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  • N&PD Moderators: Skorpio

Opiate anti-depressent properties

No, it's easy to be depressed on low dose opiates... and if you're feeling good, they make you feel better.
 
I think Opiates are not good antidepressants, the addiction, etc... can lead to more severe depression...

BUT I think they are still better than usual antidepressants (SSRIs, tricyclics, etc...), because usual antidepressants are very nasty, they can fuck your mood more than Opiates...
 
I find that low doses of Codeine (100mg, not euphoric for me), definataly stabilize my mood a bit. They don't make me happy, they don't stop me from being unhappy, but in general they level me out a bit, and make me feel a bit more sociable and talkative. I'm not saying opioids are good antidepressants (they are addictive, and have a tolerance buildup), but low doses definately have antidepressant effects (as opposed to high doses that have euphoric effects).
 
PwnX said:
I find that low doses of Codeine (100mg, not euphoric for me), definataly stabilize my mood a bit. They don't make me happy, they don't stop me from being unhappy, but in general they level me out a bit, and make me feel a bit more sociable and talkative. I'm not saying opioids are good antidepressants (they are addictive, and have a tolerance buildup), but low doses definately have antidepressant effects (as opposed to high doses that have euphoric effects).
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along those lines, it would be good to develop an AD that has specific targeted opiate receptor action, among other things, but without the negatives...the perfect drug...heh.

I have to admit, part of the AD action is just the head change, the "getting high", going from 0 to
+2 (to use Bilz0r's description)... but there's def. something that erases physiological depression and lack of energy/motivation....right slippery bastard, that.

Seems SSRI's are too much of a mind/body fuck for many of us, though I may go that route just for the boost in willpower.
 
there is a drug that was "tweaked" to do just this... Buprenorphine.
Opiates were used as antidepressants in the US up until the 1950's. then they were discontinued for the obvious reasons.
buph, being a "partial" opiate agonist/antagonist delivers alot of the antidepressant qualities of opiates, but has a "ceiling" effect as a result of the antagonist properties. you cannot od on it., and will not develop a tolerance, BUT, there is some physical dependance, nothing even close to full opiates though.
even though buph is approved for "pain management", it has been widely prescribed "off-label" for depression for at least 20 years.
just to be clear....there are 2 different formulations of this drug...in 2002 a sublingual version was approved for treatment for opiate addiction. i was not referring to that one. in 1981 Buprenex, an injectible version was approved. this version is not approved for opiate addiction, so there is no confusion as to the indications for each...
i know many people who have been prescribed buprenex by their psychiatrists for depression.
 
Helios. said:
Opiates are not antidepressants.
This thread belongs in Other Drugs.
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Opiates are not antidepressants, but they can maybe enhance your mood...
If they can, what's interesting is how they do that (which receptors plays a role in the fighting of the depression, etc...); and this discussion definitely belongs to ADD...
 
Yes he does but only in the context in which someone who takes opiates to escape reality, or forget thier problems.
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A seriously depressed person usually escapes reality and wants to forget his or her problems so I still see opiates to be no use as I doubt such a person wouldn't rise the dose having some bigger amount of medicine at hand. Going to hospital for a single dose each day surely isn't comfortable. Also, tolerance would build up, would you expect doctors to increase to the dose? A very good example of danger related to prescribing addictive drugs to depressed patients are benzodiazepines. Some people maintain prescribed dose for years, some increase it, both get strongly addicted. They look for additional ways of getting more drugs (black market, visiting a few doctors). Another disadvantage of using opiates for depression not directly connected with their effectiveness is many addicts would have an easier access to legal drugs. I'm not saying that's bad for people like us but no one beyond the community would accept it. They have no understanding for people like us. They prefer to shut themselves in their houses with their happy families, prohibit drugs and leave out without any alternatives except funny therapies and antidepressants with side effects worse than depression itself.
 
I, for one, am sick of all this bashing of the medical professions. Doctors didn't invest their money and time going to school for a decade so they could be your personal drug dealer. So antidepressent medications aren't perfect, but I'm just sick of people bitching about big pharma, big med, big whatever like it's all a giant conspiracy to make your life miserable. If antidepressents sucked that bad and it was that easy to make better drugs, why haven't any of you done it?
 
hussness said:
I, for one, am sick of all this bashing of the medical professions. Doctors didn't invest their money and time going to school for a decade so they could be your personal drug dealer. So antidepressent medications aren't perfect, but I'm just sick of people bitching about big pharma, big med, big whatever like it's all a giant conspiracy to make your life miserable. If antidepressents sucked that bad and it was that easy to make better drugs, why haven't any of you done it?
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just remember pharmacutical companies arent here to help people like all companies they are here to make money.
 
forgive me, but i still do not understand the distinction. what is the difference between an antidepressant and me taking some other drug to achieve the same effect?

antidepressants arent primariliy mood stabilisers, they are mood brighteners. this is clear in most people i have seen taking them. i know what your saying BilZ0r, but i think people continue to take antidepressants long after they are free from depression because they DO add that +1 to your mood.

i want a decent drug for my bipolar/depression whatever the fuck i have. i quit meth. cleaned my life up. changed my routines. got a job. got hobbies. while i have come so far, there is still so far to go. what pisses me off the most is that one day i will be untouchable... laughing, joking, engaging in light hearted and meaningful conversation, confident, charismatic, happy about not doing drugs, moving on with life and just being who and how i want to be. the next day i might be somewhat withdrawn, not interested in conversation, anxious and ready to go hit the pipe again and just say fuck it. and thats the last thing i want really. when lifes good at the moment, its better than its ever been. the bad days just make it hard.

i dont want to take anymore SSRIs, because ive had mixed results and side effects from them. and to be honest, i dont wanna fuck with my serotonin anymore. i dont want anything messing with my dopamine either, since that has been cained lately. what is wrong with opiates, more specifically, buprenorphine, for stabilising my mood? i really want to give it a shot, but a part of me doesnt want to give up aiming for a normal me without the aide of drugs.

dont really like the sound of antipsychotics either...
 
I know bupe deviates from the norm, but most antidepressants have to have a effect on the 5HT/NA trafficking systems.

Opiates are depressants. An antidepresant is meant to give people energy etc to help them with motivational issues and get back to work etc. Unlike an opiate, its not supposed to make it any easier to mong around the house all day doing jackshit.
 
Smyth said:
An antidepresant is meant to give people energy etc to help them with motivational issues and get back to work etc. Unlike an opiate, its not supposed to make it any easier to mong around the house all day doing jackshit.
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I have read of a lot of people complaining that fluoxetine turns off motivation, that is, makes it easier to mong around the house doing jackshit. Still, it is the prototype of modern antidepressants.
 
I've found my SSRI gives me serious motivation. That's the main reason I started taking it.
 
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