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My Top Philosophical Questions

the only than i can be sure of is that i have thoughts and exerience...however, i do not know that everyone has the same...the universe could contain only two consciousness': me and eveything else...

since there's only me and my thoughts, how do i know all the people around me also have indivivual thoughts? i can't know for sure...everyone else could be connected, i have no way of knowing...think 'truman show'...

paranoid?

nonsensical?
 
Wise Rabbit: T is the entirety of considerations - positive and negative, x1 is the entirety of positive considerations - all the answers to the "why" question, so x2=T-x1 means that you can get all the answers to "why-not" from knowing all answers to the "whys" and the subject resultant T.

ebola!: no, it is actually Exactly platonic. Remember, kingdom of the ideal and kingdom of the real? The stream of our experiences is continuous and is thus in the kingdom of ideal, then our mind processes it into the mental constructs like thoughts, impressions, 'lessons learnt' etc., discretizing it and thus sending it into the kingdom of the real. The gap theoretically cannot be bridged because by discretizing - a portion of the continuous stream is lost and we can only analyze our new (dicrete) data at certain intervals. Think about it:

y(X)=X^2 is a parabola, discretizing the parabola could give something like:

y=0; x=0
y=1; x=1
y=9; x=3
y=121; x=11
y=625; x=15

these still represent a parabola, only discretized to 5 points, which can (and do) still exist within the continuous function y=x^2, but the function cannot exist in these points. The discrete is forever encompassed in the continuous, but continuity cannot be encompassed by the discrete by definition. However you can extrapolate the discrete data and fit the curve to these points, which (for this overly simplified example) will indeed give you y=x^2 exactly, thus "bridging the gap" like you said. However, though this fitted curve will be percievably continuous, it will not return the 5 discrete points into the kingdom of the ideal (true continuity) of the original function. Because, again like you said, once the discrete emerges from continuity, it becomes distinct from the initial stream. Taken separately, these 5 points can be connected in an infinite number of ways so if you don't happen to know for a fact that they were taken from a particular function - there is no way you'll ever know if a parabola is indeed where these numbers came from. Thus there is no way of recreating the continuous from just having the discrete.

hope it helps



skjalff
 
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>>ebola!: no, it is actually Exactly platonic. Remember, kingdom of the ideal and kingdom of the real? The stream of our experiences is continuous and is thus in the kingdom of ideal, then our mind processes it into the mental constructs like thoughts, impressions, 'lessons learnt' etc., discretizing it and thus sending it into the kingdom of the real. The gap theoretically cannot be bridged because by discretizing - a portion of the continuous stream is lost and we can only analyze our new (dicrete) data at certain intervals. Think about it:>>


>>[re: math]>>

Ah, now I get how you hold that the ideal forms are continuous. I am actually more partial to the Jamesian perspective, where mental phenomena are discrete takings from the continuity of experience. Mental life, on these terms, is both discrete and ideal, but ideal only contingently, ideal only as we make of it. This leaves the question, however, how these discrete chunks fit withing the flow of experience and how they relate to the continuity of experience.
...
I dunno. The way in which I'd veiw that sort of a mathematical function would be as a conditional statement. "If [this], then [that]." This continuity then would also suggest a certain degree of "unsettledness" in our situation. Discrete takings would then render this situation definite, but only temporarilly, as new continous shifts emerge.
...
heh...I have to stop and think. I think I'm pushing on the fringes of what I can say right now.

ebola
 
why is your penis bigger than mine?

what is the reason of objective without the subjective to state the objective is real?

why do we ask so many damned questions confusing the shit out of ourselves with useless thoughts when we could be using our intellect in a productive way like saving the fucking world?

were all doomed:)
 
ebola! said:
heh...I have to stop and think. I think I'm pushing on the fringes of what I can say right now.

ebola

LOOK OUT! IT"S THE THOUGHT POLICE!

I'm already a criminal on the run.


I know what you are saying, and trust me I can see what you are saying visually, maybe you'll have to write it out sometime, and I'll see what I can do with it. I'll send you some of my work in exchange, if you wish. Sort of a mutual thought process.

Sorry this thread is officially over, Ebola feel free to delete any posts I may leave hence forth.
 
>>I know what you are saying, and trust me I can see what you are saying visually, maybe you'll have to write it out sometime, and I'll see what I can do with it. I'll send you some of my work in exchange, if you wish. Sort of a mutual thought process.>>

Heh...I'll let you know if I can put my thoughts together in a coherent manner...or if I think anything worthwhile.

>>Sorry this thread is officially over, Ebola feel free to delete any posts I may leave hence forth.>>

It's all good. The worst case scenario is this thread turning into a physics debate. If that happens, I'll simply edit the topic. :)

ebola
 
I dunno. The way in which I'd veiw that sort of a mathematical function would be as a conditional statement. "If [this], then [that]." This continuity then would also suggest a certain degree of "unsettledness" in our situation. Discrete takings would then render this situation definite, but only temporarilly, as new continous shifts emerge.

I think I'm going to cry. :(
 
If I know what you're getting at ebola (and david), then.. "wow" to say the least. If you pull off what I think you two are talking about, I might devote a religion to you two.
 
No offense, but I can't buy into your premise. Answers alone do not produce wisdom, for wisdom is understanding applied to action. Five is also an arbitrary number. Everything must be confirmed through experience, either externally in the world or internally through connection with the Ineffable.

Ebola!, those are some interesting questions. I'll try to answer them because I do feel like sorting out my thoughts in writing. I view things a bit differently from you...parallel your perspective with mine for what it's worth.

1. What is the relationship between quantity and quality? What is their ontology?

Quantity and quality are essentially the same thing and are contingent upon one another. That is, the more something is fundamental, the "better" (as to quality) it can be said to be and the more subtle it is, absolute fundamentality being the Ineffable, and absolute conventionality being non-existence. Conventionality is concrete, tangible, defined, local, individual, arbitrary, impermanent, and illusory. Fundamentality is abstract, subtle, undefined, non-local, universal, innate/natural/spontaneous, infinite, timeless, and real.

Quantity doesn't really exist. You have a bunch of apples, but in reality you have countless constituents forming various wholes we label as apples. So we have many apples, or a great many cells, or a huge number of atoms, etc. Quantity is relative to the context in which the question is posed.

2. How can the discrete coexist with the continuous? What is their relationship?

What is the continuous? From a fundamental perspective conventionality is impermanent and thus ever-changing, whereas from a conventional perspective it is the Ineffable that's ever-changing for it is perceived as the constant interplay between Yin and Yang.

Fundamentality and conventionality are not mutually exclusive and it is not an either/or matter, but a matter of degrees. Think of the Ineffable as the source and the universe as the emission, so to the extent that the Ineffable manifests as something concrete it is conventional. But all conventionality must contain at least some fundamentality to exist, for without contrast there is nothing (known only as the Nameless Tao).

Think of it this way: you can't examine a chair in isolation, you must consider its context. As the subtle empty space around it defines its physical delimitations, so must fundamentality be ever-present as a foundation within which conventionality may manifest.

What is the relationship? Well, a chain of causality regarding the physical realm can explain everything in it, but leaps of faith or discrepencies, depending on your point of view, will lie between the chains. To expand the chain and understand it more profoundly, bring the vertical axis into the equation, transforming the horizontal axis from something that comes full circle as a chain of causality into a spiral that connects with another chain one contextual level up. So pictorially you have a vertical axis with absolute fundamentality on top and absolute conventionality on the bottom, and a spiral around it like DNA.

As an aside, the physical chain of causality goes something like: universe, galaxies, planets, continents, countries, states/provinces, cities, districts, families, individuals, body parts, cells, atoms, the stuff of atoms, etc. I'm sure I've missed a lot.

The kicker is that absolute fundamentality and absolute conventionality are essentially the same thing, which is how the Yin and Yang that form the Tao merge into the Nameless Tao. This means the vertical axis comes full circle and is a chain of causality itself; understanding of the entire reletavistic spectrum constitutes an absolutely fundamental perspective, and to live fundamentally you understand relativity, so you don't question the contrast of things and you can live without constant preoccupation of thought.

Having said this, let me again address quantity and quality. Absolute fundamentality bears no distinction or definition, so everything is one and fragmentation constitues a drop down into conventionality. Think of absolute fundamentality as existence and absolute conventionality as non-existence. Absolute conventionality is zero, and absolute fundamentality is one. The Nameless Tao cannot be expressed in numbers because the very premise of a numeric field presumes a degree of innate fragmentation, in that the Whole is only one thing so there is nothing to count. Numbers come into play in consideration of the whole's constituents.

Since you say coexistence, how do they coexist in daily ever-progressing life? Well the present Now is all that exists physically. The past and the future are illusions. Linear time-bound understanding is how we perceive the timeless and non-local Ineffable, for to understand it all we'd see through physical existence and we'd be living in much higher planes.

I'm pretty tired now so I'll continue this another day. As you can see, my understanding contradicts some innate presumptions of your questions so it's difficult to give straight answers. Feel free to amend your questions into forms that might be more conducive to my type of explanation, and feel free to respond with your thoughts on these delicioius metaphysical ponderings. :)

At the very least I hope I've given you some questions from which you might push forward the fringes of your consciousness understanding. :)
 
^^Great post.

ebola! said:
Heh...I'll let you know if I can put my thoughts together in a coherent manner...or if I think anything worthwhile.

ebola

Whenever you feel ready, I'm ready. I've wanted to write something with you from the first post of your's I read. I believe, I even attempted to get some thoughts over to you, but like everything else, the timing is never correct, and I get caught up with something else. Life seems to hate me in that way at times.

sexyanon2 said:
If I know what you're getting at ebola (and david), then.. "wow" to say the least. If you pull off what I think you two are talking about, I might devote a religion to you two.

Please no religions. You can form a cult, but no religions.
 
What was here before the entire universe was created?
Where do our souls go when we die?
What is our purpose here?
What is the cure for cancer?
What will be the end of the human race?
 
jus blaze said:
What was here before the entire universe was created?

First you must define the universe, we don't even have any 'concrete' idea how big it really is, just what we can see so far.

Where do our souls go when we die?

What is a soul, and do we have them. If so, do we all have them, and what is it composed of?

What is our purpose here?

To evolve, and realize that we are animals, and give our own purpose through our own actions, and thoughts.

What is the cure for cancer?

Clean living, and genetic therapy.

What will be the end of the human race?

When they all die off. You need to re-word it if you want a better answer.;)
 
protovack said:
Challenge: Come up with five questions that, if answered truthfully, would make you wiser than all others. Feel free to intrepret the meaning of "wiser" as you please :)

Here are my top 5:

1.) If I were to travel to the edge of the universe, could I go beyond it?

2.) Is there a smallest 'particle'?

3.) Why do people believe in God?

4.) Is Life a spontaneous product or is it designed for a purpose?

5.) Is suffering an inevitable fact of living?

IN answer to question 1) The universe is infinite. The theory is, that the chemicals which compose the matter in the universe (including ourselves) was compacted into a solid mass, then for whatever chemical reason, it exploded, and the result is our universe. Now, this explains why our universe is constantly expanding. the universe is not finite. there is no edge. It is in a state of continual expansion. By the way, what I just described in anutshell was the Big Bang Theory.

2) Is there a smallest particle? Provo, I like your questions. they are good ones. You seem rather pre-occupied with SIZE - which I too, find very significant and interesting. Since we cannot physically see anything smaller than an atom, we can not really know. There are differing philosophies about this. Berkeley said that all matter is a part of God, and it exists through his existence. thus God is "smallest part".

In my personal opinion, I think there is no smallest particle. I think it is infinite just like the universe is infinite. I see the only possible explanation to be that the center of this "infinite matter" is derived from a life force of some kind; namely, God. Although of course your "life force" of choice is entirely up to you as the individual.

3) I think people believe In God because it is, almost, inherent to our nature. All cultures, throughout the world, have always believed in some Greater Spirit, whether it be Hindus, the ancient Greeks, Christians, Muslims, Buddhists, Pantheists (who believe in opposing life forces), or even Native Americans, who believed in God of Rain etc. I find this highly significant.

I am sure many people would argue "Well, its because of our society, its because of the puritanical values that have been ingrained into our nation and the Biblical values we are taught to revere by the media, authority figures, and our parents, etc." Well, I don't lend much credence to this rebuttal. The fact is, I believe that even if we were not exposed to all of that, we'd STILL seek some sort of greater being, some sort of deity out there who is greater than us.

Now, I'll give you an actual philosophical proof that address the question of God's existence.

This is St. Thomas Aquinas's Cosmological Argument for God's existence.

Definitions: Necessary being- a being which cannot fail to exist ex. God

Contigent being: a being which could or could not exist ex. human/animals
etc.

A) Contigent beings cannot exist eternally (they cannot have always existed).
B) If all beings were contigent, then at one time there could have been nothing.
C) If at one time there was nothing, then there could be nothing now (because nothing can come form nothing).
D) But there IS something now.

Conclusion: Not all beings are contigent (i.e.) there is a necessary being (God)

Hopefully that line of reasoning can sort of be an example of why I think people tend to believe in God; our reason sort of searches for it, automatically.

4) I am tired, so I am not going to respond to this one in detail, but I pose one question to you. If life did NOT have a purpose, why do we all search a purpose in life? If there was no purpose in life, then certainly we would not seek one, would we?

5) Of course suffering is an inevitable fact of living. That's why everyone who lives, suffers. It is absolutely inevitable.

I hope I answered these questions an sparked some discussion.
 
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