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Benzos Ok i did look this up but i just can't beileve it...

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Supeudol said:
Lorazepam is longer acting than Alprazolam, not shorter acting. Alprazolam is stronger mg for mg, but not longer acting by any means.
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I made a mistake, what I meant was that lorazepam was shorter acting than clonazepam and longer acting than alprazolam. It is half as potent as Xanax and clonazepam. (Which are pretty much equipotent, alprazolam being more potent but only by negligible ammounts).
 
I think the chart is pretty good except one thing. 60mg of temazepam is definetely better than 1.5mg of alprazolam. clonaz and xanax are equipotent for anxiety imo but klonopn has a "ceiling" where it doesn't do much more. seems to be 3-4mg. also, drinking does zero on clonazepam and with xanax well.... you all know how that goes. i find diazepam the 2nd best to drink on.
 
^The chart isn't talking about "better", it's talking about "stronger". Also, we try not to encourage combinations of CNS depressants such as alcohol and benzodiazepines due to the amount of people that have died on that combo....

IMO drinking on benzodiazepines is stupid as fuck, just my $0.02
 
imo I think kpins are a lot stronger than ativan but I think ativan is pure shite. I took 30mgs over a few hours and I never felt it kick in and actually work. .5mg of kpin will take away most anxiety for at least 5hrs for me although I usually take more recreationally.
 
Yeah I have never liked Lorazepam(Ativan) that much,
just because it didn't seem to do anything for me either in low doses or ridiculously high only a minor effect reducing anxiety.

Clonazepam are much heavier stuff, take a couple of 2mg's and your blacked out for a couple of hours.
It isn't that great for relieving anxiety though, much more of a bodybuzz type of thing.
 
I used to swear by Valium and lorazepam ( I really liked ativan) but have started to grow fond of clonazepam because its quite a laid back benzo.
 
Znegative said:
This is true^, but when it comes down to benzo activity, lorazepam is 1/2 the strength of clonazepam and alprazolam. I believe this fully as I've switched back and forth between 1mg of Xanax/clonazepam and 2mg of lorazepam. However, some people who have low tolerances to benzodiazepines may find lorazepam's effect more apparent as it is shorter acting, and has more hypnotic effects than both clonazepam and alprazolam. I personally find Ativan to be a shitty medication, but some people seem to swear by it. It feels like a lame cross between zolpidem or any other Z-drug and a different boring benzo like Librium.
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Well put, Znegative. The main difference between clonzepam and lorazepam is the action. Clonzepam is considered to be a long-acting benzo; it has a slower onset and longer duration than lorazepam, which is considered a short-to-intermediate acting benzo which, like you said, could cause someone less experienced in benzo use to feel like the lorazepam is actually stronger.

Took my info from Wikipedia. Hope this helps, OP!

If I am wrong with my facts, feel free to correct me.
 
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sidestyle said:
Well put, Znegative. The main difference between clonzepam and lorazepam is the action. Clonzepam is considered to be a long-acting benzo; it has a slower onset and longer duration than lorazepam, which is considered a short-to-intermediate acting benzo which, like you said, could cause someone less experienced in benzo use to feel like the lorazepam is actually stronger.

Took my info from Wikipedia. Hope this helps, OP!

If I am wrong with my facts, feel free to correct me.
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A lot of those Benzodiazepine equivalency charts are not that accurate, and even Heather Ashtons work on the BZD equivalency table is still not spot on. Clonazepam is overrated, and is actually not that strong of a benzo. 0.5mg of Clonazepam is not equivalent to 10mg of Diazepam, that is inaccurate. It is more like 0.5mg of Clonazepam is closer to 5mg of Diazepam, or 7.5mg of Diazepam.
 
Lorazepam is a bit useless at a 0.5mg dosage, just imo from the one time I tried it with a friend. Clonazepam is definitely twice as potent as lorazepam both in my experience and by benzodiazepine equivalency charts.

Clonazepam is a powerful and effective anxiety medication for the individuals it does work for. However, it's a very YMMV benzo, whereas benzos like Diazepam or Alprazolam tend to work the same for everyone. I personally think it's fantastic, it's the heavy duty form of Valium and prevents redosing by providing practically none of the rebound anxiety that more shorter-acting, and thus, more compulsively redosed benzos (Lorazepam, Ativan), do.

Supeudol, 0.5mg clonazepam definitely equals 10mg diazepam, ime, but since it doesn't kick in quickly like diazepam does, it doesn't get you as "high." But, if you're treating GAD, and can handle waiting an hour or so for relief versus 15-25 min with diazepam, then it is a hard benzo to beat, imo. There's also an ongoing debate on Bluelight whether or not equivalency charts are based on single doses, or if they're based on chronic dosing that has allowed diazepam or clonazepam (long-acting) to build up to therapeutic levels in the bloodstream.
 
Users here are mostly referring to their recreational potential while equivalency charts measure their THERAPEUTIC use which measures 5 primary domains- anxiolysis, myorelaxation, amnestic effects, sedative/hypnotic effects and anticonvulsive effects. Some benzos are better muscle relaxants than others; some are more useful as IV/IM anticonvulsants; some are more useful for treating alcoholic dependence than others; some are more subjectively enjoyable, etc

Charts creating equivalencies are inherently imperfect and just try to creating a clinically useful tool to assess dosage conversion for transitioning and so forth. When each benzodiazepine has different binding affinities for several different GABAa subtypes, you can't create direct comparisons.

Furthermore, people have different desires and preferences so of course one person may enjoy the effects of one (determine it has superior potency for them) and try to use that as evidence the charts are wrong. On top of such endeavors being ENTIRELY USELESS, they are about as scientific as determining the whole world is annoying just because Doug is :p
 
Cane2theLeft said:
Users here are mostly referring to their recreational potential while equivalency charts measure their THERAPEUTIC use which measures 5 primary domains- anxiolysis, myorelaxation, amnestic effects, sedative/hypnotic effects and anticonvulsive effects. Some benzos are better muscle relaxants than others; some are more useful as IV/IM anticonvulsants; some are more useful for treating alcoholic dependence than others; some are more subjectively enjoyable, etc

Charts creating equivalencies are inherently imperfect and just try to creating a clinically useful tool to assess dosage conversion for transitioning and so forth. When each benzodiazepine has different binding affinities for several different GABAa subtypes, you can't create direct comparisons.

Furthermore, people have different desires and preferences so of course one person may enjoy the effects of one (determine it has superior potency for them) and try to use that as evidence the charts are wrong. On top of such endeavors being ENTIRELY USELESS, they are about as scientific as determining the whole world is annoying just because Doug is :p
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^ Seconded. Different strokes for different folks. For example, I can take like 6mg of Clonazepam, and wait 2 hours, and it doesn't even compare to me taking 50-60mg of Diazepam at once. Diazepam has a fast onset, lasts longer than Clonazepam, and has a longer half life, and Diazepam is also better for BZD tapers.
 
Cane2theLeft said:
Users here are mostly referring to their recreational potential while equivalency charts measure their THERAPEUTIC use which measures 5 primary domains- anxiolysis, myorelaxation, amnestic effects, sedative/hypnotic effects and anticonvulsive effects. Some benzos are better muscle relaxants than others; some are more useful as IV/IM anticonvulsants; some are more useful for treating alcoholic dependence than others; some are more subjectively enjoyable, etc

Charts creating equivalencies are inherently imperfect and just try to creating a clinically useful tool to assess dosage conversion for transitioning and so forth. When each benzodiazepine has different binding affinities for several different GABAa subtypes, you can't create direct comparisons.

Furthermore, people have different desires and preferences so of course one person may enjoy the effects of one (determine it has superior potency for them) and try to use that as evidence the charts are wrong. On top of such endeavors being ENTIRELY USELESS, they are about as scientific as determining the whole world is annoying just because Doug is :p
Click to expand...

Let's end on a strong note, with this post.
 
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