No, you were correct, Gao's criticism in the article is aimed at the recommendation that people without symptoms or a diagnosis not wear masks, as people with symptoms are already being told to wear masks in Europe and the U.S.:
Covid-19 Outbreak of new SARS-like coronavirus (Covid-19)
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TheLoveBandit
Retired Never Was, Coulda been wannabe
While she's not in the headlines of late, I sincerely doubt Hillary had anything to do with this German fella.
What 23
Ex-Bluelighter
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living for years with fragrance sensitivity has made me more conscious than i was, probably than others are, of what and how i touch things, and when i am doing it. my actions have become super-deliberate in an attempt to minimize exposure to, for instance scented lotion that might be on someones palms/fingers. germs are also on the radar, but for my rubbing someones scented lotion on my face nose became a source of anger/rage, enough to where my behavior changed. also the last time i got flu, 5 years ago or so, i felt like i was going to die. all i remember is rubbing my eyes after making a delivery, after touching things in a building. i don't know if this is even possible but it's as if i could sense something entering me, feeling "off" immediately after.
anyway, i hope that suffering through the sensitivities to chemicals as i have, to fragrances, avoiding transferring that to my face when it's inevitably on my hands, trained me enough to reduce the chance of this spreading this way.
other things i do- if i have to use a touch screen, or keypad (atm, grocery...), i use my pinky finger. of my fingers, i am least likely to put this one in my nose, eye, or mouth. i also recently purchased a stylus to do this.
i have thought about getting a sheath for this, to put a sheath in a pocket, or on the outside, to slide this into, like a sword, because it will likely pick up some germ and i'd like to not have that in my pocket. if i was a bit more industrious i might do this, marketing it for this crisis. as humor i thought about getting a huge one of these, and making a 'sheath', using it at a supermarket, visibly making it like it is a sword, to perhaps lighten the mood at the counters, maybe spreading the idea.
also at gas-pumps, another conditioned response from too many times picking up someone's fragrance/perfume/scented-lotion, i use a paper-towel/napkin to act as a 'glove', eliminating or reducing contact with anything anyone else has touched, including keypad numbers. always open doors with elbows or with my back if i can push through. if i have to touch the handle, i try to imagine where people don't touch. there are some places that it's unavoidable. but it would probably be good to wear gloves right now, when out. i've considered just buying a pair of washable work-gloves, and having a receptacle/place to place them in in my car, or wherever i go that is marked safe(r).
i also became 'conditioned' to wearing a mask, with that illness (fragrance/chemical sensitivity). for years i would wear a respirator going into the nursing homes where i deliver stuff, because they almost always use some form of chemical odor control. i know 'how to put them on and how to take them off'. i've reused one for months at a time, even though it got nasty- but my use, infectious disease wasn't a factor. still, i'm not a doctor/nurse, and have limited exposure to patients, or people in general. i basically have no life, no friends close to me (one... we just smoke weed, always our own, separate, multiple feet apart), and the ones far... well, this situation is almost business as usual for me.
anyway, i hope that suffering through the sensitivities to chemicals as i have, to fragrances, avoiding transferring that to my face when it's inevitably on my hands, trained me enough to reduce the chance of this spreading this way.
other things i do- if i have to use a touch screen, or keypad (atm, grocery...), i use my pinky finger. of my fingers, i am least likely to put this one in my nose, eye, or mouth. i also recently purchased a stylus to do this.
i have thought about getting a sheath for this, to put a sheath in a pocket, or on the outside, to slide this into, like a sword, because it will likely pick up some germ and i'd like to not have that in my pocket. if i was a bit more industrious i might do this, marketing it for this crisis. as humor i thought about getting a huge one of these, and making a 'sheath', using it at a supermarket, visibly making it like it is a sword, to perhaps lighten the mood at the counters, maybe spreading the idea.
also at gas-pumps, another conditioned response from too many times picking up someone's fragrance/perfume/scented-lotion, i use a paper-towel/napkin to act as a 'glove', eliminating or reducing contact with anything anyone else has touched, including keypad numbers. always open doors with elbows or with my back if i can push through. if i have to touch the handle, i try to imagine where people don't touch. there are some places that it's unavoidable. but it would probably be good to wear gloves right now, when out. i've considered just buying a pair of washable work-gloves, and having a receptacle/place to place them in in my car, or wherever i go that is marked safe(r).
i also became 'conditioned' to wearing a mask, with that illness (fragrance/chemical sensitivity). for years i would wear a respirator going into the nursing homes where i deliver stuff, because they almost always use some form of chemical odor control. i know 'how to put them on and how to take them off'. i've reused one for months at a time, even though it got nasty- but my use, infectious disease wasn't a factor. still, i'm not a doctor/nurse, and have limited exposure to patients, or people in general. i basically have no life, no friends close to me (one... we just smoke weed, always our own, separate, multiple feet apart), and the ones far... well, this situation is almost business as usual for me.
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CoastTwoCoast
Bluelighter
I haven’t been following the news deliberately because it freaks me out. So I wanted to go to CVS today. Someone in my house was like “Our city is the hotbed for it. You better wear a mask.” I’m like “Why the fuck is it our city and not the suburbs?!” They’re trying to kill black people. Fuckers!!!
CoastTwoCoast
Bluelighter
And I saw a few people wearing masks for sure. The CVS employees wore gloves. My city is seriously a hotbed. I came back home and washed my hands thoroughly, counted the ABC’s. Still, I wonder why this is only in the black community and not the white community in my state. Bullshit.
CoastTwoCoast
Bluelighter
BULLSHIT!!!!!!!!!
For the same reason that I caught it comparatively early, living in one of the most densely populated square miles in Europe in an enormous apartment building with a high proportion of AirBNB apartments full of Italian and Chinese tourists: higher population densities and a consequently increased frequency of contact between greater numbers of people.
CoastTwoCoast
Bluelighter
It’s a nutty mess, but I definitely notice this is a hotbed in the black community in my state. The suburbs are not as bad as us
You have actually experienced this so all a I worry about is about you and I’m hoping you feel better!!!
Thanks C2C - I'm doing miles better now towards end of the third week. I'm now just left with some lingering flu-like symptoms and a thick gunk in my lungs (which is all greatly alleviated by the expectorant). The only slightly annoying remaining symptoms that started up later in the infection are a chronic sleep dysfunction (I can't sleep without a whole load of sleeping tablets/hormones, and the sleep I do get is of poor quality), and my inability to taste or smell anything. Fingers crossed both will ease soon though.
Painful One
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Painful One
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In one day more than 23% of the population in New Mexico applied for unemployment the first day! This is historic numbers and basically means the state is bankrupt!
This will go up over time now and we could see 50% unemployed in the near future. No stopping this now!
The population in New Mexico is roughly 2.5 million.
The state Department of Workforce Solutions received more than 586,000 calls Monday through 2:30 p.m. following approval of federal funds that will allow contractors, the self-employed and gig economy workers to apply for unemployment.
https://www.santafenewmexican.com/news/l...fe289.html
This will go up over time now and we could see 50% unemployed in the near future. No stopping this now!
The population in New Mexico is roughly 2.5 million.
The state Department of Workforce Solutions received more than 586,000 calls Monday through 2:30 p.m. following approval of federal funds that will allow contractors, the self-employed and gig economy workers to apply for unemployment.
https://www.santafenewmexican.com/news/l...fe289.html
TheLoveBandit
Retired Never Was, Coulda been wannabe
TheLoveBandit
Retired Never Was, Coulda been wannabe
I'm hearing projections of 35% unemployment nationally in a few weeks. My company (800 people) has already been furloughing the hourly workers so they can get unemployment with the expectation of getting back on the job as soon as it is allowed.
My company is considered 'essential' in our state, though my office job is to be done from home. Of course, I'm just BL surfing roughly 7h a day now instead of my usual 3-4h from the office.
mr peabody
Bluelight Crew
Police officers with a woman in Hungary, where Viktor Orbán can now rule by decree indefinitely.
Authoritarian leaders using the Covid-19 crisis to tighten their grip
by Shaun Walker | The Gurdian | 31 Mar 2020
The coronavirus has already overwhelmed medical services, grounded flights and halted economic growth, but one of its most enduring effects could be to usher in a political age in which soft authoritarians have turned harder, and the surveillance state becomes a way of life even in some democracies.
In Hungary, after a set of measures introduced on Monday, it is now a criminal offence to spread misinformation about coronavirus, and the prime minister, Viktor Orbán, can rule by decree for an indefinite period. In neighbouring Serbia, soldiers patrol the streets as part of the coronavirus response plan. In Moscow, authorities are reportedly mulling measures that would require everyone who wants to go outside to submit the reasons online, and then be tracked via their smartphones.
By now, most countries across the world have introduced some form of extraordinary measures to battle coronavirus, and even many democratic governments have faced little dissent over changes that in normal times would have been met with months or years of furious parliamentary debate. But what happens when the pandemic is over?
“Extraordinary legal situations are very easy to introduce, but it is much harder to return to business as usual afterwards,” said the Budapest-based thinktank Political Capital in response to the Hungarian measures. The sentiment could be equally applicable elsewhere.
The Hungarian government, which in the decade since Orbán took over has been accused of rolling back freedoms and democratic norms, has insisted that its measures are purely about fighting the coronavirus, and Orbán’s spokesman has dismissed criticism of them as “fake news.”
But the country’s beleaguered opposition says it offered to agree to everything, in the spirit of national unity, but merely asked for a time-based renewal clause to be placed on the measures. None was forthcoming.
Ivan Krastev, a Bulgarian political scientist who has written extensively on European political shifts, calls the Hungarian law as “a kind of authoritarian entrepreneurship,” comparing it to people selling masks and other equipment at inflated prices. "Orbán is experimenting with what might be possible in this sudden new reality. He’s trying and testing, to see what the market will take,” he said.
While Orbán is a leader flying high who has sought to push the boundaries even further, in Israel, Benjamin Netanyahu has looked to use the situation to ease himself out of a sticky spot. Despite having failed three times to form a government in the past year, he is now in talks with his rival, Benny Gantz, to agree on a deal for him to remain prime minister for at least the next two years. Additionally, Netanyahu’s trial on charges of bribery and fraud has also been delayed for two months because of the state of emergency.
At a time when even stepping outside could be dangerous, mass protests against government moves are a non-starter, and international criticism is not likely to be robust given other leaders are occupied with combating the crises in their own countries.
Additionally, citizens may feel more willing to give governments the benefit of the doubt in the current circumstances, preferring an entrenching of the status quo to weak or divided government.
Krastev compared the current crisis to the financial crisis of 2008 and the migration crisis of 2015, and said that while then the responses in Europe were driven by anxiety, this time the dominant emotion is fear, which is much more direct. “This makes people ready to tolerate everything, because when the danger is everywhere, you believe only the government can help you,” he said.
The terrifying situation in which anyone, anywhere, can be a potential threat is a perfect mobilising force for authoritarians, and many have explicitly compared the current situation to a state of war, applying military terminology to civilian life, and implying that the kind of restrictions applicable in wartime, when questioning the government could be seen as unpatriotic or even traitorous, should now apply.
“Just as in wartime, a state of emergency could extend until the end of hostilities. Today, we confront not a military power but are in a war-like state to defend our people against a pandemic the likes of which we have not seen in a century,” said Orbán’s spokesman Zoltán Kovács earlier this week, defending the Hungarian measures.
Opponents, predictably, were cast as indifferent to saving the lives of Hungarians, while Kovács also said it is logical to introduce jail terms for spreading false rumours. He said the new law only covers those who intentionally spread fake information that hampers the government response to coronavirus. How those judgments are made is a big question, however, given that Kovács and others in the government regularly accuse journalists reporting critically on the government of deliberately spreading lies.
Measures reportedly being mulled in Moscow would bring Russia a step closer to the Chinese model of surveillance, but it is not just Vladimir Putin who may soon be keeping a closer eye on his citizens. Throughout Europe, policymakers are wondering how best to monitor the population when lockdowns are eased. Once such measures are brought in for the coronavirus, it may be hard to argue against keeping them in place for hypothetical future threats.
Just how many of the “extraordinary” measures introduced now will stick around to shape our world over the next years and decades will partly depend on how severe and how long-lasting the medical situation turns out to be, and how various governments’ responses to the pandemic look in retrospect.
“If in the end, people feel they were manipulated, then maybe we will see resistance to all these measures. But at this stage, I see much more acceptance than resistance,” said Krastev.
Authoritarian leaders may use Covid-19 crisis to tighten their grip
Hungary’s PM insists extreme measures are only to fight the pandemic, others are not so sure
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JessFR
Bluelight Crew
Problem is that while there's a big difference between justified actions taken in democratic societies to reduce the spread of the disease and save lives, and authoritarian regimes using the virus to tighten their control and suppress descent.
Some people truly can't see the difference, and would quite happily sacrifice millions of lives just so they don't have to spend more time at home.
The key is perspective, being able to be reasonable. Something some people just can't seem to do. Hopefully most leaders of democratic countries will see though that the majority of people are the sensible ones, not the loud extremists.
This isn't the first time democratic countries have faced situations like this. And there is a difference between authoritarian rule, and democratic leadership.
Some people truly can't see the difference, and would quite happily sacrifice millions of lives just so they don't have to spend more time at home.
The key is perspective, being able to be reasonable. Something some people just can't seem to do. Hopefully most leaders of democratic countries will see though that the majority of people are the sensible ones, not the loud extremists.
This isn't the first time democratic countries have faced situations like this. And there is a difference between authoritarian rule, and democratic leadership.
JGrimez
Bluelighter
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While she's not in the headlines of late, I sincerely doubt Hillary had anything to do with this German fella.
lol Hillary isn't responsible for every suspicious political death. I never even hinted that the Clintons were responsible for Epstein (they were MANY people who didn't want him to talk).
As for covid-19 what we're seeing is a move by the covert global Consortium. You know that (conspiracy!) of people in the shadows who control our nation's leaders like puppets? That's what we're seeing now, blatantly and in real time. What's their agenda? Probably multifaceted and there are I'm sure battles and wars among the elites. Only really the President of Belarus and Bolsonaro are saying "fuck you" to them but keep watching and see if they change their tunes. At first Trump and BoJo weren't buying it but someone must have taken them into a room and told them how it is (or told them something) and then they did a complete 180. So it seems for some reason that they want everyone in the world locked away indoors and not associating with each other. Also I think part of it is obviously about control.
Interesting times..
Here's some exposing of the agendas:
Merkel continues to allow refugees into Germany despite pandemic fears (Video)
The Duran Quick Take: Episode 515.
theduran.com
This makes absolutely no sense - unless you're aware that the mass migration of people into Europe is designed to cause destabilization of the societies there and usher in chaos. We can see what's happening now looks like a push for total control by a one-world government.
novaveritas
Bluelighter
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Another valid perspective is that in both democratic countries and authoritarian countries the governments are populated by the same kind of people. Democratic countries have better PR and know it is easier to mess with your peoples heads and control by nudge rather than raw power all the while expanding their control. That is all. Take 9-11 as a classic example...
cold rational analysis is that there are not going to be millions of lives lost due to SARS-CoV-2 infection, covid 19 as CoD is being tagged onto people who would die anyway. I am not going to argue right now about the merits of lockdown or whether lock down is turning it around. The sun rises every morning and I have a very strong sun raising policy and measures...ergo....
mr peabody
Bluelight Crew
Brazil’s president Jair Bolsonaro speaks to journalists in Brasilia on Tuesday.
Bolsonaro ignored by state governors amid anger at his handling of the Covid-19 crisis
by Dom Phillips | The Guardian | 1 Apr 2020
Even former allies are refusing to obey the Brazilian president’s calls for people to go back to work.
Brazil’s president Jair Bolsonaro is facing a growing backlash over his handling of the coronavirus crisis, with the state governors responsible for more than 200 million of the country’s 210 million people refusing to follow his commands over the pandemic.
Bolsonaro has repeatedly played down the dangers of Covid-19 and last week urged Brazilians to get back to work – in defiance of advice from the World Health Organization and his own health ministry.
But his exhortations have been largely ignored by politicians and the general public.
Just three of Brazil’s 27 states, home to 5.7 million people, have relaxed social isolation measures as coronavirus cases continue to rise – Brazil has 5,717 confirmed cases and 201 deaths. A study showed almost 60% of Brazilians are staying at home.
João Doria, the governor of Brazil’s most populous and economically important state, São Paulo, has maintained a strict quarantine and this week openly defied Bolsonaro, telling its 44 million citizens: “Do not follow the guidance of the president.”
Wilson Witzel, Rio de Janeiro state’s rightwing governor, has also refused to back away from strict social isolation measures.
“So far I’ve been asking, now I am giving an order: don’t leave your home,” Witzel told his state’s 17 million residents on Monday as he extended Rio’s shut down for another two weeks.
Witzel, a one-time Bolsonaro ally, went on to suggest the president’s behaviour could land him a trial at the International Criminal Court in the Hague.
Only the rightwing governors of the Amazon states of Rondônia and Roraima, both Bolsonaro allies, have followed the president’s lead by relaxing restrictions on shops and businesses. In Roraima’s capital Boa Vista and Rondônia’s capital Porto Velho many – but not all - shops are open and there are people on the streets.
Ciro Gomes, a prominent leftwing politician from north-eastern Brazil, told the Guardian that in order to save thousands of lives, the country now needed – and was starting to witness – “an extensive campaign of civil disobedience initiated by governors, mayors, the overwhelming majority of religious leaders and the media.”
Gomes admitted the loss of many lives was now inevitable – but such a mutiny against Bolsonaro could help lessen the scale of the tragedy and represented “an act of protection for the Brazilian people.”
Bolsonaro has described coronavirus as a “little flu” and claimed his athletic background would protect him from it. “You have to face it like a soldier on the battlefield,” he told Rede TV on Monday. The previous day he told reporters: “We’ll all die one day.”
The president has argued the damage caused by shutting down Brazil’s economy will be worse than that caused by the virus, and has also suggested state governors were inflating the numbers of coronavirus victims to justify restrictive lockdown measures.
But as well as facing a rebellion from regional chiefs, Bolsonaro now also appears increasingly isolated from his own cabinet.
At a press conference with other ministers on Monday, Bolsonaro’s health minister Luiz Mandetta called on people "to follow state governments and maintain the maximum degree of social isolation” – a day after the president mingled with people on the streets of Brasília and said he was considering a decree to let them go back to work.
On Tuesday the Folha de São Paulo newspaper reported that justice minister Sérgio Moro, finance minister Paulo Guedes, Mandetta and military officers in the government had formed a block opposing the president’s stance.
“Bolsonaro has put himself into self-isolation,” said José Álvaro Moisés, a professor of political science at the University of São Paulo.
Bolsonaro ignored by state governors amid anger at handling of Covid-19 crisis
Even former allies are refusing to obey the Brazilian president’s calls for people to go back to work
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JessFR
Bluelight Crew
How many people need to die for such actions to be warranted? Also, just cause someone was gonna die anyway doesn't seem to mean a whole lot. The only way I can see to argue that is to argue that you are no more likely to die now as a result of this virus than if the virus hadn't existed. Which doesn't seem likely.
Cause if that's not the case, just because the person might just as easily have died from a flu, being more likely than usual to get such a virus to start with still means their life may have been extended. Unless you're saying they were literally gonna die at any moment anyway.
But how does that track when you consider that there also seems reason to believe that a lot of deaths that could be from covid 19 aren't actually being checked? Are saying that's just not true?
9/11 also seems kinda like a bad example.
You can't simply argue that you're becoming more authoritarian forever, and that you're never becoming less authoritarian.
How much freer were you really just before the virus, as opposed to say 1999?
Seems kinda like pointing out that freedoms can be reduced in emergencies, which is true, and sometimes it goes too far or is poorly thought out, also true. But just subtly ignoring examples of those freedoms being returned non violently, painting a misleading picture of an ever more oppressive state.
I can think of lots of ways societies have gotten freer since 9/11. Marijuana laws just for a start.
Id also be honestly curious to see how you're figuring that millions won't die.
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Xorkoth
Bluelight Crew
There is a simple explanation... a desire to slow the spread of the disease and not overwhelm health systems. Do you believe that New York and Michigan and Italy and Spain (and probably others) are not actually imminently facing a lack of adequate ventilators and hospital beds due to being overwhelmed by cases? If everyone gets this within a short span, there is no way to help everyone. hence social isolation, to spread it out.
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