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NDEs (Near Death Experiences)

I don't think NDE's are inherently Religious, but they can help lead you to a place of spiritual fulfillment.

A lot of the purpose of religion is the understanding of death.

I've only consistently had NDE's on hallucinogens, but all of them have helped me in regards to spiritual growth.
 
My two cents (maybe worth more than that but we'll see).

I never bothered with this stuff until about two years or so ago. But since then I've had more than a passing interest in NDE's. And as a result: I've done my fair share of reading, researching, and watching videos on the topic. And when I bite into something: I tend to go for it and thrash it to death (no pun intended).

My primary issue with NDE's are that they're just that i.e. Near Death Experiences. That, by sheer definition, isn't the same as being dead, finished, game over. never to be seen or post again. So there's a technicality I just cannot get my head around.

I do agree (and have obviously found) that almost all of the accounts are very similar (alarmingly so). But here's an interesting little curved ball: there's enough research out there to indicate that the nature of these accounts are by and large similar among different groups of people i.e. differing beliefs and ethnic backgrounds. At least when it comes to the spiritual side of things. Where they're similar across all groups is when it comes to seeing or supposedly meeting up with family or loved ones that have passed. This does in fact make sense to me i.e. if there was an emotional attachment to somebody that's passed on and that an individual has either thought about constantly or even in passing for years then to me it stands to reason that whatever part of the brain (whatever mechanism is involved) would form a part of the experience.

Now I have read a few accounts (as I'm sure many have) of those that purport to have had out of body experiences, hovered over themselves while on the operating table, and been able to give exact details of what was said or done while they were clinically dead (according to the instruments anyway). I've not quite figured what to make of these accounts. And this being said: there has indeed been one or two experiments (if you could call them that i.e. the medical professionals didn't purposely "kill" the patient) where signs and notes were put up in an operating theater (just in case one would imagine) but in none of those accounts were the patients "brought back" and able to recall anything this in spite of having their apparent NDE.

So I guess in short: I'm in the group that believes that these experiences are based on nothing more than some or the other chemical reaction (or whatever the mechanism is) in the brain under such circumstances. And please believe me when I say I never set out to debunk NDE's i.e. quite the total and polar opposite.

On a more crass level though: 99% of all of the accounts of NDE's that I've come across paint a very rosy picture of what apparently exists on the other side. And that peace and love that everybody talks about. And one common denominator with all that I've come across is that they no longer fear death. Well to put it bluntly: why come back? Most accounts note that they were given the choice? I know for as sure as fuck what my choice would be. And I'm healthy (albeit not particularly happy I'll admit). Imagine being given the choice to stay that side or get sent back to a mangled body e.g. as a result of a car wreck or something (and then having to deal with the possible years of difficulty or agony to follow)?

Truly. I wish I had the definitive answer to all of this (as opposed to having had to form my own conclusions). But I don't. So there's the best contribution on the topic that I can muster. But for sure am open to criticism or an alternate point of view that may convince me that I'm wrong on this.
 
My NDE have mainly been adrenaline dumping accidents where I have little memory other than fragments of struggling to survive.

Managed to avoid drowning, armed robbery and car accidents.
 
dalpat077 said:
On a more crass level though: 99% of all of the accounts of NDE's that I've come across paint a very rosy picture of what apparently exists on the other side. And that peace and love that everybody talks about. And one common denominator with all that I've come across is that they no longer fear death. Well to put it bluntly: why come back?
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Interesting approach to the problem. Son you can choose if stay or leave?

You are there already, and now have the answer for the most feared experience, and it doesn't look so bad. Why come back? What if the next time you die the rosy deal is not on the table and now the universe is ruled by some evil maniac? What if you come back and what remains of life is downhill for any reason? Makes sense
 
Adding: problem is also we don't know the full sample. How many people realizes of this and say: nope, I'm not going back, let's go!! We can't have testimonies from them, lol

And even more: what if besides the rosy experience with opt-out option is just one among hundreds of different after-death paths we don't have any idea exist?
 
usual-suspect said:
Interesting approach to the problem. Son you can choose if stay or leave?

You are there already, and now have the answer for the most feared experience, and it doesn't look so bad. Why come back? What if the next time you die the rosy deal is not on the table and now the universe is ruled by some evil maniac? What if you come back and what remains of life is downhill for any reason? Makes sense
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Well. That seems to be a common among these experiences. Sometimes (mostly) coupled with apparently having been informed that their purpose in life on this planet has not yet been fulfilled. I'm skeptical at best. And cannot help but wonder if that's just some type of ego phenomenon (and I don't mean that in a nasty way i.e. I just don't have quite the right word to use).

Put it another morbid way (but without going into minute detail): I personally cannot imagine this planet without me being on it. Or get used to the idea that this may be my last post (type of thing) i.e. always thinking about later, another post, something else to do later in the day, tomorrow, you get the picture. The reality is: that's pretty fucked up let's face it. I mean to say: I think I'm special. But let's not push it! :ROFLMAO: And frankly were it not for this retarded notion and the fact that I cannot prove beyond any reasonable doubt that there's even a modicum of truth or reality to what these people supposedly experience: I'd hit that Fent. stash of mine with a vengeance right after hitting the "Post Reply" button! :ROFLMAO: So I dunno. Is this ego or survival instinct? And are these (but two maybe?) reasons why people that have experienced NDE's infer "choice" or "purpose not yet fulfilled" from said experiences? Dunno. And no: I don't need to post on the suicide support forum. I'm trying to make a point is all.

And this does lead to another musing (which just came to me now): is it not possible that the medical definition or mechanics of "clinically dead" is flawed? Or maybe we just don't yet have the technology that's sensitive enough to pick up certain signals. I mean (terrible topic for some I guess): there's been more than one genuine account of people waking up inside coffins after having being pronounced dead (and obviously days later to boot). So maybe we're just not looking in the right places? Not a joke by the way i.e. a genuine musing.

Reason the above could be important: it'd be real interesting if there was something in the above. That way it'd be a cinch to experiment with this stuff. But as long as there's a (possibly unknown) difference between clinical death and dead-dead well then it may not yield results.

Fun (morbid) fact that I read about just yesterday though:

Did you know that it's been studied (albeit not at great length) that the human head, once severed, can be fully cognizant of its surroundings for up to 20 seconds after such unfortunate event? At least that's according to some or the other executioner from years back that apparently noticed this phenomenon on more than one occasion.

Oh well. There's my "wholesome fun and uplifting" post for the day! :ROFLMAO:
 
deficiT said:
That sounds boring
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In a way. I don't remember the time before I was born being super boring. Either way, it's balance. Cant expect my experience to be interesting forever. Comes a time for new beings to live and experience.
 
Pickledlemons said:
I've died before, all nine yards, not breathing no heart rate for at least 10 minutes maybe longer ( yeah I know it doesnt make sense tell me about it). Anyway you want to know what I remember? fuck all, nothing but black.
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Same here. On barbiturate overdose. Twice.
Once comatose 2 days, the other time 4. Both times docs told me I'd been technically dead.
People eagerly inquired "Did you see a light at the end of a tunnel? Did you see your dead relatives?"
Nope. Nothing. One minute I was walking around, next minute I awoke on a ventilator. Days later. That's it.
 
jasperkent said:
Same here. On barbiturate overdose. Twice.
Once comatose 2 days, the other time 4. Both times docs told me I'd been technically dead.
People eagerly inquired "Did you see a light at the end of a tunnel? Did you see your dead relatives?"
Nope. Nothing. One minute I was walking around, next minute I awoke on a ventilator. Days later. That's it.
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I can relate to that. The time it happened to me, I didn't wake up for 10 days. And when I woke I was missing 8 years of memory. I thought I was 14 again. I didn't even know what city I lived in, or how to walk.
The doctors told my parents I would almost certainly die but if I lived I'd be eating through a straw for the rest of my life. Full recovery wasn't even on the table, but somehow it happened.
I think it was a lot more traumatic for my friends and family than for me. I got to sleep through the worst of it. Kind of feel guilty for that.

Anyway yeah, no light at the end of the tunnel or anything.
 
I don't know if it was NDE, but when I was a toddler, I fell off the bed and all the blood drained from my face. I went to the er and I survived it. The moment I woke up, my stupid ass father said "we thought you didn't make it"!
 
Oh, interestingly they've made progress on this phenomenon. They recently made the first ever brain scan recording in the moments of someone's death.

www.livescience.com

First-ever scan of a dying human brain reveals life may actually 'flash before your eyes'

The accidental finding was made when a man suddenly died during a routine brain scan.
www.livescience.com www.livescience.com

The man just happened to die while in the middle of getting a brain scan. His brain started showing unusual dream like patterns as he died, and these patterns lingered for some time after the "official" point of death, after his heart stopped beating.

So NDEs may be hallucinations after all, the brain thinks death is imminent, but then luckily some people are revived and live to tell.
 
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My diabetic friend chugged over a liter of alcohol a couple years back and had a near-death experience. I'm going to ask him about his experience this weekend and report back here.
 
I've had a few near-deaths but no interesting experiences.

What freaks me out is thinking maybe I did physically die all those times, but somehow I'm still here!! LOL 😕 Like some horrible Groundhog Day.

I really hope this is not the case and the "nothingness" is true. Even Hell might be preferrable.
 
I've had 2 experiences one from a suicide attempt with a whole lot of my grandmas meds and my sister was holding my hand while in the er and my heart stopped and I felt a cold kind of hard to explain sensation all over then everything went black and I came back.. my second was last year and muc different I was in jail and my mind took my soul to this alternate reality then I came back to the med staff taking my blood pressure and asking me questions and saying my blood pressure is way too low and I have to go then I fell out again and I went back to this different reality for a few days it was so real and I was there for days then I came back to in the med ward if the jail and they asked me if I remember anything and I didn't so I go my medical records and my heart stopped twice that time and I couldn't hold my self up while In a altered mental state
 
RedRum OG said:
IME death is just quiet black nothing
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That would be bliss. But I detect laziness in that hope. Same as when a person curls up into bed and says goodbye world and goes to sleep. Or a heroin nod. Bliss. But I would not count on that! LOL I feel nature gives us all the clues we need.

Wow I want to comment on this as I do find NDE's fascinating. I need to read all the posts first though.

I did however email the guy at nderf.org and asked them to NOT include psychedelic experience. Not because they are not important, but we want the physical component of a person being clinically dead and not muddy the waters. Two separate things.
 
AbbeyLee said:
I've had a few near-deaths but no interesting experiences.
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same, I don't remember anything, I was unconscious or asleep during most of them

arrall said:
There is no evidence of this. The DMT "near-death-experience" idea has been disproven. Are you able to link this study?
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yeah I always kinda scoffed at that theory, extremely speculative and the endogenous DMT theory didn't go anywhere. Perhaps it is endogenous, but only in fleetingly minute non-psychoactive amounts.

if it were true, why are NDE experiences nothing like DMT? Nobody has ever described fractals or DMT like experiences during these.
 
To me death would be like fainting, but never coming back. Like going to sleep and not waking up. The idea of dying doesn't phase me in the slightest.
 
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