Opioids Methadone didn't work for me, what's next?

[LSDiesel]

Hi everyone. It's been awhile since I posted on here. I just wanted to share some thoughts with BL users since I really don't know who else I can talk to. So, for the past 10 years or so, I have been an opiate user, started with pills, vicodins, morphines, then eventually oxys. Once I got hooked on the Oxys, I made the switch to dope as so many do. I would say that the full switch to dope was about 5 years ago, as in, I stopped seeking anything else out. I always would conclude that any pharmy pill was overpriced when compared to the quality dope thats oall over the place in NJ/NYC.

Anyway, I got in more than one legal issues from getting sloppy, and that is ultimately what let me to re-think that maybe I had a serious problem with addiction. I got a good scare that I might have a permanent record, or could go to jail. Only when that happened did I truly feel the motivation to stop using.

I tried suboxone but I faked it, almost never taking, and prefering to empty out my bank account for dope instead. I never ever got satisfied with suboxone. So when I had my last brush with the law, about a year ago, I felt that something drastic needed to be done to appear in the eyes of the law to be taking my drug abuse seriously. "Mr. Renton, I see that you have entered into a program of rehabilitation in an effort to wean yourself off heroin. The suspension of your sentence is conditional upon your continued participation in this program. Should I see you again, I will not be inclined to impose a stricter sentence."

Well, anyway, I basically my thoughts were to try methadone since I seemed to be a "hard-head" or "hard-case" as in, I really have difficulty admitting that I have a problem to begin with other than the fact that I like to do something illegal. I am not pretended that I am not addicted/was addicted or seriously did some fucked up things all in the name of getting my next hit, but i wasn't committing serious crimes or anything.

Anyway, the scare from going to jail, in combination with the methadone actually gave me a good... 2 months of clean time, if you can count being on methadone and still smoking pot and doing acid/e at raves or hiking/camping as being clean. In other words I was able to stay away from heroin, the one thing that caused me legal problems.

While I have dabbled in ecstasy, acid, pot, they never landed me in handcuffs or anything, and i rarely had to go to the hood to get my fix of those substances.

After the honeymoon period of methadone, where I felt high everyday all day, that feeling subsided, and i was merely maintaining. I wasn't feeling happy or sad, just numb. The methadone was doing a great job at making me feel very apathetic and un-emotional. I did do much better in school and work, got promoted, got a raise, got all As this semseter in college. (the newark needle exchange is right on my way to school in university heights, someone PM me if you want to chill sometime)

So, I made the decision that I really didn't like the way methadone was making me feel. There is no pleasure if there is no pain with which to compare it to. There is no light without darkness, etc.

I was maintained at 70MG methadone for roughly 8 months. After the first 2.5 months, I was back to actively shooting dope despite not feeling it. I was chasing a high that I couldn't catch, and it was driving me crazy. Much to the chagrin of my methadone counselor, I have been coming down on my methadone dose, and I am currently at 40mg. Being tethered to the clinic really bothered me as I can't plan vacations and get take homes since I can't put together clean time. I would rather be Off methadone than be on it. I feel like I did the methadone for show, and never really had my heart in it. Granted it really helped me save money for a few months and let me know that it actually is possible for me to not do dope, but I must say, I continued to chase the high of dope, and since I have lowered my methadone, it has been great!

I did a shot this morning and I got a rush that I haven't felt in about a year. I wasted thousands of dollars while on methadone trying to get a rush, and I couldn't as long as I was above the 50mg dose level.

Has anyone else experienced what I am going through? I really don't want to quit. I know that things could change in a second. An arrest, a family member finding out I still use, being discovered at work or school would all be things that I think would cause me to stop using, but I feel like the older I get, the better I get at not only hiding the heroin habit, but at convincing myself that it is OK and that I am "smart enough" to handle a habit (omg, I can't believe I actually said that).

I don't want any of those negative things to happen, but I feel like if there aren't any of those consequences, that I will continue using. Even if I do get in trouble, clean up for a few years, I can still hear the dope calling me, years down the line. It creeps the fuck out of me and turns me on at the same time. I feel like I'd rather be crazy and chaotic than bored and stable. I would rather be an emotional roller coaster than be emotionless-ly maintained on suboxone, methadone or anti-depressants.

I plan on going all the way to zero milligrams of methadone, so that I can go and visit places and not be tethered to the methadone clinic, and I know I am kidding myself when I say that I want to go back to "ocassionally" using dope after that.

The only thing that I think that does make sense in my head, is that I miss kratom, which I havent used since before methadone. I plan on using kratom mainly to detox off methadone.

Am I just a big idiot for thinking I can handle doing dope? Please I welcome all comments from some veteran junkies, even criticism,

 

[Abhaya]

Well, the next thing after sub and methadone would be rehab, i guess. At least that is what i did after those two treatment failed. I obviously have no idea of how things practically work in the US, so i will stick to talk to you only about my personal experience and feelings.

I failed in rehab too, honestly, but the time i spent there (not much time actually, two months and then i ran away) was not wasted time. First of all i was able to taper methadone down to zero in a protected environment with a slow taper and minimal discomfort (and i was taking it for just a little more time than you and at similar dosages). And second i began to discover what the problems where about my use. I just BEGAN, really, but the way you have to relate constantly with other people without being high and without being dishonest, and the discover that you can do that without heroin, have been somewhat a revelation to me. When i ran away from the rehab i was happy. And wrong, of course, because in the long run i relapsed, but after that i managed to stay clean for a full year. Maybe someone would say that i just borrowed some time, but i feel that if you have the opportunity you might give rehab a try.

I am not pretended that I am not addicted/was addicted or seriously did some fucked up things all in the name of getting my next hit, but i wasn't committing serious crimes or anything.

That won't save you from addiction but i want you to understand that it is something. The fact that you have not put the pleasure of heroin before the life or the safety of other people can tell you something important about yourself. I too have always refused to commit crimes to feed my habit, i always worked for that or if i didn't have money, amen, no dope. I'm happy with that. I know people who have done harm to other people for their habit, and i think that when eventually they will get sober, those things would not be a good memory, to say the least.

After the honeymoon period of methadone, where I felt high everyday all day, that feeling subsided, and i was merely maintaining. I wasn't feeling happy or sad, just numb. The methadone was doing a great job at making me feel very apathetic and un-emotional.

I can relate to that. When i was on methadone i was also on antidepressant and antipsychotics and i was numb and blank and i don't remember a fuck of those months. So i understand you, but i also want to point out that it is quite a common things between junkies round here (and i think everywhere) to feel as if the handcuffs of methadone were so much worse than the life of a full heroin addicts. Think about it a moment. Are you sure that you are SO much better on heroin than on methadone?

I did do much better in school and work, got promoted, got a raise, got all As this semseter in college.

See above. I mean, you must be smart even without a needle in your arm, no?

I would rather be Off methadone than be on it. I feel like I did the methadone for show, and never really had my heart in it. Granted it really helped me save money for a few months and let me know that it actually is possible for me to not do dope, but I must say, I continued to chase the high of dope, and since I have lowered my methadone, it has been great!

I can relate, i was constantly thinking abut heroin and shooting it even on methadone, and that's another point in which maybe rehab can help: it takes you away from your usual environment and makes you understand that life is possible even without dope or without that kind of life, even if a junkie can't find this thought to be possible.

I know that things could change in a second. An arrest, a family member finding out I still use, being discovered at work or school would all be things that I think would cause me to stop using, but I feel like the older I get, the better I get at not only hiding the heroin habit, but at convincing myself that it is OK and that I am "smart enough" to handle a habit (omg, I can't believe I actually said that).

Fortunately none of this things are true, and is good for them not to be true, because while i know that feeling that you can trick everyone and that you are the smart one, it inevitably leads you to hurt the people that somehow cares about you. This is the problem. In the long run i have lots of regrets for how i tricked and lied to my family. It must be really sad and devastating to have a son that behaves like a did or to have a friend that treat you like shit because you have tried to make him stop using heroin (i did this to a friend). Just telling you things that i regret, i don't know how you actually behave...

I don't want any of those negative things to happen, but I feel like if there aren't any of those consequences, that I will continue using. Even if I do get in trouble, clean up for a few years, I can still hear the dope calling me, years down the line.

I know the feeling, but in my experience, the more you understand the consequences of your action, the more you understand that dope is more an enemy than it is a friend. For some people it takes a lot of time and pain.

I plan on going all the way to zero milligrams of methadone, so that I can go and visit places and not be tethered to the methadone clinic, and I know I am kidding myself when I say that I want to go back to "ocassionally" using dope after that.

What kind of places can you plan to see as a junkie who need a fix every 8 hours? Come one, think about it just for a second....

The only thing that I think that does make sense in my head, is that I miss kratom, which I havent used since before methadone. I plan on using kratom mainly to detox off methadone.

Maybe you can find something, i remember some threads about that...

Anyway, i wrote all this really in an emotional state, so i don't know how much i have answered you, and sorry if i sound preachy. Keep in mind that all this comes from someone that still dreams about a controlled use of opiates, and mostly fails. So, i don't have much to preach, but to share personal experiences about this is always useful.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

It'll probably be a good idea for you to go cold turkey and to be in an in-patient facility. Just saying. Methadone/Suboxone works really well for a lot of addicts.

It almost sounds like you don't want to quit, do you really want to quit?

 

[LSDiesel]

If you look closely, you'll see that I said that I don't want to. Oh, and Abhaya, I see what you mean about not being able to plan trips if you need a fix every 8 hours, but I mean, I could stock up on bags, but with the clinic, I only get one take home on Sunday, so if some friends are going away for the weekend and leaving Friday, I can't because I gotta go on Saturday morning for my saturday dose and sundays take home. I am beginning to skip doses of methadone. I truly believe that taking a trip somewhere, going hiking for a long weekend is more important to me than staying on methadone. I did it for a year, I can't do much more. These are the best years of my life. The clinic really gets to me sometimes. I know that they are only there to help, but I didn't even want to go up to 70mg to begin with, they really twisted my arm about it. I wanted to remain low, around 30mg to 40mg in the beginning, and not go up to 70mg.

Sometimes I feel like the clinic *knows* that if there is one aspect that junkies have no patience with, that is getting a fix. They were basically denying me my medication until I agreed to go up to 70mg. Now, I mean, I probably could've pushed it a litter further, but if someones in withdrawal, and you have a fix dangling right in front of them, you have a tremendous amount of influence over them.

 

[i are spectre]

so what's the question

 

[Swimmingdancer]

I think your only options if you live in North America are:
- quitting opioids (whether through a methadone or Suboxone taper/detox/rehab/whatever)
- staying on methadone, perhaps altering your dose (if they truly won't let you reduce your dose that's not cool - any other clinics in your area?)
- trying Suboxone again
- going back to heroin or another illicit opioid (not recommended)

Do you have no desire to explore your mental addiction and try to work on that? (Whether through therapy, rehab, meetings, self-help, whatever)

 

[i are spectre]

psychedelics always removed my selfish cravings for a while

 

[Paradisel]

One thing that the addicts in this area use to curb cravings is herbal incense. Have you tried that with the subox or methadone?

You also have to be ready to quit. Otherwise you will be forcing yourself through the motions. That is what programs such as NA are for. You can want to quit with all your body, but if you aren't ready, every day will be a battle. Based on your post, not only aren't you ready, you really don't want to. I would suggest some meetings, particularly ones in heavy heroin use areas. You don't have to talk, in fact I discourage it. Just listen to the stories of other addicts and apply them to yourself. And keep in mind when you hear something that appears insane to you, don't say I've never done that. You haven't done that... Yet.

The substance you are on, while fun, is much much more than just doing something illegal. Heroin, and all opiate abuse, isn't just addiction, it is nothing short of complete slavery. No other substance, that I have seen, can destroy a life as easily. You don't currently respect your addiction and that's what you need to do. NA meetings and hanging out with street level dope addicts may accomplish that because you don't fully grasp it's destructive nature yet.

There are some who can fight it and attempt to control the addiction. They live on the razors edge at all times. One slip from control to out of control. I believe many that post here are like this. They fight to control it every day. (I'm sure there's many more here who are beyond it.) You are beyond that point already and strongly in the denial phase.

My currently ex, girlfriend, is back on the streets after 12 days of cold turkey, first four in jail, then 8 after I bailed her out (yes I left her in to get the the worst part of dope sickness.) She has been hooking since age 15 to pay for dope for herself, and her brother who was the one that put her on the needle at age 13. She has been raped and gang raped and beaten by tricks regularly. About once a year she is almost killed. One particular incident, the trick burned her with cigarettes, beat her, and choked her to unconsciousness. Luckily he thought she was dead because he was drunk. He loaded her in his car and took her to a spot to dump her body. She came to and escaped, running down the street naked, bloody, and burned. Someone finally called an ambulance and she was taken to the hospital. She was released a short time later and -1- hour after leaving the hospital, she was back on the street hooking.

That is dope addiction. You may not be there yet, and being male it's unlikely you can sell yourself, but you will lose everything. You will be in an out of jail, then prison. You will rob and steal. Eventually something will go wrong and you will likely hurt or kill someone. You will either die committing a crime or scoring dope, or OD, or get bad junk that kills you. These aren't possibilities of out of control heroin addiction, they are eventualities. And once you lose control of the addiction, and in your case you appear to never really have had it, you will never gain control.

I'm not trying to attack you. I'm trying to open your eyes. If you continue your life will be filled with prison and eventually death.

 

[LSDiesel]

Thanks everyone for the responses. I actually have attended some SMART meetings because I did go to AA/NA for a few years and it really turned me off the more in depth it became. I think that I am incredibly insecure about my addiction, because the fear of someone judging me is actually worse than someone doing it. Its very similar to the fear of withdrawal can be worse than the actual WD. One of the reasons that I came to really not like how my methadone clinic was setup was, similarly to NA/AA, acknowledging that you are an addict first before anything else. I feel like it dehumanizes me. Sure I am an addict, but I am also a painter, a writer, a computer programmer, web developer and much more. Just being labeled an addict is kind of dehumanizing I think. Also, alot of people in the rehab/recovery scene do take a very firm stance on complete and total abstinence. I do feel that things like opiates and ecstasy and LSD are apples and oranges. It is unfair to assume that just because someone has an addiction to one that they automatically will have another.

It reminds me of how I made some good friends in AA, who were much older than me, and then upon going over to their house, I saw their coffee table riddled with so many prescription bottles of anti depressants, anti-anxiety, ADHD stimulants, even mild opiate painkillers. And these people are my friends, but they always say at the meetings that they have years of clean time. It seemed a little hypocritical to me. But I also know I really should not even give a fuck about others, I should focus on myself.

I feel like the 12 step program makes your life into all about "staying off drugs", which means your life still revolves around substances and thinking about them even if you don't ingest them. I would rather be invovled in work, research, building things instead of refilling the coffee machine and handing out doughnuts

 

[manman]

Thanks everyone for the responses. I actually have attended some SMART meetings because I did go to AA/NA for a few years and it really turned me off the more in depth it became. I think that I am incredibly insecure about my addiction, because the fear of someone judging me is actually worse than someone doing it. Its very similar to the fear of withdrawal can be worse than the actual WD. One of the reasons that I came to really not like how my methadone clinic was setup was, similarly to NA/AA, acknowledging that you are an addict first before anything else. I feel like it dehumanizes me. Sure I am an addict, but I am also a painter, a writer, a computer programmer, web developer and much more. Just being labeled an addict is kind of dehumanizing I think. Also, alot of people in the rehab/recovery scene do take a very firm stance on complete and total abstinence. I do feel that things like opiates and ecstasy and LSD are apples and oranges. It is unfair to assume that just because someone has an addiction to one that they automatically will have another.

It reminds me of how I made some good friends in AA, who were much older than me, and then upon going over to their house, I saw their coffee table riddled with so many prescription bottles of anti depressants, anti-anxiety, ADHD stimulants, even mild opiate painkillers. And these people are my friends, but they always say at the meetings that they have years of clean time. It seemed a little hypocritical to me. But I also know I really should not even give a fuck about others, I should focus on myself.

I feel like the 12 step program makes your life into all about "staying off drugs", which means your life still revolves around substances and thinking about them even if you don't ingest them. I would rather be invovled in work, research, building things instead of refilling the coffee machine and handing out doughnuts

I am with you. I absolutely fucking hate the cult of AA/NA. For numerous reasons..

 

[Abhaya]

One of the reasons that I came to really not like how my methadone clinic was setup was, similarly to NA/AA, acknowledging that you are an addict first before anything else. I feel like it dehumanizes me. Sure I am an addict, but I am also a painter, a writer, a computer programmer, web developer and much more. Just being labeled an addict is kind of dehumanizing I think.

I surely agree with you that the term "addict" can't describe your whole life and personality, you were not born an addict. But addiction is a way to cope with what you face in life, and you are not exactly someone who is taking some codeine pills to chill a little: from your words you have 5+ years of addiction, with legal problems...i mean, it is something BIG in your life.

Maybe in my previous post i have insisted too much on the whole "junkie" stuff, and i surely didn't meant to deny your complexity as a human being with that term, so i apologize, but in the end, don't you feel that being addicted to opiates have a nasty effect on all the things that you like to do and that you have listed? If you feel that your addiction doesn't effect your life, well, just continue...but i don't know if you feel this as true. The problem is that is is SO easy to fool oneself on this things, that i have not recognized how much addiction have closed and suffocated my life and personality until maybe a couple of years ago.

Also, a lot of people in the rehab/recovery scene do take a very firm stance on complete and total abstinence. I do feel that things like opiates and ecstasy and LSD are apples and oranges. It is unfair to assume that just because someone has an addiction to one that they automatically will have another.

No, not automatically, not every person who uses drugs becomes an addict. But you and i did. That must mean something. I have seen people do heroin and not looking for it again, but i began to chase it after just the first two times.

It reminds me of how I made some good friends in AA, who were much older than me, and then upon going over to their house, I saw their coffee table riddled with so many prescription bottles of anti depressants, anti-anxiety, ADHD stimulants, even mild opiate painkillers. And these people are my friends, but they always say at the meetings that they have years of clean time. It seemed a little hypocritical to me. But I also know I really should not even give a fuck about others, I should focus on myself.

I admit that i am currently interested in all the AA/NA stuff. I have just read books and similar and i have been very surprised by their theories, but i don't know if i will ever go to a meeting. I'm sorry to hear this and i can see how it would sound hypocritical.

I feel like the 12 step program makes your life into all about "staying off drugs", which means your life still revolves around substances and thinking about them even if you don't ingest them. I would rather be invovled in work, research, building things instead of refilling the coffee machine and handing out doughnuts

Maybe it is like this because for some people shit have been really rough. And like someone else have said in the replies above, is never said that you or me wouldn't go that far, especially when one understands how easy is not to care about what rally happens to your life and soul while you are addicted.

 

[down508]

if you start any program for the purpose of appearing to be taking your drug abuse seriously it's not going to work. you need to sincerely want it to work otherwise you are just wasting your time. if you decide you want to stop for the sake of improving your life I suggest suboxone over methadone. long term methadone can do more harm than good. either drug will buy you time, if you use that time wisely the chances of you staying off dope are higher, if you just use it as a way to not do heroin but live your life the same way you were when you were using then when you eventually get off it you will probably go back to dope. this is a lifelong thing you have, you won't wake up one day and suddenly not be a heroin addict. you may go through periods of "remission" but at the end of the day if you dont take serious action things will only get worse.

suboxone is a tool not a cure, same for methadone. you can do the same without either drug but they will make it easier in the short term, possibly harder in the long term. take this shit seriously or jail will be the least of your worries. it could easily get bad enough that jail would seem like a welcome change, or you could die, so do whatever you can to get off the shit for the sake of getting off it not for the sake of getting more leniency with the judge, because trust me when I say this won't be your last court case. going to court will be a regular part of your life. the day you don't have any court dates coming up will be a sign of change, but it wont be the day your problems are solved. it takes 30 seconds to catch a case and years to get ahead of them. be smart

 

[LSDiesel]

I wouldn't say it was a total waste of time. I did put together SOME clean time, even if it was only 2 months, that's pretty impressive when you look at my record for the past few years. And I did gain some insight about life, medicine and beaurocracy. If I could do it again, I would've went into a suboxone-oriented rehab/detox when I got arrested last summer. But now that's not really too much of an option because I am in school and working, and I am doing great at both!

 

[BananasAndOranges]

Hi everyone. It's been awhile since I posted on here. I just wanted to share some thoughts with BL users since I really don't know who else I can talk to. So, for the past 10 years or so, I have been an opiate user, started with pills, vicodins, morphines, then eventually oxys. Once I got hooked on the Oxys, I made the switch to dope as so many do. I would say that the full switch to dope was about 5 years ago, as in, I stopped seeking anything else out. I always would conclude that any pharmy pill was overpriced when compared to the quality dope thats oall over the place in NJ/NYC.

Anyway, I got in more than one legal issues from getting sloppy, and that is ultimately what let me to re-think that maybe I had a serious problem with addiction. I got a good scare that I might have a permanent record, or could go to jail. Only when that happened did I truly feel the motivation to stop using.

I tried suboxone but I faked it, almost never taking, and prefering to empty out my bank account for dope instead. I never ever got satisfied with suboxone. So when I had my last brush with the law, about a year ago, I felt that something drastic needed to be done to appear in the eyes of the law to be taking my drug abuse seriously. "Mr. Renton, I see that you have entered into a program of rehabilitation in an effort to wean yourself off heroin. The suspension of your sentence is conditional upon your continued participation in this program. Should I see you again, I will not be inclined to impose a stricter sentence."

Well, anyway, I basically my thoughts were to try methadone since I seemed to be a "hard-head" or "hard-case" as in, I really have difficulty admitting that I have a problem to begin with other than the fact that I like to do something illegal. I am not pretended that I am not addicted/was addicted or seriously did some fucked up things all in the name of getting my next hit, but i wasn't committing serious crimes or anything.

Anyway, the scare from going to jail, in combination with the methadone actually gave me a good... 2 months of clean time, if you can count being on methadone and still smoking pot and doing acid/e at raves or hiking/camping as being clean. In other words I was able to stay away from heroin, the one thing that caused me legal problems.

While I have dabbled in ecstasy, acid, pot, they never landed me in handcuffs or anything, and i rarely had to go to the hood to get my fix of those substances.

After the honeymoon period of methadone, where I felt high everyday all day, that feeling subsided, and i was merely maintaining. I wasn't feeling happy or sad, just numb. The methadone was doing a great job at making me feel very apathetic and un-emotional. I did do much better in school and work, got promoted, got a raise, got all As this semseter in college. (the newark needle exchange is right on my way to school in university heights, someone PM me if you want to chill sometime)

So, I made the decision that I really didn't like the way methadone was making me feel. There is no pleasure if there is no pain with which to compare it to. There is no light without darkness, etc.

I was maintained at 70MG methadone for roughly 8 months. After the first 2.5 months, I was back to actively shooting dope despite not feeling it. I was chasing a high that I couldn't catch, and it was driving me crazy. Much to the chagrin of my methadone counselor, I have been coming down on my methadone dose, and I am currently at 40mg. Being tethered to the clinic really bothered me as I can't plan vacations and get take homes since I can't put together clean time. I would rather be Off methadone than be on it. I feel like I did the methadone for show, and never really had my heart in it. Granted it really helped me save money for a few months and let me know that it actually is possible for me to not do dope, but I must say, I continued to chase the high of dope, and since I have lowered my methadone, it has been great!

I did a shot this morning and I got a rush that I haven't felt in about a year. I wasted thousands of dollars while on methadone trying to get a rush, and I couldn't as long as I was above the 50mg dose level.

Has anyone else experienced what I am going through? I really don't want to quit. I know that things could change in a second. An arrest, a family member finding out I still use, being discovered at work or school would all be things that I think would cause me to stop using, but I feel like the older I get, the better I get at not only hiding the heroin habit, but at convincing myself that it is OK and that I am "smart enough" to handle a habit (omg, I can't believe I actually said that).

I don't want any of those negative things to happen, but I feel like if there aren't any of those consequences, that I will continue using. Even if I do get in trouble, clean up for a few years, I can still hear the dope calling me, years down the line. It creeps the fuck out of me and turns me on at the same time. I feel like I'd rather be crazy and chaotic than bored and stable. I would rather be an emotional roller coaster than be emotionless-ly maintained on suboxone, methadone or anti-depressants.

I plan on going all the way to zero milligrams of methadone, so that I can go and visit places and not be tethered to the methadone clinic, and I know I am kidding myself when I say that I want to go back to "ocassionally" using dope after that.

The only thing that I think that does make sense in my head, is that I miss kratom, which I havent used since before methadone. I plan on using kratom mainly to detox off methadone.

Am I just a big idiot for thinking I can handle doing dope? Please I welcome all comments from some veteran junkies, even criticism,

I'm sorry but you need a REHAB man. inpatient. I'm not going to read this book but After I read you TRIED BUPE. BUT NEVER REALLY TOOK IT....that baffles me. If Methadone doesn't Hold you NOTHING will in the U.S. sorry your no special exception. I don't believe for one second that it didn't work for you I think your dose is too low or bottom line is you weren't ready to quit when you started and/or only got on methadone for a loved one. Those are both bad reasons to start methadone. If you want to QUIT you go to rehab if you Want to jump through that hoop its hope or Methadone......one will work one way or another.

 

[LSDiesel]

Oh the methadone would hold me, I just didn't like the way it made me feel, or the suboxone. I felt like I had no emotions on either. I probably didn't really give suboxone a chance, but I mean I never really enjoyed suboxone the way I once enjoyed methadone, so it would be pointless in my mind to be physically dependent on something that doesn't even make me feel somewhat good. Methadone would definitely keep any WD at bay, but I still craved the dope that much I suppose. Well I told my family what I want to do. I have probably roughly about 10 or 12mg of suboxone left from my previous treatment. I want to wean down on the methadone to probably around 5MG and then either wait out the 72 hours, or use dope for the first 36 and then nothing, and switch to suboxone, taper off that, and then use kratom twice daily for roughly 2-3 weeks. Then use loperamide taper after THAT. Having someone else involved in the recovery process helps for motivation

 

[cj]

I think your only options if you live in North America are:
- quitting opioids (whether through a methadone or Suboxone taper/detox/rehab/whatever)
- staying on methadone, perhaps altering your dose (if they truly won't let you reduce your dose that's not cool - any other clinics in your area?)
- trying Suboxone again
- going back to heroin or another illicit opioid (not recommended)

Do you have no desire to explore your mental addiction and try to work on that? (Whether through therapy, rehab, meetings, self-help, whatever)

I pretty much agree with this post. Methadone is the end of the line as far as treatment goes. I advise tou keep tapering off the mdone get bellow ten milligrams then either go get medically detoxed or stock up on comfort meds. Do dope or whatevet for a couple months then try suboxone again. Realize its not gonna get you high but will add some stability to your life

 

[LSDiesel]

I am going to give kratom a try for easing the pain of detoxing off methadone. I used to have extensive experience with kratom and was a daily user, but I have informed my family, all who are not addicts and the most they have ever done is have 4 drinks on new years/xmas, so they will be following the taper plan, so I don't just eat all the kratom in an attempt to get high. I will aim to not become dependent on kratom so that the withdrawal won't be terrible from kratom itself. And I have some suboxone laying around from last year, probably ~10mg. Then loperamide to detox off kratom.

Does anyone have a suggestion for which order I should use the kratom and suboxone. I can get endless kratom, but suboxone I don't have a current script, so that is limited.

I think that I should switch to kratom after stopping methadone, and use it for 2 weeks, then use the suboxone for like half a week, and try to put in some multiple clean days in a row and keep the last suboxone for emergencies or PAWS

 

[Paradisel]

AA/NA is a cult, and a crutch. I hate the organization, however attending meetings, particularly speaker meetings, can be productive because it exposes you to how bad addiction can get. That's why I recommend attendance without speaking. AA meetings are generally excellent for exposing you to denial and just how deep it can be.

 

[n0th1ng]

Oh the methadone would hold me, I just didn't like the way it made me feel, or the suboxone. I felt like I had no emotions on either.

You are fooling yourself if you think you have emotions when you're on heroin.

 

[Swimmingdancer]

You are fooling yourself if you think you have emotions when you're on heroin.

I think that's very presumptious. I still had strong emotions while I was using heroin, still laughed, cried, felt joy. For me it mainly just normalized my baseline level and only reduced the intensity of negative emotions like depression and anxiety. I think it really depends on the person and how much heroin they use. I can totally relate to the problem of romanticizing one's time on heroin because you feel apathetic after stopping.