New to Tina and Coke after condemning drugs for 20 of my 30 years of life. Resuction/pace tips

[Halif2]

It’s like being in withdrawal but seemingly forever

This is what has stopped me from sticking to sobriety for more than a few weeks at a time. I have more years on Earth than you (and thus more time in a chemically induced state) but yeah, I absolutely relate to what you wrote. I'm concerned that I'll never be able to really get 'clean' because the hole is now so deep that I don't know if I could ever return to any sort of baseline/normal state which wasn't just despair. Perhaps years of abstinence and healthy living would eventually do it, but I don't have the inner strength or stamina to do that.

Also, OP's experience through this thread really drives home a difficult truth: You cannot protect or help people by telling them not to take drugs, because they will never know the damage it can cause until they've experienced it for themselves. The best anyone can do is offer practical harm reduction information. That's why I think BL has genuine value - "just say no" has never and will never stop people using and abusing substances.

 

[Cult315]

This is what has stopped me from sticking to sobriety for more than a few weeks at a time. I have more years on Earth than you (and thus more time in a chemically induced state) but yeah, I absolutely relate to what you wrote. I'm concerned that I'll never be able to really get 'clean' because the hole is now so deep that I don't know if I could ever return to any sort of baseline/normal state which wasn't just despair. Perhaps years of abstinence and healthy living would eventually do it, but I don't have the inner strength or stamina to do that.

Also, OP's experience through this thread really drives home a difficult truth: You cannot protect or help people by telling them not to take drugs, because they will never know the damage it can cause until they've experienced it for themselves. The best anyone can do is offer practical harm reduction information. That's why I think BL has genuine value - "just say no" has never and will never stop people using and abusing substances.

I genuinely don’t think I could make it anywhere close to years of abstinence to even give it a thought. The few times I’ve been truly clean from all substances have been the most miserable times of my life, and I really can’t explain why other than sober feels worse than any withdrawal I’ve ever been in. I feel like my body is under more stress and my mental state is definitely impacted far worse than any drug has ever managed to do. Spending years in misery that will negatively impact not only my mental but more than likely my physical health just doesn’t make sense in the “hope” that I’ll eventually feel better.

Maybe it isn’t such a stretch on here but the few people I’ve confided that to over the years have told me I’m crazy, I’m just an addict that doesn’t want to quit. Cause yeah, drinking myself into a stupor daily to quit the drugs I actually like sounds like something I enjoy. And switching to meth, which I hate as a drug, to get off the subs that have kept me sane and I actually didn’t mind being on(for the most part) sounds like I’m enjoying it too. Honestly staying on subs for the rest of my life likely would hold me, but unfortunately it’s not as sustainable as I thought it would be.

 

[Psynaught]

I have not touched cocaine or meth (and I used to get the really, really good stuff, it looked like chunks of glass) in 28 years. They were the absolute worst addictions imaginable. I spent 20 years clean and sober and today will take other drugs but not those 2 they are so absolutely evil.

That should tell you something. Stay away.

 

[Keif' Richards]

Furthermore, I feel the difference between Methamphetamine and prescribed Amphetamines/Stimulants boils down in a big way to a relatively innocuous issue: dosage units.

Methamphetamine in general can be said to be twice as potent as Amphetamine. The highest dose you're generally going to see someone on for Adderall, which is more or less Racemic Amphetamine (I don't feel like drowning in simple math right now so bear with me) is going to be 60mg per day.

If a person buys even a single point (0.1g/100mg) of Methamphetamine, they have a dosage equipotent to 3.3 times the maximum daily dosage of Amphetamine. For most people, 60mg Amphetamine without tolerance will have them licking their lips and acting squirrely. Think about what you're getting with 2 points, a half gram or a gram.

Anyway, the dosing units are important. They tell you with confidence exactly how much of a substance you're taking. This number sits in our head. Experience teaches us what 20mg feels like or 30mg. We always know that the drug is essentially pure, the same each time. The question to redose is answered with the knowledge that you've taken enough. When you just have a half gram of Meth in a ziploc bag and you're dosing based upon how big a line is relative to your pinky, you don't stand a chance.

When the question to redose is nothing more than "should I?" with no perspective, people with Meth tend to do a little bit more. We all know what Amphetamine Psychosis looks like. It's a fairly common result of using Meth and I guarantee you not one of those people did Meth that day wanting to get so high they became psychotic.

It's just not something that is practical if we're talking about self-regulation. The idea of using Meth responsibly is generally a fantasy. I guess my main point though, is that I believe if there were standard dosing units, parameters and discipline, a person could use Meth responsibly in the same way that a person uses Adderall.

That's not how it works though. Adderall comes from a pharmacy on the same day every 28 days. It is going to be essentially the same every single time. You have to get Meth from a dealer. It can be different. Dealers get arrested. To use these drugs, not just stimulants, Opioids to, effectively, you only need to have the right system in place to guarantee use will remain stable.

 

[Dirtyblond91]

This is what has stopped me from sticking to sobriety for more than a few weeks at a time. I have more years on Earth than you (and thus more time in a chemically induced state) but yeah, I absolutely relate to what you wrote. I'm concerned that I'll never be able to really get 'clean' because the hole is now so deep that I don't know if I could ever return to any sort of baseline/normal state which wasn't just despair. Perhaps years of abstinence and healthy living would eventually do it, but I don't have the inner strength or stamina to do that.

Also, OP's experience through this thread really drives home a difficult truth: You cannot protect or help people by telling them not to take drugs, because they will never know the damage it can cause until they've experienced it for themselves. The best anyone can do is offer practical harm reduction information. That's why I think BL has genuine value - "just say no" has never and will never stop people using and abusing substances.

To clarify, when I relapsed it was 6 months (IIRC) since drugs. The shorter number was Alchohol.

And exactly how does harm reduction work with meth use? Tonight, I relapsed. But I set a timer once I started and stopped even before it went off.

 

[Halif2]

And exactly how does harm reduction work with meth use?

Don't dump that question on me! I have no idea!

Seriously though, I agree with what's been said in this thread about it basically being impossible to safely or responsibly use meth. But telling people not to use meth or any other drug does not prevent people from using it. It doesn't matter how many horror stories there are out there or the reputation that a drug has earned, people are going to do it anyway if they've set their mind to it.

So recognising that you cannot simply tell people not to use drugs, I think the best anyone can do is try to limit the harm they may suffer from their usage. Things like setting time limits, using lock boxes, only buying small amounts, and so on - anything that might temper your usage - are all worth a go .

I feel the difference between Methamphetamine and prescribed Amphetamines/Stimulants boils down in a big way to a relatively innocuous issue: dosage units.

This is such a great point (pun intended?). It is so simple but it's absolutely true. The power that a number has is profound. If you knew that your sweet spot was 100mg, you wouldn't just take 240mg without a thought. But when it's just powder with no number attached... It is so much easier to accidentally go too far when you're just racking up lines or sticking some shard in a pipe.

 

[Keif' Richards]

I'm the only one allowed to make puns around here @Halif2 so back off

You are all right regarding the "just say no" strategy to Methamphetamine usage. As the thread was geared toward the concept of self-control specifically, I felt like being blunt.

Harm Reduction with Methamphetamine is the usual stuff:

Hydrate - If you're using moderate-heavy amounts of Amphetamine/Methamphetamine, you're going to need a lot of fluids to keep yourself good. I would recommend 8fl oz of fluids every hour. You will need also to be consuming electrolytes. Sports Drinks like Gatorade/Pedialyte are great choices. Make sure you get the sugar-free kind, more on this later.

You can easily make your own Oral Rehydration Fluids at home. The recipe I have always gone by is:

1 liter water
6 Teaspoons Sugar
1/2 Teaspoon Salt

Oral Hygiene - Methamphetamine is known to cause "METH MOUTH". This is a rapid degeneration of teeth and gums. Methamphetamine causes dry mouth. Saliva is your mouth's best defense against decay outside of brushing.

It is good to brush your teeth normally. Don't forget. Also, chewing gum is a good way to stimulate saliva. It's also just good for having something to do with your mouth.

Food - it can be very hard to eat when you're on Methamphetamine. For that reason, I suggest stuff that is easy to get down. Peanut Butter, Milk and Protein Drinks are a great way to give your body most of what it needs without having to chew. Take a big hunk of peanut butter, drink some milk and have your Protein Drink.

Don't stay up for more than a day. When you stay up past 48 hours, your situation mentally and physically will start to deteriorate rapidly. I hope some of this helps.

 

[Cult315]

Don't dump that question on me! I have no idea!

Seriously though, I agree with what's been said in this thread about it basically being impossible to safely or responsibly use meth. But telling people not to use meth or any other drug does not prevent people from using it. It doesn't matter how many horror stories there are out there or the reputation that a drug has earned, people are going to do it anyway if they've set their mind to it.

So recognising that you cannot simply tell people not to use drugs, I think the best anyone can do is try to limit the harm they may suffer from their usage. Things like setting time limits, using lock boxes, only buying small amounts, and so on - anything that might temper your usage - are all worth a go .



This is such a great point (pun intended?). It is so simple but it's absolutely true. The power that a number has is profound. If you knew that your sweet spot was 100mg, you wouldn't just take 240mg without a thought. But when it's just powder with no number attached... It is so much easier to accidentally go too far when you're just racking up lines or sticking some shard in a pipe.

Even if you do happen to have a good scale and are measuring out 50mg of your meth there’s no telling if the potency is going to be the same as the last time you did 50mg. Could be doing that bullshit that’s been going around bowl after bowl, line after line and not even getting you high, and the next batch you randomly end up with some anhydrous backyard pseudo cooked shit that has you up for 4 days straight, pacing back and forth between your windows with a shotgun

 

[emkee_reinvented]

Anyway, the dosing units are important. They tell you with confidence exactly how much of a substance you're taking. This number sits in our head. Experience teaches us what 20mg feels like or 30mg. We always know that the drug is essentially pure, the same each time. The question to redose is answered with the knowledge that you've taken enough. When you just have a half gram of Meth in a ziploc bag and you're dosing based upon how big a line is relative to your pinky, you don't stand a chance.

When the question to redose is nothing more than "should I?" with no perspective, people with Meth tend to do a little bit more. We all know what Amphetamine Psychosis looks like. It's a fairly common result of using Meth and I guarantee you not one of those people did Meth that day wanting to get so high they became psychotic.

Certainly goes for me as soon as a drug is in powdered form.
Oral dosing allready is on the line, snorting fetisj kickin in.
And so bypassing the intented meant dosing a presumble pure powder.
Oral in equivalent dosages to my dextro-Amphetamine presription of 5 mg tablets.

Ain t gonna happen, its sad that every 2/ 3 year orso my dr. decides to stop my ADHD meds.
So i have to again go find a psychiater, none here, for renewel of the presciption.
But via a dr. seems wiser then Coke, Methylphenidate oral is alike, and a Amphetamine instead of Tina.
with which i have none experience, but seems like a Elephant compared to Speed.

And i recide to RC s to fill te gap. Cant remember ever dosing 2-FA/ 3-FPM oral or not doing a little more.
So warning for snorter s, dump it in a solvent direct, for volumetric dosing.

I even extracted d-Amphetamine to satisfy my fetisj. Just didn t work, the extraction did.
But the resulting product was nothing like dl-Amphetamine, lucky.