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Meditation and fear

J

juniorcat

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Jun 14, 2011
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I made a thread in the dark side asking about fear and how to overcome it. I made the thread mainly because I am suffering from fear, almost all of the time.

I've always been fearful, but it's never been so intense. I've realised that this feeling of fear came about a few months ago when I had properly got into meditation and my thoughts were less. Funny thing is. I'd fancied meditating cos of the talk of well-being and spiritual awakening.

I think the fact that I'm moving into my subconscious means I'm making lesser feelings, more prominent. Is this a natural process along the spiritual path for someone with deep-rooted fear?
Will I overcome it? And has anyone else experienced this?

Here is an article I found about harms of meditation

http://www.lifedivine.net/meditation/can-meditation-be-harmful/

Thanks for listening :)
 
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The notion of a subconscious really arises out of Freud's work. Really, in a Freudian sense your fear would be caused by a sense of some form of repression or otherwise. While simplistic in view, you might have an innate fear of some psycho-sexual hurdle that you failed to overcome. This could be an issue - although unlikely.

In a Jungian sense your fear could be caused by the "collective unconscious" and symbols and archetypes of fear pervading your life. You might have some sort of metaphysical and mystic bad 'ju-ju' messing with you.

In an Addlerian sense your fear is caused by an inferiority complex. You feel, from infancy till now, that you cannot overcome the seemingly impossible tasks at hand. You have an anger and dislike of the superior, perhaps jealousy. I think this is somewhat on the nail and usually the cause of fear I see in many people.

In a Skinnerian sense your fear is a learned response to your environment. This response is contingent on the environment presenting to you stimuli that reinforce the fear that you feel. This too is a common cause of fear.

Fear is a big thing. There are lots of reasons why we, as humans, feel it. We all experience fear all the time over the most trivial things. Regardless of why we experience it is irrelevant (this can be seen as the 'black box approach') - it is the way we treat the symptoms and neurosis that it causes.

If meditation works - do it. If substance use works - do it. Just be happy.
 
Thanks Yan for the informative yet unhelpful post. I don't think you read my question properly.

Sorry if this is rude. But I'm very fearful at the moment and common sense says 'no substances'. This fear has also I think been brought on/out by meditating.

So to say 'If meditation works - do it. If substance use works - do it. Just be happy' really makes me think you misread my post.
 
One of the key techniques in meditation is observation without judgement. When meditating, observe your emotional state. Be aware of the sensations you feel without fixating on any of them, or deeming any to be "good" or "bad". When you feel fear, don't shy away, don't focus on it, don't try to diminish it or amplify it. Just watch it with your mind's eye. Acknowledge its presence, and note it as the emotion that you are currently feeling, and think no further. Just watch.

An easy trap to fall into while meditating is to get into an analytical frame of mind. Once your mind is busy analysing, it's no longer meditating - and since it's busy, it's not obvious that this is the case. This is one of the biggest problems I've faced in my practice.
 
Raw. Thanks a lot, that makes alot of sense. What is the result of feeling the fear rather than ignoring it or trying to handle it?
 
Juniorcat

Welcome to Bluelight, and to the P&S forum.

If you don't mind me asking, what are you fearful of? Is it specific or general?

Have you misused drugs recently, or in the past? Have you experienced any major life changes recently?

Personally I have never heard of meditation being harmful, but as with all curative activities there are exceptions to the rule. If you are really concerned, and lack a cogent explanation for this fear I would recommend seeing a Doctor or Psychiatrist. It is they who are best placed to explore the basis of this 'fear' and offering solutions ranging from medication to CBT/talking therapies.

The article you link to resides on a pro-meditation website, and is perhaps only there as a counter-balance to the many articles encouraging meditation.

Hope this helps.

CARPE DIEM

Pythagoras
 
juniorcat said:
Sorry if this is rude. But I'm very fearful at the moment and common sense says 'no substances'. This fear has also I think been brought on/out by meditating.
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I would not be surprised; it's a common misconception that meditation is the cure for anxiety/depression/fear and what have you. Meditation can help bring us back into the moment reminding us that our thoughts and emotions are not who we are. But as one goes deeper into meditation so much as to incur a spiritual awakening.. a tremendous amount of fear can arise. As you become more aware of who you truly are.. so to do you begin to let go of who you believed you were.. this process in itself can generate alot of fear.

This is purely from a spiritual perspective, i wouldn't rule out approaching medical advice or therapy as these too can help you grasp a sense of what may be causing it.
 
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Hello Juniorcat and welcome to BL. This is a nice topic to get into, as i feel it has a lot to teach us all. I know where you are coming from, I too feel fearful a lot of times and It too wasnt until I started meditating that this fear showed its ugly head. I have been reading a few books in the matter, such as Oshos " the joy of living dangerously" and Paramahansa Yogananda's "Living fearlessly" i would highly recommend them both to you, as they are phenomenal reads and should provide great insights into why we experience fear and other things of the matter.

From my understanding, we have nothing to fear, but fear itself. Usually, we experience fear and then we go the opposite direction. But as we go the opposite direction, we do not rid ourselves of fear, what we do is we add on to the cowardice that is already taking play, thus the problem never gets solved. What we must to do get rid of this fear of ours, is to take it head on. That is the only, that is the only way, that is the only way! How do we take our fears head on you might ask? Well, we take on our fears with the divine swords of non-attachment, forgiveness, and courage. Let these be your objects of meditation and let them rid you of your miseries. Why is non attachment a prerequisite for defeating our fears? It is because we fear losing our attachments, that is our ultimate fears. We have gone so far in this life, we have acquired many things that make us happy and we do not want to give them up, this creates a lot of fear and uneasiness in our minds and doesnt give us any room to grow. We must realize that someday, maybe today or tomorrow or 30 years down the line, we will ultimately meet our demise and everything that we have been living with and for will come to an end. When you realize that all of your riches, your family and friends, even your own body is impermanent due to the fact of our deaths to come, we then realize that since we are alive right now, and since death is around the corner, why should we spend the rest of our lives in fear of something inevitable? We may try to cling on to stuff with all of our lives and everything in us, but in the end, death comes and takes it all away. So why live in fear of losing that of which you cannot permanently own anyway?
The second weapon of divinity I suggest for you is the machete of forgiveness. Forgiveness is very important, for it is our ultimate salvation from our own selves, god, our family and friends. Perhaps you are fearful of looking at something that someone has done to you, or you have done to them. This may have happened years ago, but still you have not yet come to terms with the problem or dilemma, and so you are still carrying this burden today. Through your meditation you notice this problem inside of you, but you are still scared to handle it or take care of it. This is why i suggest forgiveness. Forgive yourself, forgive your friend and forgive whoever caused you problems. Realize that it is not worth the effort of carrying around the burden and being afraid to handle the burden. JUst let it go. Forgive and move on. Apologize with sincerity and love, from the bottom of your heart. Let this new day of life wash away your pains and sorrows of yesterday with the beautiful liquid light of forgiveness. Let it flood over your every spectrum of existence. The third Divine enemy of the weak is courage. When you are afraid, meditate on what it means to be courageous. To be a hero, to stand up and handle yours. To put a cause greater than yourself before yourself and to then pursue that cause with conscious effort and will power. If you are weak, meditate on strength, if you are tired, meditate on vitality, if you are afraid, meditate on courage. Through meditating on the opposite affect, we can come to realize it, and through this realization, the lesser of the values will be dropped by itself.

I hope this is the advice that you are looking for and that I have answered all of your questions and lead you into the right direction. if there is any more cause for concern or questions, please let me know.-peace love and light
 
Meditate on what it means to be courageous. What does courage mean to you? if you dont like that word, think of a synonym. Think of your greatest hero, and then try to obtain his ideals. Personally, my favorite hero is Rama, who is the supreme personality of godhead on earth as a great warrior who killed the king of demons Ravana, to save his wife Sita. You too may use Rama, actually, it is highly suggested. Rama is considered to be "the perfect man", as he IS god on earth. Some say he came to earth to show us the perfect example of how to be godly in this material existence.

Another thing you can use, and this is coming from the enlightened Paramahansa Yogananda. He says that we should realize that god is the ultimate salvation and protection from all harms, malice and calamities. He says that if one is to constantly remember god, as being eternally present in everyone and everything, than one may realize there is nothing to fear. He says, and this is coming from his book "living fearlessly":

"Whenever you are in trouble, pray: 'Lord, You are within me and all around me. I am in the castle of Thy presence. I have been struggling through life, surrounded by many kinds of deadly enemies. I now see that they are not really agents for my destruction; You have put me on earth to test my power. I am going through these tests only to prove myself. I am game to fight the evil that surrounds me; I will vanquish them with the almightiness of Your presence. And when I shall have passed through the adventure of life I will say 'Lord, it was hard to be brave and fight; but the grater my terror, the greator was the strength within me, given by You, by which I conquered and realized that I am made in Your image. You are the king of this universe and I am Your child, a prince of the universe. What have i to fear?'"

He also suggests bringing out the immortal soul found in us all. He encourages us to realize that we, as spirit, are indestructible. "No weapon can pierce the soul; no fire can burn it; no water can moisten it; nor can any wind wither it.... the soul is immutable. all permeating, ever calm and immovable" This is also stated in the bhagavad-gita.

He says this, and i believe it may be pleasure to read.

"Is it not freeing to the mind to know that death cannot kill us? When disease comes and the body stops working, the soul thinks 'I am dead!' But the lord shakes the soul and says 'What is the matter with you? you are not dead. Are you not still thinking?' A soldier is walking along and a bomb shatters his body. HIs soul cries 'Oh, I am killed, Lord!' and God says 'Of course not! Are you not talking to Me? Nothing can destroy you, My child. You are dreaming' Then the soul realizes: 'This is not so terrible. It was only my temporary earth-life consciousness of being a physical body that made losing it seem the end of me. I had forgotten that I am the eternal soul!"

I hope this post helps.
 
juniorcat said:
You said meditate on the opposite of fear, so courage. How do we do this?
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By using your attention to send your energy towards this cause.
Energy flows where attention goes.
By using will power n mental imaging surrounded by the idea of courage, you are laying out a blueprint for your higher self to build upon.
 
When I meditate, I try not to think. This sounds like thinking. It sounds like it will condition my mind to thinking about courage. But also in this process, I will still be thinking and most likely still be susceptible to thinking negatively.
 
Ah, but it is indeed possible to focus attention without thinking. Put the idea of courage into your mind, and begin meditating proper once you have first done this. Focus then on feeling the courage you have in your mind, rather than thinking about it.
 
juniorcat said:
When I meditate, I try not to think. This sounds like thinking. It sounds like it will condition my mind to thinking about courage. But also in this process, I will still be thinking and most likely still be susceptible to thinking negatively.
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It can be a tricky process, because the moment you realize your not thinking.. you've thought about not thinking.

I've found two types of methods that work well when meditating, mind you i never read up on techniques most of it i taught myself.. the first method was the one i practiced with when i first started, it involves focusing concentration onto a single point.. you can let thoughts arise and pass but the only important thing is that point of focus.. that point of focus resembles nothing.

It may be helpful to meditate with an intention when beginning in order to become familiar with your mind and learning discipline, but ultimately there is no intention with meditation.. because 'intention' is an aspect of the mind, and the mind will never beable to grasp the concept of no-thing.

The second method usually comes after considerable practice with meditation and disciplining the mind through concentrated focus, you stop focusing and begin to rest within no-self/no-thing and sink deeper and deeper into silence. This is a deeper form of meditation which i still struggle to maintain because the silence is so vast that i tend to think about something to bring my 'self' back into existence.

With deep meditation your effectively surrendering your 'self' (Thought gives rise to self) to absolute silence.. your true being. This process in my experience can create alot of fear as the self slowly falls away.. i've had trouble following through with it at times because it does give the sensation that your dying.. but really it's just the illusion of self dissolving into silence.

It takes alot of practice to get a handle on meditation, but it is extremely rewarding.
 
juniorcat said:
When I meditate, I try not to think. This sounds like thinking. It sounds like it will condition my mind to thinking about courage. But also in this process, I will still be thinking and most likely still be susceptible to thinking negatively.
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This reminds me of Ajahn Chahs metaphor. Please read and let it soak in.

"Have you ever seen flowing water? Have you ever seen still water? If your mind is peaceful, it will be just like still, flowing water. Have you ever seen still, flowing water? There! You've only seen flowing water or still water haven't you? When your mind is peaceful, you can develop wisdom. Your mind will be like flowing water, and yet still, It's almost as if it were still, and yet it's flowing. So I call it "still, flowing water." Wisdom can arise here. "

Also, the words you choose to use create the reality you are living in. If you can change your language, you may change your reality. If you can change your attitudes, you can change your being. If you are already afraid of fear while trying to get rid of it, then you are setting yourself up for failure from the beginning. You must realize there is nothing to fear in the first place. Your original nature is without fear, fear is the false. Just drop it and let it go. This can be done with non attachment, forgiveness and courage. Courage is to be found through god, as he is almighty, forever merciful, omnipotent and omnipresent.

I hope this helps, please post again any problems or questions.
 
juniorcat-

Hmmmmm Fear.

Well, you said you 'properly' got into meditation, I dont know what that means exactly. There are a lot of techniques and traditions based around meditation, go to various classes, find various teachers. You can of coarse look into different meditation and find what suits you but the path is very personal. I don't think you'll get much of an answer specific to your needs with such a general question, find someone local to teach you who you feel comfortable with and in a tradition that clicks.

I might be wrong but sounds like you are getting into something without the proper grounding, teaching, background info... whatever. The best thing about finding a teacher in real life is not having to rely on random forum posts to help you on the path which can be very deep, personal and profound.

Good Luck!
 
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I'm hearing everyone talk about fighting fear. I have found that relaxing as opposed to fighting is good. I don't mean to put people down. But, fighting is not the answer to this sort of problem.
 
juniorcat said:
I'm hearing everyone talk about fighting fear. I have found that relaxing as opposed to fighting is good. I don't mean to put people down. But, fighting is not the answer to this sort of problem.
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This sounds about right. When I sit, the idea is to allow whatever wants to happen to happen as fully as possible. If fear wants to happen, do not meditate on the opposite of fear. This is backwards. Go further into the fear and you will understand it.

It is important not to be judgmental about the contents that arise in meditation. They are all value-neutral. Fear is not bad. Courage is not good. Things appear and then disappear. Just watch them.
 
juniorcat said:
I'm hearing everyone talk about fighting fear. I have found that relaxing as opposed to fighting is good. I don't mean to put people down. But, fighting is not the answer to this sort of problem.
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I suppose you could compare that to the experience of seeing a speeding car.
Instead of meeting the car with your own force (adequate amount or not), it would be alot less painful n difficult to step to the side n let it flow past you.
Fear only works when you allow it to stick to you.
 
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