Time passed by and things started getting really good at school. A distinguished professor offered me a recommendation letter. Student councellors began talking about studying at a Ivy League-university. I was in a trial (true) were the judges recognized me (false) and started asking topical questions on things i study...

2 years plus one hospitalization later, I began to realize that this is made up. All the vivid faces, scenes and conversations: just my fantasy.

Before I realized this I didn't think I had a problem, but now I do.


I used Abilify during my hospitalization and I really liked it simply because I couldn't feel it at all. Contrast that with Seroquel where I virtually became a zombie. I have no regular doctor contact, no contact with any of the hospital staff at all in fact. I doubt that I will get myself to ask for AP again. They'll start asking questions and if I say that I get spontaneous signs of psychosis, they'll just label me something that I will regret later.
I really believe that ALL information they could possibly keep is bad.

 

[clean11]

I've decided not to buy any more speed

Thanks a lot guys!

 

[pizzystrizzy]

Great news! Harm reduction at its best.

 

[EarthBounded]

Good luck! When you treat your body well you get rewarded! I used for about 5 years and have been clean for 3 months ----> Got my dreams back a couple of nights ago and I feel alot more like I did before I was using, which I never thought I would get back, you cant put a price on that!

Awesome to hear!