Opiate anti-depressent properties

[ballsaq]

y? have u ever done opiates? if so u might say the same

for one thing ssri's cause physical brain changes and they arent the best thing for ur body. natural opiates on the other hand are very safe and do not directly physically damage the body.

Physical brain damage? hah? Where is a source for this one? Don't post crazymeds.org because that is not a legit source.

 

[adder]

SSRIs and opiates at the same time are even better.

 

[redeemer]

for one thing ssri's cause physical brain changes and they arent the best thing for ur body.

As ballsaq has pointed out, you must mean permanent changes in the brain or your statement is rather pointless as all drugs cause temporary physical changes in the brain in order to exert their effects. Did you mean to say SSRIs cause permanent physical changes in the brain or were you just trying to make them sound dangerous compared to your opiate use?

 

[motiv311]

the more you enjoy the "anti-depressant" qualities of opiates, but minute you can't get a dose; A rush of depression is going to kill you.

 

[yellodolphin]

As ballsaq has pointed out, you must mean permanent changes in the brain or your statement is rather pointless as all drugs cause temporary physical changes in the brain in order to exert their effects. Did you mean to say SSRIs cause permanent physical changes in the brain or were you just trying to make them sound dangerous compared to your opiate use?

Well ya i meant physical changes and that they are more negative then opiates. They are harsher and longer lasting.

 

[qwe]

opiates resemble endogenous molecules so much they're effectively nontoxic (except at heavy and chronic doses). morphine itself IS an endogenous molecule

at therapeutic doses, i'd choose an opiate over an ssri any day as well if i had depression...

 

[saucy2040]

I'm totally with you on this, Dude. Opiates relieve my diagnosed severe depression way more than fucking Zoloft and all the others (Paxil, Lexapro, Wellbutrin, Depakote) I've tried. Thing is, antidepressants are just as addictive as opiates. When I don't have my 50 mg of Zoloft, I can't function. I have brain zaps, crying spells, suicidal thoughts, lethargy, etc.. NOW, it isn't quite as bad as opiate DTs (major depression, lethargy, restless legs, climbing the walls, insomnia, aches and pains, liquid shits, etc..) BUT they are BOTH addictive. In my utopia, I'd use opiates for depression AND anxiety but alas, we live in a fucked up world where docs would rather dope you up with antidepressants so they can get their free hookers from Pharm Reps.

took the words right out my fuckin mouth man. i think opiates as anti-depressants are nothin but a dream in america. no way their gonna prescribe somethin as addicting as opiates for depression. it sucks, but i find that no matter how bad of a mood im in at the time, if im on an opiate, im in perfect peace, and contentness.

IMO opiates definitely have positive effects on depression.

 

[santadog]

I’m currently prescribed an opiate to treat bipolar disorder, from one of the most highly regarded psychiatrists in Colorado (US). And have been for years!

It’s always a little embarrassing to admit, but I’m 36 and I’ve been dealing with mood swings, suicide, delusions, etc since college. There’s a strong genetic component to it that’s been very resistant to treatment. It’s been known to go into remission for periods as well. I’ve been to lots of shrinks over the years and tried practically everything available. Antidepressants/SSRI’s send me into severe mania. Mood stabilizers and anticonvulsants (lithium, depakote, etc, etc) make me feel like SHIT, agitate the fuck out of me and eventually make me quite depressed. Some of the newer drugs, antipsychotics, etc work most of the time but inconsistently (abilify, zyprexa, etc) but their zombie-like side effects suck badly (could you work while completely zoned and nodding on a full-dose of antipsychotics?) Everyone reacts differently to these drugs! I have a very resistant form of the disease and my doctor understands this enough to try other things.

I take a low-medium dose of abilify every night and have various benzos on hand for anxiety. These help level out my moods to an extent, but the magic bullet is oxycodone. I rarely take more than 5-10mg at a time so it’s not like I’m just trying to get high. I don’t feel euphoric. But I do feel confident, motivated and normal enough to function pretty highly. I can create music again. I can deal with stressful situations, having a career, having a family and owning a home, and being around rotten people sometimes. My tolerance has NEVER gone up, and when my bipolar’s in ‘remission’ I don’t take it and don’t even miss it. Maybe I’m special but I doubt it. I just never got that big of a kick out of the opiate buzz anyway, it gets boring and despite that certain feeling of well-being I’m just not a fan of it's other effects. It’s merely a mental health treatment tool for me. I’m more of a cannabis/psychedelic fan actually, which of course I have to use in serious moderation (my doc is cool with the moderate use).

Oxycodone has helped taper my drinking immensely too, which can’t be a bad thing, and makes me a hell of a lot more bearable to be around when this incurable lifelong condition is in full swing.

I realize my experience may be an exception, and maybe not the best option for those with more textbook-like mental illness, but thank god for doctors who are brave enough and smart enough to try different methods in treating the more resistant forms.

 

[norco10]

citalopram

is that the same as Escitalopram 10MG?
thanks

 

[johanneschimpo]

^ close. escitalopram is the active enantiomer of citalopram, which means all the molecules are in the active configuration. I believe that due to this 10mg citalopram = 5 mg escitalopram. but don't quote me on that

 

[hussness]

Escitalopram is actually (S)-Citalopram. Citalopram normally marketed is the racemic version. Unfortunately it turns out (R)-Citalopram inhibits the actions of (S)-Citalopram, the active enantiomer, in vivo. So 10 mg of Citalopram is not technically equal to 5 mg of Escitalopram. For all practical purposes they may be equal though, I'm not sure.

 

[Helios.]

Morphine is not an endogenous compound.
Do not spread misinformation anywhere near me.

 

[befuddle]

small regular doses of dihydrocodeine have helped me a lot. A quick filter of 2 10/500 codydramol tablets every 3-5 hours, nice place. No real need to filter but no use for the apap and it works quicker.

no opiate tolerance particularly but years to go yet. if you're using for depression, and are really opiate tolerant, small regular doses might help

 

[fastandbulbous]

Well ya i meant physical changes and that they are more negative then opiates. They are harsher and longer lasting.

I'd think carefully before posting something like that. A friend of mine who's just quit a 15 year opiate habit about 6 months ago is still suffering both physically & mentally because his biochemistry still hasn't returned to it's pre opiate state. He is still experiencing bouts of depression from the opiate cessation and an almost continuous bout of loose bowel movements & gut cramps on occasions due to overactivity of the smooth muscle. Nothing like that has been seen from long term use of SSRI's but that's probably because there are very few people who have been taking them continuously for 15 years. The fact that on cessation of consumption of opiates that depression almost always returns marks them down as poor candidates as a true antidepressant should also prevent the depressed state from returning on cessation by altering the brain (depression reinforces itself by changing plasticty etc - not all physical changes are a negative thing). While depression may return after cessation of SSRIs, it occurs less often than that seen with opiates

Either way, making a statement like that before all the evidence is in starts to sound like opiate users trying to justify their habits. Anyway, not all antidepressants are SSRIs and some have a proven safe track record even with long term use

 

[t3knology]

I LOVE opiates.. and they definitely are anti-depressant. But that is a big addictive effect of them. The way that class of drugs work i dont think it would ever be possible to have an analog (analogue .. sic?) of an opiate without the addictive personality of the drug.

 

[Coolio]

Opiates are depressants. An antidepresant is meant to give people energy etc to help them with motivational issues and get back to work etc. Unlike an opiate, its not supposed to make it any easier to mong around the house all day doing jackshit.

I don't know what opiates you've been doing, but that's the exact opposite experience I have. If I take some heroin or oxycodone, I become more productive. I've never been on SSRI's, but having a "stable" mood sounds boring and unmotivating.

I think the very idea of 'antidepressants' is disgusting. Why would I want to be stable when I can be euphoric?

 

[fastandbulbous]

I think the very idea of 'antidepressants' is disgusting. Why would I want to be stable when I can be euphoric?

Because euphoric does not equal productive or even mentally stable ( I speak from experience of having manic depression/bipolar illness. Hypomania might be exhilarating - moreso than most drugs - but it isn't a good thing if you need to get things done. Many tasks get started, but very few are seen through to completion)

The word antidepressant is not used in the same way depressant is w.r.t. psychoactivity. A better name for antidepressants would be mood elevators/stabilizers; depression in terms of psychiatric conditions is not the same as depressants in terms of pharmacology even though they share some common features. If they were meant in the same way then no-one would abuse depressants as they'd have no potential for euphoria

 

[Coolio]

Euphoria doesn't equal productive or mentally stable, but it doesn't contraindicate productive or stable either. Most people would agree amphetamine and methamphetamine are the ultimate productivity tools, or we wouldn't give them to our children en masse to help them get through school. Opiates can be used in exactly the same way by many people to increase focus and motivation.

SSRI's are antithetical to the hedonistic imperative.

 

[fastandbulbous]

Most people would agree amphetamine and methamphetamine are the ultimate productivity tools, or we wouldn't give them to our children en masse to help them get through school.

I think that you'd find that giving those drugs to kids that don't suffer from some degree od ADHD actually has a negative effect on productivity in the long run, just as they do on adults that use them for more than a couple of days at a time to increase productivity. People with ADHD suffer from a lack of dopamine in the reward pathways, such that they do not get the reward most people get from completing a task - too much dopamine & you're in the realms of shadow people and florid psychotic symptoms (hardly conducive to productivity unless you're talking about turning paper into confetti or such similar stereotyped behaviour!)

Incidentally, I've noticed that MDPV seems to be lacking the stereotyped behaviour seen with (meth)amphetamine or coke. At doses that should produce that behaviour you get the unpleasant sympathetic stimulation that leads to panic attacks etc., so you don't get people spending hours looking for something that doesn't exist

 

[yoyoman]

You know what ya'll....

quckly *skimmed" the last page, wouldn't waste my time because its real simple...

WHATEVER WORKS FOR YOU....

and...

Not *everybody* necessarily, all depends, on the individual and their place in the world but, if an opiate works for you - helps you function, work, do what ya need to do, life live..

whats their to FUCKIN argue about??

I see stuff about SSRI's, people saying "what brain damage, where's the references?" LOL... shit, pointless to go on, but,

really, REALLY.. all of this stuff, comes down to each individual, and what works for them...

If the DSM-666 or whatever, when some future AI robots, start figuring out every possible 'diagnosis' there ever is or will be... the ever increasing list, wouldnt it eventually.. just come down to.. fastandbulbous has the f&b "disorder*, and this.. works.. for f&b.

Simple shit mangs..