chris_p
Bluelighter
Not really feeling it anymore, only the first 3 days were quite powerful, definitely something I'd try again however
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Trip Reports Moderator: Cheshire_Kat
Memantine is the most profound mania producing drug known to man
- Thread starter chris_p
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Mjäll
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How about like 20 or 30
There are ones in that price range too, can't vouch for quality but better than eyeballing. You could read up on some reviews etc.
Anyway interesting read.
chris_p
Bluelighter
Next paycheck I'll buy one
ageingpartyfiend
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Great to hear! Best scales you can get under $500 is the common thinking
4DQSAR
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I guess the only compound that might be more active is dizocipline.
But deaths have been recorded and it's a very potent compound so you MUST titrate the dose carefully.
Fun fact. Dizocipline is used to model schizphrania in animal models.
There are trip reports. Some very good, some very bad.
But SLOW DOWN.
But deaths have been recorded and it's a very potent compound so you MUST titrate the dose carefully.
Fun fact. Dizocipline is used to model schizphrania in animal models.
There are trip reports. Some very good, some very bad.
But SLOW DOWN.
You can get one for like $15-20. As mentioned the Gemini is a time honored work horse in this field
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I think the fascinating idea here is that there are already are native people that use psychoactive drugs for divination and healing. A few continents have examples of that. Memantine I guess is considered a dissociative by BL'ers and an alzheimer's medicine by the medical field. I do find that fascinating. I wonder if there are natural dissociatives that people could use that could add to the knowledge of different types of healing. I mean we know there are natural psychedelics used by cultures. But what about natural dissociatives? Anything close to ketamine or memantine? Salvia maybe but it has other properties it seems.
Since you may be the first healer Asante using a medical drug used for healing you have a responsibility to us all.
(to keep yourself healthy, literate, knowledgeable and know when to take breaks, this way you can keep posting interesting ideas). Big info transfers are in your hands Asante. I find the notion of a tribe in Africa using memantine pretty fascinating but I think we know at this point that is not happening...yet But we know the Sangomas do use herbals in their rituals.Makes me wonder what we will find in nature 1000 years from now in Nature. I mean once LSD was discovered and then later on LSA's in Morning Glory seeds that must have sent researchers sky high with enthusiasm. Also Maria Sabina saying "the spirit of the mushroom is in the pills" is a powerful testimony. Now we need a plant that has memantine effects and only lasts say 8 hours. And if we found an ancient culture using that for healing what a cool finding that would be. I still think that is possible.
chris_p
Bluelighter
Ibogaine and Ibogaine cults are extremely popular where I am. Theyre also sold legally, but I've never onced even thought about touching the shit after hearing some reports (tripping deliriously for 3 days straight ,random heart failure, etc) many west african religions are entirely based on Ibogaine. Probably one of the most interesting drugs pharmacologically, since it seems to share effects with almost every recreational drug known to manI think the fascinating idea here is that there are already are native people that use psychoactive drugs for divination and healing. A few continents have examples of that. Memantine I guess is considered a dissociative by BL'ers and an alzheimer's medicine by the medical field. I do find that fascinating. I wonder if there are natural dissociatives that people could use that could add to the knowledge of different types of healing. I mean we know there are natural psychedelics used by cultures. But what about natural dissociatives? Anything close to ketamine or memantine? Salvia maybe but it has other properties it seems.
Since you may be the first healer Asante using a medical drug used for healing you have a responsibility to us all.
Makes me wonder what we will find in nature 1000 years from now in Nature. I mean once LSD was discovered and then later on LSA's in Morning Glory seeds that must have sent researchers sky high with enthusiasm. Also Maria Sabina saying "the spirit of the mushroom is in the pills" is a powerful testimony. Now we need a plant that has memantine effects and only lasts say 8 hours. And if we found an ancient culture using that for healing what a cool finding that would be. I still think that is possible.
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A drug that scares you Chris?
Yeah the ibogaine cults are interesting. But it makes me wonder if the level of use is the same. Like did the tribes do flood doses or is that a modern era thing? I knew it was used for night hunting in small doses. But was never sure if flood doses were historic type of use. Also since some tribes in Africa were given 2C-B and liked it I wonder what would happen if memantine was also distributed.
From Wiki list of substances used in rituals:
There are claims that 2C-B is used as entheogen by the Sangoma, Nyanga, and Amagqirha people over their traditional plants. It is referred to as Ubulawu Nomathotholo, which roughly translates to "Medicine of the Singing Ancestors"
Asante can add to it.
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chris_p
Bluelighter
Haha, I'd love to visit some of the tribes and bring them MDMA, DMT, mescaline. Getting some Dune vibes from this...A drug that scares you Chris?
Yeah the ibogaine cults are interesting. But it makes me wonder if the level of use is the same. Like did the tribes do flood doses or is that a modern era thing? I knew it was used for night hunting in small doses. But was never sure if flood doses were historic type of use. Also since some tribes in Africa were given 2C-B and liked it I wonder what would happen if memantine was also distributed.
From Wiki list of substances used in rituals:
There are claims that 2C-B is used as entheogen by the Sangoma, Nyanga, and Amagqirha people over their traditional plants. It is referred to as Ubulawu Nomathotholo, which roughly translates to "Medicine of the Singing Ancestors"
Asante can add to it.
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I honesty think that would be so awesome. Get the reactions from all tribes all over the work, from Inuites to Sangoma. With a series of different drugs. Incredible. Yeah Dune vibes is a tribe too. Lots of tribes of us average people. We are all part of it.
But yeah, give a South American shaman some LSD.
4DQSAR
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It's been done. Or at least there is anecdotal evidence that LSD was given to a group of Tibetan monks. Also the Maharaji and some of his followers were given LSD.
I remain uncertain if the drug truly had no effect or if spiritual training simply allowed them to maintain an external normality.
I suspect that there have been numerous isolated examples of visitors giving psychoactives to people living in cultures in which such things are unknown. Certainly both morphine and cocaine were taken to the interior of Africa in the 19th century when there were unmapped interior regions.
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I remember the story of Tibetan monks. I vaguely remember but can't site it. Terrence McKenna said he gave acid out in India all everyone he met was impressed.
I have a copy of the book Phantastica by Lewis Lewin. That goes way back. I think the book is from 1924 and looks back at substances and their uses. I really need to pull that one out again.
4DQSAR
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It may be apochraphal but as Wiliam Randolf Hurst noted 'when offered the choice between the truth and the legend, print the legend'.
The thing is, there aren't many isolated peoples left in the world. I can well imagine that as recently as the 1960s there were peoples to whom visitors were a rare and unusual experience but apart from a few small tribes in South America and a few isolated islands such as the Sentialese (good luck going there), almost everywhere is now in communication with the larger world.
Of course the biggest danger in contacting such remote peoples is that their immunity may now have built up to those common infections that are asymptomatic for most of us.
The thing is, there aren't many isolated peoples left in the world. I can well imagine that as recently as the 1960s there were peoples to whom visitors were a rare and unusual experience but apart from a few small tribes in South America and a few isolated islands such as the Sentialese (good luck going there), almost everywhere is now in communication with the larger world.
Of course the biggest danger in contacting such remote peoples is that their immunity may now have built up to those common infections that are asymptomatic for most of us.
Man, I am just delighted with what I read. I admire, I am proud and I subscribe to every word. I am incredibly glad that I met a like-minded person, I believe there are many more people who find memantine something more than a means of treating Alzheimer's. I am also a fan of this substance, which has radically changed my life and replaced all sorts of drugs that I, like you, have tried throughout my life. I love methamphetamine, it is the second substance after memantine that I prefer, but if I had to choose between the two, I would definitely choose memantine. Meth is like a supplement to memantine, but certainly not the other way around. I don't see the point in using methamphetamine without memantine, because tolerance and neurotoxicity will quickly turn my life into hell
Memantine is definitely the best thing I've tried. It has everything I would like to get from using drugs
•Dopamine stimulation and euphoria to which for some reason tolerance does not grow, at least in my case. I am not an expert in the field of pharmacology and neurobiology, but subjectively D2 agonism is a large part of what we want from stimulants, only in the case of memantine it is pure dopaminergicism without norepinephrine nervousness and wildness
•Dissociation without dissociation. I don't know how else to describe it, but memantine has all the benefits of dissociatives such as fear dissociation, pain reduction, etc., without the effects inherent in dissociatives such as ego dissolution, deterioration of coordination and motor skills, and cognitive functions, on the contrary, improve, unlike other dissociatives
•Some pharmacological mechanisms in addition to the main ones (antagonism of NMDA, nAchr, 5ht-3; agonism of D2) also contribute, but I am not sufficiently informed about this
Memantine does not reveal itself immediately, it takes time for nicotine receptors to be activated in response to antagonism. It is also possible that I have developed at least a discrete distolerance to memantine, since I no longer get the dissociative effects I used to, but this is only to my advantage, because now memantine feels like a functional stimulant, a euphoric, a psychedelic without withdrawal symptoms and abuse potential. For me as a drug addict, memantine is a replacement therapy, I can enjoy life to the fullest without stimulants without experiencing this constantly gnawing and annoying need for doping in order to compensate for the lack of positive feelings from life
Finally, I will say that you are really cool and you have a great style, I read this in one breath. I would like to create something like a community of memantine fans around the world, I hope I am not the only one heh)
Memantine is definitely the best thing I've tried. It has everything I would like to get from using drugs
•Dopamine stimulation and euphoria to which for some reason tolerance does not grow, at least in my case. I am not an expert in the field of pharmacology and neurobiology, but subjectively D2 agonism is a large part of what we want from stimulants, only in the case of memantine it is pure dopaminergicism without norepinephrine nervousness and wildness
•Dissociation without dissociation. I don't know how else to describe it, but memantine has all the benefits of dissociatives such as fear dissociation, pain reduction, etc., without the effects inherent in dissociatives such as ego dissolution, deterioration of coordination and motor skills, and cognitive functions, on the contrary, improve, unlike other dissociatives
•Some pharmacological mechanisms in addition to the main ones (antagonism of NMDA, nAchr, 5ht-3; agonism of D2) also contribute, but I am not sufficiently informed about this
Memantine does not reveal itself immediately, it takes time for nicotine receptors to be activated in response to antagonism. It is also possible that I have developed at least a discrete distolerance to memantine, since I no longer get the dissociative effects I used to, but this is only to my advantage, because now memantine feels like a functional stimulant, a euphoric, a psychedelic without withdrawal symptoms and abuse potential. For me as a drug addict, memantine is a replacement therapy, I can enjoy life to the fullest without stimulants without experiencing this constantly gnawing and annoying need for doping in order to compensate for the lack of positive feelings from life
Finally, I will say that you are really cool and you have a great style, I read this in one breath. I would like to create something like a community of memantine fans around the world, I hope I am not the only one heh)
Pfafffed
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I think it's wild how differently we all are wired! I'm glad that it's working so well for you. I gave it a solid, honest try over 3 months, but 4 out of 5 times, it just cast me into a long-lasting brain fog. It wasn't the worst, but it sure wasn't what I was hoping for. I had hoped for better mental clarity, mood uplift, increased motivation, and (if I was very lucky) the increased memory recall that I got from MXE. Alas, it wasn't meant to be.
Kmas
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Ram Dass,(Richard Alpert) Leary's sidekick at Harvard, gave Maharajji (Neem Karoli Baba) quite an assortment of pills along with 6 strong doses of LSD. The story is too good, I might as well copy the whole damn thing. Since it tells you a lot about Yoga and also India and their history with psychoactive substances.
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In 1967 when I first came to India, I brought with me a supply of LSD, hoping to find someone who might understand more about these substances than we did in the West.
When I had met Maharajji (Neem Karoli Baba), after some days the thought had crossed my mind that he would be a perfect person to ask. The next day after having that thought, I was called to him and he asked me immediately, “Do you have a question?”
Of course, being before him was such a powerful experience that I had completely forgotten the question I had had in my mind the night before. So I looked stupid and said, “No, Maharajji, I have no question.”He appeared irritated and said, “Where is the medicine?”
I was confused but Bhagavan Das suggested, ” Maybe he means the LSD.” I asked and Maharajji nodded. The bottle of LSD was in the car and I was sent to fetch it. When I returned I emptied the vial of pills into my hand. In addition to the LSD there were a number of other pills for this and that–diarrhea, fever, a sleeping pill, and so forth. He asked about each of these.
He asked if they gave powers. I didn’t understand at the time and thought that by “powers” perhaps he meant physical strength. I said, “No.” Later, of course, I came to understand that the word he had used, “siddhis,” means psychic powers. Then he held out his hand for the LSD. I put one pill on his palm. Each of these pills was about three hundred micrograms of very pure LSD–a solid dose for an adult. He beckoned for more, so I put a second pill in his hand–six hundred micrograms. Again he beckoned and I added yet another, making the total dosage nine hundred micrograms–certainly not a dose for beginners. Then he threw all the pills into his mouth. My reaction was one of shock mixed with the fascination of a social scientist eager to see what would happen.
He allowed me to stay for an hour– and nothing happened. Nothing whatsoever.
He just laughed at me.
The whole thing had happened very fast and unexpectedly. When I returned to the United States in 1968 I told many people about this acid feat. But there had remained in me a gnawing doubt that perhaps he had been putting me on and had thrown the pills over his shoulder or palmed them, because I hadn’t actually seen them go into his mouth.
Three years later, when I was back in India, he asked me one day, “Did you give me medicine when you were in India last time?”
“Yes.”
“Did I take it?” he asked. (Ah, there was my doubt made manifest!)
“I think you did.”
“What happened?
“Nothing.”
“Oh! Jao!” and he sent me off for the evening.
The next morning I was called over to the porch in front of his room, where he sat in the mornings on a tucket. He asked, “Have you got any more of that medicine?”
It just so happened that I was carrying a small supply of LSD for “just in case,” and this was obviously it. “Yes.”
“Get it,” he said.
So I did. In the bottle were five pills of three hundred micrograms each. One of the pills was broken. I placed them on my palm and held them out to him. He took the four unbroken pills. Then, one by one, very obviously and very deliberately, he placed each one in his mouth and swallowed it– another unspoken thought of mine now answered.
As soon as he had swallowed the last one, he asked, “Can I take water?”
“Yes.”
“Hot or cold?”
“It doesn’t matter.”
He started yelling for water and drank a cup when it was brought.
Then he asked, “How long will it take to act?”
“Anywhere from twenty minutes to an hour.”
He called for an older man, a long -time devotee who had a watch, and Maharajji held the man’s wrist, often pulling it up to him to peer at the watch.
Then he asked,” Will it make me crazy?”
That seemed so bizarre to me that I could only go along with what seemed to be a gag.
So I said, “Probably.”
And then we waited. After some time he pulled the blanket over his face, and when he came out after a moment his eyes were rolling and his mouth was ajar and he looked totally mad. I got upset. What was happening? Had I misjudged his powers? After all, he was an old man (though how old I had no idea), and I had let him take twelve hundred micrograms. Maybe last time he had thrown them away and then he read my mind and was trying to prove to me he could do it, not realizing how strong the “medicine” really was. Guilt and anxiety poured through me. But when I looked at him again he was perfectly normal and looking at the watch.
At the end of an hour it was obvious nothing had happened. His reactions had been a total put-on. And then he asked, “Have you got anything stronger?” I didn’t. Then he said, “These medicines were used in Kullu Valley long ago. But yogis have lost that knowledge. They were used with fasting. Nobody knows now. To take them with no effect, your mind must be firmly fixed on God. Others would be afraid to take. Many saints would not take this.” And he left it at that.
When I asked him if I should take LSD again, he said, “It should not be taken in a hot climate. If you are in a place that is cool and peaceful, and you are alone and your mind is turned toward God, then you may take the yogi medicine.”
What Ram Dass, and most everyone else who read the story is forgetting that Kullu Valley is the land of ganja. Maharajj mentions people taking 'Yogi Medicine' in Kullu Valley. Soma maybe? Or Amrita? Kullu Valley is where they've grown some of the best fucking hashish in India for thousands of years. I grew one of their plants a few years ago, a grower there sent me a few seeds. It was a cultivated Himalayan hand rubbed sativa hashplant. It kicked so much ass and was just as potent as the modern stuff. Hit different. Full body and mind, not just in the head. Extremely resinous with an open leafy structure and finished early by Oct 20th because of the early mountain frosts.
In the old days they didn't smoke it, they ate it. Massive amounts of hash treats. Every year at the Hindu Holi Festival, and many other celebrations, they drink an ass-kicking beverage called 'Bhang'.
During one of Anthony Bourdain's India trips for his show he went to the Bhang shop. They asked him what type he wanted. 'Mild, Medium, or full power twenty-four hour no toilet no shower!' You will have a complete ego loss psychedelic breakdown from that stuff that lasts 24 hours. It's sent a lot of people to the hospital or even the looney bin. Getting high for an hour. Or two is one thing.
India's hardcore. When I was 7 I spent two months there with my grandma, learning Siddha Yoga at an ashram. Even though I was a kid and I didn't have to do it like the adults did. I'd still get up at 4 am. Drink the strong chai. Meditate and chant for 5 hours. Sitting at least cross-legged. By the time I left I could do it full lotus position. When I was a teenager getting stoned and taking LSD with my friends it wasn't that big a headtrip for me. Most of the experiences I'd already had.
That story has been confirmed as a hoax, and a good one. It needs to be removed from the literature. (I know this is offtopic but the truth about this story needs to be known)
It's impressive how deeply it's been accepted as fact. Without any evidence or anyone interviewing or videotaping the actual healers using it. Another of so many examples of the fog of war created by the drug war that creates a mythology about the substances. It makes it nearly impossible to distinguish between fact and legend.
By chance I was watching a Hamilton Morris piece about the two new psilocybe species in South Africa. The guy that found them tells a story about being inspired by what he'd heard about the 2c-b being used as an entheogen. When he meets the guy who had supposedly found it in use by the native healers. He explained that he'd fabricated the story entirely. He was fighting to keep 2c-b legal in South Africa. At the time if he could prove the traditional healers needed it to continue their medical trade an exemption for it's sale could be made.
The stories were a complete fabrication, hoaxed by him, to raise support for fighting the 2c-b ban. Of course it didn't work, 2c-b was banned. His fake story about 'Medicine by the Singing Ancestors' has taken on a life of it's own, far outlasting the legal 2c-b debate. It's quoted everywhere, I've even quoted it.
Here's the video on YouTube. You can catch the quote at 1:54:53 to 1:59 or so.
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Yeah we have had very long discussions on that story. I believe it whole heartedly. Be Here Now is great. But honestly kmas wish you were here when @Ismene2 called it a hoax. Some people think it is. I believe it 100%. There is even part 2 in The Only Dance There Is where Ram Dass was home thinking about that situation. He even thought Maharajii threw it over his shoulder. So he had doubts. But then he got a call, Maharajii knew of his doubts and told him to come to India and bring more. And they did it again. The story is believable to me. I feel like gathering all the posts over the years on this story and make its own thread.
There are claims that 2C-B is used as entheogen by the Sangoma, Nyanga, and Amagqirha people over their traditional plants. It is referred to as Ubulawu Nomathotholo, which roughly translates to "Medicine of the Singing Ancestors"
So it is confirmed that this story truly is a hoax? I did not know. It would be nice to not have hoax stories.
I still want to hear about a south American Shaman taking LSD and comparing to Ayahuasca. Would be fascinating.
chris_p
Bluelighter
Don't really know how much I believe this one. Just seems like an alternative story to affirm their mental fortitude. I find it a lot more likely they just tripped balls and lied about it.