• MDMA &
    Empathogenic
    Drugs

    Welcome Guest!

Ok i just wanted to clear this up, How bad is ecstasy really?

In Australia there's a current campaign that says taking ecstacy can melt your organs... spreading misinformation just makes people think everything they say is a lie.

And I'm seriously hoping prsnmalam was joking.
 
I am not 100% positive, but my anatomy professor who is a Doctor and is very open about his drug use and alway talks about how much he loves them told us that too much mdma with too little recovery time slowly kills the seritonin producing cells, therefore your body makes less over time. if you dont give your body time to recover between rolls, eventually you will kill all these cells in your brain making you unable to make seritonin. No amount of antidepressants/seritonin stimulators can help you bc nothing can put it back in. medications only stimulate these cells to release or hey inhibit your body's ability to metabolize the seritonin, but nothing "makes" seritonin except these cells.

However in moderation, your body can recover, but just dont abuse it.

This is what he told us. he was not trying to scare us away from doing drugs. this came from the teacher who said "I'm flyin high on 6 vicodin right now" and "of course, we all love getting high" in class.

I know you cant believe everything you hear, even from Drs but yeah.
 
i get the "holes in the brain the size of quarters" argument from my girl all the time, you would think that after making hundreds of quarter sized holes in my brain that i would be mentally retarded.
 
That doesn't mean you should consume them readily with no thought for the harm they inflict.

You shouldn't drink every day just because it's legal because yes, you will destroy your liver and damage your brain, no matter how much the government approves of it.
 
as per the subject of bias everyone has an inherit bias that cannot be bypassed. We all have a paticullar perspective though which we view reality. If you really want to get into it all of our perspectives are wrong and there is no such thing as truth as proved in Godel's theorems. If you want to get even further into it none of this existence matters if it turns out M-Theory is right.

@ShaolinBomber where did I say MDMA wasn't neurotoxic? All I said was that we are exposed to neurotoxins everyday and nobody seems to care least of all the government who in fact approved a great a deal of them.

Your blatant disregard for MDMA's neurotoxicity because "the government approves of neurotoxins all the time." is foolish at best.

The FDA "approved neurotoxin list" doesn't even begin to compare to a substance like MDMA's ability to cause damage. Get your priorities straight.
 
shaolinbomber believe me I have no blatant disregard for MDMA's neurotoxicity, I give this molecule my utmost respect for what it can show us and for how it can harm us. I don't binge and have only used it 8 times in my life. As for the comparison to approved neurotoxins we don't really know because MDMA hasn't been well researched enough BECAUSE THE GOVERNMENT WON'T ALLOW IT! Beyond approved neurotoxins the FDA has approved thousands of "medicines" that are as harmful if not more so than MDMA. Prescription amphetamines like adderall have been linked to an increase in the sudden death of children by up to 500%! Imagine that doctors handing out amphetamines like candy to children! Just because MDMA is not 100% benign doesn't mean it should be a schedule 1 substance, after all adderall which kills children is schedule 2. There a ton of examples just like this.

I've been reading through your posts shaolinbomber and you seem a little suspect to me. If you are who you say you are then I feel sorry for you. I'm sorry you only did MDMA a handful of times and fucked up your brain. I'm sorry if you've been confined to the remainder of your life as an e-tarded Wal-Mart greeter. But we aren't all like you, I do well for myself, I'm a political science major with a 3.7 GPA. I'm going to go law school and make something of myself. Earlier you called me a typical e user, well I am. I am an average American from an upper middle class family who lives in one of the nicest suburbs in the country. I go to a well regarded university where I make good grades. I have a future in the upper echelons of American society. Your the exception and that makes me sad.

Haha, you want to start with the personal attacks because i called you out for the typical dip shit paranoid drug user that you are, im cool with that then. Your understanding of the english grammar is shit. You use too many comma's where periods are necessary.

Apparently i fucked my brain up because i have persistent visual disturbances according to you. I'd like you to tell that to the rest of the people who suffer from HPPD. I'd bet alot of money that the majority are exponentially smarter than you are, and that includes myself.

And because you know so much about me, im a wal-mart greeter e-tard right? See i thought i worked for the city i live in and am a part time college student studying kinesiology but i guess not.

I really hope you continue to use the drug and end up dieing from your own stupidity, and i'm sincere when i say that. =D

Have a nice day faggot.

Man i got so carried away with your dumb ass that i forgot to reply to your first paragraph.

What exactly does MDMA show you? That you get a lot of loved up feelings from a synthetic compound that releases all of your serotonin?

You're 100% wrong when you say MDMA hasn't been researched. It's been researched on various mammal brain's for years now. They dont allow research on humans because they've seen what the drug can do to lab tested animals.

Thousands of medicines huh? Are you fucking stupid? Give me a list that shows there are "thousands" of medicines that the FDA has approved thats been CLINICALLY RECORDED to have neurotoxic effects.

I will agree with you on one thing. They over-prescribe adderall. But here is another example of your stupidity. You say amphetamines like adderall are harmful? What the fuck do you think MDMA is? Do more research you fucking moron.
 
Last edited:
the fact that it is only those that don't do it that tell you its bad just shows they don't know what theyre talking about. i think the most dangerous thing about E is caused by the fact it is illegal - u get other drugs present in the pills and some of these might have bad side effects

it sounds like your responsible enough to know what your doin, since u only do it once every month or so. as long as u dont hammer it several times a week you'll be fine. and dont take more than u have to. if your not 'there' after a couple of pills, dont take more. they are shit pills and could be dangerous in higher doses.

gnosis x
 
Guys, ad hominem attacks make you both look bad. Let's avoid that and try to concentrate on the issues.

That said, this point has been argued to death. Nevertheless, there are generally two truths which make themselves evident after a lot of hashing:

1) We simply do not have the research to state that MDMA is neurotoxic in humans. There are so many confounding factors in the studies that have been done that they're almost totally inapplicable. For instance, the inter-species dosage scaling model almost unanimously employed in biological assays of MDMA's neurotoxicty suffers greatly from the fact that small mammals such as rats produce toxic metabolites at an enhanced rate due to their fast metabolism. The inter-species scaling model contradicts this fact, recommending extreme dosages where they should actually be administering smaller ones to compensate for the increased production of toxic metabolites. Behavioral studies in humans have been admittedly population-biased, to the extent of recruiting their subjects from raves and other such events where a host of factors would dictate one's disposition simply by their attendance. In summary, the research just isn't there. I agree with fat_bunnies that this is because of MDMA's illegality -- there's an incentive to prove MDMA's neurotoxicity, but none to prove how to use it safely (or whether this is even possible). Studies are designed to provoke a neurotoxic reaction, and anyone who's done research knows that there's a definite impetus toward providing the results that one expects.

EDIT: Actually, after writing this, I realized that the biological harm picture isn't so clear. It's obvious that releasing massive amounts of neurotransmitters is going to lead to depletion, downregulation, etc. Also, using an amphetamine analogue carries all the risks of normal amphetamines with it, even if the risks aren't as pronounced with MDMA (since it's not as effective in its stimulation as, say, dex-amphetamine). The best advice I guess we can go on is to practice caution and keep in mind that there's a risk/benefit ratio in which the risks are not entirely known, which makes the whole thing more risky but still potentially worthwhile.

2) Anecdotal reports indicate that using Ecstasy (note that I'm not going to say MDMA here) causes some harm. Lacking longitudinal studies, it's hard to say whether this harm is permanent. It's also difficult to say whether this harm is a result of the drug itself, or a result of living weekend to weekend and having one's life revolve around an altered state. I imagine that simply considering oneself to be a drug user introduces a number of psychological issues, apart from the effects of the drug itself. As such, I don't think we can say much for E's physiological effects, but I think it's prudent to caution people not to construct their lives around the drug, or use too often or at high dosages.

For the record, I see nothing wrong with fat_bunnie's grammar. On the topic of FDA-approved neurotoxic drugs, Ketamine is employed as a painkiller for children and the elderly, but potentially causes neurotoxicity (Olney's lesions, to be exact). Doctors circumvent this by using an NMDA inhibitor, which blocks the neurotoxicity. There may be a similarly simple solution for MDMA, but the current trend in MDMA research isn't helping us reach it.
 
Last edited:
My Understanding,
Ecstasy is a fairly new drug in which there is no HARD FACTS about it.

What We KNOW:
Fucks up your Serotonin nuero's because of thier massive release which the MDMA Causes.-----Leading to deppression
Also CAN POSSIBLY cause HPPD, and Insomnia
Stressful on the heart

MYTHS NOT YET PROVED BY ANY EVIDENCE:
Holes in your brain.
Mental retardation (Few people are convinced of this and told me)
Kills brain cells
Causes bone depleation
 
this might not be relevant or creditable but to be honest, too much of something is bad for you whether it be drinking, using drugs even eating. it's honestly all about moderation and control and to be safe about it. I mean what doesn't kill you these days? for god sakes our own lifestyles can kill us. but i mean as what this forum has taught me about ecstasy is that, its all about moderation of what you take, ensure that it's tested and that you aren't taking what you don't want to take and to really understand ecstasy through reading peoples post and the broad range of information found on the net. But just saying that it's bad period is simply a misunderstanding because it really isn't.
I remember when I was younger I just thought all drugs were bad period. but as i got older took research into my own hands, I've come to conclude that yeah, some drugs are really not that bad and that some like ecstasy might actually be a life-altering drug. I can actually say that my life has changed because of this drug and its for the better. :D
 
Top